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There has always been a talent gap

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brock said:
Did you completely forget what greg Rousseau did last season ? 15.5 sacks 19.5 tfls which was 2nd both categories only behind chase young in virtually his first season playing dline full time ever as only a redshirt freshman? Phillips is a stud no doubt and he’s a more explosive/twitchy edge rusher than Rousseau but regardless Rousseau be creating havoc too now.

If you are looking solely as an edge rusher you might want to go with Phillips since he’s better at rushing the passer as an end and more advanced. He’s a Myles garret type of player that’s my comp for Phillips. Phillips plays very hard

For Rousseau he’s more effective right now at rushing the passer in the interior than on the outside but also still can get the job done. He’s an explosive athlete but not as explosive as Philips. Plays very hard. My comp for Rousseau is Jason pierre Paul esque/ or Calais campbell which I eventually Think he can grow into. They got similar play styles
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Phillips does it all. He creates knockback against the run, he sets the edge and shuts down zone mesh plays, and now he has an ****nal of pass rush moves including spins to beat double teams, outside swipe moves, bullrush, etc.

You could put Phillips on an NFL field right now and he'd belong. Rousseau would be exposed badly in the same circumstance. He shrinks when you run at him and he doesn't have any juice as an edge rusher. Sack stats are a bad way to evaluate defensive players. Even Roche is a more consistent, more complete player who grades out higher.

JPP has get-off and bend that Rousseau can't match. Campbell is a physical technician who can 2-gap. I don't see those comparisons at all. If he bulks up I can see him being a David Irving type of player.
scrantoncane said:
Replay last years film. GR’s get off was insane. That’s how he had 15.5 sacks in basically 2/3 of a season.

Agree to disagree on this one. Curious to what @HighSeas thinks.
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Rousseau doesn't have much twitch as an edge rusher. That's one of the knocks on him. Phillips definitely plays with more explosive power but he doesn't really explode out of his stance either.

Rousseau had 15.5 sacks mostly beating up on overmatched interior linemen and using his length in pursuit to track down QBs. Diaz lined him up at 0 tech and he crossed the face of Cs and Gs for easy sacks. Or he engaged his man and used his length to shed and clean up coverage sacks.
 
Ver said:
They didn't lose the first game because of QB play, their defense was terrible
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Clemson was also missing their best lber and captain of their defense. This is the guy that makes their defensive calls. He’ll make a world of difference next time they play.
 
grover said:
I'm super disappointed in Reed. Thought he would be an animal at this point in his development. Wouldn't be surprised if he leaves along with Traore. The two guys that opted out, Hillery and Herbert are already gone. El Gammal is gone. All those guys will instantaneously be jumped by the incoming freshmen, so I could see them all in the portal.

The only reason I see them coming back is that with so many kids hitting the portal, they may not find any place to land. Of course, Manny doesn't have to keep them on scholarship. But I doubt he'd be that mercenary about it.
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The only person I disagree on is El Gammal, kid's only a RS Fr. I too am disappointed with Reed and I was skeptical on bringing him back since he quit the first time. I won't be sad to see Hillery leave, especially after last year's comments on him and seeing how pedestrian he looked when put into game action.
 
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HighSeas said:
Phillips does it all. He creates knockback against the run, he sets the edge and shuts down zone mesh plays, and now he has an ****nal of pass rush moves including spins to beat double teams, outside swipe moves, bullrush, etc.

You could put Phillips on an NFL field right now and he'd belong. Rousseau would be exposed badly in the same circumstance. He shrinks when you run at him and he doesn't have any juice as an edge rusher. Sack stats are a bad way to evaluate defensive players. Even Roche is a more consistent, more complete player who grades out higher.

JPP has get-off and bend that Rousseau can't match. Campbell is a physical technician who can 2-gap. I don't see those comparisons at all. If he bulks up I can see him being a David Irving type of player.

Rousseau doesn't have much twitch as an edge rusher. That's one of the knocks on him. Phillips definitely plays with more explosive power but he doesn't really explode out of his stance either.

Rousseau had 15.5 sacks mostly beating up on overmatched interior linemen and using his length in pursuit to track down QBs. Diaz lined him up at 0 tech and he crossed the face of Cs and Gs for easy sacks. Or he engaged his man and used his length to shed and clean up coverage sacks.
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Agreed. I don’t want people to think I’m crapping on Rousseau because 15.5 sacks is a great accomplishment but that number hides significant flaws. His inability to play the run is why he couldn’t crack the starting lineup for the first few games last year. Half his sack production came from 0 technique and as stated earlier, that ish ain’t gonna fly in the NFL. He has 19.5 tfls but 15.5 were sacks so he only made 4 run stops behind the line. I think him opting out had a lot to do with avoiding the sophomore slump. If you’ve got holes in your game, best to not give scouts more tape of them
 
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DTP said:
Agreed. I don’t want people to think I’m crapping on Rousseau because 15.5 sacks is a great accomplishment but that number hides significant flaws. His inability to play the run is why he couldn’t crack the starting lineup for the first few games last year. Half his sack production came from 0 technique and as stated earlier, that ish ain’t gonna fly in the NFL. He has 19.5 tfls but 15.5 were sacks so he only made 4 run stops behind the line. I think him opting out had a lot to do with avoiding the sophomore slump. If you’ve got holes in your game, best to not give scouts more tape of them
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Yep. Here's Phillips destroying a RG from 3-tech alignment faster and more impressively than GR ever did, in case anyone is thinking GR's interior production was a unique advantage.

 
HighSeas said:
Yep. Here's Phillips destroying a RG from 3-tech alignment faster and more impressively than GR ever did, in case anyone is thinking GR's interior production was a unique advantage.

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Phillips v. Rousseau is a legit discussion but I think you're selling GR15 a bit short. He finished a lot of his sacks that other players wouldn't because of his length and change of direction. Those sacks on Pickett last year where he retraced showed how much ground he can cover. He also has a unique ability to bend as a tackler given his 6'7 frame. I've seen him take down guys at waist level in the open field.
 
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DMoney said:
Phillips v. Rousseau is a legit discussion but I think you're selling GR15 a bit short. He finished a lot of his sacks that other players wouldn't because of his length and change of direction. Those sacks on Pickett last year where he retraced showed how much ground he can cover. He also has a unique ability to bend as a tackler given his 6'7 frame. I've seen him take down guys at waist level in the open field.
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Yeah for sure. Good points. He's not aesthetically impressive but he'll be an effective inside rusher at the next level once he gets stronger.
 
@HighSeas

Don't let these jabrones get you down.

I'm with you on Phillips. He won't get drafted ahead of Rousseau, but if he stays healthy and has his heart in football, he will likely have a better pro career. He's a buzzsaw.

FWIW - I like Rousseau a lot more than you, but he's got a long way to go before he's Calais, Arik Armstead, or DeForest Buckner. I think all of those guys were more complete coming out.

Rousseau's player type is an NFL player, but its with a wide range of outcomes. I'm really curious to see his testing numbers. Will tell us a lot more about him, IMO.
 
BoxingRobes said:
@HighSeas

Don't let these jabrones get you down.

I'm with you on Phillips. He won't get drafted ahead of Rousseau, but if he stays healthy and has his heart in football, he will likely have a better pro career. He's a buzzsaw.

FWIW - I like Rousseau a lot more than you, but he's got a long way to go before he's Calais, Arik Armstead, or DeForest Buckner. I think all of those guys were more complete coming out.

Rousseau's player type is an NFL player, but its with a wide range of outcomes. I'm really curious to see his testing numbers. Will tell us a lot more about him, IMO.
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Phillips' playing temperament and emotion on the field is a pretty strong indicator of where his heart is at.

I said GR's ceiling could be David Irving. He was a pretty dominant player when he had his head on straight. 7 sacks in 8 games in 2017.
 
BoxingRobes said:
I'm really curious to see his testing numbers. Will tell us a lot more about him, IMO.
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I see Rousseau as a high 4.7-4.8 with very good agility numbers for his height. He should also move well in drills.

Phillips is the more explosive athlete and will test that way.
 
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