Jon Drummond and Chad Wilson....and a question for Pete.....

[killa1storm]

C4L, Did you miss the part where Pete said Yearby had a handler? You think he got paid too?

You people see the word 'handler' and assume it involves shady dealings. A lot of these dudes grow up without fathers and so they have mentors, coaches, etc. who are a part of their life and eventually become a part of their recruiting process. Some coaches consider those people 'third parties' and don't want to work with them but that's problematic. If a kid has been mentored by a guy since pop warner then why the **** would that person not be a part of their recruiting process? These are people they trust. That's what Pete means by embracing the third parties. But I guess its best to remain ignorant and accuse everybody of shopping kids for a payoff.

No NO NO sir. Im sorry but its clear we are talking about different things here. We are OBVIOUSLY Dealing with "handlers and mentors" already, since as you and Pete have clearly stated, Yearby had one, as did some of these other kids. But were now talking about Genron, and there is this implication that we need to make a guy like that a "part of the process". A guy who has ADMITTEDLY taken money from schools to shop players, and was booted from SFE for unethical behavior.

So were talking about two different animals here. Because if this was simply about dealing with a handler or mentor of a kid, it would obviously be a moot point no? Since we just signed several that had them.

I think the point Pete is trying to make is that while many of you may see Genron as a dirty dude, the recruits he deals with may not see him that way.

Now I don't know if he's shopping players or whatever. But even if he is there's probably a kid that he's mentored who trusts him. So embrace him as much as you can within the rules. I think that's the point.

Instead of saying 'he has a handler, we're not dealing with him.' Not all 'handlers' are in it for dirty reasons. In the case of a guy like Yearby Coley cultivated that relationship whereas maybe without Coley that's a situation your staff may not have touched. Who knows.

 

[Gamineal]

These guys aren't going no where so maybe golden can learn from Pete about having good relationships. If we want to win recruiting battles we better learn to win coaches.

learn from Pete....:ibisroflmao:

 

[NoahZach]

Wow you guys have no real clue. If you really think Chad and Jon are problems to Miami then you don't understand the landscape of Miami or Recruiting. Just because they had prospects that didn't pick UM doesn't mean they were the problem. Rip the coaching staff for not offering those Uschool platers and Rip the coaches for playing that terrible soft defense. As a coach you do your best to help kids pick a school that's best for THEM not your favorite team. I wouldn't steer a kid to go play DT in that system, or BEG a school to come recruit a highly rated LEGACY player smh. They're doing a thankless job for the most part. As a coach I commend them for the way they help get kids offers that otherwise couldn't even step foot on some of these campuses.

Well, if it was him, Chad was in another thread saying that he used to lie to kids to get them to UM. What would make me think that he or other guys aren't doing it now to get kids to go somewhere other than UM?

The benefit of the doubt is earned and there are guys that have always had smoke (if not fire) around them.

 

[bacane]

Wow you guys have no real clue. If you really think Chad and Jon are problems to Miami then you don't understand the landscape of Miami or Recruiting. Just because they had prospects that didn't pick UM doesn't mean they were the problem. Rip the coaching staff for not offering those Uschool platers and Rip the coaches for playing that terrible soft defense. As a coach you do your best to help kids pick a school that's best for THEM not your favorite team. I wouldn't steer a kid to go play DT in that system, or BEG a school to come recruit a highly rated LEGACY player smh. They're doing a thankless job for the most part. As a coach I commend them for the way they help get kids offers that otherwise couldn't even step foot on some of these campuses.

Stop with this humanitarian, thanklessly helping kids nonsense. Some of these characters have created a cottage industry.

 

[azcanesfan]

I would actually do the opposite. Cut out those two scumbags for sure. That whole BS Q and A with Wilson convinced me of that. No one is bigger than the squad. Start recruiting areas where the scholarship is respected.

 

[CANE4LIFE]

C4L, Did you miss the part where Pete said Yearby had a handler? You think he got paid too?

You people see the word 'handler' and assume it involves shady dealings. A lot of these dudes grow up without fathers and so they have mentors, coaches, etc. who are a part of their life and eventually become a part of their recruiting process. Some coaches consider those people 'third parties' and don't want to work with them but that's problematic. If a kid has been mentored by a guy since pop warner then why the **** would that person not be a part of their recruiting process? These are people they trust. That's what Pete means by embracing the third parties. But I guess its best to remain ignorant and accuse everybody of shopping kids for a payoff.

No NO NO sir. Im sorry but its clear we are talking about different things here. We are OBVIOUSLY Dealing with "handlers and mentors" already, since as you and Pete have clearly stated, Yearby had one, as did some of these other kids. But were now talking about Genron, and there is this implication that we need to make a guy like that a "part of the process". A guy who has ADMITTEDLY taken money from schools to shop players, and was booted from SFE for unethical behavior.

So were talking about two different animals here. Because if this was simply about dealing with a handler or mentor of a kid, it would obviously be a moot point no? Since we just signed several that had them.

I think the point Pete is trying to make is that while many of you may see Genron as a dirty dude, the recruits he deals with may not see him that way.

Now I don't know if he's shopping players or whatever. But even if he is there's probably a kid that he's mentored who trusts him. So embrace him as much as you can within the rules. I think that's the point.

Instead of saying 'he has a handler, we're not dealing with him.' Not all 'handlers' are in it for dirty reasons. In the case of a guy like Yearby Coley cultivated that relationship whereas maybe without Coley that's a situation your staff may not have touched. Who knows.

But how far can the staff push the envolope being on NCAA probation? I mean we are going to be getting cozy with a guy who has ADMITTED he takes money for shopping players, and was booted off SFE for unethical conduct? I mean that is a recipie for DISASTER. The Yahoo, the Herald and the NCAA will blow a load in their pants if they see us cozied up with Genron hanging around UM.

There are MULTIPLE people on a number of boards now that have confirmed that there is an NCAA investigation into Genron. Ive seen the same name from the NCAA mentioned as someone that has been looking into him and asking for any information related to his activities. Im pretty confident that he is on the NCAA radar big time. If that guy was hanging around UM, that is a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[NoahZach]

C4L, Did you miss the part where Pete said Yearby had a handler? You think he got paid too?

You people see the word 'handler' and assume it involves shady dealings. A lot of these dudes grow up without fathers and so they have mentors, coaches, etc. who are a part of their life and eventually become a part of their recruiting process. Some coaches consider those people 'third parties' and don't want to work with them but that's problematic. If a kid has been mentored by a guy since pop warner then why the **** would that person not be a part of their recruiting process? These are people they trust. That's what Pete means by embracing the third parties. But I guess its best to remain ignorant and accuse everybody of shopping kids for a payoff.

No NO NO sir. Im sorry but its clear we are talking about different things here. We are OBVIOUSLY Dealing with "handlers and mentors" already, since as you and Pete have clearly stated, Yearby had one, as did some of these other kids. But were now talking about Genron, and there is this implication that we need to make a guy like that a "part of the process". A guy who has ADMITTEDLY taken money from schools to shop players, and was booted from SFE for unethical behavior.

So were talking about two different animals here. Because if this was simply about dealing with a handler or mentor of a kid, it would obviously be a moot point no? Since we just signed several that had them.

I think the point Pete is trying to make is that while many of you may see Genron as a dirty dude, the recruits he deals with may not see him that way.

Now I don't know if he's shopping players or whatever. But even if he is there's probably a kid that he's mentored who trusts him. So embrace him as much as you can within the rules. I think that's the point.

Instead of saying 'he has a handler, we're not dealing with him.' Not all 'handlers' are in it for dirty reasons. In the case of a guy like Yearby Coley cultivated that relationship whereas maybe without Coley that's a situation your staff may not have touched. Who knows.

What does that mean? Assuming a person is dirty, why would you embrace and legitimize someone if you know that person is dirty? Slippery slope and dangerous, especially for a program in the crosshairs of the NCAA and the media.

 

[NoahZach]

Wow you guys have no real clue. If you really think Chad and Jon are problems to Miami then you don't understand the landscape of Miami or Recruiting. Just because they had prospects that didn't pick UM doesn't mean they were the problem. Rip the coaching staff for not offering those Uschool platers and Rip the coaches for playing that terrible soft defense. As a coach you do your best to help kids pick a school that's best for THEM not your favorite team. I wouldn't steer a kid to go play DT in that system, or BEG a school to come recruit a highly rated LEGACY player smh. They're doing a thankless job for the most part. As a coach I commend them for the way they help get kids offers that otherwise couldn't even step foot on some of these campuses.

Stop with this humanitarian, thanklessly helping kids nonsense. Some of these characters have created a cottage industry.

Yep. I'm fine with a coach, person, mentor, whatever that truly is helping a kid and his family make the best choice for them as to the kid's future. If that is this guy Drummond, Wilson or whoever, then that'd be fine. I don't see why they would be upset about wanting to be "more a part of the process" if that was their motivation, but whatever.

The discussion here, at least from me, isn't about anyone in particular. It is about a type of person and that type does not operate from that humanitarian motivation. I don't know why anyone would advocate cozying up to that type of person.

 

[Tad Footeball]

Wow you guys have no real clue. If you really think Chad and Jon are problems to Miami then you don't understand the landscape of Miami or Recruiting. Just because they had prospects that didn't pick UM doesn't mean they were the problem. Rip the coaching staff for not offering those Uschool platers and Rip the coaches for playing that terrible soft defense. As a coach you do your best to help kids pick a school that's best for THEM not your favorite team. I wouldn't steer a kid to go play DT in that system, or BEG a school to come recruit a highly rated LEGACY player smh. They're doing a thankless job for the most part. As a coach I commend them for the way they help get kids offers that otherwise couldn't even step foot on some of these campuses.

Blah blah blah. Yep. All of these guys are selfless saints that only have the best interest of the kids in mind. They all have legitimate primary sources of income outside of youth football and have no financial stake in any of this. Just a bunch of dudes running around the community looking to be father figures...to the highly recruited kids.

In relation to the actual high school corches that think they hold all of the power in their interactions with UM, they also don't truly have the best interest of ALL of their kids in mind. The 2 and 3 star kids on their teams that actually want to stay home and "rep the 305" will eventually be frozen out in lieu of kids from programs with adult coaches that realize they're high school coaches for a reason or for out of state kids from areas not as slimey as here. Sure, that type of adversial relationship hurts UM more in the long run (see Corch Randy) but don't pretend that these local corch's egos haven't hurt some of their kids too.

In relation to Chad Wilson specifically, the guy is a clown. Don't go back to UM 40 years later for free and then turn around and badmouth the entire program and fanbase because you didn't get a sitdown. Everything else is ancillary. The fact that the school actually footed the bill for him to finish his degree should have been enough for him to handle his issue quietly. Do we really think Alfred intentionally snubbed him? Chad just can't accept that he wasn't even on Golden's radar as someone that needed gladhanding.

 

[MdCanesFan]

And win games.

Uf went 4-8 and Muchamp still pulls more hoes than diabeetus gut golden...... To ash Lupoi at cal, Adrian Klemm at UCLA. FSU wasn't doing a **** thing before this year, but jumbo was still recruiting his *** off. All about relationships, connections, etc...... Winning helps but it's not the end all be all. Uf went 6-6 the first year chump was there and he still recruited at a very high level. Before 2012 jumbo had never won 11 games in a season since he took over as head corch.

Gulden just ****ing sucks, that's reality. Chili dog nerds and optimistic fans bought into the "golden hype" before he did a mother****ing thing, which is understandable. However, at some point it's time to face the facts. Dude has a CLEAR BIAS TOWARDS HIS lover diahrrea Dorito. Dude helped produce THE WORST DEFENSE IN UM HISTORY. And that's not hyperbole, he literally was responsible for producing the worst defense in SCHOOL HISTORY. Think about that for a min, and how can anyone rationalize why that ****ing guy is still employed at UM. Gulden negative recruited himself keeping his *** around. Other coaches pounce on **** like that, and hammer it into kids heads that the so called "defense" ****ing sucks and so does the guy attempting to run it.

The sad part is I don't understand how anyone (including Golden) can truly believe that our defense will be better this year. I mean, the success of our defense hinges on a JUCO kid that hasn't even hit campus yet nor is guaranteed to ever hit campus. Let that sink in for a minute. When this defense is a disaster next year (and it's going to be a disaster) the wheels are going to come tumbling off the entire program. Call me crazy, and I probably shouldn't say this, but I think Coley realizes it and that's why we're starting to hear from various places about the work that he put in during recruiting season. History shows that Coley is opportunistic, and I guarandamntee he sees an opportunity here sooner than most think. Watch how it plays out, and when we suck, watch how we start hearing more and more about how Coley understands Miami whereas Golden doesn't. It's a coup d'etat in the making.

How can it not be better bruh?! We had KC hug-a-bear and a 2-star QB playing safety for us last year..while Armbrister had his glimpses HE was starting for us. Once this class comes in and gives us some more depth and talent then we will be better. Seattle runs the Tampa 2..so does the Dallas Cowboys, the difference between the two defenses was Seattle has the talent and all of Dallas' talent went on IR. Any scheme can be ran with the right amount of talent even Coach No'Ds.

 

[jump1cane]

C4L, Did you miss the part where Pete said Yearby had a handler? You think he got paid too?

You people see the word 'handler' and assume it involves shady dealings. A lot of these dudes grow up without fathers and so they have mentors, coaches, uncles, buddy from the block, etc. who are a part of their life and eventually become a part of their recruiting process. Some coaches consider those people 'third parties' and don't want to work with them but that's problematic. If a kid has been mentored by a guy since pop warner then why the **** would that person not be a part of their recruiting process? These are people they trust. That's what Pete means by embracing the third parties. But I guess its best to remain ignorant and accuse everybody of shopping kids for a payoff.

Yeah and they all charge $4.99 for the opportunity to see where these kids end up. I'm sure they take the time to drive them around for free and that McDonald/gas money really is McDonald, Gas money. No doubt that there are true mentors out there, but they are not latching to kids and charging for services.

 

[killa1storm]

C4L, Did you miss the part where Pete said Yearby had a handler? You think he got paid too?

You people see the word 'handler' and assume it involves shady dealings. A lot of these dudes grow up without fathers and so they have mentors, coaches, etc. who are a part of their life and eventually become a part of their recruiting process. Some coaches consider those people 'third parties' and don't want to work with them but that's problematic. If a kid has been mentored by a guy since pop warner then why the **** would that person not be a part of their recruiting process? These are people they trust. That's what Pete means by embracing the third parties. But I guess its best to remain ignorant and accuse everybody of shopping kids for a payoff.

No NO NO sir. Im sorry but its clear we are talking about different things here. We are OBVIOUSLY Dealing with "handlers and mentors" already, since as you and Pete have clearly stated, Yearby had one, as did some of these other kids. But were now talking about Genron, and there is this implication that we need to make a guy like that a "part of the process". A guy who has ADMITTEDLY taken money from schools to shop players, and was booted from SFE for unethical behavior.

So were talking about two different animals here. Because if this was simply about dealing with a handler or mentor of a kid, it would obviously be a moot point no? Since we just signed several that had them.

I think the point Pete is trying to make is that while many of you may see Genron as a dirty dude, the recruits he deals with may not see him that way.

Now I don't know if he's shopping players or whatever. But even if he is there's probably a kid that he's mentored who trusts him. So embrace him as much as you can within the rules. I think that's the point.

Instead of saying 'he has a handler, we're not dealing with him.' Not all 'handlers' are in it for dirty reasons. In the case of a guy like Yearby Coley cultivated that relationship whereas maybe without Coley that's a situation your staff may not have touched. Who knows.

But how far can the staff push the envolope being on NCAA probation? I mean we are going to be getting cozy with a guy who has ADMITTED he takes money for shopping players, and was booted off SFE for unethical conduct? I mean that is a recipie for DISASTER. The Yahoo, the Herald and the NCAA will blow a load in their pants if they see us cozied up with Genron hanging around UM.

There are MULTIPLE people on a number of boards now that have confirmed that there is an NCAA investigation into Genron. Ive seen the same name from the NCAA mentioned as someone that has been looking into him and asking for any information related to his activities. Im pretty confident that he is on the NCAA radar big time. If that guy was hanging around UM, that is a disaster waiting to happen.

That might be a point too.

But I think big picture is that its a 'respect' thing for a lot of these guys. Sad to say its still that way in a lot of black communities. If you have a guy who's the uncle, cousin, mentor, coach, etc. of a kid and has been there throughout this recruits life, they're gonna want to be involved in that kid's recruitment. And they should be. So not embracing them is seen as direspectufl. Sorta like going to a recruits house and not embracing the parents.

Like Pete and others have said its not going away. And a large part of that is because most of these dudes don't have fathers in the home growing up, so somebody is usually serving in that role as the 'third party.' This ain't really about Genron specifically, don't GAF about that dude. Embrace him, if you see he's about shady business then you move on.

 

[CANE4LIFE]

The real problem here IMO is 7 on 7. As that league attracts more and more shady cats, the compliance department at UM is going to have a f*cking stroke if the staff tries to deal with some of them and their coaches and handlers. After the Shapiro disaster, they are going to be on high alert for anyone they think is shady, and that is going to include a LOT of these 7 on 7 coaches and hanger ons. The staff is caught in a lose lose situation here.

 

[killa1storm]

C4L, Did you miss the part where Pete said Yearby had a handler? You think he got paid too?

You people see the word 'handler' and assume it involves shady dealings. A lot of these dudes grow up without fathers and so they have mentors, coaches, uncles, buddy from the block, etc. who are a part of their life and eventually become a part of their recruiting process. Some coaches consider those people 'third parties' and don't want to work with them but that's problematic. If a kid has been mentored by a guy since pop warner then why the **** would that person not be a part of their recruiting process? These are people they trust. That's what Pete means by embracing the third parties. But I guess its best to remain ignorant and accuse everybody of shopping kids for a payoff.

Yeah and they all charge $4.99 for the opportunity to see where these kids end up. I'm sure they take the time to drive them around for free and that McDonald/gas money really is McDonald, Gas money. No doubt that there are true mentors out there, but they are not latching to kids and charging for services.

You're jumping to conclusions brah.

I know you'll dismiss it but I can only tell you what I know from my experiences. One of my buddies got recruited and his uncle handled his entire recruitment. Both parents were in his life but they didn't feel they knew much and didn't want to deal with it. His uncle was a guy that trained him, did drills with him, etc. and helped him become the player he was. That dude drove him to all his camps, called coaches on his behalf, paid for his trips on unofficials, etc. Handled his entire recruitment. Somebody like you would probably think he's doing it for ulterior reasons and is dirty.

I know of multiple examples of these kind of arrangements. Are there some dirty handlers out there? **** yea. But don't make that assumption with everybody. Most of these dudes are poor as **** and have no idea how the recruitment process works, there's almost always a 3rd party.

 

[canetothemax]

honestly, this a continuation of all the threads at this point. These guys aren't going to go away anytime soon. I just hope they somehow stop interfering with our recruiting eventually.

 

[bobbydigius]

I would actually do the opposite. Cut out those two scumbags for sure. That whole BS Q and A with Wilson convinced me of that. No one is bigger than the squad. Start recruiting areas where the scholarship is respected.

Yeah that would be ideal, but you keep missing one of the main points here, and that is that these kids they represent respect them. So how are you gonna just cut them out?

 

[CANE4LIFE]

Killa has a point, and I think it needs to be fleshed out. NOT every "mentor/handler" is a pimp. There are many kids that for whatever reason have someone, a coach, family friend, relative, etc... handling their recruitment. So just because a kid has a handler or a mentor doesnt automatically mean its a shady situation. I think what we are talking about here, are the obvious hustler/street agents acting as handlers, which is where things go to sh*t real fast.

 

[CANE1775]

We're ALL dirty. Let's figure out a way to get this cleared up in the best way possible.

 

[OBLIVION]

Looks like CIS is trying to jedi mind trick it posters into believing these types are needed.

The areas our coaches need too adapt. Is winning at a high level, and developing the talent they are getting. Into guys that are sure fire 1st round talent.

The lack in the area's above. Are the only true selling points these devils have. At steering kids away from this program. Take this away from them, and they are up a creek with no paddle.

I understand why a guy like Pete needs these guys around, but this program doesn't.

 

[killa1storm]

Killa has a point, and I think it needs to be fleshed out. NOT every "mentor/handler" is a pimp. There are many kids that for whatever reason have someone, a coach, family friend, relative, etc... handling their recruitment. So just because a kid has a handler or a mentor doesnt automatically mean its a shady situation. I think what we are talking about here, are the obvious hustler/street agents acting as handlers, which is where things go to sh*t real fast.

Yep.

Pete can clarify but I think based on his comments here and in other threads it seems like Miami's staff made a decision early on not to deal with any recruit who has a handler. But that's problematic because as you said not all handlers are the street agent type. So you've just cut yourself off from a lot of talent right off the bat. Most of these dudes from the inner city have a 3rd party involved for numerous reasons.