Off-Topic Mass killings

How about both? Call it a compromise law.
We’ve had waiting periods and gun restrictions in place for decades. Some people still think that didn’t work. Voting has been open to anyone for decades. Some people think that’s not working. So let’s reverse it. Const carry for all and civics test to vote.

It’s only fair to try it out, if we’re gonna compare the two. We can check back in a couple decades from now and see how it’s worked out.
 
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Road rage shootings are less than .5 a day in Florida and Texas. They are not an issue anywhere. In fact guns at large are not an issue. There are more guns than people in this country. If it was an actual problem, you would know. The crime rate by CC permit holders is minuscule. That simple fact shows the vast majority of CC gun owners are responsible.

The rest of the developed world means nothing to me. But they are prey if someone wanted to do something about it. If you didn’t come out of Covid with a sense that the 2A is more important now, than ever, you’ll never have an understanding of it.

I grew up shooting guns and own several myself since before COVID. Unlike the hysterics and the newly minted wannabe preppers with more disposable income than sense (we call them "loot boxes"), I didn't need COVID to convince me of the benefits of responsible gun ownership. It is precisely because of this that I am confident in saying that permitless concealed carry is a very stupid idea. If someone was not able to pass the very, very easy procedures to obtain a concealed carry permit, they had absolutely no business owning a gun to begin with. We're talking fingerprinting, a very generously scored shooting test, and in some cases a few hours of classes or a demonstration that you know how to handle your weapon safely. This whole process takes at most one month. Most who emerge the other side of it still don't know how to properly engage a target in a self-defense situation without being a danger to themselves or other people, so I'm not sure what the ultimate utility is other than giving terminally frightened people the illusion of safety. But that's a discussion for another time. The point is, any person who was hesitant about going to South Beach strapped to drink and party next spring break - as at least a hundred people decided to do this past March, with two bodies to show for it - now can do so without any fear of getting in trouble for a concealed weapon as long as they legally purchased it. Can't imagine what could go wrong.
 
I grew up shooting guns and own several myself since before COVID. Unlike the hysterics and the newly minted wannabe preppers with more disposable income than sense (we call them "loot boxes"), I didn't need COVID to convince me of the benefits of responsible gun ownership. It is precisely because of this that I am confident in saying that permitless concealed carry is a very stupid idea. If someone was not able to pass the very, very easy procedures to obtain a concealed carry permit, they had absolutely no business owning a gun to begin with. We're talking fingerprinting, a very generously scored shooting test, and in some cases a few hours of classes or a demonstration that you know how to handle your weapon safely. This whole process takes at most one month. Most who emerge the other side of it still don't know how to properly engage a target in a self-defense situation without being a danger to themselves or other people, so I'm not sure what the ultimate utility is other than giving terminally frightened people the illusion of safety. But that's a discussion for another time. The point is, any person who was hesitant about going to South Beach strapped to drink and party next spring break - as at least a hundred people decided to do this past March, with two bodies to show for it - now can do so without any fear of getting in trouble for a concealed weapon as long as they legally purchased it. Can't imagine what could go wrong.
I have also been a firearm owner and permit carrier long before Covid and knew what it meant. But it solidified everything I believed before, and woke up a ton of normies. And good for them, exercising their right.

You can claim whatever you want and use situations here and there, but it doesn’t prove anything. You can cherry pick tragedies for anything. I’ve stated numbers that prove my point. You have given your opinion. Guns aren’t close to being the top danger issue in this country.
 
I grew up shooting guns and own several myself since before COVID. Unlike the hysterics and the newly minted wannabe preppers with more disposable income than sense (we call them "loot boxes"), I didn't need COVID to convince me of the benefits of responsible gun ownership. It is precisely because of this that I am confident in saying that permitless concealed carry is a very stupid idea. If someone was not able to pass the very, very easy procedures to obtain a concealed carry permit, they had absolutely no business owning a gun to begin with. We're talking fingerprinting, a very generously scored shooting test, and in some cases a few hours of classes or a demonstration that you know how to handle your weapon safely. This whole process takes at most one month. Most who emerge the other side of it still don't know how to properly engage a target in a self-defense situation without being a danger to themselves or other people, so I'm not sure what the ultimate utility is other than giving terminally frightened people the illusion of safety. But that's a discussion for another time. The point is, any person who was hesitant about going to South Beach strapped to drink and party next spring break - as at least a hundred people decided to do this past March, with two bodies to show for it - now can do so without any fear of getting in trouble for a concealed weapon as long as they legally purchased it. Can't imagine what could go wrong.
One of the things you learned in class is that you can't carry to bars. Has that changed? Of course, criminals aren't really known to follow the law.
 
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JFC

Twice deported illegal alien. Once again another shooting that could have been stopped if the laws on the books were enforced. But keep blaming the guns.
 
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I have questions for the anti-2A crowd:
1. Take away all the legal guns from gun owners who never shot anyone, even in self-defense. What is your plan to remove the now overwhelming gang and cartel weapon usage? Asking pretty please? Anti-4A Raids in violation of the USCON?
2. If someone kills a bunch of people, like running over them with a rented truck (like that's never happened before), what do you do to confiscate all the rented trucks?
3. If someone were to snap and kill people, this would be easily stopped if they had brain chip and we could predict thought processes only laden to violence. is that ok with you?
 
Peter Santenello did a few YouTube videos on the US-Mexican border recently that I highly recommend. Was illuminating for me as someone who did not understand the true scale of the problem.
People want to ignore it under the guise of compassion, but the reality is anything but.
 
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I grew up shooting guns and own several myself since before COVID. Unlike the hysterics and the newly minted wannabe preppers with more disposable income than sense (we call them "loot boxes"), I didn't need COVID to convince me of the benefits of responsible gun ownership. It is precisely because of this that I am confident in saying that permitless concealed carry is a very stupid idea. If someone was not able to pass the very, very easy procedures to obtain a concealed carry permit, they had absolutely no business owning a gun to begin with. We're talking fingerprinting, a very generously scored shooting test, and in some cases a few hours of classes or a demonstration that you know how to handle your weapon safely. This whole process takes at most one month. Most who emerge the other side of it still don't know how to properly engage a target in a self-defense situation without being a danger to themselves or other people, so I'm not sure what the ultimate utility is other than giving terminally frightened people the illusion of safety. But that's a discussion for another time. The point is, any person who was hesitant about going to South Beach strapped to drink and party next spring break - as at least a hundred people decided to do this past March, with two bodies to show for it - now can do so without any fear of getting in trouble for a concealed weapon as long as they legally purchased it. Can't imagine what could go wrong.
Is there not a law about drinking and partying with a CC weapon? I would think that wouldn't be allowed.
 
One of the things you learned in class is that you can't carry to bars. Has that changed? Of course, criminals aren't really known to follow the law.

I'll set aside your point about criminals, which is well taken but it's true whether permitless cc exists or not and to criticize the merits of the law it's best to assume someone who is otherwise carrying legally under it.


For pure bars - that is, establishments with no other purpose - yes, this hasn't changed with the new bill and it would be unlawful to be carrying inside one. But with a place like Miami Beach that restriction is practically meaningless. Most of the spots on that busy strip of South Beach are restaurants that serve alcohol, and in those kinds of establishments the only restriction is you can't be in the "bar area." You can still be in the restaurant and you can still order drinks. Not to mention the number of open air bars where it's sort of not clear where the bar begins and ends (I'm thinking Wet Willies but there are others), and the fact that a lot of people BYO and drink out of their cars or hotels before walking around Collins. You can also legally bring guns into night clubs too (not considered single purpose bars), though in theory the establishments themselves have rules about that and are supposed to be checking people at the door. This isn't only a Miami Beach spring break problem of course but that's a very obvious example where no one can plausibly believe that adding more guns to the situation is going to improve things.
 
I'll set aside your point about criminals, which is well taken but it's true whether permitless cc exists or not and to criticize the merits of the law it's best to assume someone who is otherwise carrying legally under it.


For pure bars - that is, establishments with no other purpose - yes, this hasn't changed with the new bill and it would be unlawful to be carrying inside one. But with a place like Miami Beach that restriction is practically meaningless. Most of the spots on that busy strip of South Beach are restaurants that serve alcohol, and in those kinds of establishments the only restriction is you can't be in the "bar area." You can still be in the restaurant and you can still order drinks. Not to mention the number of open air bars where it's sort of not clear where the bar begins and ends (I'm thinking Wet Willies but there are others), and the fact that a lot of people BYO and drink out of their cars or hotels before walking around Collins. You can also legally bring guns into night clubs too (not considered single purpose bars), though in theory the establishments themselves have rules about that and are supposed to be checking people at the door. This isn't only a Miami Beach spring break problem of course but that's a very obvious example where no one can plausibly believe that adding more guns to the situation is going to improve things.
But that hasn't really changed. there are over 2.5 million legal carry holders. By and large, the legal gun owners still aren't going to be the problem. There is a legal BAC limit for using a firearm, there probably should be for carry as well, but I expect that will be enacted if an issue arises.
 
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But that hasn't really changed. there are over 2.5 million legal carry holders. By and large, the legal gun owners still aren't going to be the problem. There is a legal BAC limit for using a firearm, there probably should be for carry as well, but I expect that will be enacted if an issue arises.
Legal gun owners, especially CC permit holders, have never been a problem. In most places you already can’t drink and carry a firearm.
 
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