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Real talk about 2012...

Joecane said:
Why would Buchanon scare you at WLB?
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Because I have no faith in him improving. He is what he is IMHO at this point. And even more so I have little faith of him being able to stay on the field. So we should really list the 3rd guy in there too. I'd love to see him beat out.
 
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bomb said:
Joecane said:
Why would Buchanon scare you at WLB?
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Because I have no faith in him improving. He is what he is IMHO at this point. And even more so I have little faith of him being able to stay on the field. So we should really list the 3rd guy in there too. I'd love to see him beat out.
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But he's been at SLB. IMO, he's much more suited to play WLB.
 
My best take at the lineup:

LT: Henderson/Bunche/Flowers
LG: Washington/Wheeler/Lewis
C: Linder/McDermott
RG: Feliciano/Linder
RT: Bunche/Johnson/Gadbois

TE: Walford/Cleveland
TE: Dye/White

WR: Streeter/Scott
WR: Hurns/Dorsett/the best freshman

QB: Morris/Williams/Dewey/Crow
FB: Hagens/Calhoun
TB: James/Clements/Duke

Offensive recruiting has been way ahead of the defense and it shows. The Class of 2010 is an example of a strong offensive recruiting class and a horrid defensive class. Overall, guys like Streeter, Walford, Dorsett, Hagens and the offensive line "look" how UM players should look at those positions. Morris and Williams do, too.

The defensive two deep is where we'll see Golden's recruiting. Some of his young signees need to step up and provide a spark.

DE: Chickillo/Grimble
DT: Porter/Smith
DT: Forston/Ojomo/Robinson
DE: Vernon/Pierre/Green

Chickillo and Vernon are a promising DE duo and will be relied on for heavy snaps. DT looks a lot better than it did a few months ago with Forston coming back and Ojomo developing as a nickel rusher. Don't see anyway how the defensive line is not improved.

SLB: Buchanan/Cain
MLB: Gaines/Paul
WLB: Perryman/Buchanan

FS: Telemaque/Crawford
SS: Armstrong/Highsmith

Linebacker has some talented players up front and a slew of Golden guys in development. Spence's next-level ability will be missed but Perryman looks ready to take that role. Safety play should be status quo, which is not good. Crawford or somebody else need to inject life into this group.

CB: McGee/Rodgers/Freshmen
CB: Finnie/Payne/Freshmen

Another bad year at corner. The top two have a chance. McGee showed improvement late in the year and Finnie is a fast, hard-nosed player. The key will be developing the freshmen, who are fairly polished corners coming in.

The difference between 6-6 and 9-3 was small this year. With another year in the system and the same or better level of talent, I expect (and I'm sure Golden expects) those wins to swing the other way.
 
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Andrew said:
Who do you think will be our 2012 Tommy Streeter?
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I'm hoping it's Brandon McGee.

Individually, his performance was one of the most disappointing. With his physical gifts, he had a chance to be an anchor on one side.

Maybe he can put it all together and have a great Senior campaign. He seemed to make incremental improvements as the year went on.
 
DMoney said:
My best take at the lineup:

LT: Henderson/Bunche/Flowers
LG: Washington/Wheeler/Lewis
C: Linder/McDermott
RG: Feliciano/Linder
RT: Bunche/Johnson/Gadbois

TE: Walford/Cleveland
TE: Dye/White

WR: Streeter/Scott
WR: Hurns/Dorsett/the best freshman

QB: Morris/Williams/Dewey/Crow
FB: Hagens/Calhoun
TB: James/Clements/Duke

Offensive recruiting has been way ahead of the defense and it shows. The Class of 2010 is an example of a strong offensive recruiting class and a horrid defensive class. Overall, guys like Streeter, Walford, Dorsett, Hagens and the offensive line "look" how UM players should look at those positions. Morris and Williams do, too.

The defensive two deep is where we'll see Golden's recruiting. Some of his young signees need to step up and provide a spark.

DE: Chickillo/Grimble
DT: Porter/Smith
DT: Forston/Ojomo/Robinson
DE: Vernon/Pierre/Green

Chickillo and Vernon are a promising DE duo and will be relied on for heavy snaps. DT looks a lot better than it did a few months ago with Forston coming back and Ojomo developing as a nickel rusher. Don't see anyway how the defensive line is not improved.

SLB: Buchanan/Cain
MLB: Gaines/Paul
WLB: Perryman/Buchanan

FS: Telemaque/Crawford
SS: Armstrong/Highsmith

Linebacker has some talented players up front and a slew of Golden guys in development. Spence's next-level ability will be missed but Perryman looks ready to take that role. Safety play should be status quo, which is not good. Crawford or somebody else need to inject life into this group.

CB: McGee/Rodgers/Freshmen
CB: Finnie/Payne/Freshmen

Another bad year at corner. The top two have a chance. McGee showed improvement late in the year and Finnie is a fast, hard-nosed player. The key will be developing the freshmen, who are fairly polished corners coming in.

The difference between 6-6 and 9-3 was small this year. With another year in the system and the same or better level of talent, I expect (and I'm sure Golden expects) those wins to swing the other way.
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Totally agree with this breakdown. Offense looks very good on paper. I think Morris wins the job and is an improvement over Jac. Very good trio of receivers and great depth and upside at TE. Starting OL on paper should be great, but I'll feel a lot better about that happening if Kehole's gone.

Like I said earlier, a great DL can mask deficiencies in the secondary. Next year's DL has the potential to be a **** good one. Great set of ends and I really liked what I saw of Porter in limited action this season. Other starting DT spot is a bit of a question mark but we actually have good depth there for a change. I think Perryman does a nice job replacing Spence, and I have a hard time believing that getting Futch out of the starting 3 isn't a good thing. Whole defensive backfield is trouble. Hopefully VT slims down a bit and regains the form we saw from him earlier in his career and Crawford steps up (Ray Ray is terrible and I don't see him getting any better). Corners look ugly, period. Finnie might be a good one...past him who knows what we've got.

In the end, neither the talent nor depth will be worse next year than it was this year. With another offseason to focus on conditioning, work ethic, and getting these guys to buy into his system, I see no reason why we can't win a few more games next season. 9 wins seems realistic.
 
Like the thoughts, everyone. If the DL and OL don't get worn down by the end of the year, maybe we won't see the end of the year collapse that we've become accustomed to. Gaines scares the living **** out of me as a starting MLB. He was young and dumb this year, hopefully a year like this is just what he needed.
 
It is not hard to build in a positive direction off 6-6 at the University of Miami. Even Randy Shannon improved on that kind of junk for a few years.

Overall, the upperclassmen that return need to be de-Shannonized. If they aren't able to be rehabilitated, they need to be shown the door. Unacceptable for the upperclassmen on this team to pushed around, play lackadaisical and freelance, and play with the general aloofness they have for the previous X number of years. If you don't change how you perform off and on the field, you just got to go. Ray Ray Armstrong, Marcus Forston, amongst the players I'm calling out right now in saying that.

As for the positions that need to step up...

We need either Stephen Morris or Ryan Williams or Preston Dewey to be legit, and we need to know it, and they need to play like it from Day 1. If we start Stephen Morris, there is zero room for error on his part. He needs to be able to play at a high level right away. No learning curve for the guy.

Secondly, players on defense need to step the **** up. There were three players that played anything worth a **** all year. Sean Spence is one of them, and he's gone. The others were true freshmen (Anthony Chickillo and Denzel Perryman). Of the players that need to make the jump to NFL draft picks or at least All-ACC type players...Olivier Vernon is #1 on that list. The others include Ramon Buchanan, Brandon McGee, Vaughn Telemaque (sorry to call out your boy, D), and the aforementioned Ray Ray Armstrong and Marcus Forston. We also need to start getting play out of guys like Curtis Porter and Luther Robinson.

And not to only hold the upper classmen on D accountable, players like Thomas Finnie, Dallas Crawford, AJ Highsmith, Olsen Pierre, Gionni Paul, need to not only push the upperclassmen in front of them, they need to go out there and take their **** jobs.
 
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Don't sleep on Leggett at CB...kid is a baller and may contribute right away (assuming he gets in)
 
BigCaneAl said:
Don't sleep on Leggett at CB...kid is a baller and may contribute right away (assuming he gets in)
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Relying on a freshman to be the answer to your problems is a lesson that you never want to learn the hard way.
 
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Larry said:
It is not hard to build in a positive direction off 6-6 at the University of Miami. Even Randy Shannon improved on that kind of junk for a few years.

Overall, the upperclassmen that return need to be de-Shannonized. If they aren't able to be rehabilitated, they need to be shown the door. Unacceptable for the upperclassmen on this team to pushed around, play lackadaisical and freelance, and play with the general aloofness they have for the previous X number of years. If you don't change how you perform off and on the field, you just got to go. Ray Ray Armstrong, Marcus Forston, amongst the players I'm calling out right now in saying that.

As for the positions that need to step up...

We need either Stephen Morris or Ryan Williams or Preston Dewey to be legit, and we need to know it, and they need to play like it from Day 1. If we start Stephen Morris, there is zero room for error on his part. He needs to be able to play at a high level right away. No learning curve for the guy.

Secondly, players on defense need to step the **** up. There were three players that played anything worth a **** all year. Sean Spence is one of them, and he's gone. The others were true freshmen (Anthony Chickillo and Denzel Perryman). Of the players that need to make the jump to NFL draft picks or at least All-ACC type players...Olivier Vernon is #1 on that list. The others include Ramon Buchanan, Brandon McGee, Vaughn Telemaque (sorry to call out your boy, D), and the aforementioned Ray Ray Armstrong and Marcus Forston. We also need to start getting play out of guys like Curtis Porter and Luther Robinson.

And not to only hold the upper classmen on D accountable, players like Thomas Finnie, Dallas Crawford, AJ Highsmith, Olsen Pierre, Gionni Paul, need to not only push the upperclassmen in front of them, they need to go out there and take their **** jobs.
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They have 1 year in the new culture, another spring/summer will help a lot.
 
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We're wasting no time whatsoever laying the foundations for excuses next year. The flies aren't even completely congregated on the heap of **** that is this season, and we're already trying to lower the limbo bar.

Folks that actually know football, see Botch Davis on the sideline. We hope he improves, and we'll see how he recruits going forward.

And LOL @ D'Onofrio only leaving for an NFL gig. Lou Feinberg was running that same line about Larry Coker a few years back. Sad, stupid ****.

Golden needs a decade, but Tressell and Meyer hoisted the glass in their second year? Child please.
 
It's always hard to make these sorts of predictions bc there are so many variables. If Morris has a stellar year, then there's no telling how good we can be offensively, or vice-versa. Same with the oline, young play at cb, dt, injuries, strength of schedule, etc.

All I really want to see is progress. Another year with Golden, another year with a change in culture, another year in the S&C program. I'm not sure it's going to show in the W/L column, but if it does then we're happier for it.

Ultimately, you always know a team is back or getting there with signature, milestone wins. Who will be our UCLA win, our FSU Shockey TD we're back win? We'll notice when the team buys in and when the system and game slows down for them. It's just a different level of play, and it's very obvious.
 
Is Forston definitely coming back? I actually hope that is not the case because he plays with no real effort.

DMoney said:
Not buying it.

We return seven starters on offense. All four replacements (Morris, Seantrel, James/Clements and Bunche) have experience.

We return seven starters on defense. Three of the replacements (RayRay, Buchanan and Forston) have extensive starting experience. So that's basically ten returning starters.

The raw numbers of freshmen mean nothing. Florida was the youngest team in the NCAA when they won the title in 2006. Played more freshman than anybody, many in key roles. The important thing is signing good players.

Go position by position. At quarterback, you have two guys with starting experience who IMO are more talented than Jacory. This is their second year in Fisch's system. The offensive line returns three starters and two NFL-type behemoths with experience at tackle. Walford and Hagans are front-end talents at their respective positions. The top two receivers return, including a potential first rounder, and Dorsett should give us a more reliable version of Benjamin. Miller's playmaking will be missed but James/Clements/Duke are three good all-around football players.

The defensive line returns just about everybody and should be improved with the continued development of Porter and Ojomo. Linebackers lose Spence, but bring back four guys (Perrman, Gaines, Cain and Buchanan) who have played significant snaps. Again, one more year in the system. We lose one good player in the secondary and return everybody else. That will continue to be a trouble spot.

No reason why we can't be a better version of this year's team. And a better version of this year's team wins a lot of those close games.
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Gables said:
We're wasting no time whatsoever laying the foundations for excuses next year. The flies aren't even completely congregated on the heap of **** that is this season, and we're already trying to lower the limbo bar.

Folks that actually know football, see Botch Davis on the sideline. We hope he improves, and we'll see how he recruits going forward.

And LOL @ D'Onofrio only leaving for an NFL gig. Lou Feinberg was running that same line about Larry Coker a few years back. Sad, stupid ****.

Golden needs a decade, but Tressell and Meyer hoisted the glass in their second year? Child please.
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I hear you, but you have to take into account the fact that for TEN years this has been run like a little league team. A little league administration that hired little league coaches to run what should be a big league program. Everything is broken with this program from the way these guys train and eat all the way to the fans that have pretty much given up. It's going to take awhile to fix, if it can be fixed at all.
 
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