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Calm down

I still have one foot in the bandwagon with Golden after last night. But Dorito...man it would one thing if was making adjustment then I could tolerate it. Teams beat us with the same plays every week. That **** old quit
 
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Sorry, I go by what I see on the field...there were red flags at UNC and Wake....UF sucks so that was a mirage. Who else did we beat? GT? Come on. Say what you will we have the talent to be 8-1 right now, and it's not that we are 7-2, it's how...there is no excuse for the close games with UNC and WF. We got lucky. Coker and Shannon was enough....there is no more patience. When you're defense is doing the same **** for two years then there is a fundamental problem and it needs to be addressed. Stop making excuses, this is year three and guys are open all over the field. You have 10 guys back on D and they STILL are making mental errors? Bull****, it's bad coaching period...the scheme sucks, it either sucks because fundamentally guys are open everywhere or it's too **** complicated for guys to pick up even after two full years.
 
Our D is horrible... Last year was bad but someone could get the stats I'm sure our "shining" D who we're tops is starting to balloon back to last years numbers
 
The Franchise said:
Team is playing worse every week instead of getting better. That's an indictment of the HC. We haven't played a good full game since uf.ag.
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True. That said I attribute it to the fact that once teams got our UF game on film they had all they needed to scheme against us. Our coaches are not developing schematically. Yes everything is ultimately on the head coach but at this time I think the correct move is a change at D Coordinator and a serious discussion between Al and the AD about what they want to do with coach Coley.

Coach Coley is learning on the job here. If we truly value him as an elite recruiter than I suggest that Al/UM spend some time and money getting coach Coley onto the off-season coaching clinic circuit this spring to clinic under some quality play callers. We need him to get much better by next season.
 
Last night was more than a loss.

If we had lost to Virginia Tech in a hard-fought game that went down to the wire, I could've lived with that.

But we got ****ed no vaseline with all the chips on the table. At home. It was an ugly display that hopefully isn't indicative of bigger problems.
 
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Cal jimmy said:
I would agree with OP. Golden has held it together through tough times, masterful recruiting vs long odds, the UF win was described as a "program changer" (at the time and context matters) and we held our own vs long odds at FSU for the first half. It is still a young team and we have a ways to go.

This fan base does seem irrational given a 7-2 record albeit yesterday was UGLY. In time what matters is a pattern of improvement: one ugly loss doesn't define the coach.

All that being said, watching the post game presser with Golden wasn't very inspiring. I don't know what he could say and he was clearly frustrated but blaming the fumbles and the low snap for 21 points seems to miss the point that the D got shredded. Also, don't like it when a coach says "they" , meaning his players, need to decide who they want to be. It's a cliche but it comes across as blaming players.

Coach and team got to stick together. Hope that's the case going forward.

Fans can follow if they want.
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The fumbles and O'Donnell's turnover suck, but he acts like they automatically had to result in 3 touchdowns against a team with a garbage offense. That's a loser approach.
 
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CanesAreAble said:
Last night was more than a loss.

If we had lost to Virginia Tech in a hard-fought game that went down to the wire, I could've lived with that.

But we got ****ed no vaseline with all the chips on the table. At home. It was an ugly display that hopefully isn't indicative of bigger problems.
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Yep. It's not just a loss. Remember when we destroyed Houston's up and coming juggernaut program in the 90s? That wasn't just a loss for them.
 
what does coach d have to work with? aqm is the only superstar talent on dl and he is a skinny legged fresh. chick is overrated because of his last name. not a stud. dl has nothing. lbs are young. gaines doesnt see the field at fsu. green, rodgers, aj, ty, probably dont even get a an offer from fsu. figs, grace, aqm and other would be redshirting right now at fsu. everyone talks scheme, if scheme was all that matter you would have wake contending for an acc title every year.
 
The Franchise said:
Cal jimmy said:
I would agree with OP. Golden has held it together through tough times, masterful recruiting vs long odds, the UF win was described as a "program changer" (at the time and context matters) and we held our own vs long odds at FSU for the first half. It is still a young team and we have a ways to go.

This fan base does seem irrational given a 7-2 record albeit yesterday was UGLY. In time what matters is a pattern of improvement: one ugly loss doesn't define the coach.

All that being said, watching the post game presser with Golden wasn't very inspiring. I don't know what he could say and he was clearly frustrated but blaming the fumbles and the low snap for 21 points seems to miss the point that the D got shredded. Also, don't like it when a coach says "they" , meaning his players, need to decide who they want to be. It's a cliche but it comes across as blaming players.

Coach and team got to stick together. Hope that's the case going forward.

Fans can follow if they want.
Click to expand...

The fumbles and O'Donnell's turnover suck, but he acts like they automatically had to result in 3 touchdowns against a team with a garbage offense. That's a loser approach.
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Franchise nailed it more concisely than I did
 
The Franchise said:
Cal jimmy said:
I would agree with OP. Golden has held it together through tough times, masterful recruiting vs long odds, the UF win was described as a "program changer" (at the time and context matters) and we held our own vs long odds at FSU for the first half. It is still a young team and we have a ways to go.

This fan base does seem irrational given a 7-2 record albeit yesterday was UGLY. In time what matters is a pattern of improvement: one ugly loss doesn't define the coach.

All that being said, watching the post game presser with Golden wasn't very inspiring. I don't know what he could say and he was clearly frustrated but blaming the fumbles and the low snap for 21 points seems to miss the point that the D got shredded. Also, don't like it when a coach says "they" , meaning his players, need to decide who they want to be. It's a cliche but it comes across as blaming players.

Coach and team got to stick together. Hope that's the case going forward.

Fans can follow if they want.
Click to expand...

The fumbles and O'Donnell's turnover suck, but he acts like they automatically had to result in 3 touchdowns against a team with a garbage offense. That's a loser approach.
Click to expand...
This +1,000,000 as well as Morris postgame snickers win some lose some - as poorly as the team played and it was ****-poor - I am more upset by the reaction by the team (staff/qb/etc) - no one is ****ed that they lost a football game and on top of that no one is ****ed that they got curb stomped by a terrible offense.
 
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I've been a huge Golden supporter from day one. I'm still thrilled to have him captaining this ship.

But there are some systemic problems that have to be fixed.

We still suck at running the ball, constantly requiring our backs to make people miss before they reach the line of scrimmage. I have never been a Kehoe fan, and nothing this year has changed that.

And I can no longer deny that there is a schematic problem on defense. The explanation that we are essentially running two defenses w/ the hybrid 3-4, 4-3, and therefore, not running either effectively appears to be the best explanation. I can't imagine any other team in the top 40 is less effective in stopping 3d and longs. It's demoralizing to watch us get killed on simple crossing routes repeatedly.
 
It has been mentioned, but the lack of improvement this season is really a microcosm of the defense under this regime.

Obstacles beyond the staff's control (negative recruiting from other coaches, recruits that wouldn't qualify, etc.) have probably hindered it's ability to bring in the players required to run their defense with ideal personnel, but this is Year 3 and the same problems persist on defense.

Seriously, under Dorito's defense, how many times have we made opposing QBs look like Peyton ******* Manning? This happens to often. It goes well beyond the "we have too many mediocre players on defense." We're getting thrashed. Something is systematically wrong. Whether scheme, personnel or coaching, we will never be legit BCS contenders with performances from the defense like last night.

Most of us predicted a 2 or 3 loss season, but to regress as the season progresses is a major issue.
 
drifters1234 said:
I've been a huge Golden supporter from day one. I'm still thrilled to have him captaining this ship.

But there are some systemic problems that have to be fixed.

We still suck at running the ball, constantly requiring our backs to make people miss before they reach the line of scrimmage. I have never been a Kehoe fan, and nothing this year has changed that.

And I can no longer deny that there is a schematic problem on defense. The explanation that we are essentially running two defenses w/ the hybrid 3-4, 4-3, and therefore, not running either effectively appears to be the best explanation. I can't imagine any other team in the top 40 is less effective in stopping 3d and longs. It's demoralizing to watch us get killed on simple crossing routes repeatedly.
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This
 
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As far as the "regression" goes, JEEBUS gents, our schedule was BACK loaded with tougher games. The REAL problem here, is that everyone bought into a fantasy at the beginning of the year starting 7-0. We had a VERY easy early schedule. But all the signs were there for trouble. Morris' play has been horrendous all year. The defense, HAS regressed IMO, and that is a huge sign that our DC is not cutting it.

But people are OVER reacting now and going over the top trashing Golden when 3 weeks ago they were crowning him as a God. Honestly it makes you look like a **** FOOL for the cats that are always going to extremes.

I had a wait and see approach on COach D, and Ive seen enough. This defense is terrible. I DONT blame it all on the scheme as some do, because its MORE than just the scheme. The bigger problem is our personnel just DONT fit the scheme, and our LB play is attrocious, and our DC is also the LB coach. I actually made a point out of watching the D closely last night and I lost count of how many plays we had a player blow his assignment. IT was almost comical at times, like when Gilbert blew his assignment and rushed Thomas right next to another one of our guys who was also rushing him. They looked RIGHT at the back going into the flat for the screen, and both ran into eachother, ignored the back, and rushed the QB, leaving the back WIDE OPEN. The game was full of that. Gaines is always in the wrong place. Cornelius does nothing but stare into the backfield while people run right by him and end up wide open in the flat. We are NOT well coached on Defense, and that is deeper than the scheme, and WHY I feel Coach D needs to go, and now.

But trashing Golden right now is idiotic. This team is still no where near where it needs to be. Its still very young and missing any real Senior leadership. That game last night was very winnable but for a total special teams collapse for about 18 minutes of the game. Three crucial mistakes crushed the momentum of the game, and led to our loss. That is NO excuse for the Defense, but we would not be seeing this EPIC meltdown and hysteria trashing Golden if we would have pulled it out.
 
nycane said:
what does coach d have to work with? aqm is the only superstar talent on dl and he is a skinny legged fresh. chick is overrated because of his last name. not a stud. dl has nothing. lbs are young. gaines doesnt see the field at fsu. green, rodgers, aj, ty, probably dont even get a an offer from fsu. figs, grace, aqm and other would be redshirting right now at fsu. everyone talks scheme, if scheme was all that matter you would have wake contending for an acc title every year.
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I'm sure Wake Forest has a lot to work with, too. That would explain why they have scored a grant total of 3 points since having their best offensive game against our defense.
 
McGahee2TheHouse said:
nycane said:
what does coach d have to work with? aqm is the only superstar talent on dl and he is a skinny legged fresh. chick is overrated because of his last name. not a stud. dl has nothing. lbs are young. gaines doesnt see the field at fsu. green, rodgers, aj, ty, probably dont even get a an offer from fsu. figs, grace, aqm and other would be redshirting right now at fsu. everyone talks scheme, if scheme was all that matter you would have wake contending for an acc title every year.
Click to expand...
I'm sure Wake Forest has a lot to work with, too. That would explain why they have scored a grant total of 3 points since having their best offensive game against our defense.
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Come on Dawg. You are better than that. You can more than make your point without fudging things. You know **** well that WF lost their two best offensive players after our game. One at the end of our game, and the other at the beginning of the Cuse game. That was ALL they had on offense. Would be the equivalent of us losing Duke, Coley, HUrns and Waters all in a week.

There is no longer a doubt we have a serious problem on Defense, but we dont need to be gilding the lilly to make our point.
 
CANE4LIFE said:
As far as the "regression" goes, JEEBUS gents, our schedule was BACK loaded with tougher games. The REAL problem here, is that everyone bought into a fantasy at the beginning of the year starting 7-0. We had a VERY easy early schedule. But all the signs were there for trouble. Morris' play has been horrendous all year. The defense, HAS regressed IMO, and that is a huge sign that our DC is not cutting it.

But people are OVER reacting now and going over the top trashing Golden when 3 weeks ago they were crowning him as a God. Honestly it makes you look like a **** FOOL for the cats that are always going to extremes.

I had a wait and see approach on COach D, and Ive seen enough. This defense is terrible. I DONT blame it all on the scheme as some do, because its MORE than just the scheme. The bigger problem is our personnel just DONT fit the scheme, and our LB play is attrocious, and our DC is also the LB coach. I actually made a point out of watching the D closely last night and I lost count of how many plays we had a player blow his assignment. IT was almost comical at times, like when Gilbert blew his assignment and rushed Thomas right next to another one of our guys who was also rushing him. They looked RIGHT at the back going into the flat for the screen, and both ran into eachother, ignored the back, and rushed the QB, leaving the back WIDE OPEN. The game was full of that. Gaines is always in the wrong place. Cornelius does nothing but stare into the backfield while people run right by him and end up wide open in the flat. We are NOT well coached on Defense, and that is deeper than the scheme, and WHY I feel Coach D needs to go, and now.

But trashing Golden right now is idiotic. This team is still no where near where it needs to be. Its still very young and missing any real Senior leadership. That game last night was very winnable but for a total special teams collapse for about 18 minutes of the game. Three crucial mistakes crushed the momentum of the game, and led to our loss. That is NO excuse for the Defense, but we would not be seeing this EPIC meltdown and hysteria trashing Golden if we would have pulled it out.
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So you telling me we couldn't have held them to field goals?!

I am to the point once a opponent offense gets past the 50 its automatic touchdown.
 
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