(SIAP) Chuck Todd hurting the program and recruiting

[BoroCane83]

Urban didn't go to a program that had coker and shannon running it into the ground before he stepped in.

Oh, so all is forgiven.

You can't use you inherited crap as an excuse if after 4 years we had a worse record than when he started.

Urban took his sanctions and won. Al did nothing and regressed.

Not about all being forgiven. It's just not the same situation. OSU has been crushing it for years, and recruiting well.. Other than Luke fickell season (who?) They have won at least 10 games a year for an eternity. Urban took over a good, successful, talent laden program and kept it going... al has failed, but he didn't have that luxury.

Of course the situation is not "identical". It never will be "identical." Chuck was demonstrating how a program with similar sanctions (9 Scholarships), can win it all. That 9 scholarships is not an excuse for losing.

But my point is that isn't relevant because when Al did have his guys in the program (year 4), he lost more games than when he started. If Al went on to improve and had his best season with his guys, then you could say RS screwed him. It no longer holds any water because we started 6-6 and now we're 6-7. 4 years later, what has changed? The constant is Al Golden.

9 schollies on a stacked team is different than 9 schollies on a non stacked team. Not defending Golden, just showing how they are not similar, and to be a bit fair, this year's senior class was put together by Al in like 2 weeks.

Yes they had sanctions, that's where the similarities in the situations end.

Yes you are.

 

[We the Boss]

OSU wasn't stacked when Urban took over, it was better than us, but he just won with Sophomores and Freshman leading the way.

Was his roster back than what let him go 12-0 and self impose or was it his skill?

Was our roster so bad that we got run out the building in every game against a ranked team or was it golden's "skill".

 

[DaU83]

OSU wasn't stacked when Urban took over, it was better than us, but he just won with Sophomores and Freshman leading the way.

Was his roster back than what let him go 12-0 and self impose or was it his skill?

Was our roster so bad that we got run out the building in every game against a ranked team or was it golden's "skill".

Ohio State Buckeyes (Big Ten Conference) (2001–2010)
2001 Ohio State 7–5 5–3 3rd L Outback
2002 Ohio State 14–0 8–0 T–1st W Fiesta† 1 1
2003 Ohio State 11–2 6–2 T–2nd W Fiesta† 4 4
2004 Ohio State 8–4 4–4 T–5th W Alamo 19 20
2005 Ohio State 10–2 7–1 T–1st W Fiesta† 4 4
2006 Ohio State 12–1 8–0 1st L BCS NCG† 2 2
2007 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st L BCS NCG† 5 5
2008 Ohio State 10–3 7–1 T–1st L Fiesta† 9 9
2009 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st W Rose† 5 5
2010 Ohio State 12 –1*[1] 0–1*[1] T–1st* Sugar*†

6-7 with that random no name coach.. and back to the status quo as soon as urban returned. The situations are not comparable.

 

[DaU83]

DaU83,

Once again the sanctions are similar, the programs are not. Read his tweet again, similar cloud.

the state of the programs when the sanctions hit couldn't be any more different.

 

[ggleft]

View attachment 29067

Good quote, but hate the title from OP.. The ones that are hurting recruiting are the UM Administration, Golden, and his soft a** slurpers .

 

[L A M P]

They are a lot more talented than us at most positions actually. This team wasn't created by urb. This wasn't a "rebuild" job because it's obvious he doesn't want to do that( his fake health scare at Uf, and the way he left cupboard bare). This was a step into a loaded job for him, as he spent his time at espy going to all the big name schools practices and spring games and looking at the talent, etc. Osu has been loaded for awhile just couldn't get over the hump, he brought that with his coach expertise. Car dale jones wasn't some gray crow bum, dude was a big time recruit who went to glenville and prep school

I wasn't taking a shot at Ohio St.. I was merely saying I think we have legit Top 10 talent on our roster.

 

[Rellyrell]

Enough w/ this. It's funny how fans of Golden will say "it's the cloud, it's the cloud...that's why."

The cloud was from the 2011-12 season and ended after the 2012-2013 season. The excuse has been, b/c of this cloud, it affected Golden's recruiting ability. Can we all evaluate that statement for a second?

The 2011 class was really Randy's class, however Golden had the daunting responsibility of keeping it together. B/c of that coaching switch, the class ranked #36 in the nation w/ only 16 commits. That class included Dorsett, Perryman, Chick, D. Crawford, Matt Goudis, Dalton Botts, O. Pierre, however, just to name a few. It also had some other noteworthy players who were eventually kicked off the team (more on that later). Well, certainly, this class was effected by the cloud, right? WRONG. This class was signed in Feb of 2011. The Shapiro Scandal didn't hit until August 2011. So the cloud had no affect on the 2011 class.

The 2012 class was in the midst of the cloud, so certainly this scandal must have rocked this class to it's foundation right?? WRONG AGAIN. The 2012 class was arguably Miami's best class since 2008. It was ranked as the Number 9 class in the nation...albeit, we were in the midst of the center of the cloud. Interesting.

The 2013 class was also apart of the "negative recruiting era" as Golden had thrown out. This class ranked No. 20. This class was also an epic fail for Golden as he, personally, botched several high profiled recruiting efforts by pulling a scholly from a well known player in the area which gave him the tab of being untrustworthy in the community (more on this as well). Prior to NSD, Miami's 2013 class was ranked 5th in the nation based upon verbal commitments. This is when Golden said other programs were negatively recruiting against us when when, in actuality, the negative recruiting came from him. **I find it odd that excuse wasn't used when the very first class that was supposed to be "affected" by the cloud (2012 class) which turned out to be a great class, but the moment he botched the 2013 class, he used "negative recruiting" as means to justify the failure.

The 2014 class was free of the cloud all together. It was Golden himself that said, "Now I feel like I can recruit freely, w/o having to talk about sanctions. I can recruit w/o one hand being tied behind my back." The 2014 class ranked #12 in the nation. Once again, prior to NSD, Miami's 2014 class was ranked 5th in the nation based upon verbal commitments. Golden, however, proved his untrustworthiness, AGAIN, as he tried to get T. Rudolph to play a position he didn't want when his commitment was accepted as a WR. He also stopped communicating w/ recruits as he ventured off to try to get the PSU position. He, too, refused to address that situation all together w/ recruits and their parents or the media for that matter. This also coming off the heels of his team going 2-4 down the stretch and being embarrassed by another inferior team on national TV during a bowl game. The cloud had no effect on this class, Golden did.

The 2015 class is far, far, farrrrrrrrrrrrr away from the cloud, yet it's currently ranked 18th in the nation. Again, as we draw closer to NSD, this class has completely collapsed from being in the top 10 per verbal commitments. We currently have 12 huge decommitments, yet the new theme is that it's us as the fans along w/ lingering affects from the cloud that's causing this collapse. lol. I'm sure it has nothing to do w/ Miami going 6-7 this year including while losing 4 in a row (3 of which came at the hands of .500 teams on the season)

The cloud has been nothing more than a myth from the get-go; a convenient term that has been used ONLY when things go array for this program. The cloud wasn't used for the 2012 class b/c that class was great, yet it was used for the 2013 class after Golden f'd up (ask Ice Harris how much he f'd up that class). Although Golden admitted he could recruit freely for the 2014 class, when that class began to collapse due to him trying to back door his way into PSU, he used the cloud as a crutch, again; and now, w/ the 2015 class falling before our very eyes, it's now a combination of the fans and the lingering "mist" of the cloud.

Two years removed, yet we are still talking about something that never existed. The real cloud has been Golden and his ineptitude as a coach and player developer. The real cloud has been a crappy scheme we've run for the last 4, now going on 5 yrs that's yielded loss after loss. The real cloud is Golden's sub 500 record as a HC, his inability to make half time adjustments, his inability to instill a killer instinct in his players, and his inability to beat a noteworthy opponent. That's the real cloud; that's where the negative recruiting is coming from.

He states we've lacked true depth on our football roster, and the cloud has affected that. Really? I'm sure it has nothing to do w/ 30% of the players he recruited never made it in. That's right, approx. 1/3 of the players who decided to come here, regardless of the cloud, aren't even on the roster. The cloud had no affect on that type of attrition, that was Golden and his "recruiting prowess."

Until he, James, and Shalala are gone, we will always be faced w/ a real CLOUD over this program.

 

[BoroCane83]

 

[Consigliere]

DaU83,

Once again the sanctions are similar, the programs are not. Read his tweet again, similar cloud.

the state of the programs when the sanctions hit couldn't be any more different.

Here is again

The cloud is referring to the NCAA mess. Here, Todd is saying the "cloud" was similar in Miami (to OSU). He isn't saying, OSU was in better shape [talent] than Miami or Al Golden inherited the same overall program (in terms of talent). He is only saying the "cloud" was similar. Each program was dealing with an NCAA issue and the sanctions were similar. That is it.

If you don't believe it, go tweet him.

 

[UMAlum21]

Oh man us poor little private schools can't compete with our billions in revenue we bring in as a school and our almost billion dollar endowment. We don't allocate **** to sports, that's why we "can't compete." It's amazing that TCU, Baylor, USC, Stanford, Notre Dame, and even freaking Duke have been able to succeed on a big stage without compromising their academics. Boy how do these poor little guys manage.

 

[gfer1988]

OSU wasn't stacked when Urban took over, it was better than us, but he just won with Sophomores and Freshman leading the way.

Was his roster back than what let him go 12-0 and self impose or was it his skill?

Was our roster so bad that we got run out the building in every game against a ranked team or was it golden's "skill".

Ohio State Buckeyes (Big Ten Conference) (2001–2010)
2001 Ohio State 7–5 5–3 3rd L Outback
2002 Ohio State 14–0 8–0 T–1st W Fiesta† 1 1
2003 Ohio State 11–2 6–2 T–2nd W Fiesta† 4 4
2004 Ohio State 8–4 4–4 T–5th W Alamo 19 20
2005 Ohio State 10–2 7–1 T–1st W Fiesta† 4 4
2006 Ohio State 12–1 8–0 1st L BCS NCG† 2 2
2007 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st L BCS NCG† 5 5
2008 Ohio State 10–3 7–1 T–1st L Fiesta† 9 9
2009 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st W Rose† 5 5
2010 Ohio State 12 –1*[1] 0–1*[1] T–1st* Sugar*†

6-7 with that random no name coach.. and back to the status quo as soon as urban returned. The situations are not comparable.

so you're saying that bad coaching at OSU is was lead to that 6-7 2011 team despite the great talent but that Golden's 6-6 record his first year was because he had no talent? and if you're a nfl draft guy like me, you would remember that the 6-6 had plenty of nfl talent on it. i could list them out for you if you want

 

[the storm]

I agree with much of what you say that many of the so-called 'fans' are completely irrational. However, anyone who runs a business knows that the longer you let a problem fester, the worse things generally get & a lynch mob mentality tends to take over resulting in a further demise of the football program, recruiting and the BRAND. I respectfully disagree about the booster money...a big time football program will bring in even more money to athletics and to THE U, as every school currently in the top 5 will tell you. Leadership is desperately needed here. Sign me: HC member & long time season ticket holder who didn't just fall off the turnip truck.

Chuck carries Obama's water but he's as legit a Canes fan as it comes. Was calling out problems with how the admin and athletic department operate a long time ago as he was donating money. Hope that has stopped.

This is one sick board, and one sick group of "fans." Yeah, there are problems in the administration and I've already told friends privately that AG is a "dead man walking."

Chuck Todd is an idiot. He does work for the anti-American NBC network and I cannot, for the life of me, understand why he has risen to the level he has, with no apparent talent or exceptional intellect. He might be right about the administration, the university, the coaches, but the hate on this board is sick.

This is an ongoing jihad by a bunch of maladjusted and immature kids that see everything in life as tied up with the success of our program, a program I've probably been following and supporting before most of you had your first in utero erections.

I've seen lots of ups and downs with our program, as I have with other programs, and you have to realize that we are going to find it extremely difficult to compete with the big state schools with their endless resources, ethical and academic compromises. It's foolish to think we can swoop in and hire an Urban Meyer or Saban, give them everything they want and need, let them take almost anybody they want with no academic standards. It's just not going to happen. Look at the final four--was there a private school among them? How many private schools are there competing year in, year out for the NC? Where's Stanford, USC? Maybe TCU should have been there, but I think their boosters have devoted extraordinary resources to the program. I doubt that we have the booster money to follow suit. I'd also like to know if they have maintained academic standards for their recruits, or have they compromised? I haven't seen them play, so I wonder if they really belong on the level of the other schools in the final 4. (Good thing they didn't clamor for the firing of Gary Patterson after their 2013 season, which was worse than Al's this year, not that I think Golden is going to rebound by much, if any. I just don't think he has what it takes and will be gone after 2015.)

You can complain about Golden, and I have serious doubts about him as a coach, but who are we going to get? If I were a coach, I would probably try to steer clear of Miami, with all it's limitations, problems and an increasingly nasty, hateful fan base.

Bring on the hate, maybe I can reach a minus ten--would that be a new record?

 

[Jedi Master Cane]

Can we change the title of this thread to

(SIAP) Al Golden hurting the program and recruiting


That way it can at least be a little more accurate. Thanks in advance.

 

[DaU83]

DaU83,

Once again the sanctions are similar, the programs are not. Read his tweet again, similar cloud.

the state of the programs when the sanctions hit couldn't be any more different.

Here is again

The cloud is referring to the NCAA mess. Here, Todd is saying the "cloud" was similar in Miami (to OSU). He isn't saying, OSU was in better shape [talent] than Miami or Al Golden inherited the same overall program (in terms of talent). He is only saying the "cloud" was similar. Each program was dealing with an NCAA issue and the sanctions were similar. That is it.

If you don't believe it, go tweet him.

I believe him, but the premise of this thread is that meyer took over a similar situation and is winning. The premise is incorrect.

 

[Consigliere]

DaU83,

Once again the sanctions are similar, the programs are not. Read his tweet again, similar cloud.

the state of the programs when the sanctions hit couldn't be any more different.

Here is again

The cloud is referring to the NCAA mess. Here, Todd is saying the "cloud" was similar in Miami (to OSU). He isn't saying, OSU was in better shape [talent] than Miami or Al Golden inherited the same overall program (in terms of talent). He is only saying the "cloud" was similar. Each program was dealing with an NCAA issue and the sanctions were similar. That is it.

If you don't believe it, go tweet him.

I believe him, but the premise of this thread is that meyer took over a similar situation and is winning. The premise is incorrect.

No it isn't. The premise is his tweet. The topic of the thread is his tweet. That is all. Do you want to start again?

 

[DaU83]

OSU wasn't stacked when Urban took over, it was better than us, but he just won with Sophomores and Freshman leading the way.

Was his roster back than what let him go 12-0 and self impose or was it his skill?

Was our roster so bad that we got run out the building in every game against a ranked team or was it golden's "skill".

Ohio State Buckeyes (Big Ten Conference) (2001–2010)
2001 Ohio State 7–5 5–3 3rd L Outback
2002 Ohio State 14–0 8–0 T–1st W Fiesta† 1 1
2003 Ohio State 11–2 6–2 T–2nd W Fiesta† 4 4
2004 Ohio State 8–4 4–4 T–5th W Alamo 19 20
2005 Ohio State 10–2 7–1 T–1st W Fiesta† 4 4
2006 Ohio State 12–1 8–0 1st L BCS NCG† 2 2
2007 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st L BCS NCG† 5 5
2008 Ohio State 10–3 7–1 T–1st L Fiesta† 9 9
2009 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st W Rose† 5 5
2010 Ohio State 12 –1*[1] 0–1*[1] T–1st* Sugar*†

6-7 with that random no name coach.. and back to the status quo as soon as urban returned. The situations are not comparable.

so you're saying that bad coaching at OSU is was lead to that 6-7 2011 team despite the great talent but that Golden's 6-6 record his first year was because he had no talent? and if you're a nfl draft guy like me, you would remember that the 6-6 had plenty of nfl talent on it. i could list them out for you if you want

The team that won 11, 10, 11, 12, then 6, then 12 again. Yes. It was a talent issue, not some no name coach. I don't know how I could have missed it.

 

[gfer1988]

OSU wasn't stacked when Urban took over, it was better than us, but he just won with Sophomores and Freshman leading the way.

Was his roster back than what let him go 12-0 and self impose or was it his skill?

Was our roster so bad that we got run out the building in every game against a ranked team or was it golden's "skill".

Ohio State Buckeyes (Big Ten Conference) (2001–2010)
2001 Ohio State 7–5 5–3 3rd L Outback
2002 Ohio State 14–0 8–0 T–1st W Fiesta† 1 1
2003 Ohio State 11–2 6–2 T–2nd W Fiesta† 4 4
2004 Ohio State 8–4 4–4 T–5th W Alamo 19 20
2005 Ohio State 10–2 7–1 T–1st W Fiesta† 4 4
2006 Ohio State 12–1 8–0 1st L BCS NCG† 2 2
2007 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st L BCS NCG† 5 5
2008 Ohio State 10–3 7–1 T–1st L Fiesta† 9 9
2009 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st W Rose† 5 5
2010 Ohio State 12 –1*[1] 0–1*[1] T–1st* Sugar*†

6-7 with that random no name coach.. and back to the status quo as soon as urban returned. The situations are not comparable.

so you're saying that bad coaching at OSU is was lead to that 6-7 2011 team despite the great talent but that Golden's 6-6 record his first year was because he had no talent? and if you're a nfl draft guy like me, you would remember that the 6-6 had plenty of nfl talent on it. i could list them out for you if you want

The team that won 11, 10, 11, 12, then 6, then 12 again. Yes. It was a talent issue, not some no name coach. I don't know how I could have missed it.

you do know who was coaching before Golden and before Shannon? it didn't matter what talent we had. the teams were gonna suck with a lame coach just like that great OSU team went 6-7. you get it? how can you judge our talent when it's being coached by discount coaches that won't be offered a head coaching gig anywhere else in fbs football

 

[jwayne]

OSU wasn't stacked when Urban took over, it was better than us, but he just won with Sophomores and Freshman leading the way.

Was his roster back than what let him go 12-0 and self impose or was it his skill?

Was our roster so bad that we got run out the building in every game against a ranked team or was it golden's "skill".

Ohio State Buckeyes (Big Ten Conference) (2001–2010)
2001 Ohio State 7–5 5–3 3rd L Outback
2002 Ohio State 14–0 8–0 T–1st W Fiesta† 1 1
2003 Ohio State 11–2 6–2 T–2nd W Fiesta† 4 4
2004 Ohio State 8–4 4–4 T–5th W Alamo 19 20
2005 Ohio State 10–2 7–1 T–1st W Fiesta† 4 4
2006 Ohio State 12–1 8–0 1st L BCS NCG† 2 2
2007 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st L BCS NCG† 5 5
2008 Ohio State 10–3 7–1 T–1st L Fiesta† 9 9
2009 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st W Rose† 5 5
2010 Ohio State 12 –1*[1] 0–1*[1] T–1st* Sugar*†

6-7 with that random no name coach.. and back to the status quo as soon as urban returned. The situations are not comparable.

so you're saying that bad coaching at OSU is was lead to that 6-7 2011 team despite the great talent but that Golden's 6-6 record his first year was because he had no talent? and if you're a nfl draft guy like me, you would remember that the 6-6 had plenty of nfl talent on it. i could list them out for you if you want

The team that won 11, 10, 11, 12, then 6, then 12 again. Yes. It was a talent issue, not some no name coach. I don't know how I could have missed it.

They didn't have a QB. Pryor left in the summer, Braxton was a TF and Bauserman wasn't any good. After losing to Miami, they started Braxton the rest of the way and took their lumps.

 

[DaU83]

OSU wasn't stacked when Urban took over, it was better than us, but he just won with Sophomores and Freshman leading the way.

Was his roster back than what let him go 12-0 and self impose or was it his skill?

Was our roster so bad that we got run out the building in every game against a ranked team or was it golden's "skill".

Ohio State Buckeyes (Big Ten Conference) (2001–2010)
2001 Ohio State 7–5 5–3 3rd L Outback
2002 Ohio State 14–0 8–0 T–1st W Fiesta† 1 1
2003 Ohio State 11–2 6–2 T–2nd W Fiesta† 4 4
2004 Ohio State 8–4 4–4 T–5th W Alamo 19 20
2005 Ohio State 10–2 7–1 T–1st W Fiesta† 4 4
2006 Ohio State 12–1 8–0 1st L BCS NCG† 2 2
2007 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st L BCS NCG† 5 5
2008 Ohio State 10–3 7–1 T–1st L Fiesta† 9 9
2009 Ohio State 11–2 7–1 1st W Rose† 5 5
2010 Ohio State 12 –1*[1] 0–1*[1] T–1st* Sugar*†

6-7 with that random no name coach.. and back to the status quo as soon as urban returned. The situations are not comparable.

so you're saying that bad coaching at OSU is was lead to that 6-7 2011 team despite the great talent but that Golden's 6-6 record his first year was because he had no talent? and if you're a nfl draft guy like me, you would remember that the 6-6 had plenty of nfl talent on it. i could list them out for you if you want

The team that won 11, 10, 11, 12, then 6, then 12 again. Yes. It was a talent issue, not some no name coach. I don't know how I could have missed it.

They didn't have a QB. Pryor left in the summer, Braxton was a TF and Bauserman wasn't any good. After losing to Miami, they started Braxton the rest of the way and took their lumps.

Urban just won with his third stringer. Dude's a great coach. But he inherited good talent.

 

[Cane Dynasty]

Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.