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New Players & Upcoming Trip to France

TheOriginalCane said:
I'm gonna be honest on Wooga, and I've said this before.

The problem I have with Wooga as a ball handler is that he is very upright and has a high bounce. I've seen plenty of defenders who swipe at the ball when he bounces it high, and several steals.

Wooga has not developed the bend that Wong has, where he can dribble and advance the ball very low to the floor. That's how Wong is able to bob and weave his way through defenders, though he occasionally can mishandle the ball in some tight spots.

But Wooga's handle is very susceptible to steals. He can be a good decision-maker and passer and shooter, and he can bring the ball up when there is minimal pressure, but I'd trust Pack and Bens and others against a press defense more than I would with Wooga.

And I love Wooga's overall game. Just not his ball-handling.
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Guards develop here.
 
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TheOriginalCane said:
I'm gonna be honest on Wooga, and I've said this before.

The problem I have with Wooga as a ball handler is that he is very upright and has a high bounce. I've seen plenty of defenders who swipe at the ball when he bounces it high, and several steals.

Wooga has not developed the bend that Wong has, where he can dribble and advance the ball very low to the floor. That's how Wong is able to bob and weave his way through defenders, though he occasionally can mishandle the ball in some tight spots.

But Wooga's handle is very susceptible to steals. He can be a good decision-maker and passer and shooter, and he can bring the ball up when there is minimal pressure, but I'd trust Pack and Bens and others against a press defense more than I would with Wooga.

And I love Wooga's overall game. Just not his ball-handling.
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Agree. He's always looked a little stiff on the court. Not sure there's anything to be done about that. As long as he keeps stroking those deep corner jump shots he'll be a major contributor. Best corner scorer here since James Jones.
 
TheOriginalCane said:
I'm gonna be honest on Wooga, and I've said this before.

The problem I have with Wooga as a ball handler is that he is very upright and has a high bounce. I've seen plenty of defenders who swipe at the ball when he bounces it high, and several steals.

Wooga has not developed the bend that Wong has, where he can dribble and advance the ball very low to the floor. That's how Wong is able to bob and weave his way through defenders, though he occasionally can mishandle the ball in some tight spots.

But Wooga's handle is very susceptible to steals. He can be a good decision-maker and passer and shooter, and he can bring the ball up when there is minimal pressure, but I'd trust Pack and Bens and others against a press defense more than I would with Wooga.

And I love Wooga's overall game. Just not his ball-handling.
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I don’t disagree. I’ve written before that Wooga is best on the baseline where he only needs to make 1-2 dribbles to reach the basket, He does not look like he handled the ball a lot even in high school. He probably always has received the ball on the offensive side of half court and is told to attack.

Running point is about attacking but with the correct play call and often pass. I’m with you that Wooga would have to dramatically improve his ball handling to run point. But we have never seen it.
 
hotshot said:
Agree. He's always looked a little stiff on the court. Not sure there's anything to be done about that. As long as he keeps stroking those deep corner jump shots he'll be a major contributor. Best corner scorer here since James Jones.
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And running.

Wooga and Cleveland will put on a dunk contest next year in some games.
Our defensive pressure on the wings will be the best we have ever seen but Pack/Bensley have to put some pressure on the primary ball handler like Wong did last year to give the wing defenders a chance.
Everyone knows Pack can shoot. This year he will have to prove that he can defend well enough to play in the NBA.
 
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AmherstCane said:
L said last year he didn’t want Wooga dribbling. He wanted him to take one or two bounces and pass or shoot. Dribble, dribble, turnover was the gist of why.

If L is now talking about Wooga at the point… I suspect his handle has improved - as you say.
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Think/hope you are right. Wooga with an improved handle has gotta be a scary thought for opponents. Putting the ball on the floor and driving to the rack .... goes a long way to completing his offensive game.

I still like him in the corner (not out front as a PG) because it really helps unclog the middle for Omier and Nwoko/Casey. Defenders have to go out and help on Wooga.
 
AmherstCane said:
I believe there is a 3 point shooting drill and players have to make a certain number to get a green light from three. At least that is what L used to do years ago.

Casey had a 3 point shot in high school and was recruited as a stretch 4.

Regarding that play… the perimeter defender (was it Lively) initially started to close and then hedged to defend the drive/pass. Also I think even Casey v. Filip 1v1 was big advantage Filip at that point in their respective careers.
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I get all of what you're saying, but I think what it comes down to is...do we like Casey taking a 3pt'er in that spot, or do we like Casey faking past Lively and driving down the lane with a head full of steam towards Filipowski? You like the former, I much prefer the latter. The former is what happened, and it didn't work out. It's a wild "what-if", I know.

Remember - Casey doesn't have to finish over Filipowski...he just has to get to the rim and at least draw the foul. You go in with a head of steam and bad intentions, Casey's a hard man to stop. Plus...if he's faked past Lively and is basically 1v1 with Filipowski...one of those other 4 guys on the floor is open...likely for a 3, and those dudes are a whole lot better than 13% on the season from 3.

Good conversation, just agreeing to disagree. (y)
 
BWCD said:
I get all of what you're saying, but I think what it comes down to is...do we like Casey taking a 3pt'er in that spot, or do we like Casey faking past Lively and driving down the lane with a head full of steam towards Filipowski? You like the former, I much prefer the latter. The former is what happened, and it didn't work out. It's a wild "what-if", I know.

Remember - Casey doesn't have to finish over Filipowski...he just has to get to the rim and at least draw the foul. You go in with a head of steam and bad intentions, Casey's a hard man to stop. Plus...if he's faked past Lively and is basically 1v1 with Filipowski...one of those other 4 guys on the floor is open...likely for a 3, and those dudes are a whole lot better than 13% on the season from 3.

Good conversation, just agreeing to disagree. (y)
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Lively didn’t commit hard enough to the close out… he still had position to defend the drive until the ball literally left Casey’s hands… I also don’t think creating off of a drive from the perimeter was Casey’s game last year.
 
BWCD said:
You go in with a head of steam and bad intentions, Casey's a hard man to stop. Plus...if he's faked past Lively and is basically 1v1 with Filipowski...one of those other 4 guys on the floor is open...likely for a 3, and those dudes are a whole lot better than 13% on the season from 3.
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I can't think of one instance all season that would make me think "Casey's a hard man to stop" taking it to the rack.
 
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hotshot said:
I can't think of one instance all season that would make me think "Casey's a hard man to stop" taking it to the rack.
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Well, you only had 1 instance out of 8 on the season that said he could make a 3. :ROFLMAO: I guess what I'm saying is with his length/athleticism, he gets a head full of steam...I like his chances at the rack against Filipowski of at the very least drawing a foul and getting to the line. But...it is what it is and we know how it turned out. To each their own.
 
AmherstCane said:
Lively didn’t commit hard enough to the close out… he still had position to defend the drive until the ball literally left Casey’s hands… I also don’t think creating off of a drive from the perimeter was Casey’s game last year.
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He did more of that in HS than he did hitting 3's from the videos I've seen. I would have liked to have seen him try to drive it, make the D rotate, and even if he doesn't go to the rim himself, maybe the defense rotates and gives one of those other 4 guys an open look. But again...it's a "what if" scenario.
 
BWCD said:
He did more of that in HS than he did hitting 3's from the videos I've seen. I would have liked to have seen him try to drive it, make the D rotate, and even if he doesn't go to the rim himself, maybe the defense rotates and gives one of those other 4 guys an open look. But again...it's a "what if" scenario.
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I’m not saying you’re wrong but watching the video again Lively was super slow on the close out and I believe still had position to defend the drive unless Casey really sold the shot fake hard.

I agree in a perfect world with the benefit of hindsight (and with Casey shooting the way he did)… a really good shot fake is probably the better option as it gets Casey an open jumper at the free throw line or pass to an open man if somebody rotates to help.

But that’s a lot of Monday morning analysis for a true freshman “stretch 4” with a wide open three while playing his first really big minutes of the season.
 
I said the first exhibition game Wooga didn’t look like the same guy. I kept going on about it in the game thread. One of the better one year jumps I’ve seen. I put nothing past this cat after that. Would you really be surprised to see him jump to a 14-16 ppg game scorer next year ?
 
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AmherstCane said:
I’m not saying you’re wrong but watching the video again Lively was super slow on the close out and I believe still had position to defend the drive unless Casey really sold the shot fake hard.

I agree in a perfect world with the benefit of hindsight (and with Casey shooting the way he did)… a really good shot fake is probably the better option as it gets Casey an open jumper at the free throw line or pass to an open man if somebody rotates to help.

But that’s a lot of Monday morning analysis for a true freshman “stretch 4” with a wide open three while playing his first really big minutes of the season.
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And he'll hopefully develop - I may have concerns, but it's just concerns at this point. Not writing the kid off as some have pointed out.

It's a little bit of microanalysis on my part sure, but it was a really big spot that I happened to see live...so that made it a bit more impactful in the moment to me. I mean...when he took/missed that 3 and we couldn't get the lead in that possession, you should have seen the "oh **** we're in trouble" looks from the other Canes fans in the stands. It was one of those palpable turning points. The game wasn't out of reach after that at all realistically...but that moment just felt like our chance to get a win got blown.

I'm all about context, so I agree that him being a true Freshman playing big minutes in Omier's stead was a contributing factor to his decision making on that possession.

I am, however, gonna move that we stop calling him a "stretch 4" as an excuse until he can shoot a respectable pace from 3...lol. 10% on the season ain't a "stretch 4", man...not yet. He can develop! He's just not there yet.
 
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