OT: Was Kobe the most competitive player in league history?

MJ was the most intense competitor ever. Maybe Dan Gable gets second billing.

Thanks for mentioning Dan. Met him in person. I always call him the nicest intense person I've ever met.

"HOW ARE YOU DOING YOUNG MAN?"

"...I'm fine Sir. It's an honor to meet you. Would it be allright to get your autograph? (I was 16, lol)"

"SURESURENOPROBLEM. YOUWRESTLE160, EH? YOU GOT THE FRAME FOR IT."

...Dan Gable makes coffee nervous. xD
 
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Thanks for mentioning Dan. Met him in person. I always call him the nicest intense person I've ever met.

"HOW ARE YOU DOING YOUNG MAN?"

"...I'm fine Sir. It's an honor to meet you. Would it be allright to get your autograph? (I was 16, lol)"

"SURESURENOPROBLEM. YOUWRESTLE160, EH? YOU GOT THE FRAME FOR IT."

...Dan Gable makes coffee nervous. xD
On field there are a lot of intense athletes. And they’re most all relatively intense in prep. AI is a rare cat who was athletically gifted enough to dominate but wasn’t a serious practice guy. But Jordan, Gables, a few others, they were legends amongst their peers at all aspects of practice and prep, off-season and during season. Tiger Woods was also. E. Smith and J. Rice were also pretty **** intense preparers. Ray Lewis was. Ed Reed was. But we’re now talkin base camp compared to Jordan. Best athlete, most skills, best preparation, most intense competitor, best kill instinct, and best clutch player, all rolled into one savage dude. He could have been everything else he was, and take away the kill instinct or clutch hunger and ice in the veins, and his career ain’t close to what it was. Dude was not human. For better and worse.

/cool story re gables. As a former wrestler, that resonates.
 
I’ve got Bird in my top 6-8. I want to have him higher because I’ve seen him ball out. I hated the C’s and he used to put the fear of God in me.

****, you know what? I’ve got to throw Bird in Dream’s spot. Gotta get that guy in the top 5. He was too much of a **** force
Hakeem has never gotten the respect he deserved. A true great. Duncan also, low key, low pub, won big.
 
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Hakeem has never gotten the respect he deserved. A true great. Duncan also, low key, low pub, won big.

Had Dream played Power Forward in the NBA, we'd probably regard him as the best Power Forward to ever live. Better than Barkley. Better even than Duncan. He did play PF in college. Only reason the Rockets and Kenny the Jet got to the NBA Finals was because of that man.
 
I’ve got Bird in my top 6-8. I want to have him higher because I’ve seen him ball out. I hated the C’s and he used to put the fear of God in me.
****, you know what? I’ve got to throw Bird in Dream’s spot. Gotta get that guy in the top 5. He was too much of a **** force
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Bird was a 6'10 power forward that could point forward, post, team defend and shoot as well outside as well as in (with left or right hand). He was also one of the best clutch shooters I've ever seen. As clutch as Kobe or Jordan. He was also the founding member of the 50/40/90 club, and won the 3 point contest the first three years it existed. As of 2020, Bird is the only person in NBA history to be named Rookie Of The Year, MVP, NBA All Star MVP, Coach Of The Year, and Executive Of The Year.

I watched him in '91, his last year. Broke back, can't move, can barely walk; was still dishing dimes and defenders still couldn't stop him.

Bird is often overlooked because Lebron is now Dubbed the GOAT Forward. I'd STILL take Larry Bird. Larry Bird wouldn't have passed the ball in the all star game when Kobe told him to bring it. Larry would've said, "Yeah, f*****, I'm gonna shoot it right in your face."
 
Had Dream played Power Forward in the NBA, we'd probably regard him as the best Power Forward to ever live. Better than Barkley. Better even than Duncan. He did play PF in college. Only reason the Rockets and Kenny the Jet got to the NBA Finals was because of that man.
He was the perfect C for the current era because of mobility, speed, fluidity, touch and post moves

Those Phi Slamma Jamma teams were awesome to watch

Duncan was taller, and different. Cannot criticize him st all. But Hakeem wanted the rock when the chips were down. One of the goats.

Easily better than Charles. Barkley was a marvel, but is overrated as a player because of his personality and celebrity.
 
Kobe is up there. I would take Jordan over him. I would take Bird over him, too. Bird was equal parts genius and competitor. He outplayed everyone he matched up against. Also I would take Duncan over Kobe when I get away from a player's *** appeal.

Kobe was a great player, but his flaws are being glossed over and have been glossed over since the last few years of his career.

My top 15 all time:

1) Jordan
2) Kareem
3) Lebron
4) Wilt
5) Magic
6) Bird
7) Russell
8) Duncan
9) Kobe
10) Shaq
11) Big O
12) Durant
13) Olajuwon
14) Jerry West
15) Tie between: a lot of guys (Isiah, Dirk, etc.)
OT.... Why do u have Shaq higher than the dream?
 
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Very hard to dislike the man he grew into and we all saw it. I hated Kobe as a player but always respected him and grew to admire him the last 2 years of his career. But here is why people loved the guy over the past 5 years, including me. He became incredibly graceful his last two seasons of the NBA, and even more so in retirement.

And accomplishments are just off the charts, and this is why he’s loved (his off the court accomplishments were well on its way to matching what he did on the court)

Top 2-3 basketball player of all time

Net worth: $600 million

Won an Oscar within 2 years of retiring - it takes people 30-40-50-60 Years of disciplined training to achieve this yet he did it in only TWO

New York Times best selling author of children books within 3 years of retiring (Also nuts). Again, this takes some decades of disciplined writing but he did it in 3. Was also in the process of co-writing a book with the great Paulo Coelo - author of the Alchemist. Both of these are mind blowing to me.

We can stop here if we wanted to and be in total awe, because that would mean he was great and one of the best in the World in THREE career disciplines (hoops, film-making, and writing) but wait there is more!!

Multilingual - spoke 3-4 languages fluently

Became one of the most sought after motivational speakers in the world (Business, universities, coaches all clamores for his services)

Was a GREAT businessman....and he was a big name and great investor in the startup scene. He and Jeff Stibel created a $100M VC fund in 2016 - months after he retired.

Mentored athletes from every sport (tennis, football, men hoops, women’s hoops, soccer, college and pro athletes). He became a kind of sage or philosopher genius to many of his mentees.

Gave 1:1 and group training to G-league players, NBA players, WNBA and men’s and women’s college players

Mentored businessman and women

Ambassador for women’s hoops and was working in partnership with the WNBA

Family man and great dad - you saw his softer side here

Basketball coach for kids and created his own girls AAU team (he coached the **** thing!)

Created Mamba Academy for athletic training (all athletes) and for hosting boys and girls AAU tournaments weekly

Lastly- he was an authentic dude and he never “lost himself” unlike many athletes. Namely, he could role with any group or swimlane with ease. He could roll with and had friendships with businessman/women from any ethnicity, actors, entertainers, professional athletes, media, regular folks AND he has immense street cred/hood respect.
This 💯!!!!!! I couldn't stand his *** when he played, but I always knew he was a dope player. But since he retired I started paying more attention to dude. His basketball iq was thru the ******* roof. Loved hearing his take on the game and how he was helping younger players. Right when I was starting to like him this **** happens.... Smh
 
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Bird was a 6'10 power forward that could point forward, post, team defend and shoot as well outside as well as in (with left or right hand). He was also one of the best clutch shooters I've ever seen. As clutch as Kobe or Jordan. He was also the founding member of the 50/40/90 club, and won the 3 point contest the first three years it existed. As of 2020, Bird is the only person in NBA history to be named Rookie Of The Year, MVP, NBA All Star MVP, Coach Of The Year, and Executive Of The Year.

I watched him in '91, his last year. Broke back, can't move, can barely walk; was still dishing dimes and defenders still couldn't stop him.

Bird is often overlooked because Lebron is now Dubbed the GOAT Forward. I'd STILL take Larry Bird. Larry Bird wouldn't have passed the ball in the all star game when Kobe told him to bring it. Larry would've said, "Yeah, f*****, I'm gonna shoot it right in your face."
I take Bird over Bron every day of the **** week and twice on Sundays. I’ve watched both of those dudes play. I know what Bird can do when things got real.

I was TERRIFIED of Larry Bird, especially in clutch situations
 
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I take Bird over Bron every day of the **** week and twice on Sundays. I’ve watched both of those dudes play. I know what Bird can do when things got real.

I was TERRIFIED of Larry Bird, especially in clutch situations

Bron is a way better player than Bird. But Larry had way more killer instinct. It’s tough to say who was better in history as there is no measurement for heart and toughness.
 
I take Bird over Bron every day of the **** week and twice on Sundays. I’ve watched both of those dudes play. I know what Bird can do when things got real.

I was TERRIFIED of Larry Bird, especially in clutch situations

Bird played for Red, Lebron played for Gilbert, Bron >>>>>>>>>> Bird.

Lebron led a bunch of tomato cans to the NBAFs His 4th year outta HS!!!
 
Bron is a way better player than Bird. But Larry had way more killer instinct. It’s tough to say who was better in history as there is no measurement for heart and toughness.
Killer instinct, focus, and mentality is an actual skill. It’s a key differentiator and there is actually “energy” in it that’s infectious to a group / teammates. It makes the whole bigger and more powerful than the individual parts. It’s crazy to me that folks don’t see this.

LeBron can never ever be top 5 because he don’t have it.
 
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Killer instinct, focus, and mentality is an actual skill. It’s a key differentiator and there is actually “energy” in it that’s infectious to a group / teammates. It makes the whole bigger and more powerful than the individual parts. It’s crazy to me that folks don’t see this.

LeBron can never ever be top 5 because he don’t have it.

Easy to have a killer instinct when you're part of one of the greatest front courts to play the game, a front court that Red put together.
 
Killer instinct, focus, and mentality is an actual skill. It’s a key differentiator and there is actually “energy” in it that’s infectious to a group / teammates. It makes the whole bigger and more powerful than the individual parts. It’s crazy to me that folks don’t see this.

LeBron can never ever be top 5 because he don’t have it.

ok let me clarify. In a vacuum, dismissing what you said above and having the heart...Lebron might be best player ever. I know the game isn’t played in a vacuum. I know what you describe counts.

Listen...you’ll be hard pressed to find a bigger MJ fan than me. I can’t tell you how many shoes I have. I coach my daughters 6 year old team and every week I get asked “those original or re-releases? I have the original 6s with Nike Air on back. Mike is my all time #1.

im not sticking up for lebron over anyone. I’m just talking strictly on court ball skills In a vacuum.
 
ok let me clarify. In a vacuum, dismissing what you said above and having the heart...Lebron might be best player ever. I know the game isn’t played in a vacuum. I know what you describe counts.

Listen...you’ll be hard pressed to find a bigger MJ fan than me. I can’t tell you how many shoes I have. I coach my daughters 6 year old team and every week I get asked “those original or re-releases? I have the original 6s with Nike Air on back. Mike is my all time #1.

im not sticking up for lebron over anyone. I’m just talking strictly on court ball skills In a vacuum.
From last month

 
I think Kobe was the greatest at branding competitiveness. He created a great brand out of it.
Branding? Is there a shoe named ‘Competitive’?

I remember Jordan extremely ill with a flu in the Finals. He would take breaks on the bench, a towel over his head, then go back in a dominate. How’s that for ‘competitive’?
 
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