OT: Spencer Jones

Mr. Crabs Cane

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Easy to plead down or get dismissed- if Jones did hit him earlier, then the MMA guy got cornered in the bathroom (looks that way based on body language) a defense attorney can argue the encounter was still ongoing. Also if MMA guy got sucker punched by Jones earlier so hard he got a bloody nose, then MMA guy can ask for Jones to be charged with battery (probably lots of witnesses). Can also argue that Jones was assaulting the MMA guy, a reasonable person would be become fearful if cornered by a D1 football player in the bathroom, especially if he punched MMA guy earlier (so now Jones could be facing assault and battery charges). Most importantly, you CAN punch first and still claim self defense. The guy who throws the punch has to reasonably believe he is about to be attacked. Clear enough to me that is the case since he Jones looked like the aggressor and his buddy shoved MMA guy when he wasn't looking. I don't think a prosecutor would waste time trying to secure a doubtful felony battery conviction.

The MMA guy will have to contend with a a lawsuit, but then Jones will have deal with not only getting smacked around like a little b!tch but acting like a b!tch afterwards and suing for getting his ass kicked in a fight he started. Good luck to him in the locker room if he wants to double down on being a b!tch.

He might just be lawyering up to sue the club for poor security or some such thing as it probably has deeper pockets and insurance. Still a b!tch move, but not as bad as suing the dude who put your lights out because your buddy f#cked up.

Can the MMA guy claim to be cornered if he is on the side facing the door? Would there be an expectation for the MMA guy to first try to leave the BR? Thanks for the great analysis.
 

JD08

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Did MMA guy reasonably believe he was in danger? Your obligation to avoid confrontation doesn't mean you have to take all manners of abuse. If Jones already punched him, can't he reasonably claim he thought it was going to happen again since Jones was getting more confrontational?
 

TimeBum

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Can the MMA guy claim to be cornered if he is on the side facing the door? Would there be an expectation for the MMA guy to first try to leave the BR? Thanks for the great analysis.

Depends on the state. Some say you have a duty to retreat, others are "stand your ground." Personally, I don't think the door makes a difference in this situation because if he's in fear of bodily harm, trying to turn around and go out door would only put him in a more vulnerable position (especially if he's already been sucker punched earlier as appears to be the case). Jones size is definitely going to work against him as it is reasonable that most people, even ones who have MMA training, would be fearful that a (probably drunk) D1 football player that outweighs you by 40-50+ lbs could cause bodily harm. MMA guy isn't required to determine if Jones has any fight training before defending himself.

Look at it this way, if you are walking down a street and get boxed in two or three thugs who back you into a corner and are telling you that they about to kick your ass, then one of the group (you don't see who) throws a punch from the side and you respond by punching the guy directly in front to fight your way out, the guy you initially punched isn't going to have much of a case based on "I was just sh!t talking and he punched me first." Jones buddy is going to be the one responsible since he started the brawl by shoving MMA guy.
 
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No_Fly_Zone

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Funny you ask this question because my 18 year old son saw the video and was asking this morning how much trouble will people have for the fight.

I would expect the 2 guys, the MMA fighter and his friend to both be charged with assault. Depending on the severity of the injuries will likely determine if the charges are upgraded to a felony. If Jones needs surgery to his eye then that is almost certainly a felony. In Georgia we would charge that as aggravated assault, or aggravated battery if there is some loss of use of the eye, even if temporary, as a result of the hit.

People will likely ask that if Jones and his friend initiated the fight are they also in trouble or does that mitigate the trouble for the MMA guy and his friend. Talking **** isn't a charge and that light push is a misdemeanor at most. Remember that a person can always defend her/himself or a 3rd party in a manner and to a degree that is equivalent to the threat. The question in this case for the police and prosecutor is did the threat (**** talking and light shove) warrant the reaction from the other 2 guys. Most likely the answer will be no and they will be charged. If I was a betting person I would bet on misdemeanor probation of 12 months, fine and. possibly community service and/or anger management for the friend, and felony probation of 205 years and similar conditions for the MMA guy.

Last comment about the fight. No one was breaking it up. People today would rather film the fight than stop it. Crazy how times have changed. We would watch for a few punches but once it looked like someone may get hurt we always jumped in to stop the fight before someone went to the hospital and someone else went to jail.

On your last comment, I would not recommend somebody even consider breaking up that fight unless they themselves are trained in some form of martial art (and preferably something like MMA/Wrestling/BJJ). You approach a trained martial artist who is engaged in real life combat (i.e., non-sparring, non-competition) with another person the wrong way and no matter how well-intentioned you may be, you might be incorrectly considered a threat in the heat of the moment and dealt with on those terms. Adding alcohol to the equation only ups the likelihood of getting caught.

The filming is stupid and a sickness, though. If you aren't trained to deal with these situations, walk outside and grab security.
 

OldhamA

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I still remember chatting up my home inspector years ago. The guy was all of 5'7" maybe 145 pounds. But he had mentioned he had just fought professionally at the Miccosukee. I don't care how big you are, some trained fighter gonna whup my and probably else's ass, regardless of height/weight differences. That's a skill.

And yeah, as a practicing (civil) attorney, word to the wise-avoid fights. Someone is going to get sued. Doesn't matter what someone said. Ain't worth it. When that lawsuit comes in, hard to justify you beat some dude's ass because he made fun of your girl or your momma.

I think years ago, when men had more pride, a fight was a fight and it ended there. Now, lots of plaintiff's attorneys in town and lots of $ to be made. That bar is likely going to be sued and the mma guy will be a co-defendant. That's an easy plaintiff case right there; the Bar should have had an attendant to ensure that bathroom limited to 2-3 people for social distancing, etc. I counted 8, 9 in there.
'Chatting up' over here in the UK has an entirely different meaning. Unless you're into 5'7" home inspectors of course - in which case, more power to you.

I've always avoided street fights not because of the fear of litigation, but the fear that it's not going to be a fair fight / (especially when I was younger) it doesn't end with just fists and feet. The first time I saw a bloke's buddy pull a knife in a bar was an eye opener for me.
 

dycane

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'Chatting up' over here in the UK has an entirely different meaning. Unless you're into 5'7" home inspectors of course - in which case, more power to you.

I've always avoided street fights not because of the fear of litigation, but the fear that it's not going to be a fair fight / (especially when I was younger) it doesn't end with just fists and feet. The first time I saw a bloke's buddy pull a knife in a bar was an eye opener for me.
Fighting is dumb — and I did a lot of it 20 years ago — unless it’s necessary to protect friends or family.
 

AFCane11

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1. At first glance at the title, thought it was Spencer Rattler cause hes known to be a **** talker. 2. Both those dudes got knocked the **** out but whoever was in blue got damn near speared through a wall, lol. 3. Like @Rellyrell people said if dude got that popcorn/cauliflower unless u trained as well fall back homie.
 

MovingZen

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Funny you ask this question because my 18 year old son saw the video and was asking this morning how much trouble will people have for the fight.

I would expect the 2 guys, the MMA fighter and his friend to both be charged with assault. Depending on the severity of the injuries will likely determine if the charges are upgraded to a felony. If Jones needs surgery to his eye then that is almost certainly a felony. In Georgia we would charge that as aggravated assault, or aggravated battery if there is some loss of use of the eye, even if temporary, as a result of the hit.

People will likely ask that if Jones and his friend initiated the fight are they also in trouble or does that mitigate the trouble for the MMA guy and his friend. Talking **** isn't a charge and that light push is a misdemeanor at most. Remember that a person can always defend her/himself or a 3rd party in a manner and to a degree that is equivalent to the threat. The question in this case for the police and prosecutor is did the threat (**** talking and light shove) warrant the reaction from the other 2 guys. Most likely the answer will be no and they will be charged. If I was a betting person I would bet on misdemeanor probation of 12 months, fine and. possibly community service and/or anger management for the friend, and felony probation of 205 years and similar conditions for the MMA guy.

Last comment about the fight. No one was breaking it up. People today would rather film the fight than stop it. Crazy how times have changed. We would watch for a few punches but once it looked like someone may get hurt we always jumped in to stop the fight before someone went to the hospital and someone else went to jail.
please excuse my laymans terms here but is there some deal where two dudes mutually enter into the fight and nobody gets charged?
 

Rellyrell

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'Chatting up' over here in the UK has an entirely different meaning. Unless you're into 5'7" home inspectors of course - in which case, more power to you.

I've always avoided street fights not because of the fear of litigation, but the fear that it's not going to be a fair fight / (especially when I was younger) it doesn't end with just fists and feet. The first time I saw a bloke's buddy pull a knife in a bar was an eye opener for me.

Hence why I stopped fighting, as well. My dad always taught me all I needed was what God gave me. I realized at the age of 19, not everyone is taught that. Got into a fight w/ a dude over his chick saying nice shoes. Dude was so extra’d, but we fought & I proceeded to hit him w/ a three piece combo after he spit my way. His girl intervened, and dude tried to pull out a gun, but his girl & her homegirls was holding him back & his arm down. I was seriously fortunate b/c I was walking away & my back was turned.

Street fights hardly ever just end w/ one guy winning & one guy walking away licking his wounds.
 

Uom2001

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It looked like he was wiping his nose , like he’d maybe been hit before footage started. Also it looks like a couple of football players stereotypically bullying somebody. Which in today’s society will have the mma fighter being sympathetic. Then again you never know how any of these retards today will react to something lol.
Yeah, I wonder how the MMA dude was bloodied.
 

Tad Footeball

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As a veteran of at least 1000 bar fights and having won 14 of them, I can tell you that in most instances that it actually doesn't matter if you're fighting a wrestler or an MMA dude because they're almost always broken up before any substantial time is spent on the ground. That's why the dude with better hands is almost always victorious. This is also why you don't fight someone that looks like a stereotypical college wrestler in the hidden confines of a men's room or then this actually can become very true:

 

Canes2082

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Couple years ago... the night of the ND ass whooping in 2017 we left the stadium victorious... an over zealous drunk ND fan ran his mouth challenging one of my very good friends in the green lot at Hard Rock. This friend has practiced MMA for 10 + years. We told him to back off, go home and leave it be..... He didn't...

My friend never threw a punch but put him in some sort of hold ill never understand, but never want to be in. He let him go after 3 seconds of the guy screaming. I said, " wow you could have hurt him."

He said, " I could have killed him."... i said " well im glad were friends lol"
 

MiamiChris

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Sooooooooo my cousin is a former fixed martial artist. He’s a pretty boy, but he will beat the everlasting ish out of u. First thing he taught me; he said Rell, I know u got hands & what not, but if u ever come across a muthafcka that got an ear like me, walk away.”

Any mofo that have a crinkled or cauliflower ear, there’s a 98.9% chance he’s a MMA guy. That physical contact gave him a license to defend.

But what I’m most impressed w/ is he did this w/ some cowboy boots on. Lol
Or a wrestler who will also mess up the majority of peeps
 

The Franchise

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Play stupid games and you win stupid prizes.

ufc 239 sport GIF by UFC
What the fck is that?
 

The Franchise

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Funny you ask this question because my 18 year old son saw the video and was asking this morning how much trouble will people have for the fight.

I would expect the 2 guys, the MMA fighter and his friend to both be charged with assault. Depending on the severity of the injuries will likely determine if the charges are upgraded to a felony. If Jones needs surgery to his eye then that is almost certainly a felony. In Georgia we would charge that as aggravated assault, or aggravated battery if there is some loss of use of the eye, even if temporary, as a result of the hit.

People will likely ask that if Jones and his friend initiated the fight are they also in trouble or does that mitigate the trouble for the MMA guy and his friend. Talking **** isn't a charge and that light push is a misdemeanor at most. Remember that a person can always defend her/himself or a 3rd party in a manner and to a degree that is equivalent to the threat. The question in this case for the police and prosecutor is did the threat (**** talking and light shove) warrant the reaction from the other 2 guys. Most likely the answer will be no and they will be charged. If I was a betting person I would bet on misdemeanor probation of 12 months, fine and. possibly community service and/or anger management for the friend, and felony probation of 205 years and similar conditions for the MMA guy.

Last comment about the fight. No one was breaking it up. People today would rather film the fight than stop it. Crazy how times have changed. We would watch for a few punches but once it looked like someone may get hurt we always jumped in to stop the fight before someone went to the hospital and someone else went to jail.
Respect to your knowledge, friend, but they'd have to be fools to charge that dude. Any half decent defense attorney would be drooling over this case. In the heat of the moment, you don't have the time to respond in kind. Those guys knew they were escalating a situation and what the potential ramifications of their actions would be.

They wouldn't make sympathetic complainants at all starting shyt at a bar. There's always a real world component to every case, and when juries are involved, you need a compelling and sympathetic story. And a couple meatheads starting shyt at a bar and then getting tuned up isn't sympathetic or compelling.
 

Jaxson Villain

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Funny you ask this question because my 18 year old son saw the video and was asking this morning how much trouble will people have for the fight.

I would expect the 2 guys, the MMA fighter and his friend to both be charged with assault. Depending on the severity of the injuries will likely determine if the charges are upgraded to a felony. If Jones needs surgery to his eye then that is almost certainly a felony. In Georgia we would charge that as aggravated assault, or aggravated battery if there is some loss of use of the eye, even if temporary, as a result of the hit.

People will likely ask that if Jones and his friend initiated the fight are they also in trouble or does that mitigate the trouble for the MMA guy and his friend. Talking **** isn't a charge and that light push is a misdemeanor at most. Remember that a person can always defend her/himself or a 3rd party in a manner and to a degree that is equivalent to the threat. The question in this case for the police and prosecutor is did the threat (**** talking and light shove) warrant the reaction from the other 2 guys. Most likely the answer will be no and they will be charged. If I was a betting person I would bet on misdemeanor probation of 12 months, fine and. possibly community service and/or anger management for the friend, and felony probation of 205 years and similar conditions for the MMA guy.

Last comment about the fight. No one was breaking it up. People today would rather film the fight than stop it. Crazy how times have changed. We would watch for a few punches but once it looked like someone may get hurt we always jumped in to stop the fight before someone went to the hospital and someone else went to jail.
Buddy who won the fight looked like he had a bloody nose when the video started, seems to me there’s a case he was attacked in the bathroom and felt cornered because he got hit, didn’t respond, felt threatened, got pushed again, and beat his ass in self defense.
 
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