Jacory or Kaaya

[kryptonite]

Because Jacory Harris was throwing to the other team.. You do understand that good QB make average player look good? have u watched a GB game before?

Duke was not better than Miller in college. Millar just left early. Also, Mike James could pick up a third and short unlike Yearby

WTF are you talking about now? Duke averaged a full yard per carry (6.7) more than Miller (5.7) and was a much, much, much bigger threat out of the backfield. Miller averaged 91 yards per scrimmage per game and Duke averaged 128 yards per scrimmage per game. "Duke was not better than Miller" You guys are just getting ridiculous. I really have to get away from this thread.

Normally I'd rely on numbers but I've seen Lamar Miller dominate games (VT for example). Love some Duke Johnson but he wasn't as good as Lamar. Lamar split the backfield and only had one season as the premier back where he put up 1200 yards. Duke didn't top that until his third season as the premier back. Lamar Miller would have killed it if he returned for his junior year.

You're probably not relying on numbers because there are none that work to support that argument. Yet you still want to bring up an arbitrary number such as 1200 yards, which Lamar had once (he had 646 yards his other season). Duke had 947, 920, and 1652 yards (the year with Kaaya) during his 3 seasons and again a significantly higher YPC. This is not an argument. Lamar may have "killed it" during his junior year, but he didn't. And we are talking about the support Jacory/Kaaya had so that's irrelevant what he could've done.

I want no part of this ridiculous argument you've gotten yourself into, but I can't help myself. Didn't Duke split carries with Mike James his first year and miss a few games his second? So in addition to having better numbers he did it splitting time and missing games.

 

[Waffle Honcho]

Duke was not better than Miller in college. Millar just left early. Also, Mike James could pick up a third and short unlike Yearby

WTF are you talking about now? Duke averaged a full yard per carry (6.7) more than Miller (5.7) and was a much, much, much bigger threat out of the backfield. Miller averaged 91 yards per scrimmage per game and Duke averaged 128 yards per scrimmage per game. "Duke was not better than Miller" You guys are just getting ridiculous. I really have to get away from this thread.

Normally I'd rely on numbers but I've seen Lamar Miller dominate games (VT for example). Love some Duke Johnson but he wasn't as good as Lamar. Lamar split the backfield and only had one season as the premier back where he put up 1200 yards. Duke didn't top that until his third season as the premier back. Lamar Miller would have killed it if he returned for his junior year.

You're probably not relying on numbers because there are none that work to support that argument. Yet you still want to bring up an arbitrary number such as 1200 yards, which Lamar had once (he had 646 yards his other season). Duke had 947, 920, and 1652 yards (the year with Kaaya) during his 3 seasons and again a significantly higher YPC. This is not an argument. Lamar may have "killed it" during his junior year, but he didn't. And we are talking about the support Jacory/Kaaya had so that's irrelevant what he could've done.

I want no part of this ridiculous argument you've gotten yourself into, but I can't help myself. Didn't Duke split carries with Mike James his first year and miss a few games his second? So in addition to having better numbers he did it splitting time and missing games.

I only have so much energy. Everything this guy says is ridiculous. I also didn't bring up how Duke's performance against VT was even more impressive.

 

[kryptonite]

WTF are you talking about now? Duke averaged a full yard per carry (6.7) more than Miller (5.7) and was a much, much, much bigger threat out of the backfield. Miller averaged 91 yards per scrimmage per game and Duke averaged 128 yards per scrimmage per game. "Duke was not better than Miller" You guys are just getting ridiculous. I really have to get away from this thread.

Normally I'd rely on numbers but I've seen Lamar Miller dominate games (VT for example). Love some Duke Johnson but he wasn't as good as Lamar. Lamar split the backfield and only had one season as the premier back where he put up 1200 yards. Duke didn't top that until his third season as the premier back. Lamar Miller would have killed it if he returned for his junior year.

You're probably not relying on numbers because there are none that work to support that argument. Yet you still want to bring up an arbitrary number such as 1200 yards, which Lamar had once (he had 646 yards his other season). Duke had 947, 920, and 1652 yards (the year with Kaaya) during his 3 seasons and again a significantly higher YPC. This is not an argument. Lamar may have "killed it" during his junior year, but he didn't. And we are talking about the support Jacory/Kaaya had so that's irrelevant what he could've done.

I want no part of this ridiculous argument you've gotten yourself into, but I can't help myself. Didn't Duke split carries with Mike James his first year and miss a few games his second? So in addition to having better numbers he did it splitting time and missing games.

I only have so much energy. Everything this guy says is ridiculous. I also didn't bring up how Duke's performance against VT was even more impressive.

You mean 29 carries for 249 yards? That one? I mean, I'm sure Miller would have had like 7 TDs, but Duke still did ok that night.

 

[KevinCaneFace]

Because Jacory Harris was throwing to the other team.. You do understand that good QB make average player look good? have u watched a GB game before?

Duke was not better than Miller in college. Millar just left early. Also, Mike James could pick up a third and short unlike Yearby

WTF are you talking about now? Duke averaged a full yard per carry (6.7) more than Miller (5.7) and was a much, much, much bigger threat out of the backfield. Miller averaged 91 yards per scrimmage per game and Duke averaged 128 yards per scrimmage per game. "Duke was not better than Miller" You guys are just getting ridiculous. I really have to get away from this thread.

Normally I'd rely on numbers but I've seen Lamar Miller dominate games (VT for example). Love some Duke Johnson but he wasn't as good as Lamar. Lamar split the backfield and only had one season as the premier back where he put up 1200 yards. Duke didn't top that until his third season as the premier back. Lamar Miller would have killed it if he returned for his junior year.

You're probably not relying on numbers because there are none that work to support that argument. Yet you still want to bring up an arbitrary number such as 1200 yards, which Lamar had once (he had 646 yards his other season). Duke had 947, 920, and 1652 yards (the year with Kaaya) during his 3 seasons and again a significantly higher YPC. This is not an argument. Lamar may have "killed it" during his junior year, but he didn't. And we are talking about the support Jacory/Kaaya had so that's irrelevant what he could've done.

Lamar was only the feature back one year. He put up 1200. Duke didn't top that until his third year when there was a freshman QB and the whole offense ran through him. I don't think you have to look very hard at their careers to see who had more talent. Miller is getting paid big money and Duke will likely be a journeyman role player here soon. You bash Kaaya for third down percentage but don't factor in that he hasn't had a running back that can pick up a 3rd and short his whole time here. Yearby and Duke were often stopped behind the line in those situations

 

[We the Boss]

This thread is horrific. My wonderlic score dropped 8 points after I read it.

 

[jjacks93]

In terms of what, talent? Cause they weren't the same on the field. Jacory's Canes team would beat the **** out of 3/4 of Kaaya's teams. (and maybe squeek out a win against last season's team too)

We were much better on defense and special teams when Jacory was here. We were among tops in the nation in sacks, TFL's, pass defense, etc...and we were explosive on special teams.

Jacory definitely had more help than Kaaya throughout his career.

Yes in terms of talent they were roughly the same. The reason they weren't the same on the field was because of the coaching, like I said. They were roughly the same caliber of player.

Ok. So Jacory still played with the better TEAM.

They were roughly the same. If you want to go through each player throughout the entire time and make a real debate out of it, I'll participate. But I don't care enough to start that, and the overall gestalt was that the teams were roughly the same.

They weren't the same on the field. The defenses that played beside Jacory were much better, as were the special teams. Doesn't matter if it was due to coaching or not, they were better.

what does the defenses have to do with Jacory vs Kaaya ? If youre going to argue supporting casts, it would be more relevant to talk who surrounded them on offense, not who was playing on the other side of the ball. Kaaya had better offensive weapons and played against weaker competition (Golden scheduling) and thats a fact .

 

[KevinCaneFace]

Yes in terms of talent they were roughly the same. The reason they weren't the same on the field was because of the coaching, like I said. They were roughly the same caliber of player.

Ok. So Jacory still played with the better TEAM.

They were roughly the same. If you want to go through each player throughout the entire time and make a real debate out of it, I'll participate. But I don't care enough to start that, and the overall gestalt was that the teams were roughly the same.

They weren't the same on the field. The defenses that played beside Jacory were much better, as were the special teams. Doesn't matter if it was due to coaching or not, they were better.

what does the defenses have to do with Jacory vs Kaaya ? If youre going to argue supporting casts, it would be more relevant to talk who surrounded them on offense, not who was playing on the other side of the ball. Kaaya had better offensive weapons and played against weaker competition (Golden scheduling) and thats a fact .

How does defense effect offense? Really? You don't think having a defense ranked in the 100's made it harder to win games? Defense wins field position, wins time of possession, creates turnovers that give the offense more opportunity. You don't think that stuff matters?

You're scheduling comment is also not a fact.

 

[Gransapo]

 

[simplycanes]

Harris was victimized by an overly aggressive oc in whipple...kaaya had to play for the worse coach in hurricane history. I can see kaaya being pretty good in the right system. Same with Harris. Both had their weak points. Some of the int's Harris tossed made you shake your head but he did play against better teams. Kaaya played against trash overall.

See I think Kaaya is the better QB overall, and could play in a number of different systems. Jacory, OTOH, I agree with [MENTION=3951]Coach[/MENTION]Macho, he needs to be in a spread system.

Kaaya needs to cleanup his footwork and pocket decisions when he is under pressure, but the kid can read a defense and work through his progressions at an NFL level, IMO.

Jacory needed a spread offense with fast intermediate reads, and then hit someone over the top when they creep in on routes. It was maddening how he was asked to do pretty much the opposite of that all the time.

 

[VaCane17]

Kaaya I can't believe this is even a question. I loved J12 but Brad would have this team in the playoff talk. We would legit be talking about going undefeated

 

[Waffle Honcho]

Duke was not better than Miller in college. Millar just left early. Also, Mike James could pick up a third and short unlike Yearby

WTF are you talking about now? Duke averaged a full yard per carry (6.7) more than Miller (5.7) and was a much, much, much bigger threat out of the backfield. Miller averaged 91 yards per scrimmage per game and Duke averaged 128 yards per scrimmage per game. "Duke was not better than Miller" You guys are just getting ridiculous. I really have to get away from this thread.

Normally I'd rely on numbers but I've seen Lamar Miller dominate games (VT for example). Love some Duke Johnson but he wasn't as good as Lamar. Lamar split the backfield and only had one season as the premier back where he put up 1200 yards. Duke didn't top that until his third season as the premier back. Lamar Miller would have killed it if he returned for his junior year.

You're probably not relying on numbers because there are none that work to support that argument. Yet you still want to bring up an arbitrary number such as 1200 yards, which Lamar had once (he had 646 yards his other season). Duke had 947, 920, and 1652 yards (the year with Kaaya) during his 3 seasons and again a significantly higher YPC. This is not an argument. Lamar may have "killed it" during his junior year, but he didn't. And we are talking about the support Jacory/Kaaya had so that's irrelevant what he could've done.

Lamar was only the feature back one year. He put up 1200. Duke didn't top that until his third year when there was a freshman QB and the whole offense ran through him. I don't think you have to look very hard at their careers to see who had more talent. Miller is getting paid big money and Duke will likely be a journeyman role player here soon. You bash Kaaya for third down percentage but don't factor in that he hasn't had a running back that can pick up a 3rd and short his whole time here. Yearby and Duke were often stopped behind the line in those situations

I love the quote feature because it can see the evolution of your argument as everything you say is rebuked. Now you're saying Miller has more talent than Duke, and not that Miller was "better in college". Miller is a better pro, that's undisputable at this point. In college, Duke was a better weapon, that's undisputable as well.

 

[KevinCaneFace]

WTF are you talking about now? Duke averaged a full yard per carry (6.7) more than Miller (5.7) and was a much, much, much bigger threat out of the backfield. Miller averaged 91 yards per scrimmage per game and Duke averaged 128 yards per scrimmage per game. "Duke was not better than Miller" You guys are just getting ridiculous. I really have to get away from this thread.

Normally I'd rely on numbers but I've seen Lamar Miller dominate games (VT for example). Love some Duke Johnson but he wasn't as good as Lamar. Lamar split the backfield and only had one season as the premier back where he put up 1200 yards. Duke didn't top that until his third season as the premier back. Lamar Miller would have killed it if he returned for his junior year.

You're probably not relying on numbers because there are none that work to support that argument. Yet you still want to bring up an arbitrary number such as 1200 yards, which Lamar had once (he had 646 yards his other season). Duke had 947, 920, and 1652 yards (the year with Kaaya) during his 3 seasons and again a significantly higher YPC. This is not an argument. Lamar may have "killed it" during his junior year, but he didn't. And we are talking about the support Jacory/Kaaya had so that's irrelevant what he could've done.

Lamar was only the feature back one year. He put up 1200. Duke didn't top that until his third year when there was a freshman QB and the whole offense ran through him. I don't think you have to look very hard at their careers to see who had more talent. Miller is getting paid big money and Duke will likely be a journeyman role player here soon. You bash Kaaya for third down percentage but don't factor in that he hasn't had a running back that can pick up a 3rd and short his whole time here. Yearby and Duke were often stopped behind the line in those situations

I love the quote feature because it can see the evolution of your argument as everything you say is rebuked. Now you're saying Miller has more talent than Duke, and not that Miller was "better in college". Miller is a better pro, that's undisputable at this point. In college, Duke was a better weapon, that's undisputable as well.

Look at the original quote. It states the Duke wasn't better in collage, Millar just left early. I didn't even go as far to say that Millar was better. Duke stayed long enough to hit a big season. Miller broke 1,000 yards in his first season as a feature back and left. The year you mentioned that he had 600 yards, he was the third RB on the roster behind Cooper and James. (Although he eventually got more snaps than James) I have zero doubts that Miller would have outpaced Duke in similar situations.

 

[jjacks93]

Ok. So Jacory still played with the better TEAM.

They were roughly the same. If you want to go through each player throughout the entire time and make a real debate out of it, I'll participate. But I don't care enough to start that, and the overall gestalt was that the teams were roughly the same.

They weren't the same on the field. The defenses that played beside Jacory were much better, as were the special teams. Doesn't matter if it was due to coaching or not, they were better.

what does the defenses have to do with Jacory vs Kaaya ? If youre going to argue supporting casts, it would be more relevant to talk who surrounded them on offense, not who was playing on the other side of the ball. Kaaya had better offensive weapons and played against weaker competition (Golden scheduling) and thats a fact .

How does defense effect offense? Really? You don't think having a defense ranked in the 100's made it harder to win games? Defense wins field position, wins time of possession, creates turnovers that give the offense more opportunity. You don't think that stuff matters?

You're scheduling comment is also not a fact.

I see you're not to good at reading comprehension. And that is a fact. I guarantee Jacory played against and beat more ranked team than Kaaya did. Kaaya has about 3 maybe 4 wins vs ranked opponents, one of those being Pitt this year who was trash.

 

[KevinCaneFace]

They were roughly the same. If you want to go through each player throughout the entire time and make a real debate out of it, I'll participate. But I don't care enough to start that, and the overall gestalt was that the teams were roughly the same.

They weren't the same on the field. The defenses that played beside Jacory were much better, as were the special teams. Doesn't matter if it was due to coaching or not, they were better.

what does the defenses have to do with Jacory vs Kaaya ? If youre going to argue supporting casts, it would be more relevant to talk who surrounded them on offense, not who was playing on the other side of the ball. Kaaya had better offensive weapons and played against weaker competition (Golden scheduling) and thats a fact .

How does defense effect offense? Really? You don't think having a defense ranked in the 100's made it harder to win games? Defense wins field position, wins time of possession, creates turnovers that give the offense more opportunity. You don't think that stuff matters?

You're scheduling comment is also not a fact.

I see you're not to good at reading comprehension. And that is a fact. I guarantee Jacory played against and beat more ranked team than Kaaya did. Kaaya has about 3 maybe 4 wins vs ranked opponents, one of those being Pitt this year who was trash.

We've always played one or two big non conference games and then a couple of scrubs. That hasn't changed. Also, time wasn't great to Jacory's biggest wins. His biggest wins were 7-5 FSU and 8-5 Oklahoma (without Sam Bradford). Kaaya has played FSU and played in the ACC when it was finally getting good. (Clemson, North Carolina, and Louisville who joined the ACC after Jacory) So you're schedule theory is opinion at best

 

[doctaj11]

Pickory, nah... I am taking Kaaya.

 

[KrazyCane]

I'm actually one of the rare beings that thinks Jacory's career was ruined by coaching. I think he could've done well had he been in a spread offense.

However, let's keep it real. Jacory orchestrated a few nice comebacks but HE WAS OFTEN THE REASON WE HAD TO COMEBACK TO BEGIN WITH. He was an INT machine.

Do you guys not remember how bad we were on offense during those years? Our defense was actually pretty good. Our offense was the main thing holding us back. Kaaya, on the other hand, has had to play beside some of the worst defenses in Miami history. Golden also didn't do Kaaya any favors when he decided to sign multiple WR's and RB's who run 4.7's. Our skill positions were mediocre under Golden. At least Jacory got the benefit of distributing the ball to a few NFL starters during his career.

Our offense was bad bc our Offensive coordiantors and Head Coach were a joke not bc of Jacory Harris....

Jacory Harris had more game winning drives then Brad Kaaya who has zero. **** Stephen Morris is more clutch than Kaaya.

Jacory as a true freshman... that game tying drive against UVa and the drive in OT to win the game was more impressive than any performance Kaaya has ever had.

 

[FlipT]

When Jacory was reeled in by Fisch, he looked really good!! Short leash!!

 

[Coach Macho]

I'm actually one of the rare beings that thinks Jacory's career was ruined by coaching. I think he could've done well had he been in a spread offense.

However, let's keep it real. Jacory orchestrated a few nice comebacks but HE WAS OFTEN THE REASON WE HAD TO COMEBACK TO BEGIN WITH. He was an INT machine.

Do you guys not remember how bad we were on offense during those years? Our defense was actually pretty good. Our offense was the main thing holding us back. Kaaya, on the other hand, has had to play beside some of the worst defenses in Miami history. Golden also didn't do Kaaya any favors when he decided to sign multiple WR's and RB's who run 4.7's. Our skill positions were mediocre under Golden. At least Jacory got the benefit of distributing the ball to a few NFL starters during his career.

Our offense was bad bc our Offensive coordiantors and Head Coach were a joke not bc of Jacory Harris....

Jacory Harris had more game winning drives then Brad Kaaya who has zero. **** Stephen Morris is more clutch than Kaaya.

Jacory as a true freshman... that game tying drive against UVa and the drive in OT to win the game was more impressive than any performance Kaaya has ever had.

LOL. Ok.

 

[Coach Macho]

Yes in terms of talent they were roughly the same. The reason they weren't the same on the field was because of the coaching, like I said. They were roughly the same caliber of player.

Ok. So Jacory still played with the better TEAM.

They were roughly the same. If you want to go through each player throughout the entire time and make a real debate out of it, I'll participate. But I don't care enough to start that, and the overall gestalt was that the teams were roughly the same.

They weren't the same on the field. The defenses that played beside Jacory were much better, as were the special teams. Doesn't matter if it was due to coaching or not, they were better.

what does the defenses have to do with Jacory vs Kaaya ? If youre going to argue supporting casts, it would be more relevant to talk who surrounded them on offense, not who was playing on the other side of the ball. Kaaya had better offensive weapons and played against weaker competition (Golden scheduling) and thats a fact .

I guess you haven't been following the conversation since the beginning.

We were a terrible team under Jacory despite having a good defense and explosive special teams. Us being terrible had almost everything to do with our atrocious offense. Part of that atrocious offense was the turnover machine that we had at QB.

We were a terrible team under Kaaya too, but we can't attribute that to just our offense (like you could during Jacory's career). We were bad on special teams and had some of the worst defenses in Miami history.

And we DID NOT play weaker competition while Kaaya was here. Clemson, FSU and North Carolina were not this good when Jacory was playing.

 

[Coach Macho]

Give Kaaya the 2010 defense and special teams and tell me he wouldn't have been more successful than Jacory.

Pffft. LOL ok.