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Week 9 Stat Roll

One9 said:
2024:
Martinez - 24 carries of 10+ yards on 160 att. (13 carries of 15+ yards)
Fletcher - 17 carries of 10+ yards on 112 att. (8 carries of 15+ yards)

2025:
Fletcher - 17 carries of 10+ yards on 109 att. (8 carries of 15+ yards)
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What are the stats for Brown and Lyle?

Clearly, we miss Martinez and Lyke has been hurt for a large % of the year.
 
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The offense has all the tools, they're just not being used correctly. If this team gets left out it will 100% be on the coaching and not the players. I don't know that the offense needs to speed up all the time but there are times when it clearly does need to speed up. Going slow limits your own possessions also and definitely lowers the margin of error. It's like we're just not interested in making things easier for the offense. Going so slow and just throwing away plays.
 
DMoney said:
Great post but I think you overstated it when you said "this offense stinks."

I agree we aren't national championship-caliber on offense right now and we need to get a lot more explosive. But we've seen bad offenses. This offense is scoring at a decent clip (32nd) and ranks high on a lot of the advanced stuff because we don't lose yards or throw incompletions.

The fundamental issues are pretty clear and evident in the stats: we aren't explosive enough in the passing game, and teams can stack the box with impunity because we aren't scaring defensive coordinators. Improving that element is going to the key to any potential playoff run (or even getting there).
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I did explain that I’m a harsh critic when it comes to offensive football. I’m just disappointed, and I’m lashing out because I’m a child and don’t know how else to express emotion.

Seriously though, I think I explained it decently after the opening sentence. Nationally, it doesn’t stink. For what we should expect given the resources and talent, it does. Or at least for what I expected. I thought this offense should be top 25-ish in the country. It is most certainly not that. Even though yes I do acknowledge being 32nd in scoring isn’t far off. And points are what it’s all about. But it’s been inconsistent. A G5 team and what equates to a G5 team, we scored 40+. The other 4 games, we’re under 30.

Let’s put it this way. We’re averaging 32 a game. If we actually put up 32 in every single game, I would say this team can win a natty. But I’m not convinced we’re actually scoring 32 against playoff teams. We didn’t against ND, UiF, FSU, or Louisville.
 
JHallCanes said:
There’s “ball control, staying on time, being efficient” etc

And then there’s flirting with Iowa levels of lack of explosive plays

We’ve played some tough defense so far but man…the 10+ yard plays in particular is sickening

That’s working way too hard for first downs and I think it’s why the fans backlash about the grind mode is so strong
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Mario took that old saying about working smarter not harder and said nah... lets flip that around

To pull a couple quotes from him this morning on Joe Rose
"Some times there are muddy yards where you are outnumbered by one or two guys"
"When you commit to the run, you really have to be committed to it and I feel like we did that"

Why do things the hard way when you dont have to? Outnumbered by one or two guys in the box? Bear fronts? LBs flying to the A gaps? Yeah, lets run into them anyway and prove how tough and committed we are. Heaven forbid we zip an RPO pass over the over aggressive LB, throw a screen the back or run it off tackle to make everyones life a little easier.
 
We ever gonna have a complete team?? I mean last year we had the offense rolling but no defense, now this year we have the defense rolling to no offense. It’s happened to many times in the past as well.
 
OrangeBowlMagic said:
I did explain that I’m a harsh critic when it comes to offensive football. I’m just disappointed, and I’m lashing out because I’m a child and don’t know how else to express emotion.

Seriously though, I think I explained it decently after the opening sentence. Nationally, it doesn’t stink. For what we should expect given the resources and talent, it does. Or at least for what I expected. I thought this offense should be top 25-ish in the country. It is most certainly not that. Even though yes I do acknowledge being 32nd in scoring isn’t far off. And points are what it’s all about. But it’s been inconsistent. A G5 team and what equates to a G5 team, we scored 40+. The other 4 games, we’re under 30.

Let’s put it this way. We’re averaging 32 a game. If we actually put up 32 in every single game, I would say this team can win a natty. But I’m not convinced we’re actually scoring 32 against playoff teams. We didn’t against ND, UiF, FSU, or Louisville.
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Agree with all that.

This is going to be the story of the rest of the season. On paper, we should boost those numbers with the teams remaining on our schedule. But if we sputter, those teams can outright beat us.
 
Warrior808 said:
Mario took that old saying about working smarter not harder and said nah... lets flip that around

To pull a couple quotes from him this morning on Joe Rose
"Some times there are muddy yards where you are outnumbered by one or two guys"
"When you commit to the run, you really have to be committed to it and I feel like we did that"

Why do things the hard way when you dont have to? Outnumbered by one or two guys in the box? Bear fronts? LBs flying to the A gaps? Yeah, lets run into them anyway and prove how tough and committed we are. Heaven forbid we zip an RPO pass over the over aggressive LB, throw a screen the back or run it off tackle to make everyones life a little easier.
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Thats always been his mentality and accounts for a loss or two like not taking a knee when the win is guaranteed, he wants to surrender nothing and show he is a man while or whatever it is.. tuff n fizical
 
OrangeBowlMagic said:
Not sure how accurate this really is, and also doesn't account for situation obviously, but teamrankings.com has Miami at 127th in the country in seconds per play. Meaning, we take 29.6 between each play, which ranks 127th out of 136. Yes, Army and Navy are lower/slower, but not many other teams.

HOWEVER, and again I think some of this is situation driven because they're almost always winning, but Ohio State is dead last. 136th out of 136. Vanderbilt, who is a Top 10 team, is 131st. So I don't think this directly correlates to winning or offensive production. There is more than one way to skin a cat. Last year, we were 77th in this number. So it wasn't exactly hyperspeed there either.

Again, I don't think the problem is pace. Some could disagree, and that's OK, I'm not saying I'm right. I'm not saying pace = production, but if you want to argue we should go faster, I'll agree because what we're doing isn't working.

But Ohio State, again, is dead last. They're 25th in yards per play. We're 55th. So slow isn't necessarily bad, but if you're slow AND inefficient, maybe try to switch it up? I do think though the staff understands they have a championship defense and perhaps their line of thinking is, we can win games with that side, so possess the ball, obviously try to score points but don't sacrifice quick punts to do it, and keep our defense fresh because that's our superior unit? Just spitballing. Obviously it'd be ideal to be Top 10 on both sides, but there's probably a reason very few teams historically are. You usually need to play complementary, and scoring 50 and allowing zero probably only exists on XBox. Again, thinking/typing out loud.
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Good stuff. I want more tempo not because it automatically correlates with production, but because Beck’s playing style fits that pace IMO. He is a quick operator by nature.
 
MovingZen said:
The offense has all the tools, they're just not being used correctly. If this team gets left out it will 100% be on the coaching and not the players. I don't know that the offense needs to speed up all the time but there are times when it clearly does need to speed up. Going slow limits your own possessions also and definitely lowers the margin of error. It's like we're just not interested in making things easier for the offense. Going so slow and just throwing away plays.
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I don't agree with this line of thinking. I keep seeing this here. "Well Lance said it lowers the margin for error". Don't get me wrong, I respect Lance very much and he knows more about this stuff than me. But I'd love to be educated how running more plays automatically lowers your margin for error. Let me preface this by saying, I would be in favor of going faster, simply because we have 7 games of data showing going at our current pace isn't working very well. So, I'm all for trying something a little different. But I think people are under some impression that this magically equates to production. We are bad on offense on a per play basis. Let me make that very clear. Down to down, this is an average offense. So, you think adding more mediocrity (aka more plays) magically makes us better. And magically improves this margin of error? Again, I'm an analytical guy, but admittedly am not an expert in this line of thinking. So I'm all for being educated.

I make a basketball analogy. The league is obsessed with three point shooting. And yes, if you're an efficient shooter, you should shoot threes and often because they're worth 1.5X more than a two-point shot. But what if you shoot 22% from three? Should you still jack them up relentlessly?

Again, back to us, if we had last year's offense, **** **** yes, run as many plays as possible. Because every time you snap the ball, you get 7.5 yards a play, which is the best in the history of the school, so keep banking 7.5 after 7.5, you'll likely score points. Does that same thinking hold true when you're 55th in the country in yards per play? We should just be average even faster than we are? I'm not sure I buy this magically lowers the margin of error.

Either way, as I've said 50X in this thread, we have to do something. Because this offense isn't good enough right now. If thread 1 to pull is "go faster", have at it. Do something.
 
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DMoney said:
Good stuff. I want more tempo not because it automatically correlates with production, but because Beck’s playing style fits that pace IMO. He is a quick operator by nature.
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This I can agree with. Check my post directly below yours. I agree with you here. And even more ground-floor thinking, as I said, try something different. I agree with you, Beck has played a ton of ball, he's seen it all, let him to fast and not be so cerebral and just play loose. I'm all for that. But to me, you're over 50% of the way through the year, I think that's enough of a sample to say what you're doing isn't working overly well. I'm not saying do a total 180, but "more of the same" doesn't really seem logical when the same has you 55th in America in yards per play. Try a new wrinkle.

I don't even really care if it's this week. I think we can beat SMU somewhat soundly just playing the same game we've been playing, but not turning the ball over. And not to get ahead of myself here, but maybe you try some new stuff the next 2 weeks, at home, against Syracuse and NC State, two teams you should be able to flatten with your eyes closed.
 
90scane said:
Carp to Brock is the biggest issue. Remember, McCoy did get snaps last year. Carpenter was a much bigger C and we run a ton of inside zones.
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I agree--to my untrained eye, it seems like Brock is a major issue in the run game. And that has an outsized impact because we run the A gap so regularly. His getting completely destroyed by the Stanford DT on the 4th-and-1 is a pretty obvious example.
 
I question how much the pace is to help the defense. For a few games we hardly rotated on D (Louisville). Wondering if they are worried about depth.

I know our defense is performing well, but the rest helps a ton as well.
 
OrangeBowlMagic said:
This I can agree with. Check my post directly below yours. I agree with you here. And even more ground-floor thinking, as I said, try something different. I agree with you, Beck has played a ton of ball, he's seen it all, let him to fast and not be so cerebral and just play loose. I'm all for that. But to me, you're over 50% of the way through the year, I think that's enough of a sample to say what you're doing isn't working overly well. I'm not saying do a total 180, but "more of the same" doesn't really seem logical when the same has you 55th in America in yards per play. Try a new wrinkle.

I don't even really care if it's this week. I think we can beat SMU somewhat soundly just playing the same game we've been playing, but not turning the ball over. And not to get ahead of myself here, but maybe you try some new stuff the next 2 weeks, at home, against Syracuse and NC State, two teams you should be able to flatten with your eyes closed.
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On Joe Rose this morning, Mario said they changed things up on offense in the 2nd half. He said they were always flexible and adaptive depending on the situation. We did see some some off tackle runs and 4 wides.
 
TomAce said:
Great job. Really appreciate it. I wish there was a metric to measure the damage of timely penalties. Quite a few of them have been during an offense series where Cane are moving the ball and have rhythm or in the red zone.

Also, think we miss out on some explosive runs because it isn't Fletcher's game. He can't run away from anyone and I have more wiggle in the open field. Many times he simply tries to run through a man ten yards down field because there isn't another option.
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Think there a few ways to measure this. Most broadly could compare points/drive on drives with and without penalties. Could also look at expected drive points from the field position and down & distance just before the penalty was assessed versus the points we actually scored on the drive. Like Brockermeyer's false starts in the red zone against UF (I think that's who it was). We got 3 points but am guessing our expected points on those drives was greater than 3 just before the penalties. I think we're uniquely unsuited to overcome offensive penalties this year amongst playoff contenders. We did score a TD after Samson's false start in Stanford territory at the end of the first half which was good to see. On the other hand, the Bauman false start on the first drive wrecked that one. We had leverage on them outside to the right on the run, and Coach was ****ed off (rightfully so)
 
DMoney said:
Good stuff. I want more tempo not because it automatically correlates with production, but because Beck’s playing style fits that pace IMO. He is a quick operator by nature.
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I agree, plus of course it limits the ability of the defense to substitute and change packages. I think we took advantage of that some in the Stanford game, including when Fletcher broke off a decent run to about the 4, we went tempo, Stanford was unable to substitute to its short yardage package, and Fletcher essentially walked into the end zone untouched.
 
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DMoney said:
Great post but I think you overstated it when you said "this offense stinks."

I agree we aren't national championship-caliber on offense right now and we need to get a lot more explosive. But we've seen bad offenses. This offense is scoring at a decent clip (32nd) and ranks high on a lot of the advanced stuff because we don't lose yards or throw incompletions.

The fundamental issues are pretty clear and evident in the stats: we aren't explosive enough in the passing game, and teams can stack the box with impunity because we aren't scaring defensive coordinators. Improving that element is going to the key to any potential playoff run (or even getting there).
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100% this. Stanford still went bear front when we were in 10 and 20 personnel to start the game. The more #17/3/1/anyone else with legs and hands become weapons the better our run game and offense will get. Similarly, the more effective Lyle is threatening the edge in the run game, the better the rest of the run game will look.
 
Warrior808 said:
Mario took that old saying about working smarter not harder and said nah... lets flip that around

To pull a couple quotes from him this morning on Joe Rose
"Some times there are muddy yards where you are outnumbered by one or two guys"
"When you commit to the run, you really have to be committed to it and I feel like we did that"

Why do things the hard way when you dont have to? Outnumbered by one or two guys in the box? Bear fronts? LBs flying to the A gaps? Yeah, let’s run into them anyway and prove how tough and committed we are. Heaven forbid we zip an RPO pass over the over aggressive LB, throw a screen the back or run it off tackle to make everyones life a little easier.
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Agreed and to be fair he’s not wrong SOMETIMES

He’s built the team through recruiting to dominate the short yardage situations and there’s nothing inherently wrong with that

The problem I see is fundamental

You can run tight formations in between the tackles and still be creative. **** guys like Kyle Shanahan and Jim Harbaugh style teams spent years successful at the highest levels saying hey man we are running it right at you try and stop it

Couple issues though:

1. Our guys and their presnap penalties and procedural issues. Tough to be creative like that when guys can’t handle the basics which is frustrating because we’ve invested so much up front

2. If you’re gonna recruit guys like Bauman and use them as blockers over say taking an Elijah Arroyo wide receiver threat at TE, well that’s fine, but these guys suck. Talk about a complete waste of a position on the team. If you can’t be a receiving threat and you can’t block for ****, what are we doing? Lofton same thing

Take a look at that failure of a 4th and short play against FSU. We tried to get creative and honestly it was probably 6 points if Beck just makes a simple throw to Toney. But we ****ed it all up and made it a disaster

I want to see some simple wrinkles just like everyone else. I see some glaring issues with coaching up front though but you can’t suggest that type of thing with Mario and Mirabal
 
90scane said:
What are the stats for Brown and Lyle?

Clearly, we miss Martinez and Lyke has been hurt for a large % of the year.
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outside for Fletch & Damian Martinez

2024:
Ward - 14 carries of 10+ yards on 44 att.
Lyle - 9 carries of 10+ on 60 att. (3 15+ yard carries)
Ajay Allen - 4 carries of 10+ on 25 att. (2 15+ yard carries)
Lofton - 1 carry of 10+ on 2 att. (1 15+ yard carry)
Chris Johnson Jr - 1 on 6 att. (1 15+ yard carry)

2025:
Marty Brown: 4 carries of 10+ yards on 65 att.
Keelan Marion: 2 carries of 10+ on 2 att. (1 15+ yard carry)
Emory Vick: 2 carries of 10+ on 2 att.
Toney: 2 carries of 10+ on 3 att.
Wheatley-Humphrey: 2 carries of 10+ on 14 att.
Lyle: 2 carries of 10+ on 21 att. (1 15+ yard carry)
Pringle: 1 carry of 10+ on 10 att. (1 15+ yard carry)
Beck 1 carry of 10+ on 19 att.
 
OrangeBowlMagic said:
I did explain that I’m a harsh critic when it comes to offensive football. I’m just disappointed, and I’m lashing out because I’m a child and don’t know how else to express emotion.

Seriously though, I think I explained it decently after the opening sentence. Nationally, it doesn’t stink. For what we should expect given the resources and talent, it does. Or at least for what I expected. I thought this offense should be top 25-ish in the country. It is most certainly not that. Even though yes I do acknowledge being 32nd in scoring isn’t far off. And points are what it’s all about. But it’s been inconsistent. A G5 team and what equates to a G5 team, we scored 40+. The other 4 games, we’re under 30.

Let’s put it this way. We’re averaging 32 a game. If we actually put up 32 in every single game, I would say this team can win a natty. But I’m not convinced we’re actually scoring 32 against playoff teams. We didn’t against ND, UiF, FSU, or Louisville.
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Saw this on X: Pretty surprising some of the teams on this list.

 
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