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Aside from the Willis debacle, which was painful to watch, they all roughly got picked where they deserved to be. Joe Jack should've stayed in school considering how deep the d line class was and another year with a real strength coach like Feeley should've improved his athletic profile. Redwine exceeded his expectations. Mike Jack, Homer were fairly assessed and picked justly. Jaquon is a **** of a ball player but he's small and tested poorly.
 
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The entire defense was good (not great), including the scheme, so that elevated all their play.

Joe Jack floundered as DE1.
JJ was undersized and didn't test well.
Redwine was shaky in coverage in year 1 and 2, tested well and got drafted higher than anticipated for it.
Mike Jack regressed from year 3 to year 4.

The only stunner is obviously Willis, but I'm sure he didn't get picked up for a myriad of reasons that have nothing to do with football.
Redwine exceeded all expectations. Mike Jack also exceeded all expectations. We overrated Joe Jack tremendously.
 
Did this draft prove that we might be over evaluating our players as fans?
No question Miami players are seen and projected in a more favorable light. It's to be expected. A lot are South Florida kids who folks on the board have followed since high school days. Those in this year's draft class were very good college players, but it's pretty telling when Canes are going in the later rounds and after kids from schools you rarely if ever hear of.
Can recall folks during the season saying Willis was a first rounder. Obviously, his situation is very odd, but no way he was ever going in the first round with the DL talent in the draft. Joe Jackson and Michael Jackson, both good players, were being talked of as early round picks. Not sure why.
Last few drafts are indicative of the talent Miami has put on the field. Hopefully it'll soon pick up.
 
Yes

The players we get are good but other teams who are elite have different dogs. The problem with most fans is the watch YT videos of our players and HUDL highlights. When you see other teams (the elite) they have different animals and the draft indicates that. If it were 2000 the NFL would not overlook our guys. It not because of wins its because those guys were elite and jumped off the film.

Fans are stuck in the past (i was one of them) i now realize those schools get other worldly athletes. If u watch recruiting and watch the elite squads they get beast man and the HS film shows beasts. Even NFL scouts say we arent the same its the truth.

Our team would look a whole lot different if we closed on the beasts that we lose on NSD. But teams are cheating as per a coach on this very team said. That little bit is the difference IMO

Sorry i Edited this 100 times.
Sick and tired of your schtick. No one overvalued anyone. Homer got picked in the top 110 players after 1 full year as a starter. Redwine went from a lightly recruited CB to a Top 4 round safety. Mike Jackson was left for dead 2 years ago by our fanbase and turned into a mid-round draft pick. Will love JJ forever but no one with half a brain thought he was going in the first two days of the draft given his size and testing numbers. Joe Jax left early but that was on him. Would have loved to have seen his stock rise with another year of seasoning. The Willis debacle is one of, if not the biggest draft mysteries of the past few years but don't put that on the fanbase overvaluing him. Every draft outlet had him going in the first 3 rounds.
 
This is what gets Miami fans “in trouble”:

1. Under the radar kid has great measurables out of HS. This generates a measure of expectation with him before he’s stepped onto the field.

2. In his first season on the field he starts to deliver on some of that promise. Projections start to settle in, a benchmark is established for his freshman/RS freshman year. This benchmark is fluid, really only requiring the kid to make a handful of key plays to justify his lofty college projection. (Amari Carter is a recent example.) We start to see his future and, this is the first key mistake, project a track of improvement. This track is often inaccurate, assuming a steady rate of growth in a human being who has limited (not small, just not unlimited) means of improvement.

3. The second critical error: after 1 possibly legitimate season we marry the track of improvement with an NFL projection. That projection is almost always “if he keeps improving, with his size, he could be a 1st rounder.” It’s not **** to say, “JJ needs to keep improving at a steady rate and have a favorably thin class at his position to get drafted on day 2.” Nobody says that, ever.

4. We do not reevaluate our expectations as that “projected player” fails to materialize. Mike Jack did not have a great year. It was fine, it was not what I personally expected. But I said to myself, “his size is an NFL ideal, it was just a down year, he’s a second day guy.” And he may have a career that reflects that, but I should’ve downgraded my expectations of his slot. Stacy Coley goes here, etc. We are quick to raise our projection on a guy, but slow to lower it. That’s just being a fan.

5. Guys like Willis artificially weigh down the outlook of a class. There’s no way to project that fall, it makes no sense. Couple that with guys sliding down a round or two later than we all expect and suddenly it looks like you overrate your players. Ultimately, I don’t think we do more than any other fan base. In fact, maintain that we are our own harshest critics, on the whole.

A few addendums:

Many in our fanbase completely ignore the athletic testing our players perform during the pre-draft process. Its not as if some of these players are average or even below average players...they are going to be in the bottom 10% of all NFL athletes. This stuff matters. More and more teams are using advanced analytics, metrics, etc. for on field performance and also use the same data driven evaluations to help get outliers off of their board. Guys like Joe Jackson, Gerald Willis, and Jaquan Johnson were not even on a majority of team's draft board most likely because they failed to make qualifying scores during the process. Redwine and Mike Jackson were the first two 'Canes off the board...they were also the highest athletic testing performers from our class.

Many on this forum got it twisted...they think its a conspiracy against Miami players...when, I think most NFL teams give Miami players the benefit of the doubt in their projection to the NFL. Its why we still have so many players in the NFL despite being a pretty mediocre team for basically, 15 years.

One more...we as fans ignore aspects of these players that we consciously know are problematic. Our bewilderment with Gerald Willis is a prime example of this. We know his background and character are problematic for even the most kind of evaluators. We saw how poor his athletic testing was. We constantly complained about how soft our front seven can be. But, we loved the splash plays he made and the fact that he has a U on his helmet says we think he's going to be drafted high. If Gerald Willis played for another other team, knowing what we know about him...no one would support him as a draft pick. He just played for us, so we ignore all of the legitimately concerning aspects of his prospect profile.
 
Any time a player looks remotely decent you have half the board thinking they're first round talent. How many times this last year did we read about joe jack and willis being 1st rounders? Hear the same thing already with Garvin
 
The bottom line is that Miami has always had good skill players. Even when we were bad.

But the line play hasn't always been there and that's what wins games.

So, yes, the fans blame coaching because it's cheap and easy but the truth is that our line play has been poor for a long time.
Our OL has ALWAYS been UMs Achilles Heel (beside 2001)....Look at 93...94..95 etc...Even in 2002 against Ohio St they were manhandled...
 
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Y’all wouldve been crying if Joe Jackson committed somewhere else but now he’s not a great player even though he was the best DE on the team last season and was a key player on our top 4 ranked defense??? Some of y’all are clueless groupies lol

I guess the University of Charleston is out recruiting us at the DE position based on your groupie logic.
 
Sick and tired of your schtick. No one overvalued anyone. Homer got picked in the top 110 players after 1 full year as a starter. Redwine went from a lightly recruited CB to a Top 4 round safety. Mike Jackson was left for dead 2 years ago by our fanbase and turned into a mid-round draft pick. Will love JJ forever but no one with half a brain thought he was going in the first two days of the draft given his size and testing numbers. Joe Jax left early but that was on him. Would have loved to have seen his stock rise with another year of seasoning. The Willis debacle is one of, if not the biggest draft mysteries of the past few years but don't put that on the fanbase overvaluing him. Every draft outlet had him going in the first 3 rounds.
When I see @Dwinstitles I see a true fan that just finally broke, but can you blame him? We are a middling program at this point. Sure we still have our history and built in recruiting advantage because of location but other than that we have fallen mightily. The problem is that a good part of the fan base refuses to acknowledge that harsh truth. I mean, this board was trying to convince itself that Richt was a top 5 coach when we first hired him. Bottom line as it pertains to this thread, we absolutely over rate our own players. Let’s revisit prior to the season. Joe Jack was gonna possibly be a 1st rounder, as well as Mike Jack. Then after the season Willis, Joe and Mike were all 2-3 round talents. Homer and JJ 3-4. **** there were posts in August citing PFF that St Louis was one of the bets Tackles in the ACC. We over rate our players, all fans do that.
 
Did this draft prove that we might be over evaluating our players as fans?
Absolutely. Those of us old enough to remember our great teams and players of the past are always amused by the GTAAs (Green Tree All Americans) We have not had elite talent for a decade. I can remember when UM players were constantly All Pro, POYs, future HOFs and so on. **** the Canes NFL players scored a TD in 149 consecutive weeks, an NFL record that will be hard to break. We are far from elite fellas. Hopefully Manny can get the ball rolling again but anyone with a realistic approach knows there’s plenty of work to be done.
 
In relation to the Homer example specifically:

If you thought he was going in the first three rounds then you're insane.

If you think he made a mistake by coming out this year then you're not insane but you're still wrong.

I'm all for kids like Joe Jack staying but witn RBs specifically it's completely different beast. Unless you have the potential to move into the "elite" category and pretty much be guaranteed as a first two round pick then I'll pretty much now never second guess a RB that leaves AND gets drafted.
 
https://www.sbnation.com/2019/2/25/18233778/nfl-combine-worst-performances-history

I say BS!!! WIllis was projected as the 79th Best Player in this Draft, and that's after the NFL Combine. Some players just don't test well, but their on-field performance speaks for itself.


A few addendums:

Many in our fanbase completely ignore the athletic testing our players perform during the pre-draft process. Its not as if some of these players are average or even below average players...they are going to be in the bottom 10% of all NFL athletes. This stuff matters. More and more teams are using advanced analytics, metrics, etc. for on field performance and also use the same data driven evaluations to help get outliers off of their board. Guys like Joe Jackson, Gerald Willis, and Jaquan Johnson were not even on a majority of team's draft board most likely because they failed to make qualifying scores during the process. Redwine and Mike Jackson were the first two 'Canes off the board...they were also the highest athletic testing performers from our class.

Many on this forum got it twisted...they think its a conspiracy against Miami players...when, I think most NFL teams give Miami players the benefit of the doubt in their projection to the NFL. Its why we still have so many players in the NFL despite being a pretty mediocre team for basically, 15 years.

One more...we as fans ignore aspects of these players that we consciously know are problematic. Our bewilderment with Gerald Willis is a prime example of this. We know his background and character are problematic for even the most kind of evaluators. We saw how poor his athletic testing was. We constantly complained about how soft our front seven can be. But, we loved the splash plays he made and the fact that he has a U on his helmet says we think he's going to be drafted high. If Gerald Willis played for another other team, knowing what we know about him...no one would support him as a draft pick. He just played for us, so we ignore all of the legitimately concerning aspects of his prospect profile.
 
Willis is the exception rather than the rule, in that I do believe he should have been drafted but for something going on behind the scenes we are not aware of, which clearly is the case. There were a number of lineman with glaring physical limitations and less production who were taken in the draft. I don't think he is part of the Greentree bubble.

Joe Jackson on the other hand will go down as another strong piece of evidence though. He had a very productive career here, with some spectacular highlights. He has been one of the more productive ends we've had in a long time, which brings to light a number of issues in recruiting, coaching and the schemes we've run for the better part of the past decade (until recently).

That said, you had a defensive end from Clemson who was rated higher than him by most services and was given a 3rd to 4th round grade. When you look at that evidence, Joe Jackson was drafted about where the NFL was indicating he would be. However, many of you guys had him as a second or third-round pick.

No one is saying he wasn't a good to great player for us, but if you look at the makeup of the types of players being selected in the first, second, and even third round these days, we don't have a lot of that type of depth on our roster.
 
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This wasn't a knock on our players. Just more a reality check, we love our players and think they're the best there is but it's kinda mind blowing that maybe Duke and Alabama State have more talent.
 
A resounding NO

what happened out of the norm other than Willis not being picked?

Joe Jackson was a great college player but he tested well below average athletically which will make teams take you off their board or not prioritize you in the draft. Simply put he didn’t meet certain thresholds you like edge rushers to meet and most teams don’t overlook that. Could he have gone earlier? Yeah but his athleticism held him back for sure and it was a deep de class

Same with Jaquan, ultra productive but he’s small and tested poorly and not fast. He got drafted about where he should have

Not sure why homer never got the hype he deserved since he’s a do it all back who is athletically gifted and can block but his vision is not that good.

Mike Jackson and redwine were probably under drafted imo but it was a deep db class.

And guys like mcshay/kiper who do this scouting for a living thought Gerald Willis was a 2nd round pick and both thought homer/Jaquan would go higher

So would you say we are under recruiting or under developing the guys we recruit?
 
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