Chantz Williams this season

[Canesfan1899]

Everyone gets a fresh start now. What chance does a defensive player really have being coached by frauds like Manny & Patke. Most of that list may be JAGS but real coaches will get something out of most of them.

I think Cam Williams was going to be a player, unfortunately didn't like the school part of college.

 

[Canesfan1899]

The talent for Kelly & Moss is there but Kelly coming off injury & Moss being quite underweight may make early season contributions for both a bit too ambitious but if one of then were truly ready by September that'd be huge for us.

This, we should not be rushing true Freshman DE's onto the field unless they're ready.

 

[The Sphinx]

Now Stroud and Jess are terrible coaches? Come on man. Let's be real here.

Also, if one thing Manny's defense *DOES* do, it's allow edge players to be successful. Your last piece is true, though. The talent level was not nearly as good in 2021 than it was in years past. There's probably a pretty good chance that dudes like C. Williams and Deandre Johnson simply aren't as good as the players you named. Especially considering every single one of those guys except DJ were or are cashing NFL checks.

Manny's problem, and the reason we're in the situation we're in, comes back once again to recruiting much more than coaching. The talent levels dropped, as you mentioned, due to poor evals and poor recruiting.

In 2018, we signed Greg and Patrick Joyner as the edge players. Both very unheralded players, one obvious hit and one massive miss. So we yielded one edge player in that class.

In 2019, we signed Harvey and Cam Williams. One decent player, a 4-star, and a complete bust. He knew he needed help, so he went to the portal and got Hill and Phillips. Phillips couldn't play until 2020, but Hill had to come in and contribute right away. Manny is treading water, at best, at this point, and likely drowning.

In 2020, he gets Chantz, who was very highly ranked but the jury is still out on, hence this thread. Elijah Roberts is a bit of a tweener but is best served inside. Quentin Williams signs, but leaves very quickly. So we have to dip into the portal again, and gets an NFL kid in Roche. See the pattern here? Not nearly enough quality talent being taken out of HS in these classes at a very important positon.

So we're screwed again for 2021, he knows he needs more help and it can't be from true freshmen, so he gets Deandre Johnson, who turns out to be an average player. In the HS class, he signs Jabari Ishmael, a decent prospect but one who needs a few years of development. Same with Thomas Davis.

This just simply isn't good enough from a recruiting perspective. He took 4 edge players from the portal in 3 classes. You're doing a poor job evaluating and signing high school kids if this is the case. In FOUR high school classes, he yielded Rousseau, Harvey, Chantz Williams, Jabari Ishmael and Thomas Davis. That is god awful.

Agreed, and Manny's LB recruiting was the same. And we wonder why our Defense dipped each year of his tenure.

 

[BCntyCane]

You know Mario would love nothing more than a pair of starting DEs from Columbus HS!

100%

 

[supacane]

Structure is gonna be the best thing for alot of these guys. Asked to do random things on D does not help development.

 

[htownkidd]

The key to steeles defenses at auburn was interior push. He had horses there. If we don’t get any of that it may be a slow road. So while end is important to address I’m hoping Taylor and miller can break out

No doubt.

A lot of people don’t mention this when discussing Auburn’s 2019 defense under Steele. They had the best DT in the country and another top 50 pick on the DL. Those 2 truly were the catalysts for that defense that season.

Nothing ground breaking but we have to recruit much better on the DL and we will. But THIS season will bring some frustrations barring some portal miracles and unreal jumps from 1-2 guys.

 

[bandhammer]

No doubt.

A lot of people don’t mention this when discussing Auburn’s 2019 defense under Steele. They had the best DT in the country and another top 50 pick on the DL. Those 2 truly were the catalysts for that defense that season.

Nothing ground breaking but we have to recruit much better on the DL and we will. But THIS season will bring some frustrations barring some portal miracles and unreal jumps from 1-2 guys.

Guys, any defense would benefit greatly from two top tier DT's. That doesn't really have anything to do with Steele. I mean, yes, it wouldn't work for Dorito, but pretty much everyone else would love to have that situation.

 

[htownkidd]

Guys, any defense would benefit greatly from two top tier DT's. That doesn't really have anything to do with Steele. I mean, yes, it wouldn't work for Dorito, but pretty much everyone else would love to have that situation.

For sure, I agree 1000%. I was just pointing that out because I’ve seen a million people refer to the 2019 season like it’s the standard and what we should expect from a Steele defense when that isn’t the norm. I expect us to be much much better obviously, but just emphasizing that we are nowhere near as good as AU was that year from a personnel standpoint.

 

[grover]

Are Harvey, Chantz and Lichtenstein most likely our DE starting rotation? Or is Lichtenstein definitely moving in unless the other two get injured?

Regarding the interior, what does everyone think of a base rotation of Taylor and JHH in early downs with Lichtenstein, Moultrie and Roberts potentially subbing in or moving over to 3-Tech on 2nd/3rd & long? Do you see Miller and/or Haye being good, serviceable, or liabilities as run stuffers?

 

[gogeta4]

Now Stroud and Jess are terrible coaches? Come on man. Let's be real here.

Also, if one thing Manny's defense *DOES* do, it's allow edge players to be successful. Your last piece is true, though. The talent level was not nearly as good in 2021 than it was in years past. There's probably a pretty good chance that dudes like C. Williams and Deandre Johnson simply aren't as good as the players you named. Especially considering every single one of those guys except DJ were or are cashing NFL checks.

Manny's problem, and the reason we're in the situation we're in, comes back once again to recruiting much more than coaching. The talent levels dropped, as you mentioned, due to poor evals and poor recruiting.

In 2018, we signed Greg and Patrick Joyner as the edge players. Both very unheralded players, one obvious hit and one massive miss. So we yielded one edge player in that class.

In 2019, we signed Harvey and Cam Williams. One decent player, a 4-star, and a complete bust. He knew he needed help, so he went to the portal and got Hill and Phillips. Phillips couldn't play until 2020, but Hill had to come in and contribute right away. Manny is treading water, at best, at this point, and likely drowning.

In 2020, he gets Chantz, who was very highly ranked but the jury is still out on, hence this thread. Elijah Roberts is a bit of a tweener but is best served inside. Quentin Williams signs, but leaves very quickly. So we have to dip into the portal again, and gets an NFL kid in Roche. See the pattern here? Not nearly enough quality talent being taken out of HS in these classes at a very important positon.

So we're screwed again for 2021, he knows he needs more help and it can't be from true freshmen, so he gets Deandre Johnson, who turns out to be an average player. In the HS class, he signs Jabari Ishmael, a decent prospect but one who needs a few years of development. Same with Thomas Davis.

This just simply isn't good enough from a recruiting perspective. He took 4 edge players from the portal in 3 classes. You're doing a poor job evaluating and signing high school kids if this is the case. In FOUR high school classes, he yielded Rousseau, Harvey, Chantz Williams, Jabari Ishmael and Thomas Davis. That is god awful.

Agreed. The only thing you really missed is.....dude couldve continued to just use the portal at DE.

His miscalc last class was bringing the southridge crew back together and getting Deandre Johnson instead of the kid FSU got. Jermaine Johsnon. Had he done that dude wouldve had 3 straight portal des drafted...and just continued to do that if still here. The portal honestly was never going to top out.
Some lazy takes and misses at end recently. Thomas Davis in no way shape or form was a de/edge recruit at his size. Then BOTH elijah Roberts and quentin williams both became or were tweener types. Cam Williams flamed out after he saw reps early in his career.

Manny's problem was the conundrum of his defense. His defense is made for DE'S to eat....the problem is ...his de's mostly eat...and leads to them being early nfl entries majority of the time. Just think about it....Jaelan Phillips wouldnt have even started if Rousseau didnt opt out...Jaelan Phillips is a productive nfl rookie starter...which is crazy in it self. So its a position he should have always stockpiled with high level talent or hit the portal for plug n plays.

 

[skyman]

Agreed. The only thing you really missed is.....dude couldve continued to just use the portal at DE.

His miscalc last class was bringing the southridge crew back together and getting Deandre Johnson instead of the kid FSU got. Jermaine Johsnon. Had he done that dude wouldve had 3 straight portal des drafted...and just continued to do that if still here. The portal honestly was never going to top out.
Some lazy takes and misses at end recently. Thomas Davis in no way shape or form was a de/edge recruit at his size. Then BOTH elijah Roberts and quentin williams both became or were tweener types. Cam Williams flamed out after he saw reps early in his career.

Manny's problem was the conundrum of his defense. His defense is made for DE'S to eat....the problem is ...his de's mostly eat...and leads to them being early nfl entries majority of the time. Just think about it....Jaelan Phillips wouldnt have even started if Rousseau didnt opt out...Jaelan Phillips is a productive nfl rookie starter...which is crazy in it self. So its a position he should have always stockpiled with high level talent or hit the portal for plug n plays.

Our luck was crazy.. First year in forever we get a LEGIT first round lock who cant leave early on us and its the same year he can opt out, which means we got only 6 games starting out of him and causes the domino effect of Phillips starting and balling out and leaving early also, lol.. have to laugh at it really

 

[KANE]

He’s got premium speed and really good strength for his size. Supposedly, he’s not very fluid and plays a bit stiff. He’s a strong side end that can set the edge and pick up hustle sacks. A good comparison would be Chad Thomas.

****, I wouldn’t mind having another Chad Thomas playing under a defensive staff that’s got a **** clue.

 

[grover]

Our luck was crazy.. First year in forever we get a LEGIT first round lock who cant leave early on us and its the same year he can opt out, which means we got only 6 games starting out of him and causes the domino effect of Phillips starting and balling out and leaving early also, lol.. have to laugh at it really

A blessing in disguise because it led to a strong 2021 COVID class, Manny’s demise, the 3 billionaires’ BOT insurrection and Mario’s rise.

 

[88]

Just not a bendy guy and doesn't look to have THAT great of size.

 

[TruCane81]

Like anything else in Manny's defense, if it was physiological skill needed- you made the play. 3rd and long 5-7 step pass drop. Simple IZ blocking. Chasing down a screen from behind.

As soon as the player needed technical, tactical or psychological skill it was over before it started. ie. Counter / any kick outs, read options coming to you where you're read vs away.

The All-22 EZ cut of the defense the last two years is very telling. You can actually watch the defenders' eyes and see that no one is home.

This staff needs to work on visual-cognitive skills during S&C and cut the chit on pushing unloaded sleds, doing the same boring bag drills over and over.

Where do you get that all 22 film?

 

[Ironmanfootball]

Where do you get that all 22 film?

 

[Damiencane86]

Are Harvey, Chantz and Lichtenstein most likely our DE starting rotation? Or is Lichtenstein definitely moving in unless the other two get injured?

Regarding the interior, what does everyone think of a base rotation of Taylor and JHH in early downs with Lichtenstein, Moultrie and Roberts potentially subbing in or moving over to 3-Tech on 2nd/3rd & long? Do you see Miller and/or Haye being good, serviceable, or liabilities as run stuffers?

Lich, Moultrie, and Roberts are definitely all interchangeable as ends or playing inside. I think it'll all depend on our opponent weekly how we utilize them. Taylor & JHH are likely starters but we badly need one of the bigger body tackles to step up, still too small overall with not enough depth in the middle. Wouldn't be surprised if Moten factors big sooner than later. Haye is a wildcard, has the size & motor but he was a longer term developmental project so I'm not personally placing too much expectations on him till I see more of him with my own eyes.

 

[dirtyred786]

Lich, Moultrie, and Roberts are definitely all interchangeable as ends or playing inside. I think it'll all depend on our opponent weekly how we utilize them. Taylor & JHH are likely starters but we badly need one of the bigger body tackles to step up, still too small overall with not enough depth in the middle. Wouldn't be surprised if Moten factors big sooner than later. Haye is a wildcard, has the size & motor but he was a longer term developmental project so I'm not personally placing too much expectations on him till I see more of him with my own eyes.

I think we will see Harvey and Chantz on one end and a bigger DE on the other side of the defensive line. Thats where Roberts, Moultrie, and Lich will play. Manny liked smaller DEs because all he cared about was getting into the backfield. I think Steele will want at least one big DE on the field that can take on a tackle, set the edge in the run game and free up linebackers to make plays.

 

[Damiencane86]

I think we will see Harvey and Chantz on one end and a bigger DE on the other side of the defensive line. Thats where Roberts, Moultrie, and Lich will play. Manny liked smaller DEs because all he cared about was getting into the backfield. I think Steele will want at least one big DE on the field that can take on a tackle, set the edge in the run game and free up linebackers to make plays.

I definitely favor Roberts being that bigger d end type vs having gain too much weight and be an inside guy.

 

[Elijah's Biggest Fan]

I believe Roberts is going to breakout this year he flashed last year but every time he made a great play he got taken out, Mannys way of saying great play kid

Exactly. Made absolutely NO SENSE!! He was more concerned about his pride but I'm going to leave that right there. I won't talk down on a Coach but that was confusing to us all.