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OT: Restaurant and Food Thread

Mikep said:
South FLa. The haze craze has been around for 3-4 years but it finally arrived down here last year. I'm more of a clear, west coast IPA guy. Racer 5 is one of my favorites, don't know if you ever had it.

I listen to the Dave Chang show podcast and Meateater Podcast. Both of them had Skenes on. Very interesting guy.
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Yea I like both styles... time and place for each. Civil Society is some good stuff. We started getting Tripping Animals up here recently but I have yet to buy it. When I was down last time, my buddy and I did a LOT of damage at Union Beer on Calle Ocho. They get some serious brewers in there, though definitely focused on the trendier styles.
 
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wspcane said:
Yea I like both styles... time and place for each. Civil Society is some good stuff. We started getting Tripping Animals up here recently but I have yet to buy it. When I was down last time, my buddy and I did a LOT of damage at Union Beer on Calle Ocho. They get some serious brewers in there, though definitely focused on the trendier styles.
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I went to Civil Society new location last week. Beers seemed good except the Kolsch I had. Seemed way over hopped.
 
shwarma5 said:
Way I do annual Napa trip now is half the time in RRV/Sonoma and half in Napa (always stay Yountville). Gives you enough vino variety and different experiences. After tasting the longer meals can be tough. While not all timers, simple meals at Ciccio and Bistro Jeanty after a day of tasting leave you feeling very happy.
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****. A Bistro Jeantry reference. Yes! Good spot.

So, the last time we were out in wine country, we met a local (from San Fran) who said that Napa has become quite disfavored b/c of how touristy it has gotten, and that "those in the know" were spending more time in Sonoma. I can't say I disagree. Napa is fun, but you can easily stay in Sonoma and do the 30 minute drive (which is gorgeous) to visit wineries or restaurants in Napa.

Also, for the poster that referenced Redd. The first time we went it was magnificent. The second time . . . the complete opposite. Never went back. Not only was the food mediocre but the service was awful. (And I'm not one to complain about service if the food is a draw.) It was my birthday, and a server came by and dropped off a birthday dessert on the table and said something to the effect of "I heard it's someone's birthday" and then just walked off. It was so immensely impersonal and I'm rarely one to be bothered by things like that.
 
AlexCane said:
****. A Bistro Jeantry reference. Yes! Good spot.

So, the last time we were out in wine country, we met a local (from San Fran) who said that Napa has become quite disfavored b/c of how touristy it has gotten, and that "those in the know" were spending more time in Sonoma. I can't say I disagree. Napa is fun, but you can easily stay in Sonoma and do the 30 minute drive (which is gorgeous) to visit wineries or restaurants in Napa.

Also, for the poster that referenced Redd. The first time we went it was magnificent. The second time . . . the complete opposite. Never went back. Not only was the food mediocre but the service was awful. (And I'm not one to complain about service if the food is a draw.) It was my birthday, and a server came by and dropped off a birthday dessert on the table and said something to the effect of "I heard it's someone's birthday" and then just walked off. It was so immensely impersonal and I'm rarely one to be bothered by things like that.
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I have heard the same on Napa/Sonoma. i also felt in Napa that unless you were coming to certain wineries to spend serious cash, you pretty much were not welcomed at certain wineries or drivers would steer you elsewhere.

It is also wild how many urban wineries are in the Bay Area now. We get Broc Cellars distributed here in Atlanta, but their operation is in Berkeley (really great stuff if you come across it and like the funkier side of natural wines).

The last time I was in Napa, the most memorable meal we had was buying a bunch of charcuterie, cheeses, breads, etc. at Oxbow Market and Salvestrin Winery putting together a huge tasting on a picnic table in the middle of the vineyards with all of that stuff for lunch. I guess that is how it goes sometimes.

You can actually get Ad Hoc's fried chicken to go in certain nights at Keller's place at the Surf Club in Miami.
 
wspcane said:
Yep, there is a reason bistros and the like are so popular through Burgundy. We went to Redd years back and liked it, but I think they have since closed.

The Sonoma/Napa split is a good one. There also seems to be a lot more of the natural wine stuff going on in Sonoma, which I have really started to dig. Martha Stoumen is out of Sonoma and making some insanely delicious wine. Plus, Russian River Brewing, if you are into beer, makes some of the best sours and west coast IPAs in the country.
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Yes Redd was great, but it closed a year or so ago. I think a notable project was supposed to soon move in, but I might be wrong on that. Only thing that makes RRV/Sonoma a bit tougher is that its a larger land area so have to be a bit more focused (then again in Napa we usually go up into the Vaca and Mayacamas ranges vs. stay on 29, so similar issues). Healdsburg is a great base for RRV
 
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wspcane said:
I have heard the same on Napa/Sonoma. i also felt in Napa that unless you were coming to certain wineries to spend serious cash, you pretty much were not welcomed at certain wineries or drivers would steer you elsewhere.

It is also wild how many urban wineries are in the Bay Area now. We get Broc Cellars distributed here in Atlanta, but their operation is in Berkeley (really great stuff if you come across it and like the funkier side of natural wines).

The last time I was in Napa, the most memorable meal we had was buying a bunch of charcuterie, cheeses, breads, etc. at Oxbow Market and Salvestrin Winery putting together a huge tasting on a picnic table in the middle of the vineyards with all of that stuff for lunch. I guess that is how it goes sometimes.

You can actually get Ad Hoc's fried chicken to go in certain nights at Keller's place at the Surf Club in Miami.
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Napa has definitely become commercialized. We try and always stick with smaller places that only do private tours (where you are only person there or in your own area), or we select the elevated experiences. There is always the $$$ expectation, but frankly, we are also going to buy wine. For a trip as a whole we usually end up with four to five cases, plus a new membership or two. Sitting at a table with the winemaker or owner is great. Ad Hoc fried chicken to go is real solid.
 
wspcane said:
I have heard the same on Napa/Sonoma. i also felt in Napa that unless you were coming to certain wineries to spend serious cash, you pretty much were not welcomed at certain wineries or drivers would steer you elsewhere.

It is also wild how many urban wineries are in the Bay Area now. We get Broc Cellars distributed here in Atlanta, but their operation is in Berkeley (really great stuff if you come across it and like the funkier side of natural wines).

The last time I was in Napa, the most memorable meal we had was buying a bunch of charcuterie, cheeses, breads, etc. at Oxbow Market and Salvestrin Winery putting together a huge tasting on a picnic table in the middle of the vineyards with all of that stuff for lunch. I guess that is how it goes sometimes.

You can actually get Ad Hoc's fried chicken to go in certain nights at Keller's place at the Surf Club in Miami.
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Love Napa/Sonoma/RRR. My wife and I try to get out there whenever possible. Typically stay at the Harvest Inn in St. Helena. Oxbow Market is a very fun spot and the one place in Napa I consistently go beer over vino. Some excellent local craft brew available.

Ad Hoc's fried chicken is basically famous at this point. Everyone knows French Laundry. Also a big fan of Mustards and Farmstead (they always have Pappy when I have been there, which is a bonus if I am feeling stupid). My favorite out there was probably Cindy's Backstreet Kitchen, but sadly they closed a couple years ago.

Yeah, some of the Napa wineries can be a bit standoff-ish, though it also depends what time of the year you go. Everyone's much nicer in March vs. harvest season (unless it's on a whim, I try to avoid Napa from mid-August through late-October). I also generally find that if you do a guided tour over a straight tasting, you will usually get an overall better experience (at least in Napa). Sonoma vibe is a bit more bohemian, and I can (vaguely) recall one awesome afternoon at Gundlach Bundschu where my wife and I struck up a conversation with the wine stewards and it felt like they just kept pouring wine for over an hour after our tour was over (the complimentary glasses just kept coming and we closed it down).
 
Sonoma is definitely friendlier. Describing it as Bohemian is perfect. There's a vibe of "let's just chat over wine and get to know each other" with strangers that is pretty cool. Napa can definitely be more intimidating, although if you go often enough, you learn how to blend in if you happen to find yourself in a stuffier place.

Over the years, we've noticed the smaller the spot, the friendlier the vibe. Some of the more commercialized wineries tend to have that feel, although I don't even frequent those anymore anyways.
 
Good point on timing. March is actually when we always go now. Like the weather change from South Florida and the fact its not packed. Mustard sometimes in bloom too. Once you seen grapes on a vine, that becomes a lot less important. Rule of thumb (generally), further off the beaten path, better the experience. See a tour bus? Run.
 
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No_Fly_Zone said:
Love Napa/Sonoma/RRR. My wife and I try to get out there whenever possible. Typically stay at the Harvest Inn in St. Helena. Oxbow Market is a very fun spot and the one place in Napa I consistently go beer over vino. Some excellent local craft brew available.

Ad Hoc's fried chicken is basically famous at this point. Everyone knows French Laundry. Also a big fan of Mustards and Farmstead (they always have Pappy when I have been there, which is a bonus if I am feeling stupid). My favorite out there was probably Cindy's Backstreet Kitchen, but sadly they closed a couple years ago.

Yeah, some of the Napa wineries can be a bit standoff-ish, though it also depends what time of the year you go. Everyone's much nicer in March vs. harvest season (unless it's on a whim, I try to avoid Napa from mid-August through late-October). I also generally find that if you do a guided tour over a straight tasting, you will usually get an overall better experience (at least in Napa). Sonoma vibe is a bit more bohemian, and I can (vaguely) recall one awesome afternoon at Gundlach Bundschu where my wife and I struck up a conversation with the wine stewards and it felt like they just kept pouring wine for over an hour after our tour was over (the complimentary glasses just kept coming and we closed it down).
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We went down to Chile two years back and spent some time in their wine country. We did a tasting a Viu Manent, as well as the tour. They did the private tasting in a separate room, opened up 5 bottles of their top wines for the two of us. After 45 minutes or so the guide said, well you have lunch in an hour so you can feel free to hang out here, got up and walked out leaving the 5 bottles behind. I do not remember much of lunch.

Saw some wild stuff down there. We were at another private tasting and two Chinese businessmen and their translator asked if they could join. They paid for three tastings, smelled, did not put a drop in their mouth to even swish and spit. Talked about how they did the same at Clos Apalta and walked out after the first glass was poured because they did not like the smell of it. They then tried to negotiate to buy the entire year's vintage, wanting to send a freight ship to Chile to bring wine back to China.

Bohemian is a great way to describe Sonoma. Willamette was not bohemian, as much as the farmers are the vintners are the people doing tours are the people bottling/labeling are the people in the tasting rooms. It felt like what I imagine Napa was like years back. I really, really loved that experience, and would really, really love us to play at Oregon one day to spend a weekend there. Same with Stanford or Cal.
 
AlexCane said:
LMAO . . . so would my wife!
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I said this last year when we scheduled South Carolina. That trip, even driving from Atlanta, has about zero appeal. I would love more games in cities or regions worth a **** to visit, eat and drink in. The Rose Bowl was amazing to go to... so was Spago the night before.
 
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wspcane said:
We went down to Chile two years back and spent some time in their wine country. We did a tasting a Viu Manent, as well as the tour. They did the private tasting in a separate room, opened up 5 bottles of their top wines for the two of us. After 45 minutes or so the guide said, well you have lunch in an hour so you can feel free to hang out here, got up and walked out leaving the 5 bottles behind. I do not remember much of lunch.

Saw some wild stuff down there. We were at another private tasting and two Chinese businessmen and their translator asked if they could join. They paid for three tastings, smelled, did not put a drop in their mouth to even swish and spit. Talked about how they did the same at Clos Apalta and walked out after the first glass was poured because they did not like the smell of it. They then tried to negotiate to buy the entire year's vintage, wanting to send a freight ship to Chile to bring wine back to China.

Bohemian is a great way to describe Sonoma. Willamette was not bohemian, as much as the farmers are the vintners are the people doing tours are the people bottling/labeling are the people in the tasting rooms. It felt like what I imagine Napa was like years back. I really, really loved that experience, and would really, really love us to play at Oregon one day to spend a weekend there. Same with Stanford or Cal.
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Appreciate the insight on Willamette. Less familiar with the wines in the region (other than a handful of the more well-known pinot noir producers out there), but your description sounds enticing. Wife and I had been considering it, might have to push it further up the list once things start to normalize. Thanks for sharing!
 
What wineries are you guys a fan of?

I enjoyed Joseph Phelps immensely. It's perched atop a hill and they do tastings outside. The wine will never taste better than it does at that moment.

We also enjoy visiting Williams Selyem. Did a lunch/wine tasting at Paul Hobbs that was a blast. Copain was also gorgeous. Had a little picnic at Mauritson (IIRC) that was really nice. I've visited a bunch in Napa/Sonoma (V. Sattui, Mondavi, Silver Oak, Cakebread, Nickel & Nickel, Chateau Montelena, Beckmen, Opus One, Cardinale, Merry Edwards, to name a few) but those seem to be the most memorable.
 
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AlexCane said:
What wineries are you guys a fan of?

I enjoyed Joseph Phelps immensely. It's perched atop a hill and they do tastings outside. The wine will never taste better than it does at that moment.

We also enjoy visiting Williams Selyem. Did a lunch/wine tasting at Paul Hobbs that was a blast. Copain was also gorgeous. Had a little picnic at Mauritson (IIRC) that was really nice. I've visited a bunch in Napa/Sonoma (V. Sattui, Mondavi, Silver Oak, Cakebread, Nickel & Nickel, Chateau Montelena, Beckmen, Opus One, Cardinale, Merry Edwards, to name a few) but those seem to be the most memorable.
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My favorites / most memorable (as been to about 60 different wineries in total between the two areas):

Napa
  • Lail – Great wine. Because of a hookup did the tasting in her personal home. Philippe Melka winemaker
  • Beau Vigne – Was our previous favorite. Yountville tasting room, but did visit in the middle of vineyard on Atlas Peak. Sold winery though, so dropped membership. Kirk Venge winemaker.
  • Outpost – Best view in Napa I have seen (atop Howell). Wonderful Zin. Thomas Rivers Brown.
  • James Cole – Right off Silverado Trail. One of my favorite quality, “value” wines
  • Haber – Another Howell Mt. Super Small Production. Member. Did tasting in owner’s home.
  • Clif Family – Did an amazing lunch pairing up at their Cold Springs Vineyard property.
  • Sinegal – Owned by Costco guys. One of the best looking properties I have ever been on. This ain’t the Kirkland brand.
  • Amici – Awesome single vineyard cabs (not their total wine stuff). Tony Biagi is the winemaker.
  • Tres Perlas – Super high-end great winery. Owned by Renteria family who owns of the Valley’s largest farming businesses. Member.
Sonoma/RRV
  • Donum – Sick sculpture garden all over property. Great pinot / pairing tasting. Member.
  • Williams Seylem – Favorite RRV pinot. On their allocation list.
  • Arista – Hands down best lunch pairing I ever did.
 
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