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OT- Have athletes gotten worse in the NBA/MLB?

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DMoney said:
We don’t have the numbers for the other dudes and they definitely weren’t training for the combine. They were worried about finishing in the paint with a beast center in the way.

Now, kids are practicing 30 footers because that’s the ticket to the league.
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Practicing 30 footers has nothing to do with who is more athletic. It’s just an added skill that’s important in this era.
 
AllAboutTheU said:
Practicing 30 footers has nothing to do with who is more athletic. It’s just an added skill that’s important in this era.
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The ability to shoot gets players in the league, or keeps them out. It is the most important ability in today’s game, over athleticism.

Humans train and eat better today, but they haven’t evolved. The only things that have changed are the rules and the traits that teams select in the draft. Shooting has surpassed athleticism as the most desired trait in the draft.
 
DMoney said:
The ability to shoot gets players in the league, or keeps them out. It is the most important ability in today’s game, over athleticism.

Humans train and eat better today, but they haven’t evolved. The only things that have changed are the rules and the traits that teams select in the draft. Shooting has surpassed athleticism as the most desired trait in the draft.
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Yes, players are on aggregate more skilled. That is undeniable. Athletes are also better. Even the freak athlete superstars are skilled, which is why people don’t just value having an athletic guy to build around anymore. That does not mean that guys aren’t more athletic in this era. You’re constantly conflating all of these things and making a pretty weak point here to live in the nostalgia of yester year.
 
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AllAboutTheU said:
Yes, players are on aggregate more skilled. That is undeniable. Athletes are also better. Even the freak athlete superstars are skilled, which is why people don’t just value having an athletic guy to build around anymore. That does not mean that guys aren’t more athletic in this era. You’re constantly conflating all of these things and making a pretty weak point here to live in the nostalgia of yester year.
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exactly right
 
TruCane81 said:
Running doesn’t just happen.It’s the result of long rebounds and turnovers, things the Bulls didn’t give up.

Pippin would be the toughest matchup of Durant’s career. His percentages would be below his average most games.

Iggy and Kukoc are a wash off the bench. Livingston is decent, but he ain’t Lou Williams coming off the bench.

With an open lane and modern physicality, the Warriors would run the Bulls out of the building because they signed big stiffs to have the size needed to deal with the great centers of the 90s.

That’s why they win under 90s rules and lose under modern rules. If that team was built for the modern game, they would have smaller more athletic bigs and longer more athletic wings. If the Warriors had to go through guys like Olajuwon, Robinson, Barkley, Ewing, Shaq, etc to get the title, they would have big stiffs down low too.

That’s why you can’t ignore the rules changes because it completely changes who can enforce their strengths better.

We watched the Warriors so AMAZING things on the court and they are a GREAT team. However the ridiculousness of some of the things they have are the result of a deliberate effort the league made to increase scoring because coaches were turning games into low scoring iso-ball wrestling matches.

They would be a great team in any era, but they would look more human forced to play outside of the environment their team was specifically built to function in, same as the Bulls.

Show me the rules, I will show you the winner.
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Basically you’re saying teams adapt to the rules and the trends in the league. Exactly right.
 
DMoney said:
Spencer Dinwiddie is the same caliber of athlete as Michael Jordan, per Spencer Dinwiddie.

Is this what we’re doing?
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Skills and intelligence / sport IQ matter more than athleticism in all sports, though I would like to understand what you mean by athleticism to begin with.

I have a hard time believing that the 90s NBA athletes were stronger and jumped higher than today’s NBA. Stronger, probably.
 
Kyle Liburd said:
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Spencer Dinwittie doesn’t Look athletic because of his style of play.

It doesn’t matter if you got a 40” when you are not that fast and don’t show out in transition.

He can jump but he isn’t that explosive on the floor with his running to really showcase it. So he doesn’t fly down the court in transition and make jaw dropping plays like guys that are shorter than him do.

He is mostly an underrated shooter and layup guy.
 
A lot of guys that are combine freaks/ athletes don’t look explosive in the game except in rare flashes under perfect conditions because they don’t have the court awareness and technical skill to make that athleticism turn into basketball plays.

It’s always been like that and applyies to other sports as well.

Durant is a weak combine athlete but his skills make him look more explosive than he is because they get him to open space on a crowded court.
 
TruCane81 said:
Spencer Dinwittie doesn’t Look athletic because of his style of play.

It doesn’t matter if you got a 40” when you are not that fast and don’t show out in transition.

He can jump but he isn’t that explosive on the floor with his running to really showcase it. So he doesn’t fly down the court in transition and make jaw dropping plays like guys that are shorter than him do.

He is mostly an underrated shooter and layup guy.
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https://www.nbadraft.net/players/spencer-dinwiddie/
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Spencer-Dinwiddie-41168/

Check his scouting report coming out.

Spencer Dinwittie doesnt look athletic because he plays wing in an era of the most athletic guys the world has ever seen play basketball.
 
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gogeta4 said:
https://www.nbadraft.net/players/spencer-dinwiddie/
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Spencer-Dinwiddie-41168/

Check his scouting report coming out.

Spencer Dinwittie doesnt look athletic because he plays wing in an era of the most athletic guys the world has ever seen play basketball.
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As we have written before, he is not the most explosive athlete, but he shows the quickness, first step, and body control to suggest that he can play a variety of positions and roles at the next level. - Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Spencer-Dinwiddie-41168/ ©DraftExpress

This is an excerpt from the link you posted. Dinwiddie has good handle and athleticism, but he doesn’t have superstar athletic ability or skill.

He compared himself to Jordan when he has nowhere near the skill, craftiness or tenacity. It’s laughable.

The only thing similar about them are their height and vert.

The rules changes have affected 2 guards the most because now point guards can get into the lane better and their superior passing ability makes that preferable.

The 2s are assigned to mostly stand around the arc and wait for the point guard or ball rotation to get the shot when they used to be the get the most touches as soon as the team got into their half court offense.

Now if a 6’6 guy has point guard skill, he plays point guard.

Then you got the 6’8 to 6’10 guys with point guard skills.

It’s slim pickings for an off guard in the modern NBA. If you can’t shoot the 3, good luck getting a big contract.
 
prinmemo said:
I will say that the picture on the left means Jordan probably had at least two open teammates with easier shots. Even for the great one, that is a low percentage shot.
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Means Jordan didn’t want his teammate to throw up another brick

I looked at his rosters before pippin got there and grant Nd my god he played with garbage
 
DMoney said:
Spencer Dinwiddie is the same caliber of athlete as Michael Jordan, per Spencer Dinwiddie.

Is this what we’re doing?
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This is a continuation of the conversation Isiah Thomas started. Michael Wilbon and Jalen Rose said MJ would average mid 40s to 50 ppg after hearing Isiah's comments. That's ridiculous. Obviously Spencer and Michael aren't even close to the same athlete, but his sentiment stands and its an extension of what Tim Grover has said about today's athletes. Weren't as many 6'6 guys with 40 inch verticals back then. If you look at my next post Wilt and Russell in '97 were talking exactly like Barkley and MJ are in '20. Harping about rule changes, their era having the best athletes, and how unguardable they are
 
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