forums

Making the pieces fit on DL

Liberty City El said:
WDE - Mitchell Agude/Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss/
1T - Jordan Miller/ Jared Harrison-Hunte/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Leonard Taylor/ Antonio Moultrie/ Elijah Roberts
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Elijah Roberts/ Chantz Williams/ Jabari Ishmael/ Nyjalik Kelly
Click to expand...
I kinda see it similar to LCE

the guys I can see moving around to play 2 positions are:

JHH- No he's not a natural nose, but I think he can give you a series or two there a game, especially considering he is talented and there's a long jam at 3T

Lich- Same as JHH and as an upper classmen you'd expect him to have physical strength

Moultrie- 3 Tech/SDE...I think he's more of a depth guy to begin with, maybe he proves me wrong

Roberts- Like El says 3T/SSDE
 
Advertisement
rok said:
I don't know who needs to hear this but Moultrie would have led Miami in tackles last year at 62.
Click to expand...

Hopefully no one at this point. But there were a lot of guys on here who thought the front 7 didn't need major upgrading. I'm sure they're still lurking.

The problem with 20 years of mediocrity is a whole generation of fans don't know what greatness looks like. No disrespect to Moultrie, he's a better player than who we had before he joined the roster. But he's barely good enough to help us win the Coastal, he's not playoff caliber. Yet he's almost certain to start, which shows you how gapped we were up front.

Where are the Wilforks, Calais Campbells, Vilmas, McDougles of our roster? Leondard Taylor is the only one I see a among the front 7 with enough talent to "maybe eventually" be a Day 1 or Day 2 kid. I'm not sure he is good enough to start right now, though. I'm really hoping we get a high-level portal DT so we Taylor can get fewer snaps and make them more meaningful so he develops into his potential.

In fact, there is no one across the entire defense right now who is capable of putting the on his back and wining the contested game. Maybe Tae can get there, we'll see. Our rosters used to be filled with guys who would do that.

Cristobal, Steele, Strong, Salave'a and Addae are going to get us back there. I am sure of it. Just need to be patient and enjoy the journey.
 
Last edited:
grover said:
Hopefully no one at this point. But there were a lot of guys on here who thought the front 7 didn't need major upgrading. I'm sure they're still lurking.

The problem with 20 years of mediocrity is a whole generation of fans don't know what greatness looks like. Moultrie isn't even where we need to be, no disrespect. He's barely good enough to help us win the Coastal. He is not good enough to get us to the playoffs. And he's almost certain to start, which shows you how gapped we were up front.

Where are the Wilforks, Calais Campbells, Vilmas, McDougles of our roster? Leondard Taylor is the only one I see a among the front 7 with enough talent to mayyyyybbbbbeeee eventually be a Day 1 or Day 2 kid. And there's no one across the entire defense right now who is capable of putting the on his back and wining the contested game. Maybe Tae can get there, we'll see. Our rosters used to be filled with legends.

Cristobal, Steele, Strong, Salave'a and Addae are going to get us back there. I am sure of it. Just need to be patient and enjoy the journey.
Click to expand...
You make good points, Leonard is key up front and he needs to establish himself as a premier player like you said from day one .

Others will follow and in the process Leonard can / will challenge “ his” front seven rise with him.

Some of my best fights at practice was caused by me challenging others.

Example:

Tony Chickillo ( the OLD one) on one play didn’t take the hit on he hesitated at practice.

I said under my voice to Chick “ I SEE YOUR RUNNING A LITTLE LATE TODAY “. the fight was on BIG TIME.

He wasn’t late anymore he later played in the NFL Buccaneers.

See leaders bring others with them, I could not perform my game next to Chickillo unless his game was top flight elite I needed him and his game to keep mine running hot full throttle.

Leonard will need to establish what I did at a cause of a fierce fight to bring others game to elite.

LEADERS BRING OTHERS WITH THEM

GOCANES
 
Updated with the addition of Darrell Jackson:

WDE - Mitchell Agude/Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss/
2T - Darrell Jackson/ Jordan Miller/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Leonard Taylor/ Antonio Moultrie/ Jared Harrison-Hunte
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Elijah Roberts/ Chantz Williams/ Jabari Ishmael/ Nyjalik Kelly

(After potential Portal exits)

WDE - Mitchell Agude/ Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss
2T - Darrell Jackson/ Leonard Taylor/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Antonio Moultrie/ Elijah Roberts
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Chantz Williams/ Nyjalik Kelly/ Jabari Ishmael

Now obviously, there’s a real possibility that at least 1 of, if not both Jordan Miller & JHH end up hitting the Portal.

Maybe we keep them, I would doubt that we do, but if we did that would give us the 2nd most depth at DL in the ACC.

I hope we can keep both, but that’s unrealistic, but hopefully we can keep at least one of them.

I still would bring in DJ Coleman if we can, after Agude & Mesidor I’m not sure we have a big time pass rusher at DE. I was never high on Chantz coming out of HS, he was always a limited speed rusher to me that struggles fighting off blocks due to inability to properly hand fight while engaging. I was high on Harvey but he’s been a disappointment thus far, between the two I think he can at least be a solid situational rusher given the flashes he shown, but otherwise none except for the TF’s who aren’t ready yet have really show premier pass rush ability.

But either way, this staff has a lot of pieces to work with on the DLine, we have a line full of versatile guys & adding Jackson adds even more to that group. A front 4 with Akheem, Jackson, Taylor & Agude on a 3rd down & long with guys Stunting the B & C gaps is a **** scary sight & I know Steele, Wright & Salave’a can’t wait mix up the sub packages & exotic looks we can throw out there vs offenses.
 
Advertisement
DMoney said:
An influx of transfers has remade our defensive front. Now, we have an abundance of guys with similar body types- long, lean for a DT, built more like a 3-4 DE. They average out to 6'4, 272 and all fit into that general profile:

Jared Harrison-Hunte- 6'4, 285
Jake Lichtenstein- 6'5, 270
Antonio Moultrie- 6'4, 260
Akheem Mesidor- 6'2, 272
Elijah Roberts- 6'4, 275

Leonard Taylor is a little stouter (6'3, 305) but still far from a nose tackle. So how do we make all of these pieces fit in a four-man front? On one hand, length and athleticism is always good and Steele did wonders with a similar body type in Marlon Davidson. But it is still a unique situation when you are lacking a true nose and are thin at EDGE.

Curious to hear any thoughts from others on how we should deploy this group.

@Coach Macho @WestEndzone @San Amaro Dr @Liberty City El @gogeta4 @LuCane @gcane44 @Lance Roffers
Click to expand...
ANDDDDDD just like that @DMoney the pieces fit😃
 
Liberty City El said:
Updated with the addition of Darrell Jackson:

WDE - Mitchell Agude/Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss/
2T - Darrell Jackson/ Jordan Miller/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Leonard Taylor/ Antonio Moultrie/ Jared Harrison-Hunte
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Elijah Roberts/ Chantz Williams/ Jabari Ishmael/ Nyjalik Kelly

(After potential Portal exits)

WDE - Mitchell Agude/ Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss
2T - Darrell Jackson/ Leonard Taylor/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Antonio Moultrie/ Elijah Roberts
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Chantz Williams/ Nyjalik Kelly/ Jabari Ishmael

Now obviously, there’s a real possibility that at least 1 of, if not both Jordan Miller & JHH end up hitting the Portal.

Maybe we keep them, I would doubt that we do, but if we did that would give us the 2nd most depth at DL in the ACC.

I hope we can keep both, but that’s unrealistic, but hopefully we can keep at least one of them.

I still would bring in DJ Coleman if we can, after Agude & Mesidor I’m not sure we have a big time pass rusher at DE. I was never high on Chantz coming out of HS, he was always a limited speed rusher to me that struggles fighting off blocks due to inability to properly hand fight while engaging. I was high on Harvey but he’s been a disappointment thus far, between the two I think he can at least be a solid situational rusher given the flashes he shown, but otherwise none except for the TF’s who aren’t ready yet have really show premier pass rush ability.

But either way, this staff has a lot of pieces to work with on the DLine, we have a line full of versatile guys & adding Jackson adds even more to that group. A front 4 with Akheem, Jackson, Taylor & Agude on a 3rd down & long with guys Stunting the B & C gaps is a **** scary sight & I know Steele, Wright & Salave’a can’t wait mix up the sub packages & exotic looks we can throw out there vs offenses.
Click to expand...
Chantz is a solid run defender but he has the pass rush moves of a road cone. No bend
 
They have to perform but we closed the gap on Clemson on the DL this offseason. With the experience factored in and production. Need another LB and we cooking
 
Advertisement
Advertisement
Liberty City El said:
Updated with the addition of Darrell Jackson:

WDE - Mitchell Agude/Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss/
2T - Darrell Jackson/ Jordan Miller/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Leonard Taylor/ Antonio Moultrie/ Jared Harrison-Hunte
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Elijah Roberts/ Chantz Williams/ Jabari Ishmael/ Nyjalik Kelly

(After potential Portal exits)

WDE - Mitchell Agude/ Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss
2T - Darrell Jackson/ Leonard Taylor/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Antonio Moultrie/ Elijah Roberts
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Chantz Williams/ Nyjalik Kelly/ Jabari Ishmael

Now obviously, there’s a real possibility that at least 1 of, if not both Jordan Miller & JHH end up hitting the Portal.

Maybe we keep them, I would doubt that we do, but if we did that would give us the 2nd most depth at DL in the ACC.

I hope we can keep both, but that’s unrealistic, but hopefully we can keep at least one of them.

I still would bring in DJ Coleman if we can, after Agude & Mesidor I’m not sure we have a big time pass rusher at DE. I was never high on Chantz coming out of HS, he was always a limited speed rusher to me that struggles fighting off blocks due to inability to properly hand fight while engaging. I was high on Harvey but he’s been a disappointment thus far, between the two I think he can at least be a solid situational rusher given the flashes he shown, but otherwise none except for the TF’s who aren’t ready yet have really show premier pass rush ability.

But either way, this staff has a lot of pieces to work with on the DLine, we have a line full of versatile guys & adding Jackson adds even more to that group. A front 4 with Akheem, Jackson, Taylor & Agude on a 3rd down & long with guys Stunting the B & C gaps is a **** scary sight & I know Steele, Wright & Salave’a can’t wait mix up the sub packages & exotic looks we can throw out there vs offenses.
Click to expand...
Interesting that you think two Senior DTs are going to transfer out.
 
GOCANES05 said:
You make good points, Leonard is key up front and he needs to establish himself as a premier player like you said from day one .

Others will follow and in the process Leonard can / will challenge “ his” front seven rise with him.

Some of my best fights at practice was caused by me challenging others.

Example:

Tony Chickillo ( the OLD one) on one play didn’t take the hit on he hesitated at practice.

I said under my voice to Chick “ I SEE YOUR RUNNING A LITTLE LATE TODAY “. the fight was on BIG TIME.

He wasn’t late anymore he later played in the NFL Buccaneers.

See leaders bring others with them, I could not perform my game next to Chickillo unless his game was top flight elite I needed him and his game to keep mine running hot full throttle.

Leonard will need to establish what I did at a cause of a fierce fight to bring others game to elite.

LEADERS BRING OTHERS WITH THEM

GOCANES
Click to expand...

@GOCANES05 The guy who benefits the most by far from this Jackson commit is Leonard Taylor. He suddenly went from being a guy I was worried wouldn't hold up being targeted and pounded by double teams and blocking RBs to the guy I'm most looking forward to seeing grow into the gunner DT role. Jackson's going to command that double or that RB attention now more often than not, or at least 50/50. Now Taylor will be free to EAT. And they've both got 3 years eligibility.

I really hope and expect that Salave'a will rotate in 5-6 guys at DT to keep these kids fresh. We're about ready to crush teams in the second half especially. They will not hold up to our DL onslaught.
 
Advertisement
grover said:
@GOCANES05 The guy who benefits the most by far from this Jackson commit is Leonard Taylor. He suddenly went from being a guy I was worried wouldn't hold up being targeted and pounded by double teams and blocking RBs to the guy I'm most looking forward to seeing grow into the gunner DT role. Jackson's going to command that double or that RB attention now more often than not, or at least 50/50. Now Taylor will be free to EAT. And they've both got 3 years eligibility.

I really hope and expect that Salave'a will rotate in 5-6 guys at DT to keep these kids fresh. We're about ready to crush teams in the second half especially. They will not hold up to our DL onslaught.
Click to expand...
If these guys stay 3 years that’s not a good sign
2 years max
A guy like Jackson if he puts on 10-15 this off season and has an all acc year
I can see him going to the draft
Guys his size and athletic ability are rare
 
Liberty City El said:
Updated with the addition of Darrell Jackson:

WDE - Mitchell Agude/Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss/
2T - Darrell Jackson/ Jordan Miller/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Leonard Taylor/ Antonio Moultrie/ Jared Harrison-Hunte
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Elijah Roberts/ Chantz Williams/ Jabari Ishmael/ Nyjalik Kelly

(After potential Portal exits)

WDE - Mitchell Agude/ Jahfari Harvey/ Thomas Davis/ Cyrus Moss
2T - Darrell Jackson/ Leonard Taylor/ Allan Haye Jr/ Ahmad Moten
3T - Jake Lichtenstein/ Antonio Moultrie/ Elijah Roberts
SDE - Akheem Mesidor/ Chantz Williams/ Nyjalik Kelly/ Jabari Ishmael

Now obviously, there’s a real possibility that at least 1 of, if not both Jordan Miller & JHH end up hitting the Portal.

Maybe we keep them, I would doubt that we do, but if we did that would give us the 2nd most depth at DL in the ACC.

I hope we can keep both, but that’s unrealistic, but hopefully we can keep at least one of them.

I still would bring in DJ Coleman if we can, after Agude & Mesidor I’m not sure we have a big time pass rusher at DE. I was never high on Chantz coming out of HS, he was always a limited speed rusher to me that struggles fighting off blocks due to inability to properly hand fight while engaging. I was high on Harvey but he’s been a disappointment thus far, between the two I think he can at least be a solid situational rusher given the flashes he shown, but otherwise none except for the TF’s who aren’t ready yet have really show premier pass rush ability.

But either way, this staff has a lot of pieces to work with on the DLine, we have a line full of versatile guys & adding Jackson adds even more to that group. A front 4 with Akheem, Jackson, Taylor & Agude on a 3rd down & long with guys Stunting the B & C gaps is a **** scary sight & I know Steele, Wright & Salave’a can’t wait mix up the sub packages & exotic looks we can throw out there vs offenses.
Click to expand...

jsy said:
If these guys stay 3 years that’s not a good sign
2 years max
A guy like Jackson if he puts on 10-15 this off season and has an all acc year
I can see him going to the draft
Guys his size and athletic ability are rare
Click to expand...
Jackson has to be here at least 2 more seasons.
 
OldhamA said:
Interesting that you think two Senior DTs are going to transfer out.
Click to expand...
If they do, that will make 3 senior DTs who left. These guys signed up to play in Manny’s system (well, not Miller. I think we were just his best offer). They want to play the run on the way to the quarterback. In a way, I get it. That’s the fun side of playing defensive line. But part of being a good defense is having guys who are willing to control their gap. Maybe sacrifice their own stats to occupy a double team and free up someone else. If you’re going to be a one dimensional pass rusher, you better be all world like Warren Sapp or Aaron Donald. Otherwise you have to learn something besides how to shoot gaps and swim move over a blocker.
 
OldhamA said:
Interesting that you think two Senior DTs are going to transfer out.
Click to expand...
I don’t know if they are going to transfer, but I wouldn’t be shocked if they did.

There have been 3 DT adds from the Portal this offseason, that will cut their reps in half, they may decide that they think they should be a starter somewhere else.
 
Advertisement
Back
Top