What the NFL Draft will tell us about Cristobal and Miami's evaluations

[Brains]

Missed most of this thread but I'm with D$ here - development is so overrated. There is no one that takes HS nobodies and turns them into draft picks. Underrated guys? Sure. But there's always a telling sign from testing or track numbers or something that they found that made them pursue that kid. If anyone does do it.. it's the S&C program not the position coach, coordinator, or HC. Physical and mental development takes place in the weight room. Habits and work ethic are created there or already exist and separate the kids over 3-5 years in the weight room.

Outside of QB... 90% of the time... the kid is going to end up being what they end up being regardless... Especially physically. There's some fine tuning, polishing, etc. that goes into it with coaches. Some S&C programs are better than others but its very marginal - sure all of this can be the difference in a 4th rounder vs a 1st rounder or a 5th rounder and an UDFA. But no one is taking Henry Parrish and making him Benson, Brooks, or Corum. No one was taking Mike Redding and making him Marvin Harrison. Also, nobody developed Marvin Harrison, nobody developed Benson, nobody developed Malik Nabers. No one is out there turning Lou Cristobal into a 1st round monster. Texas WRs coach didn't do anything to Xavier Worthy. FSU didn't do anything to Benson or Verse except maybe put them in the lime light of the FBS (Verse) or put them in a system that they shine in (Benson). Had that not happened, Verse would have come out of Albany in the 3rd round and someone would be claiming "developing" or "finding a hidden gem" in the league. If Benson went to Mississippi State from Oregon and played in their terrible offense that was outmanned.. he'd tested into the 4th-5th round and then the same thing applies.

The biggest thing is identification and projection. Certain positions are less about physical traits projecting production.. like surprising enough speed isn't a strong indicator on WRs. But it's a nice extra layer of the evaluation process.

Much more goes into it than I can type here. Evaluating future NFL prospects when they come out of HS and signing them is a lot more important than who is coaching them. More importantly.. Mario is going to be crowned or exposed in the next 2-3-4 years when his classes that he identified, recruited, signed, coached, etc. all at Miami and all the way through. They're juniors now. I will say it doesn't look promising on that transition 2022 class but that is what it is. The 2023 class looks much stronger in that regard.

@NC_Canes_11 and I have been beating the drum regarding this "development" BS for years.

 

[Coach Macho]

I think "development" is a little overrated. Pretty much everybody in college football is doing the same drills, emphasizing the same things, teaching the same techniques, etc. Once you get to the college level pretty much every coach knows how to "coach up" kids. Some a little better than others, but nobody is making chicken salad out of chicken .

The guys who win games and send kids to the NFL are the ones who recruit more talented players.

I think EVALUATION is more important than development. (I think of Pitt and their DL recruiting)
If you recruit kids with talent and good work ethic then your "development" looks a lot better.
I've been doing this a long time, and most of my/our kids that have been successful in college were no-brainers in high school. We knew they would be successful wherever they went. And the kids who didn't pan out, well we kinda knew that was gonna happen too.
Kids like Leonard Taylor and James Williams are so gifted that colleges are willing to recruit/give them a chance regardless. But those kids showed red flags in high school and even a couple years into college. They're both 1st round talents who are HOLDING THEMSELVES BACK. It has NOTHING to do with development.

How kids pan-out in college and whether they go to the NFL is solely UP TO THEM.

But when you recruit at a high level, you can stack talented players like the Bama and Georgias of the world, so you don't have to rely on the 5-star talent with poor work ethic. You just sit his a$$ on the bench and slide-in another blue-chip guy. Nothing wakes a kid up like the old pine.

Being down here and seeing how Miami recruits currently, I can say for a fact that Mario and Co are putting a much bigger emphasis on body type and measureables than the previous staffs. They have an idea of what certain positions are supposed to look like, and they're pretty adamant about that. I've got 3 LB's right now with ACC offers and they're not really recruiting any of them. (for specific reasons that are kinda picky but still understandable if you're tying to be an elite program)

I'm not sure yet how good we'll be under Mario, but I know we'll finally LOOK like an actual premier program, at least getting off the bus. And I'm positive that we will send more kids to the NFL.

 

[mirvin88]

I think "development" is a little overrated. Pretty much everybody in college football is doing the same drills, emphasizing the same things, teaching the same techniques, etc. Once you get to the college level pretty much every coach knows how to "coach up" kids. Some a little better than others, but nobody is making chicken salad out of chicken .

The guys who win games and send kids to the NFL are the ones who recruit more talented players.

I think EVALUATION is more important than development. (I think of Pitt and their DL recruiting)
If you recruit kids with talent and good work ethic then your "development" looks a lot better.
I've been doing this a long time, and most of my/our kids that have been successful in college were no-brainers in high school. We knew they would be successful wherever they went. And the kids who didn't pan out, well we kinda knew that was gonna happen too.
Kids like Leonard Taylor and James Williams are so gifted that colleges are willing to recruit/give them a chance regardless. But those kids showed red flags in high school and even a couple years into college. They're both 1st round talents who are HOLDING THEMSELVES BACK. It has NOTHING to do with development.

How kids pan-out in college and whether they go to the NFL is solely UP TO THEM.

But when you recruit at a high level, you can stack talented players like the Bama and Georgias of the world, so you don't have to rely on the 5-star talent with poor work ethic. You just sit his a$$ on the bench and slide-in another blue-chip guy. Nothing wakes a kid up like the old pine.

Being down here and seeing how Miami recruits currently, I can say for a fact that Mario and Co are putting a much bigger emphasis on body type and measureables than the previous staffs. They have an idea of what certain positions are supposed to look like, and they're pretty adamant about that. I've got 3 LB's right now with ACC offers and they're not really recruiting any of them. (for specific reasons that are kinda picky but still understandable if you're tying to be an elite program)

I'm not sure yet how good we'll be under Mario, but I know we'll finally LOOK like an actual premier program, at least getting off the bus. And I'm positive that we will send more kids to the NFL.

I can also see a change in the character/love of the game personalities they’re bringing in which kinda goes hand in hand with your mention of work ethic. With that passion for the game also comes that mentality of “we’re not losing this game” that we’ve been severely lacking.

 

[cway313]

I think "development" is a little overrated. Pretty much everybody in college football is doing the same drills, emphasizing the same things, teaching the same techniques, etc. Once you get to the college level pretty much every coach knows how to "coach up" kids. Some a little better than others, but nobody is making chicken salad out of chicken .

The guys who win games and send kids to the NFL are the ones who recruit more talented players.

I think EVALUATION is more important than development. (I think of Pitt and their DL recruiting)
If you recruit kids with talent and good work ethic then your "development" looks a lot better.
I've been doing this a long time, and most of my/our kids that have been successful in college were no-brainers in high school. We knew they would be successful wherever they went. And the kids who didn't pan out, well we kinda knew that was gonna happen too.
Kids like Leonard Taylor and James Williams are so gifted that colleges are willing to recruit/give them a chance regardless. But those kids showed red flags in high school and even a couple years into college. They're both 1st round talents who are HOLDING THEMSELVES BACK. It has NOTHING to do with development.

How kids pan-out in college and whether they go to the NFL is solely UP TO THEM.

But when you recruit at a high level, you can stack talented players like the Bama and Georgias of the world, so you don't have to rely on the 5-star talent with poor work ethic. You just sit his a$$ on the bench and slide-in another blue-chip guy. Nothing wakes a kid up like the old pine.

Being down here and seeing how Miami recruits currently, I can say for a fact that Mario and Co are putting a much bigger emphasis on body type and measureables than the previous staffs. They have an idea of what certain positions are supposed to look like, and they're pretty adamant about that. I've got 3 LB's right now with ACC offers and they're not really recruiting any of them. (for specific reasons that are kinda picky but still understandable if you're tying to be an elite program)

I'm not sure yet how good we'll be under Mario, but I know we'll finally LOOK like an actual premier program, at least getting off the bus. And I'm positive that we will send more kids to the NFL.

I don't care how it's categorized we have failed to implement accountability and create competition. To me those are developmental aspects that the HC can fix.

 

[ALLoverCANE]

LBJ is too PASSive to be the GOAT. Jordan all day. And I was born in the early 90s so I didn’t even watch Jordan. LBJ and the new NBA is garbage

So you didn't watch him and you think the only NBA you've ever watched is garbage. Got it. You sound real credible LOL

 

[Coach Macho]

I don't care how it's categorized we have failed to implement accountability and create competition. To me those are developmental aspects that the HC can fix.

Create competition between who?
We were fvckin' pedestrian at DT and Safety. And Williams only competition couldn't keep his head on straight.

Culture and talent create competition.
He held Taylor accountable. He wasn't a full-time starter here.

 

[cway313]

Create competition between who?
We were fvckin' pedestrian at DT and Safety. And Williams only competition couldn't keep his head on straight.

Culture and talent create competition.
He held Taylor accountable. He wasn't a full-time starter here.

Everywhere, we have guys are the unquestioned starter year after year. We failed the LTs and JWs by not recruiting alternative options.

 

[canes732]

So you didn't watch him and you think the only NBA you've ever watched is garbage. Got it. You sound real credible LOL

Watched from like 1999 till now. This new era is absolute garbage can openly travel and carry the ball every play. Unwatchable

 

[bshaw28]

2022 Recruiting class will be eligible for the 2025 Draft.

2022 isn't looking too good draft prospect wise - but it was a transition class, so it's got some leeway to be excused IMO.

2023 Recruiting class / 2026 Draft is more where we can see the effect of Mario's recruiting.

Of course the all the transfers are going to make what school you give credit to pretty messy.

Like if DT Darrell Jackson becomes a high draft pick in 2025 - was that FSU, Miami, or Maryland? Is Cam Ward Incarnate World, Wash St, or Miami?

 

[Telituesday]

There’s no hiding when it comes to the NFL Draft. If you’ve been struggling with talent evaluation and acquisition, the Draft will expose you. If you’re recruiting guys with subpar measurables, the Combine will expose them. It’s an unforgiving and unsentimental process.

The Miami Hurricanes had a rough time at last weekend’s combine, with Leonard Taylor, James Williams and Kam Kinchens all performing below expectations. Javion Cohen elected not to run his forty and faced questions about his departure from Alabama. Matt Lee had a tremendous workout, but has long-term durability concerns.
All told, it’s possible that no Hurricane goes on Days 1 and 2. This is what Mario Cristobal was brought in to fix. Here’s the good news: as many as six players signed by Mario Cristobal could go in the Top 100: OC Jackson Powers-Johnson, WR Troy Franklin, OT Kingsley Suamataia, DL Brandon Dorlus, RB Trey Benson and CB DJ James. Two of those players left Oregon after Mario came to Miami, and another left to BYU when he got homesick. But all were evaluated, recruited and signed by Mario Cristobal.
I joined Peter Ariz to talk about this and other Hurricane-related draft topics on the CanesInSight Daily Podcast. First, we broke down the combine numbers for each set of players. It quickly became clear that Cristobal was recruiting a higher level of measurables than Miami from 2019-2021:

• Kam Kinchens: 5’11, 203, 4.65, 35-inch vert, 9’2 broad
• James Williams: 6’4, 231, 4.65, 30-inch vert, 9’9 broad
• Leonard Taylor: 6’3, 303, 5.12 (1.76 split), 30-inch vert, 9’1 broad, 7.81 3 cone
• Javion Cohen: 6’4, 324, 26’5-inch vert, 8’8 broad
• Matt Lee: 6’4, 301, 5.03 forty (1.76 split) 31-inch vert, 9’3 broad

Compare those numbers to Cristobal’s signees:

• Jackson Powers-Johnson: 6’3, 328, 32-inch vert, 8’8 broad, 30 bench reps
• Troy Franklin: 6’2, 174, 4.41, 39-inch vert, 10’4 broad jump
• Kingsley Suamataia: 6’5, 326, 5.04 forty (1.74), 28-inch vert, 9’2 broad, 31 bench reps
• Brandon Dorlus: 6’3, 283, 4.85 (1.68 split), 30.5-inch vert, 9’3 broad
• Trey Benson: 6’0, 216, 4.39, 33.5-inch vert, 10’2 broad
• DJ James: 6’0, 175, 4.41

The most frustrating evaluation is Dorlus, a Deerfield Beach grad who outperformed every single player in Miami’s class that year. He was underrated, but not a secret– myself, Coach Macho and other board regulars promoted him as one of the year’s top sleepers. Cristobal identified him, came across the country and stole him from under Manny Diaz’s nose.

Will Cristobal be able to recreate his success as an evaluator at Oregon in Miami? That remains to be seen. But the NFL Draft will tell us a lot, and there are some encouraging signs this year.

Later in the Podcast, Peter Ariz polled some of his NFL scouting sources to get a feel for the draft range of Miami’s top prospects. Here is what he found:

Kam Kinchens: “Second to third round range was always more likely because there was an understanding that the physical testing may not be his strong suit. Obviously, he didn't put up good numbers at all. But scouts know that he went out there and ran on an ankle that was not 100%. Most of the time guys are looking for any excuse not to run. A lot of the feedback I've gotten is that it confirms who Kam is character-wise and as a football player. So I think third round is probably where Kam goes off the board. He blew the interview process out of the water and has another opportunity to to test at Pro Day. Hopefully, he’s 100%.”

James Williams: “By the numbers in his safety group, he did not stack up well testing-wise. But you understand his NFL role is going to be as more of a linebacker. Here’s the question for the scouts: they want to project him at linebacker because his skill set could be really, really dangerous there. But they haven't seen that on film. They haven't seen the consistent physicality, the consistency as a tackler or as a striker. So the film needs to match what they want him to be. I think probably fifth to seventh round, someone will take a chance on his skill set. It's going to take a scheme-specific team that takes him and really thinks they can put him in a role.”

Javion Cohen: “He’s a very interesting one. Went to the Senior Bowl and had a good week. Did not run at the combine but did a field workout, and I’m told he did a good job there. I think the question is, he's at Alabama and was All-Conference. Why do you leave Alabama to go to Miami? Team are digging into his background.”

Leonard Taylor: “Leonard Taylor did not have a productive year on the field. Before the season, I talked to people who told me he does stuff as an interior pass rusher and he has ability as an interior pass rusher that is hard to find. Does he give it a hundred percent every play? Does he have that motor? Those are the questions these scouts have tried to figure out. He did not test well. And that was something he was supposed to have in his back pocket because the production was not there. Someone will take him fifth, sixth, seventh round. Probably closer to six or seventh round for him.”

Matt Lee: “Awesome day of testing for him. He has a couple things going against him: number 1, being a center, there's only 32 starting centers in the league. A lot of times these backups now are hybrid guys who can play some guard as well as center. Matt Lee is pretty much only a center. He's not going to be able to play guard at the next level. And then the medical side. There might be some concerns that he's not going to be able to stay completely healthy for more than a few years. But that's not to say he can't get drafted late, get an opportunity in a camp. He has all the ability to play there. If the medical was clean, he'd be a mid-round guy. No doubt about it. But if he can get into a camp, stay healthy, teams won't have any objection to giving him a multi-year deal. I think probably late round to undrafted for him, a priority free agent. If that's the case, he'll have plenty of suitors because he can play for sure.”

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Pretty sure Mario would’ve taken two top 10 players in James Williams and Leonard taylor if he could have at oregon (or Miami) lol. Not to mention kinchens became a very strong eval wherever he gets drafted. Don’t think those guys having bad pro days reflects poorly on the coaches who recruited them.

 

[Silentobserver]

Pretty sure Mario would’ve taken two top 10 players in James Williams and Leonard taylor if he could have at oregon (or Miami) lol. Not to mention kinchens became a very strong eval wherever he gets drafted. Don’t think those guys having bad pro days reflects poorly on the coaches who recruited them.

No, but the fact you can only list 3 names is problematic and that issue sits squarely on the shoulders of Manny Diaz.

 

[Ironmanfootball]

I think "development" is a little overrated. Pretty much everybody in college football is doing the same drills, emphasizing the same things, teaching the same techniques, etc. Once you get to the college level pretty much every coach knows how to "coach up" kids. Some a little better than others, but nobody is making chicken salad out of chicken .

The guys who win games and send kids to the NFL are the ones who recruit more talented players.

I think EVALUATION is more important than development. (I think of Pitt and their DL recruiting)
If you recruit kids with talent and good work ethic then your "development" looks a lot better.
I've been doing this a long time, and most of my/our kids that have been successful in college were no-brainers in high school. We knew they would be successful wherever they went. And the kids who didn't pan out, well we kinda knew that was gonna happen too.
Kids like Leonard Taylor and James Williams are so gifted that colleges are willing to recruit/give them a chance regardless. But those kids showed red flags in high school and even a couple years into college. They're both 1st round talents who are HOLDING THEMSELVES BACK. It has NOTHING to do with development.

How kids pan-out in college and whether they go to the NFL is solely UP TO THEM.

But when you recruit at a high level, you can stack talented players like the Bama and Georgias of the world, so you don't have to rely on the 5-star talent with poor work ethic. You just sit his a$$ on the bench and slide-in another blue-chip guy. Nothing wakes a kid up like the old pine.

Being down here and seeing how Miami recruits currently, I can say for a fact that Mario and Co are putting a much bigger emphasis on body type and measureables than the previous staffs. They have an idea of what certain positions are supposed to look like, and they're pretty adamant about that. I've got 3 LB's right now with ACC offers and they're not really recruiting any of them. (for specific reasons that are kinda picky but still understandable if you're tying to be an elite program)

I'm not sure yet how good we'll be under Mario, but I know we'll finally LOOK like an actual premier program, at least getting off the bus. And I'm positive that we will send more kids to the NFL.

Development isn't as overrated as it's being done so poorly at most schools it's become a wash.
Like you said- same drills. No creativity or growth in the business.
Just watch most tracking and tackling drills done at a college or HS practice. WOOF.
Also- Same S&C at every stop. Literally copy-paste and forget to change logos.

Clearly acquiring "the best" people (Core Values + Talent/Skill) should be a top priority.
What Partridge did right at Pitt was to trust his own evaluation over everything else. Know who you can get, and what you want to get.
But those players were developed.

Kurt Hester takes chicken **** and makes chicken salad.
La Tech (and is again) and Tulane were garbage before him.
Houston will be a force now with Uncle Kurt in the big seat.
He doesn't turn blue chips into 5th-7th rounders, he takes 0-2 stars and turns them into draft picks.

Agree completely that PT is the ONLY way to wake someone up, and if they don't care about PT cut them loose.
How about if you're going to go 12-13 anyway, why not do it with people who care?

Agree choices define us and giving a chit is a choice. Caring is completely up to the individual.
But some people can care and be misguided (ie #GrindSZN)
A lot of caring going into the wrong tools to get better.
Have to hope the five-stars stay five-stars and don't get worse in your program.

 

[ALLoverCANE]

Watched from like 1999 till now. This new era is absolute garbage can openly travel and carry the ball every play. Unwatchable

There was as much traveling in the early 2000s. I understand arguing that the 90s or earlier was better than the current era, but not the early 2000s. The current is basically the early 2000s but with better shooting.

 

[canes732]

There was as much traveling in the early 2000s. I understand arguing that the 90s or earlier was better than the current era, but not the early 2000s. The current is basically the early 2000s but with better shooting.

They literally made a rule change calling it a “gather dribble” like 3-4 years ago. So what u said is false. New era allows 3 steps. Why even dribble anymore there’s no rules structuring play anymore

 

[ALLoverCANE]

They literally made a rule change calling it a “gather dribble” like 3-4 years ago. So what u said is false. New era allows 3 steps. Why even dribble anymore there’s no rules structuring play anymore

Traveling in the NBA was invented 3 years ago LOL ok dude.

 

[SWFLHurricane]

I’ve had the pleasure to meet Mr George Iceman Gervin on multiple occasions. One of the nicest ppl I’ve ever met. I told him I want to give him the flowers he deserved. Bro is hardly ever mentioned among greatest SF to ever play the game.

@Rellyrell ...no words needed...

 

[Glow]

Jordan at his peak was better than LBJ at his peak. Here's the argument for LBJ:

-40k career points is insane
-Longevity and durability
-The talent pool was much deeper during LBJ's era, due to European players
-There was much more player movement during LBJ's era. Players teamed up to win rings while LBJ was around
-LBJ is the most versatile player of all time. If you were having an all time draft, he'd likely go #1 bc you can pick anyone at #2. You can't pick Kobe second if you pick MJ first, for example
-Losing in the finals isn't worse than losing before the finals

There's no wrong answer. It just depends what you value and how you define GOAT

Here’s the argument for LBJ:

1. Longevity

That’s it; yet, that argument wasn’t valid for

1. Stockton being the best point guard of all time
2. Malone being the best power forward of all time
3. Kareem being the GOAT (although some old heads view him as such)
4. Stockton being the greatest defender of all time

Here are the inflated facts about LBJ vs. MJ:

1. LBJ is a more versatile player than MJ

Well, that’s interesting b/c LBJ avg. only 2 more assist per game than MJ, 1 more rebound per game than MJ, while avg. less steals, the same amount of blocks, and more turnovers. He avg. 2 less shots than MJ per game for his career.

2. LBJ is a pass first guy

Again, he avg. 7.2 assist while taking 20 shots per game. Magic avg. 11.5 assist while avg. 13 shots per game. Stockton avg. 10.5 assist while avg. 9 shots per game.
Kids avg. 8.7 assist while avg. 11 shots per game

These r the definitions of pass first

3. Losing the Finals isn’t worst than losing before the Finals.

Lol. Since when? Did we hold this same criteria for Jerry West? Did we hold this same criteria for Elgin Baylor? LBJ is the only player to reach the Finals 10x & not have a winning record. In fact, he has the 3rd most Finals losses in NBA history. Furthermore, LBJ has missed the playoffs 4x, have been swept 2x, had a complete choke job in 2011.

4. LBJ makes his teams better

Does he? Fans point to Cleveland collapsing twice after he left, yet fail to acknowledge that both collapse happened AFTER all resources were used to build around LBJ including trading away players, and draft picks ONLY for LBJ to leave, those same players that were traded for to get traded, AGAIN, to reclaim draft picks to rebuild! Lol

They point to Miami in 2014-15, failing to realize that Bosh had season ending lung issues, Ray retired, Wade got hurt, & oh yeah, draft capital gone due to trades.

LBJ attempts to microwave results, and those results have come at the expense of the future.

5. Player movement

Well, guess who started that? Lol. KG, Allen, & Pierce got together in 2007 to chase a ring at the ends of their careers, no different than Barkley, Pippen, & Hakeem linking together in ‘98.

In 2007, KG was in his 13th season at 32 yrs old. Pierce was in his 10th year at 31 yrs old, & Allen was in his 10th at 32 yrs old.

In ‘98, Dream was in 15th yr at 35 yrs old. Barkley was in his 15th yr at 35 yrs old. Pippen was in 12th yr at 33 yrs old.

In 2010 LBJ joined Wade & Bosh. LBJ was in his 8th yr at 26 yrs old. Wade was in his 8th yr at 28 yrs old. Bosh was in his 8th yr at 27 years old.

This would be equivalent to MJ joining Zeke, & Bird in their primes. That seismic shift started the trend of “player movement.” The only player movement, however, has been LBJ & KD. LBJ has been on Cleveland, Miami, Cleveland, & now LA. KD has been on OKC, GSW, Brooklyn, & now Phx. Those two r the poster children of scotch hopping to chase rings, while crying they r GOATs. Lol


This is about LBJ stat stuffing: He knows that’s all he has.

LBJ has never built or sustained a dynasty
LBJ career accomplishments are still a 1st ballot HOF player away from MJ & he’s played considerably longer

It amazes me how longevity stats have become over blown.

MJ has:
More Rings (2 more) in a shorter period of time
More MVPs (1) in a shorter period of time
More Finals MVPs (2) in shorter period time
More DPOY (1) in a shorter period of time
More All Defensive Teams (3) in a shorter period of time

MJ’s peak was 13 yrs, my guy, culminating with him being the oldest player to:
Win the chip, Win the MVP, Win the Finals MVP, Make 1st team All NBA, Make 1st team All Def, Make 1st team, & win All Star Game MVP all in the same season.

LBJ is also the first player to miss the playoffs while
1. Being the NBA Finals Favorite
2. Having 3 or more NBA Top 75 players on one team

LBJ has a lot of holes in his resume compared to MJ, Kobe, Kareem, Magic, & other legends. His legacy is based upon stats compiling, not substance.

Lastly, the era of European players is interesting. Jokic & Luka, specifically said it’s easier to play in today’s NBA than Europe. That’s an issue; The NBA was much more difficult for European players to adjust to in the 80’s - early 2000’s. The rule changes have made it **** near impossible to play defense, & guys coming over from countries where goal tending & paint occupation is allowed, along w physical contact are eating American basketball up. That’s not a good thing for LBJ; it shows he’s playing in a much more watered down, arcade like league. The fact he’s not dominating this league despite the help he has is even more of a black eye.

We should all just decide on Kareem as the GOAT because his resume is good enough and he doesn't inspire the sort of unhinged fandom and hating and bad faith takes that happen with the other guys, and he had a unique signature move which is a style points bonus.

 

[Peachycarnahan]

I think "development" is a little overrated. Pretty much everybody in college football is doing the same drills, emphasizing the same things, teaching the same techniques, etc. Once you get to the college level pretty much every coach knows how to "coach up" kids. Some a little better than others, but nobody is making chicken salad out of chicken .

The guys who win games and send kids to the NFL are the ones who recruit more talented players.

I think EVALUATION is more important than development. (I think of Pitt and their DL recruiting)
If you recruit kids with talent and good work ethic then your "development" looks a lot better.
I've been doing this a long time, and most of my/our kids that have been successful in college were no-brainers in high school. We knew they would be successful wherever they went. And the kids who didn't pan out, well we kinda knew that was gonna happen too.
Kids like Leonard Taylor and James Williams are so gifted that colleges are willing to recruit/give them a chance regardless. But those kids showed red flags in high school and even a couple years into college. They're both 1st round talents who are HOLDING THEMSELVES BACK. It has NOTHING to do with development.

How kids pan-out in college and whether they go to the NFL is solely UP TO THEM.

But when you recruit at a high level, you can stack talented players like the Bama and Georgias of the world, so you don't have to rely on the 5-star talent with poor work ethic. You just sit his a$$ on the bench and slide-in another blue-chip guy. Nothing wakes a kid up like the old pine.

Being down here and seeing how Miami recruits currently, I can say for a fact that Mario and Co are putting a much bigger emphasis on body type and measureables than the previous staffs. They have an idea of what certain positions are supposed to look like, and they're pretty adamant about that. I've got 3 LB's right now with ACC offers and they're not really recruiting any of them. (for specific reasons that are kinda picky but still understandable if you're tying to be an elite program)

I'm not sure yet how good we'll be under Mario, but I know we'll finally LOOK like an actual premier program, at least getting off the bus. And I'm positive that we will send more kids to the NFL.

Interesting POV. Great post. Thanks.

 

[EmCane]

Cool, then he also deserves credit for 90% of the players he identified & signed while at UO amounted to chit, correct?

What is the hit rate for drafted recruits for a NCAA program? There are 134 Div I football programs. Last year there were 259 selections and approx 70 come from non Div 1 schools. So math tells us each Div 1 school should have approx 5.6% of recruits drafted if equal distribution. Since Mario is about double the average, I would say he is doing good. Room for improvement sure, but still better than most. Very simple model I know, but it’s a football board, no need to over complicate things.

 

[cway313]

What is the hit rate for drafted recruits for a NCAA program? There are 134 Div I football programs. Last year there were 259 selections and approx 70 come from non Div 1 schools. So math tells us each Div 1 school should have approx 5.6% of recruits drafted if equal distribution. Since Mario is about double the average, I would say he is doing good. Room for improvement sure, but still better than most. Very simple model I know, but it’s a football board, no need to over complicate things.

Agreed, when grouping Mario in with Navy, Army, Jacksonville St and all other programs that compete for absolutely nothing he is crushing it. Bang up job.