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The best athletes ever?

CaneOil said:
What I did see was Jordan losing almost every game in Boston Garden even with Pippen as early as the 87 season, Jordan, Grant, Oakley, Gilmore, Paxton, Sparrow, threate and a couple other back up big guys. Not a bad lineup, still Boston destroyed them. Both Magic and Bird have said each other was the best along with saying Jordan was, but when they were all in their prime the both beat Jordan. Boston 17 times in a row, swept them in the playoffs twice. Jordan shot the ball over 40 times in a couple of those games I was at. One was 45 times I believe. How many of the best players in the league get 50 or 60 if they shoot the ball 40 times? Twenty or so of those points off of foul shots. Bird was better at free throws and 3 pointers. More assists per game, much better rebounder, field goal percentage the same, points per game Jordan by 6, only because he took a ton more shots that Bird. Jordan took a ****load more shots than Bird sometime over 700 per year as in 1996. Bird more steals per game, more blocks per game, Jordans stats surely don't show he was better either. And head to head it wasn't even close.
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If i thought you were trolling, i’d give you a high score instead, you sound like a dumb, biased, bitter, jordan-hating moran. Lol. Not doing this again. Believe what you want.
 
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OriginalGatorHater said:
If we are going to add a wrestler we add Alexander Karelin. That man dominated in one of the most competitive era of Oly wrestling ever. If we are talking about pure talent. Jordan Burroughs is easily on that list. I have never seen someone shoot that fast at his weight. The man has a double like a 57kger.
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Karelin was great. For wrestling, john smith, lee kemp and gene mills should be added also.
 
TerragonSix said:
I like Magic, but with this team, I don't neccessarily need a prolific scorer. Stocktons job would be to get the ball to the hand, set up screens and play hard nosed defense and occassionally drive to the basket. Stockton was a better defender than Magic.

Bird could spot up, mid range fade or post @ 6'10 and rebound, as well as defend and set up a pass.

Jordan is obviously the best SG ever in terms of defense/offense combined.

Olajowon was just ridiculous. Had moves like a guard, but was a C/PF. In my opinion, perhaps sans Kareem, was the best post player I've ever seen. Great big man defender.

As for Shaq, I think of the years when he was with the Orlando magic. Big and Strong AND FAST. The only reason I'd take Shaq was I feel he was a better defender than Kareem. It's a close call though.

And if we get Whack-A-Shaq, I'll keep Hakeem in and have my sixth man, The Worm get all the free throws that he misses. xD
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Sometimes it's not who's better but who gels together as a team. I didn't see Stockton as much as Magic because he was one of my favorites. I know he was a great passer and led the league in assists for a bunch of years. Magic was really close to him there. I agree with your lineup you don't need a prolific scorer as point with your team. How do you make every player happy if you have 5 shooters starting, in that sense I agree with you.

I think a lot of people see what Jabbar did his last 6 or 7 years instead of what he did for the first 12 or 13. I saw him in the early 80's where he probably was still over his peak years. He had such long span in the league some didn't get to see him when he was great. Can't go wrong with Shaq though, probably the most powerful center ever even with all those big 80's centers. Always loved Rodman too, he gave 100%, Detroit made a real bad decision not paying him what he deserved. Always took on the best scorers on D and his rebounding was out of this world. One of the most under rated players ever.
 
Ethnicsands said:
If i thought you were trolling, i’d give you a high score instead, you sound like a dumb, biased, bitter, jordan-hating moran. Lol. Not doing this again. Believe what you want.
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Stats don't lie. Not one doubt Jordan was the best scoring guard ever, easy to see that.
 
paksat said:
boy you watch too much ESPN, you are drinking the kool-aide

all you gotta see is how many times l39ron james has passed up the game winning shot to know how weak he is

the man got SHOVED by some nobody named kuzma to play defense recently. LOL @ anyone shoving kobe or MJ or wade, they'd have two black eyes and be on the trade block.

lbj has had some of the BEST shooters in nba history on his teams at all times seemingly. He's had kyrie playing on god like levels, and also riddle me this.. How many times has lbj fouled out in the playoffs? **** how many times has he EVEN been in foul trouble? Apparently your king is so perfect he can't even foul people.... OR the refs coddle him like no other player

the guys go to move is literally a stiff arm. He has no crossover, no real go to move to speak of in fact that I can think of. Maybe a 1 dribble step back? His off ball movement is a joke, he literally stands there and does nothing if he doesn't have the ball in his hands. When he does have the ball, everyone else has now been regulated to a spot up 3 point shooter.

On top of all of that, people HATE playing with him because drama follows him everywhere he goes. I can't believe he's even passing the eye test in terms of skill, let alone all the stuff I just posted. The guy is literally scared to take a game winning jump shot, and don't even get me started on how much he whines to the refs. Like every.single.time. down he's looking at the ref wondering where his foul is.
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The fact that you said his go to move is “literally a stiff arm” proves your opinion is idiotic sprinkled with a lot of hate. Lmao the man has more playoff GW Than both Kobe and MJ.

All playoffs. Stick to facts and stop getting all emotional
 
CaneOil said:
That's a great lineup. All great players but my Point guard would be Magic. And center Jabbar. Either team would pretty much be unbeatable. lol Magic and Jordan in the back court, I like Stockton but not Over Magic. Magic could play every position on the floor. I loved him! I can see how you could take Shaq though, his foul shooting would probably be the difference though for me.
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My man put Stockton over magic🥴..y’all tripping man. My 5 would be these guys. Lineups would be unguardable.

Steph
MJ
KD
Bron
Wilt

Bench

Cp3
Kobe
Klay
Dirk
Shaq
 
CaneOil said:
Always loved Rodman too, he gave 100%, Detroit made a real bad decision not paying him what he deserved. Always took on the best scorers on D and his rebounding was out of this world. One of the most under rated players ever.
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As a kid, everyone wanted to be Jordan. In the youth league I played in, I played on the team that was the Ace Pest Control Bulls. When jersey time came, #23 was not availible, much to the chagirin of the kids on the team. I took #19 (Opposite of #91), because I looked up to Dennis Rodman.

The other kids thought I was nuts, but I didn't care. He played with 100% intensity, went body to body with some of the best big men in the game. He could slide his feet, take the charge, and he would never stop letting up.

Maybe its homerism (well actually, it is), but I thought the perfect foil to a guy like Lebron would be Rodman, who was just as quick on his feet, unafraid to post up defend and would most certainly out rebound Lebron in offensive/defensive rebounds.

It wouldn't work today though; because the NBA cut the nuts of defensive players. Especially that no-charge zone horse****.

The NBA I see today is not the basketball I played as a kid; so much so a year or so back I was playing pick up basketball at a park, nearly got in a fight because I was playing 90's era basketball, not 2019 patty-cake. xD

I can't hardly watch it nowadays.
 
HamburgerSV said:
Uhm no Jordan murders Bird in steals per game (not even close) and he also beats him in blocks per game despite being shorter ... you just making **** up at this point lol or your memory isn’t very good (Jordan in his prime was 1+ blocks per game, Bird did that only once) but like I said...those stats are prehistoric, we now have advanced stats who are not perfect but more accurate description of a players value
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You are 100% right I'm wrong on those two. I took two pain killers later on in the night my back was killing me. Not making things up, I was flat out wrong. Rebounds Bird dominated him, Free throw percentage was right, 3 point shooting was right and Jordan took a mountain more shots. In 86 was Jordans best scoring year, he had over 750 more shots than Bird, then add in the free throw attempts from those extra shots. Just not as impressive when you see all those attempts. He shot 48.2% that year, pretty average. He's still the best shooting guard I've ever seen play. Again I apologize for those two stats I misquoted, I was wrong.
 
305to954 said:
My man put Stockton over magic🥴..y’all tripping man. My 5 would be these guys. Lineups would be unguardable.

Steph
MJ
KD
Bron
Wilt

Bench

Cp3
Kobe
Klay
Dirk
Shaq
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I picked Magic, he's my favorite guard of all time and borderline my best player ever which is hard to pick.
 
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305to954 said:
My man put Stockton over magic🥴..y’all tripping man. My 5 would be these guys. Lineups would be unguardable.

Steph
MJ
KD
Bron
Wilt

Bench

Cp3
Kobe
Klay
Dirk
Shaq
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Hey, its all good man. My main thing with my starting 5, is that all of them can play defense.

If I were going 'greatest' (at their position) 5, it would be:

PG: Magic
SG: Jordan
F: Lebron
PF: Duncan
C: Russell (11-1 in 13 years don't lie)

I just think my starting five synnergizes better together.
 
TerragonSix said:
Hey, its all good man. My main thing with my starting 5, is that all of them can play defense.

If I were going 'greatest' (at their position) 5, it would be:

PG: Magic
SG: Jordan
F: Lebron
PF: Duncan
C: Russell (11-1 in 13 years don't lie)

I just think my starting five synnergizes better together.
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Ok I feel you. Greatest at slotted positions. I’d take Russell off tho for the fact there’s what 8 teams in the league. They’d win a chip then be able to draft the best players. But he was still great. I’d put Ferdinand Lewis Alcindor, Jr in the 5 slot. Literally the greatest basketball career ever. HS-colleg to pro
 
TerragonSix said:
As a kid, everyone wanted to be Jordan. In the youth league I played in, I played on the team that was the Ace Pest Control Bulls. When jersey time came, #23 was not availible, much to the chagirin of the kids on the team. I took #19 (Opposite of #91), because I looked up to Dennis Rodman.

The other kids thought I was nuts, but I didn't care. He played with 100% intensity, went body to body with some of the best big men in the game. He could slide his feet, take the charge, and he would never stop letting up.

Maybe its homerism (well actually, it is), but I thought the perfect foil to a guy like Lebron would be Rodman, who was just as quick on his feet, unafraid to post up defend and would most certainly out rebound Lebron in offensive/defensive rebounds.

It wouldn't work today though; because the NBA cut the nuts of defensive players. Especially that no-charge zone horse****.

The NBA I see today is not the basketball I played as a kid; so much so a year or so back I was playing pick up basketball at a park, nearly got in a fight because I was playing 90's era basketball, not 2019 patty-cake. xD

I can't hardly watch it nowadays.
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Great post, Rodman always took on the best scorers and never backed down. Then he'd take the rebound away from them if they missed. His rebounding #'s are insane for a 6'7 guy. I agree with you with Rodman on Labron, he would have driven him crazy.

I agree BB is not what it used to be, loved the 80's game. Laimbeer crossed the line quite a few times though, that's all he had to win. Without that he'd have been a bench warmer.
 
The thing is, Magic was such a freak. How the **** does a 6'9 guy play that can dribble, dime and score like that at POINT GUARD? No one had really saw that before.

The only knock I have against him is, at best, was a mediocre defender. Stockton has the record for assists AND steals.

One of my favorite stories about Stockton was, when he was on the dream team, all the big name guys were getting the attention at the hotel they were staying; but Stockton dressed in regular clothes and was out with his family and nobody bothered him because he just looked like an average 6' American white dude. xD
 
CaneOil said:
Laimbeer crossed the line quite a few times though, that's all he had to win. Without that he'd have been a bench warmer.
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Laimbeer did cross the line. He was a dirty basketball player. He could be cruel and vicious. He deserved getting knocked around like a bowling pin and having his nose broke.

...That being said, I don't hate him. I understand it, in fact.

Listen, if I could somehow turn the clock back being a college kid, and somehow (by miracle) got drafted into the NBA, and I'm getting paid millions of dollars to play.

And to stay in the league, I had to play dirty, take liberties and be the most hated player in the league outside of my team? Would I do that?

...Absolutely.

The boos of the fans, the anger of the players, the pundits calling me a scumbag, coaches cursing my name?

None of those things provide shelter for my family or brings food to the table. And thats all that I care about. :)
 
305to954 said:
for me you gotta separate bigs from wings and then have a separate category for 6”4 and under
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Maybe I'm being a little bit of a homer. I mostly saw Jordan play against Boston live, he had some big games but lost most of the time. He also had some crap games like every other player. Jordan is every bit in the greatest player talk. Picking one player as the greatest of all time, I can't do. But I'd still take Jabbar as my first pick in a draft. I agree much easy to pick players by size.
 
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CaneOil said:
Maybe I'm being a little bit of a homer. I mostly saw Jordan play against Boston live, he had some big games but lost most of the time. He also had some crap games like every other player. Jordan is every bit in the greatest player talk. Picking one player as the greatest of all time, I can't do. But I'd still take Jabbar as my first pick in a draft. I agree much easy to pick players by size.
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I think you have something there. Instead of arguing the GOAT, I think the better mark of a great player is if you pool these players together in an NBA draft today, and you had a #1 pick to start a team from scratch, who would it be?

That is a way different discussion from the GOAT because you're building a team for championships.

I'll tell ya, if I were building a team, Jordan might not get the #1 pick, even though I think hes the best athletic two-way player I've ever seen. It would depend on the team I was building.

I'd probably draft either a PG or a Center as my #1 pick.
 
305to954 said:
The fact that you said his go to move is “literally a stiff arm” proves your opinion is idiotic sprinkled with a lot of hate. Lmao the man has more playoff GW Than both Kobe and MJ.

All playoffs. Stick to facts and stop getting all emotional
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I dont hate him, i dont hate frauds and colluders.

The fact you put kd in your top 5 already told real hoop fans you started watching ball in 2010.

Kareem, hakeem, wilt, so so many greats and you put a guy with one ring and half their stats. Step aside son, ill show you the way
 
paksat said:
I dont hate him, i dont hate frauds and colluders.

The fact you put kd in your top 5 already told real hoop fans you started watching ball in 2010.

Kareem, hakeem, wilt, so so many greats and you put a guy with one ring and half their stats. Step aside son, ill show you the way
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I never put KD In my top 5. Tf are talking about...btw KD HAS 2 rings..go take a lap
 
TerragonSix said:
The thing is, Magic was such a freak. How the **** does a 6'9 guy play that can dribble, dime and score like that at POINT GUARD? No one had really saw that before.

The only knock I have against him is, at best, was a mediocre defender. Stockton has the record for assists AND steals.

One of my favorite stories about Stockton was, when he was on the dream team, all the big name guys were getting the attention at the hotel they were staying; but Stockton dressed in regular clothes and was out with his family and nobody bothered him because he just looked like an average 6' American white dude. xD
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He did play good D against Boston sorry to say. When he was on he could dominate with the best of them. He didn't have to take on the best guy, they had Worthy and Cooper who were great on D. Magic might not have had the steals and assists, close on assists, but he changed the way people shot on the outside with his height. You brought up Hakeem he had some crazy #'s in some games. This is why it really is hard to pick the greatest of all time. Funny Stockton story.

I guess if I had to pick 5 it would be Jabbar, Magic at point, Jordan, Hakeem and Bird for my starters. But don't hold me to that. lol Rodman would always have a spot on my team.
 
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