New roster weights

[305to954]

Reviewing the offensive line weight changes in the past year

The official heights and weights have been updated for the upcoming 2020 season.

247sports.com

Football

The Official Athletic Site of the Miami Hurricanes, partner of WMT Digital. The most comprehensive coverage of Miami Hurricanes Football on the web with highlights, scores, game summaries, schedule and rosters.

miamihurricanes.com

Amari Carter down to 200 lbs is interesting

 

[canadianhurricane]

My biggest takeaway:

Quentin Williams

You win games in the trenches and its looks like we are starting to develop linemen properly again. Our DL room is full on big, strong, athletic dudes! And it looks like we are only getting better..

 

[Deleted member 26015]

For the offensive line, its not just the weight, its how you move the weight. Its about how explosive the getoff is with that weight.

Justice has worked with the O-Line on the getoff from the first spring practice and will continue to do so starting on Friday. We need to get away from this absorbing contact bs that this midget Barry tried to establish and need to deliver some shots.

 

[bshaw28]

You guys get too caught up in NFL combines. How many players have we had here completely change their bodies between the end of their final season and the combine? Again, Pope's size will be a total non-factor in what he accomplishes here at UM, which is all I care about.

I'm very much in the middle here. I think you make great points, and while I have a different opinion, I don't strongly disagree with anything you're saying.

IMO the NFL Combine isn't the end all be all, and I agree people can put too much stock in it. But it's the only verified height/weight/athletic testing we have to work off of - so it's helpful to use as a guide.

I don't think it's common for a player to make drastic changes in the 2 months leading up to the combine. Off by 1 inch or 5 lbs - sure, that's common. Off by 2 inches and 10+ lbs - sure, it happens, but it's not common IMO.

If Pope is listed at 6-1 172 - him measuring at 6-0 178 wouldn't surprise me. But I think something like 5-11 185 is unrealistic (I could be wrong though).

But take Mark Pope and the NFL and all that out of the equation. Just take any college WR you knew for a fact was 6-1

At 6-1, 130 lbs - I'm assuming you and most people would have some concerns about their weight, right?
At 6-1, 150 lbs - Would you have concerns about his weight? I think it likely would still play a major factor
At 6-1, 170 lbs - You're saying this is a total non-factor. I don't think it's a major factor, but do think it plays a small role in limiting what he can accomplish. But I don't at all think you're wrong in your opinion.

Height/Weight/40 time - all that stuff is a sliding scale and each person has their own opinion on at what point they would stop or start to have concerns.

 

[Go Canes!!]

What is is, 90 pounds in two years? Did someone put a wedding ring on him?

Particularly well done sir. Made me legit LOL.

 

[Novacane32000]

Mark Pope's weight is definitely concerning going into year 3.

Here is a list of the WR's that were drafted.

The average for 6.1 is 204 pounds. The lightest 6.1 receiver is 185 and ran a 4.35.

170 pounds is a problem for any receiver, let alone one that is 6.1.

Player	Ht	Wt	40yd	Vertical	Bench	Broad Jump	3Cone	Shuttle	Drafted (tm/rnd/yr)
Collin Johnson​	6.6	222			17​				Jacksonville Jaguars / 5th / 165th pick / 2020​
Chase Claypool​	6.4	238	4.42​	40.5​	19​	126​			Pittsburgh Steelers / 2nd / 49th pick / 2020​
Antonio Gandy-Golden​	6.4	223	4.6​	36​	22​	127​	7.33​	4.55​	Washington Football Team / 4th / 142nd pick / 2020​
Tee Higgins​	6.4	216							Cincinnati Bengals / 2nd / 33rd pick / 2020​
Isaiah Hodgins​	6.4	210	4.61​	36.5​	9​	124​	7.01​	4.12​	Buffalo Bills / 6th / 207th pick / 2020​
Dezmon Patmon​	6.4	225	4.48​	36​	15​	132​	7.28​	4.38​	Indianapolis Colts / 6th / 212th pick / 2020​
Michael Pittman​	6.4	223	4.52​	36.5​	13​	121​	6.96​	4.14​	Indianapolis Colts / 2nd / 34th pick / 2020​
Bryan Edwards​	6.3	212							Las Vegas Raiders / 3rd / 81st pick / 2020​
Jauan Jennings​	6.3	215	4.72​	29​		119​			San Francisco 49ers / 7th / 217th pick / 2020​
Denzel Mims​	6.3	207	4.38​	38.5​	16​	131​	6.66​	4.43​	New York Jets / 2nd / 59th pick / 2020​
Tyrie Cleveland​	6.2	209	4.46​	39.5​	13​	126​			Denver Broncos / 7th / 252nd pick / 2020​
Isaiah Coulter​	6.2	198	4.45​	36​		121​	7.28​	4.62​	Houston Texans / 5th / 171st pick / 2020​
Gabriel Davis​	6.2	216	4.54​	35​	14​	124​	7.08​	4.59​	Buffalo Bills / 4th / 128th pick / 2020​
CeeDee Lamb​	6.2	198	4.5​	34.5​	11​	124​			Dallas Cowboys / 1st / 17th pick / 2020​
Donovan Peoples-Jones​	6.2	212	4.48​	44.5​		139​			Cleveland Browns / 6th / 187th pick / 2020​
Brandon Aiyuk​	6.1	205	4.5​	40​	11​	128​			San Francisco 49ers / 1st / 25th pick / 2020​
Quintez Cephus​	6.1	202	4.73​	38.5​	23​	124​	7.2​	4.33​	Detroit Lions / 5th / 166th pick / 2020​
Antonio Gibson​	6.1	228	4.39​	35​	16​	118​			Washington Football Team / 3rd / 66th pick / 2020​
John Hightower​	6.1	189	4.43​	38.5​		122​	7.07​	4.21​	Philadelphia Eagles / 5th / 168th pick / 2020​
K.J. Hill​	6.1	196	4.6​	32.5​	17​	114​			Los Angeles Chargers / 7th / 220th pick / 2020​
Justin Jefferson​	6.1	202	4.43​	37.5​		126​			Minnesota Vikings / 1st / 22nd pick / 2020​
Van Jefferson​	6.1	200							Los Angeles Rams / 2nd / 57th pick / 2020​
Jerry Jeudy​	6.1	193	4.45​	35​		120​		4.53​	Denver Broncos / 1st / 15th pick / 2020​
Tyler Johnson​	6.1	206							Tampa Bay Buccaneers / 5th / 161st pick / 2020​
Laviska Shenault Jr.​	6.1	227	4.58​		17​				Jacksonville Jaguars / 2nd / 42nd pick / 2020​
Joe Reed​	6.1	224	4.47​	38​	21​	123​			Los Angeles Chargers / 5th / 151st pick / 2020​
Freddie Swain​	6.1	197	4.46​	36.5​	16​	124​	7.05​	4.26​	Seattle Seahawks / 6th / 214th pick / 2020​
Quez Watkins​	6.1	185	4.35​	36.5​		125​	7.28​	4.36​	Philadelphia Eagles / 6th / 200th pick / 2020​
Lynn Bowden​	5.11	204			13​				Las Vegas Raiders / 3rd / 80th pick / 2020​
Henry Ruggs III​	5.11	188	4.27​	42​		131​			Las Vegas Raiders / 1st / 12th pick / 2020​
K.J. Osborn​	5.11	203	4.48​	37.5​	18​	123​	7​	4.35​	Minnesota Vikings / 5th / 176th pick / 2020​
James Proche​	5.11	201		34.5​	20​		7.27​	4.4​	Baltimore Ravens / 6th / 201st pick / 2020​
Jalen Reagor​	5.11	206	4.47​	42​	17​	138​	7.31​	4.46​	Philadelphia Eagles / 1st / 21st pick / 2020​
Devin Duvernay​	5.10	200	4.39​	35.5​		123​	7.13​	4.2​	Baltimore Ravens / 3rd / 92nd pick / 2020​
Darnell Mooney​	5.10	179	4.38​	37​	9​	124​			Chicago Bears / 5th / 173rd pick / 2020​
KJ Hamler​	5.9	178			15​				Denver Broncos / 2nd / 46th pick / 2020​
Malcolm Perry​	5.9	186	4.63​	36​	10​	122​	7.12​	4.31​	Miami Dolphins / 7th / 246th pick / 2020​

Love that spreadsheet.

 

[ben]

he looekd fast to be i thought people said he was a high 4.5 good.

high 4.5 as a high schooler is still a burner

 

[bshaw28]

We ain’t worried about the nfl. Rashad Greene at fsu was a similar size and put up numbers at fsu. And pope is more explosive than him

Julio Jones 6-3 & 220 lbs
Amari Cooper 6-1 & 211 lbs

Do you consider them to be similar size? Because they're closer in size than Pope & Greene are

I'm not talking about playing in the NFL, I'm just talking about getting invited to the combine.

If these Miami WR's can get invited to the combine and Pope doesn't - then Pope won't be very good in college

Kevin Beard
Ryan Moore
Darnell Jenkins
Rayshawn Scott
Daryl Jones
Andre King

 

[bambam]

You guys aren’t concerned about Nelson being that heavy? His get off was really slow and him gaining more weight in short time can’t be good

Ok. Thx

 

[The Franchise]

I'm very much in the middle here. I think you make great points, and while I have a different opinion, I don't strongly disagree with anything you're saying.

IMO the NFL Combine isn't the end all be all, and I agree people can put too much stock in it. But it's the only verified height/weight/athletic testing we have to work off of - so it's helpful to use as a guide.

I don't think it's common for a player to make drastic changes in the 2 months leading up to the combine. Off by 1 inch or 5 lbs - sure, that's common. Off by 2 inches and 10+ lbs - sure, it happens, but it's not common IMO.

If Pope is listed at 6-1 172 - him measuring at 6-0 178 wouldn't surprise me. But I think something like 5-11 185 is unrealistic (I could be wrong though).

But take Mark Pope and the NFL and all that out of the equation. Just take any college WR you knew for a fact was 6-1

At 6-1, 130 lbs - I'm assuming you and most people would have some concerns about their weight, right?
At 6-1, 150 lbs - Would you have concerns about his weight? I think it likely would still play a major factor
At 6-1, 170 lbs - You're saying this is a total non-factor. I don't think it's a major factor, but do think it plays a small role in limiting what he can accomplish. But I don't at all think you're wrong in your opinion.

Height/Weight/40 time - all that stuff is a sliding scale and each person has their own opinion on at what point they would stop or start to have concerns.

I'm not saying the weight measurements are off. I'm saying our guys, over the years, have packed on weight and muscle in that window between their final season and the combine. It's happened a LOT here over the years, so putting stock in a combine weight isn't all that telling when it comes to what they might have actually weighed when they were playing football here.

Of course, that invalidates the idea that Travis Benjamin weighed 175 pounds when he played here just because he might have weighed 175 pounds at the combine. When he played here, he weighed around 155-160 pounds. Santana was also very thin for most of his career here. So were countless other excellent college WRs. Devontae Smith looks Chris Rock as Pooky.

 

[No_Fly_Zone]

Historically, UM typically lists its players 1 to 2 inches taller on its roster than what ends up verified at the NFL Combine. Especially at WR, TE, and LB, for some reason. So I expect their numbers to be slight exaggerations, and consider arguments based on those numbers to be based on a false premise.

But even if we're going to imagine those numbers are legit, using NFL Combine numbers and draft position or NFL success as an indicator for what works in the college game is just the wrong analysis. There are plenty of examples of All-Conference WRs who pile on stats and help their teams win football games in college, but don't fit the perfect NFL mold. Their lack of NFL measurables or success is irrelevant to their prior collegiate success.

If people are really interested in comparing imaginary heights/weights of college athletes to determine collegiate success, it seems fair to use accolades like making All-Conference or All-American teams instead of NFL draft position.

Looking at the ACC, Tutu Atwell is listed on UL's website at 5'9" and allegedly 165 lbs. He was a 1st team All-ACC WR last season who caught 70 passes for over 1200 yards and 12 TDs. KJ Hamler is a listed 5'9" and 176 lbs. at PedState. He managed to put up 56 catches for over 900 yards and 8 TDs and was named 2nd team All Big-Ten WR last year. And here's a fun one... Devonta Smith, listed on Baga's website at 6'1" 175 lbs. (same height at Pope and 3 pounds heavier) was second team All-$EC last season (with stats that pain me to type).

So this talk about height/weight, especially at the WR position, is largely overemphasized.

 

[bshaw28]

I'm not saying the weight measurements are off. I'm saying our guys, over the years, have packed on weight and muscle in that window between their final season and the combine. It's happened a LOT here over the years, so putting stock in a combine weight isn't all that telling when it comes to what they might have actually weighed when they were playing football here.

Of course, that invalidates the idea that Travis Benjamin weighed 175 pounds when he played here just because he might have weighed 175 pounds at the combine. When he played here, he weighed around 155-160 pounds. Santana was also very thin for most of his career here. So were countless other excellent college WRs. Devontae Smith looks Chris Rock as Pooky.

I think this is something that sounds like it makes sense that it happens often - but doesn't actually happen very often.

Here's our last 5 WR's where I could find their Miami bio past their Freshman year (just by doing a quick Google search)

No one changed more than 1 inch and 5 lbs. If I keep going back I'm 100% sure 1 or 2 would have big differences - but they'd be outliers.

Now....what weight they actually play at and how much weight they put on or lose before the combine - anyone can speculate about.

But we can only go by what we have (Miami's Roster & NFL Combine) - and those 2 are generally pretty close.

 

[Mackmiller974]

Zion has put on almost 75LBs since he arrived on campus last year. Pretty impressive

 

[bshaw28]

Historically, UM typically lists its players 1 to 2 inches taller on its roster than what ends up verified at the NFL Combine. Especially at WR, TE, and LB, for some reason. So I expect their numbers to be slight exaggerations, and consider arguments based on those numbers to be based on a false premise.

But even if we're going to imagine those numbers are legit, using NFL Combine numbers and draft position or NFL success as an indicator for what works in the college game is just the wrong analysis. There are plenty of examples of All-Conference WRs who pile on stats and help their teams win football games in college, but don't fit the perfect NFL mold. Their lack of NFL measurables or success is irrelevant to their prior collegiate success.

If people are really interested in comparing imaginary heights/weights of college athletes to determine collegiate success, it seems fair to use accolades like making All-Conference or All-American teams instead of NFL draft position.

Looking at the ACC, Tutu Atwell is listed on UL's website at 5'9" and allegedly 165 lbs. He was a 1st team All-ACC WR last season who caught 70 passes for over 1200 yards and 12 TDs. KJ Hamler is a listed 5'9" and 176 lbs. at PedState. He managed to put up 56 catches for over 900 yards and 8 TDs and was named 2nd team All Big-Ten WR last year. And here's a fun one... Devonta Smith, listed on Baga's website at 6'1" 175 lbs. (same height at Pope and 3 pounds heavier) was second team All-$EC last season (with stats that pain me to type).

So this talk about height/weight, especially at the WR position, is largely overemphasized.

Mentioning all these 5-10 or 5-9 guys in comparison to a 6-1 guy is irrelevant. That 3 to 4 inches makes a huge difference in body and what you'd expect their weight to be. It's a completely different body type.

Let me help everyone out here - Here's the best WR's 6-0+ and 182 lbs or less in the last 20 years (that's subtracting 1 inch & adding 10 lbs to Pope)

2021 - Devonta Smith - 6-1, 175
2017 - Dede Westbrook - 6-0, 178
2014 - Paul Richardson - 6-0, 175
2008 - Mario Manningham - 6-0, 181
2003 - Terrence Edwards - 6-0, 176
2002 - Snoop Minnis - 6-1, 171
2001 - Todd Pinkston, 6-2, 169

By best, I mean the only ones that played in the NFL.

Great college players. Pope can be a great college player. Some good, but no great NFL players. Smith's size/weight will be an issue for some NFL teams. It's not a common body type for a WR.

 

[The Franchise]

Mentioning all these 5-10 or 5-9 guys in comparison to a 6-1 guy is irrelevant. That 3 to 4 inches makes a huge difference in body and what you'd expect their weight to be. It's a completely different body type.

Let me help everyone out here - Here's the best WR's 6-0+ and 182 lbs or less in the last 20 years (that's subtracting 1 inch & adding 10 lbs to Pope)

2021 - Devonta Smith - 6-1, 175
2017 - Dede Westbrook - 6-0, 178
2014 - Paul Richardson - 6-0, 175
2008 - Mario Manningham - 6-0, 181
2003 - Terrence Edwards - 6-0, 176
2002 - Snoop Minnis - 6-1, 171
2001 - Todd Pinkston, 6-2, 169

By best, I mean the only ones that played in the NFL.

Great college players. Pope can be a great college player. Some good, but no great NFL players. Smith's size/weight will be an issue for some NFL teams. It's not a common body type for a WR.

And that's where the conversations on here tend to veer off course--with NFL chatter. Every time we discuss players on here, it devolves into an NFL discussion. There are tens of dozens of WRs built similarly to Pope, who have had tremendous success at the collegiate level. Likewise, there are QBs, who don't necessarily fit NFL measurables, who have great success in college football.

I don't think anyone's arguing Pope is a prototype NFL WR. Our point is that Pope's size should have very little to no bearing on his ability to achieve at this level. Show me something that refutes that instead of talking about the NFL.

 

[Damiencane86]

Zion, Scaife, Brooks, Clarke made some big leaps in weight gain. Hope its solid mass. I gotta wonder what pope's diet is like since he seemingly looks the same as he did his senior year at Southridge

 

[No_Fly_Zone]

Smith's size/weight will be an issue for some NFL teams. It's not a common body type for a WR in the NFL.

FIFY to emphasize the critical distinction between NFL prototype vs. collegiate success. The former is overemphasized when discussing the latter.

Smith might be a total bust in the NFL, but it will not alter the fact that he had 68 catches for over 1250 yards and 14 TDs on his way to becoming a 2nd team All-$ec WR as a true junior in 2019. Smith is already a great college WR (where his body type is far more common than it is in the NFL), which should be Pope's primary goal (and all of our hope for Pope) before any NFL talk.

 

[bshaw28]

And that's where the conversations on here tend to veer off course--with NFL chatter. Every time we discuss players on here, it devolves into an NFL discussion. There are tens of dozens of WRs built similarly to Pope, who have had tremendous success at the collegiate level. Likewise, there are QBs, who don't necessarily fit NFL measurables, who have great success in college football.

I don't think anyone's arguing Pope is a prototype NFL WR. Our point is that Pope's size should have very little to no bearing on his ability to achieve at this level. Show me something that refutes that instead of talking about the NFL.

Because of the BEST ones I listed, no one named them outside of Devonta Smith.

And before we even got to 6-1 Devonta Smith, people used these guys as a comparison

5-11 DeSean Jackson
5-10 Travis Benjamin
5-10 Santana Moss
5-8 Sinorice Moss
5-9 Tutu Atwell
6-1 Lamar Thomas - @Tetragrammaton Cane for the win


So if you say "there's been a zillion college WRs who have excelled at 6 feet 170 lbs" - then everyone can only name guys under 6 feet - does it really happen that often?

If there's a zillion - then can you name just 3 6' 170 lb WR's that have excelled (other than the 6-7 we've already named)?

 

[bshaw28]

FIFY to emphasize the critical distinction between NFL prototype vs. collegiate success. The former is overemphasized when discussing the latter.

Smith might be a total bust in the NFL, but it will not alter the fact that he had 68 catches for over 1250 yards and 14 TDs on his way to becoming a 2nd team All-$ec WR as a true junior in 2019. Smith is already a great college WR (where his body type is far more common than it is in the NFL), which should be Pope's primary goal (and all of our hope for Pope) before any NFL talk.

I totally agree with everything you said.

But same question to you I asked @The Franchise

Who are the most dominant 6'1 170 lb WR's at the college level (regardless on NFL performance) you can name outside of the 6-7 that have already been named?

 

[The Franchise]

Because of the BEST ones I listed, no one named them outside of Devonta Smith.

And before we even got to 6-1 Devonta Smith, people used these guys as a comparison

5-11 DeSean Jackson
5-10 Travis Benjamin
5-10 Santana Moss
5-8 Sinorice Moss
5-9 Tutu Atwell
6-1 Lamar Thomas - @Tetragrammaton Cane for the win


So if you say "there's been a zillion college WRs who have excelled at 6 feet 170 lbs" - then everyone can only name guys under 6 feet - does it really happen that often?

If there's a zillion - then can you name just 3 6' 170 lb WR's that have excelled (other than the 6-7 we've already named)?

So if Pope is 6 feet and not 5'10 or 5'11, which is what I think he actually is, then is it really that much of a difference? Do you consider a 6' WR a completely different class than the laundry list of 5'10'ish guys with builds similar to Pope who excelled in college? I'd say a 5'10 and 6' WR are pretty much the same when it comes to size classification. Neither is considered a big WR in today's game.

I'm not going to dig through the archives to produce the list, but I've been watching college football forever, and I can assure you the list of 5'10 to 6' WRs with Pope's general body size that have excelled is much longer than the few you just listed.

Are you going to continue quibbling until I just quit and say "you win" because I'm happy to do that if it'll drag me from a vortex of NFL prototype talk that has nothing to do with Pope's light weight affecting his ability to produce at the college level. We're not asking him to block DE's or to carry from the football from the I formation 45 times per game.