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The case for Tom Herman as HC (Please don't merge)

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Cane44 said:
depends if he want's to relax for 2 more years making great money, or get right back into the insanity?? maybe depends how ****ed he is at Texas and wants them to pay every cent of the buyout, to to spite them... Not sure he's too worried about being an attractive name for a big OC gig in 2years or even a mid tier HC job...
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If he wants to relax for 2 more years he's not the guy for us.

It really is that simple.
 
I just re-examined Herman’s resume at Texas & the worst loss he had was in year 1 vs TCU by 21 & that was with nothing but Charlie Strong’s roster...

But in terms of point deferential 17 of the 18 losses he had in 4 years at Texas, literally none of them were more than 14 points. In 2018 after beating Oklahoma in the regular season they lost in the rematch to Okla in the Big XII title game by 12 points, but then beat a top 10 ranked UGA in Alamo Bowl. But the rest of the losses that season were a combined 9 points in 3 games. That means that season Texas literally lost 3 games off one possession in year 2 of Herman’s tenure.

Then the following year they had a 7 point loss to LSU, another 7 point loss to Oklahoma, 10 point loss to TCU, 2 point loss to Iowa St & a 14 point loss to Baylor. But then finished the year with a another Alamo bowl victory vs Utah.

Then last year in the truncated Covid season, had a two point loss to TCU, an 8 point loss in a 4OT game vs Oklahoma & 3 point loss to Iowa St, followed by another Alamo bowl win lol.

Also had the #3 ranked class Nationally in 2018 (Herman’s first class), #3 ranked class in 2019, #8 ranked class for 2020 & you could argue he also built most Texas’s 2021 class considering he was fired in January of 2021 & most of their class was signed in December of 2020.

So what I take from all that is, Herman had really good offenses at Texas but struggled in 3 years finding the proper DC to settle the tide of having to play in the high impact offensive league of the Big XII, which to be fair there really aren’t any good Defenses in the conference. But with that said, he finished 32-18, but his biggest issue was beating Oklahoma & having closes losses vs TCU. You could argue that he really didn’t deserve to be fired, but that will really only be a point to be made in comparison to how Sark does by year 4 as well.

Herman is 3rd on my list in terms of coaches I think would fit well here mainly because of his offensive acuity & if you compare resumes he had more success within his first 4 years than Stoops & did so at a much more pressure packed program in Texas, the only difference is he didn’t have the job security that Stoops had especially considering Stoops didn’t actually have a winning season until year 6 of his tenure. I didn’t do a comparison with Cristobal at Oregon because IMO the PAC-12 is the easiest/worst P5 conference & with USC & Washington being down their record is skewered to look better than it actually is, the degree of difficulty is less than IMO.

I’m 100% certain Miami will not & would never hire Herman, but I fully expect him to get hired at a vacancy that opens up for next year & it’ll be interesting to see what kind of job he takes & if his reputation has been scarred too much from his Texas to overcome.
 
ItsAUThing.com said:
Talk to anybody in the know in Austin — known cokehead and wild-animal swinger with his wife.

Probably a fun dude to hang out with, but this is literally the last guy who should be anywhere where South Beach and the University of Miami. He couldn't even handle the rigors of Austin's night life.

Hard, hard, hard pass.
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A guy named Erickson managed to win here and on most nights in the Grove or Old Cutler Inn he wasn't ambulatory after 10pm..
 
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Liberty City El said:
I just re-examined Herman’s resume at Texas & the worst loss he had was in year 1 vs TCU by 21 & that was with nothing but Charlie Strong’s roster...

But in terms of point deferential 17 of the 18 losses he had in 4 years at Texas, literally none of them were more than 14 points. In 2018 after beating Oklahoma in the regular season they lost in the rematch to Okla in the Big XII title game by 12 points, but then beat a top 10 ranked UGA in Alamo Bowl. But the rest of the losses that season were a combined 9 points in 3 games. That means that season Texas literally lost 3 games off one possession in year 2 of Herman’s tenure.

Then the following year they had a 7 point loss to LSU, another 7 point loss to Oklahoma, 10 point loss to TCU, 2 point loss to Iowa St & a 14 point loss to Baylor. But then finished the year with a another Alamo bowl victory vs Utah.

Then last year in the truncated Covid season, had a two point loss to TCU, an 8 point loss in a 4OT game vs Oklahoma & 3 point loss to Iowa St, followed by another Alamo bowl win lol.

Also had the #3 ranked class Nationally in 2018 (Herman’s first class), #3 ranked class in 2019, #8 ranked class for 2020 & you could argue he also built most Texas’s 2021 class considering he was fired in January of 2021 & most of their class was signed in December of 2020.

So what I take from all that is, Herman had really good offenses at Texas but struggled in 3 years finding the proper DC to settle the tide of having to play in the high impact offensive league of the Big XII, which to be fair there really aren’t any good Defenses in the conference. But with that said, he finished 32-18, but his biggest issue was beating Oklahoma & having closes losses vs TCU. You could argue that he really didn’t deserve to be fired, but that will really only be a point to be made in comparison to how Sark does by year 4 as well.

Herman is 3rd on my list in terms of coaches I think would fit well here mainly because of his offensive acuity & if you compare resumes he had more success within his first 4 years than Stoops & did so at a much more pressure packed program in Texas, the only difference is he didn’t have the job security that Stoops had especially considering Stoops didn’t actually have a winning season until year 6 of his tenure. I didn’t do a comparison with Cristobal at Oregon because IMO the PAC-12 is the easiest/worst P5 conference & with USC & Washington being down their record is skewered to look better than it actually is, the degree of difficulty is less than IMO.

I’m 100% certain Miami will not & would never hire Herman, but I fully expect him to get hired at a vacancy that opens up for next year & it’ll be interesting to see what kind of job he takes & if his reputation has been scarred too much from his Texas to overcome.
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It's the same thing I saw with Herman. The Texas BOT seemed to want to have too much input and his worst year in TX came at the time of the Zach Smith debacle. It's a shame Miami wouldn't hire Herman because he never got caught doing anything wrong. It's all hearsay at this point. I am hoping a new AD will change how we look at HC candidates moving forward.

I do think Stoops is another good coaching candidate as well to consider. He coaches at Kentucky and has to go against SEC competition. He took over a 2-10 football team, so his road to building a program would be more challenging than others.
However, He just had seven players draft in 2021, has had three pro bowlers come out of his program, teams usually rank within the top 50 in defense, and fields discipline teams that consistently rank well in YPG when it comes to penalties.

We share the same concern when it comes to his offense. It could be he is just working with what he's got. The numbers show they try to control the time of possession and do enough to win that way. That won't fly in Miami.

If it's Stoops, I hope he will find a good up-and-coming OC to come with him. The answer could be in the same State. WKU Zach Kittley would be a name to consider, not just for him but any coach we get. Air-Raid :)
 
Google the words "Tom Herman Zach Smith Newsweek" and see what you find. Stoops would be the better hire. Herman unlikely to pass basic DD by the BOT.
 
Liberty City El said:
Also had the #3 ranked class Nationally in 2018 (Herman’s first class), #3 ranked class in 2019, #8 ranked class for 2020 & you could argue he also built most Texas’s 2021 class considering he was fired in January of 2021 & most of their class was signed in December of 2020.
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This, plus the fact that Sarkisian is 4-3, tells me that Texas has overrated recruits. With classes ranked that high, you should be in contention for the CFP or a NY6 bowl.
 
Liberty City El said:
I just re-examined Herman’s resume at Texas & the worst loss he had was in year 1 vs TCU by 21 & that was with nothing but Charlie Strong’s roster...

But in terms of point deferential 17 of the 18 losses he had in 4 years at Texas, literally none of them were more than 14 points. In 2018 after beating Oklahoma in the regular season they lost in the rematch to Okla in the Big XII title game by 12 points, but then beat a top 10 ranked UGA in Alamo Bowl. But the rest of the losses that season were a combined 9 points in 3 games. That means that season Texas literally lost 3 games off one possession in year 2 of Herman’s tenure.

Then the following year they had a 7 point loss to LSU, another 7 point loss to Oklahoma, 10 point loss to TCU, 2 point loss to Iowa St & a 14 point loss to Baylor. But then finished the year with a another Alamo bowl victory vs Utah.

Then last year in the truncated Covid season, had a two point loss to TCU, an 8 point loss in a 4OT game vs Oklahoma & 3 point loss to Iowa St, followed by another Alamo bowl win lol.

Also had the #3 ranked class Nationally in 2018 (Herman’s first class), #3 ranked class in 2019, #8 ranked class for 2020 & you could argue he also built most Texas’s 2021 class considering he was fired in January of 2021 & most of their class was signed in December of 2020.

So what I take from all that is, Herman had really good offenses at Texas but struggled in 3 years finding the proper DC to settle the tide of having to play in the high impact offensive league of the Big XII, which to be fair there really aren’t any good Defenses in the conference. But with that said, he finished 32-18, but his biggest issue was beating Oklahoma & having closes losses vs TCU. You could argue that he really didn’t deserve to be fired, but that will really only be a point to be made in comparison to how Sark does by year 4 as well.

Herman is 3rd on my list in terms of coaches I think would fit well here mainly because of his offensive acuity & if you compare resumes he had more success within his first 4 years than Stoops & did so at a much more pressure packed program in Texas, the only difference is he didn’t have the job security that Stoops had especially considering Stoops didn’t actually have a winning season until year 6 of his tenure. I didn’t do a comparison with Cristobal at Oregon because IMO the PAC-12 is the easiest/worst P5 conference & with USC & Washington being down their record is skewered to look better than it actually is, the degree of difficulty is less than IMO.

I’m 100% certain Miami will not & would never hire Herman, but I fully expect him to get hired at a vacancy that opens up for next year & it’ll be interesting to see what kind of job he takes & if his reputation has been scarred too much from his Texas to overcome.
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great post. From a strictly coaching perspective, Herman is my number one choice.

I hear a lot of ppl refer to off the field stuff and personality, which to be honest, i don't know about.

But from a coaching perspective, get him a decent DC and he would kill it at UM. We dont have Oklahoma level teams in the coastal, or Pat Fitzgerald type coaches in the coastal. It would be easy money imo.
 
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CaneSince4Ever said:
This, plus the fact that Sarkisian is 4-3, tells me that Texas has overrated recruits. With classes ranked that high, you should be in contention for the CFP or a NY6 bowl.
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Sark is gonna go the way of Herman in 3 years. Texas is maybe the weirdest job in all of college football. How they’re not winning is so wild. All the money for players and staff yet they suck. And they have a top 3 running back in the nation. Embarrassing.
 
Liberty City El said:
I just re-examined Herman’s resume at Texas & the worst loss he had was in year 1 vs TCU by 21 & that was with nothing but Charlie Strong’s roster...

But in terms of point deferential 17 of the 18 losses he had in 4 years at Texas, literally none of them were more than 14 points. In 2018 after beating Oklahoma in the regular season they lost in the rematch to Okla in the Big XII title game by 12 points, but then beat a top 10 ranked UGA in Alamo Bowl. But the rest of the losses that season were a combined 9 points in 3 games. That means that season Texas literally lost 3 games off one possession in year 2 of Herman’s tenure.

Then the following year they had a 7 point loss to LSU, another 7 point loss to Oklahoma, 10 point loss to TCU, 2 point loss to Iowa St & a 14 point loss to Baylor. But then finished the year with a another Alamo bowl victory vs Utah.

Then last year in the truncated Covid season, had a two point loss to TCU, an 8 point loss in a 4OT game vs Oklahoma & 3 point loss to Iowa St, followed by another Alamo bowl win lol.

Also had the #3 ranked class Nationally in 2018 (Herman’s first class), #3 ranked class in 2019, #8 ranked class for 2020 & you could argue he also built most Texas’s 2021 class considering he was fired in January of 2021 & most of their class was signed in December of 2020.

So what I take from all that is, Herman had really good offenses at Texas but struggled in 3 years finding the proper DC to settle the tide of having to play in the high impact offensive league of the Big XII, which to be fair there really aren’t any good Defenses in the conference. But with that said, he finished 32-18, but his biggest issue was beating Oklahoma & having closes losses vs TCU. You could argue that he really didn’t deserve to be fired, but that will really only be a point to be made in comparison to how Sark does by year 4 as well.

Herman is 3rd on my list in terms of coaches I think would fit well here mainly because of his offensive acuity & if you compare resumes he had more success within his first 4 years than Stoops & did so at a much more pressure packed program in Texas, the only difference is he didn’t have the job security that Stoops had especially considering Stoops didn’t actually have a winning season until year 6 of his tenure. I didn’t do a comparison with Cristobal at Oregon because IMO the PAC-12 is the easiest/worst P5 conference & with USC & Washington being down their record is skewered to look better than it actually is, the degree of difficulty is less than IMO.

I’m 100% certain Miami will not & would never hire Herman, but I fully expect him to get hired at a vacancy that opens up for next year & it’ll be interesting to see what kind of job he takes & if his reputation has been scarred too much from his Texas to overcome.
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thank you for the common sense sir, these dudes on here dont know a fuqin thing
 
305407cane said:
Sark is gonna go the way of Herman in 3 years. Texas is maybe the weirdest job in all of college football. How they’re not winning is so wild. All the money for players and staff yet they suck. And they have a top 3 running back in the nation. Embarrassing.
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What kills me is when some of our fans say we need to completely abandon South Florida recruiting, but give Texas a pass even though their recruiting classes are 99.9999999% kids from Texas LOL.
 
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Juanka said:
It's the same thing I saw with Herman. The Texas BOT seemed to want to have too much input and his worst year in TX came at the time of the Zach Smith debacle. It's a shame Miami wouldn't hire Herman because he never got caught doing anything wrong. It's all hearsay at this point. I am hoping a new AD will change how we look at HC candidates moving forward.

I do think Stoops is another good coaching candidate as well to consider. He coaches at Kentucky and has to go against SEC competition. He took over a 2-10 football team, so his road to building a program would be more challenging than others.
However, He just had seven players draft in 2021, has had three pro bowlers come out of his program, teams usually rank within the top 50 in defense, and fields discipline teams that consistently rank well in YPG when it comes to penalties.

We share the same concern when it comes to his offense. It could be he is just working with what he's got. The numbers show they try to control the time of possession and do enough to win that way. That won't fly in Miami.

If it's Stoops, I hope he will find a good up-and-coming OC to come with him. The answer could be in the same State. WKU Zach Kittley would be a name to consider, not just for him but any coach we get. Air-Raid :)
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Zach Kittley is a young Coach I been talking about on here since he was Houston Baptist, if we were smart enough to snatch him from WKU he’d would absolutely DESTROY the ACC as an OC!

And I’m right there with you, I absolutely think we should get an Air Raid OC, not the Leach style Air Raid but the Riley, Heupel, Lebby, Briles etc adapted Air Raid, that would make our offense elite. & would have us beating the teams we’re clearly more talented than in the Coastal.
 
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Liberty City El said:
I just re-examined Herman’s resume at Texas & the worst loss he had was in year 1 vs TCU by 21 & that was with nothing but Charlie Strong’s roster...

But in terms of point deferential 17 of the 18 losses he had in 4 years at Texas, literally none of them were more than 14 points. In 2018 after beating Oklahoma in the regular season they lost in the rematch to Okla in the Big XII title game by 12 points, but then beat a top 10 ranked UGA in Alamo Bowl. But the rest of the losses that season were a combined 9 points in 3 games. That means that season Texas literally lost 3 games off one possession in year 2 of Herman’s tenure.

Then the following year they had a 7 point loss to LSU, another 7 point loss to Oklahoma, 10 point loss to TCU, 2 point loss to Iowa St & a 14 point loss to Baylor. But then finished the year with a another Alamo bowl victory vs Utah.

Then last year in the truncated Covid season, had a two point loss to TCU, an 8 point loss in a 4OT game vs Oklahoma & 3 point loss to Iowa St, followed by another Alamo bowl win lol.

Also had the #3 ranked class Nationally in 2018 (Herman’s first class), #3 ranked class in 2019, #8 ranked class for 2020 & you could argue he also built most Texas’s 2021 class considering he was fired in January of 2021 & most of their class was signed in December of 2020.

So what I take from all that is, Herman had really good offenses at Texas but struggled in 3 years finding the proper DC to settle the tide of having to play in the high impact offensive league of the Big XII, which to be fair there really aren’t any good Defenses in the conference. But with that said, he finished 32-18, but his biggest issue was beating Oklahoma & having closes losses vs TCU. You could argue that he really didn’t deserve to be fired, but that will really only be a point to be made in comparison to how Sark does by year 4 as well.

Herman is 3rd on my list in terms of coaches I think would fit well here mainly because of his offensive acuity & if you compare resumes he had more success within his first 4 years than Stoops & did so at a much more pressure packed program in Texas, the only difference is he didn’t have the job security that Stoops had especially considering Stoops didn’t actually have a winning season until year 6 of his tenure. I didn’t do a comparison with Cristobal at Oregon because IMO the PAC-12 is the easiest/worst P5 conference & with USC & Washington being down their record is skewered to look better than it actually is, the degree of difficulty is less than IMO.

I’m 100% certain Miami will not & would never hire Herman, but I fully expect him to get hired at a vacancy that opens up for next year & it’ll be interesting to see what kind of job he takes & if his reputation has been scarred too much from his Texas to overcome.
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Todd Orlando at DC (even though he hired him) should have given TH a pass with UT.

Orlando is Coach No'D bad.
 
Liberty City El said:
Zach Kittley is a young Coach I been talking about on here since he was Houston Baptist, if we were smart enough to snatch him from WKU he’d would absolutely DESTROY the ACC as an OC!

And I’m right there with you, I absolutely think we should get an Air Raid OC, not the Leach style Air Raid but the Riley, Heupel, Lebby, Briles etc adapted Air Raid, that would make our offense elite. & would have us beating the teams we’re clearly more talented than in the Coastal.
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Is Kittley one of them? I didn’t follow WKU but I know their QB is putting out HUGE numbers.
 
ssvir said:
Todd Orlando at DC (even though he hired him) should have given TH a pass with UT.

Orlando is Coach No'D bad.
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100%, Todd Orlando’s Defenses have been bad since his days back at FIU with Butch.

That’s what stuck out to me in taking a deeper dive at Herman’s tenure at UT, even with how awful his Defenses were he literally never got blown out one time in 4 years.

Now that might seem trivial in a way, but IMO that matters a great deal because in comparison, Manuel Diaz’s have gotten blown out routinely literally every year he’s been here. Like we’ve had games where it looked like our Defense had never even played Football before.

The fact Herman basically had 17 one possession game losses in contrast to 32 wins plus 5-0 in Bowl games showed me that as a Coach he understood how to stabilize drastic moments in games & not allow for his teams to be overwhelmed by being down by a few scores & having to come back.

He’s not the perfect coach in terms of some of his idiosyncrasies, but he has a lot more substance as a play caller & X’s & O’s guy than just being a bluster-full showman, which IMO is what we really need. I prefer we get a guy who doesn’t give AF about winning press conferences or having home run quotes, but just a pure lab technician who will scheme up up TD’s in his sleep & utilize the skill players we have to their strengths.
 
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