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Ivins: Now what on CB's

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dsddcane said:
That's not true though. They did come up the ladder together. He's been a defensive assistant at two previous stops on staffs with manny before here. He literally came here with no more experience than defensive assistant. Dnofrio as much as I hated that dude can atleast take credit for previous success. His problem was he was too stupid to realize the system he demanded on running is for ivy league kids or atleast unathletic kids who don't thrive on instincts & athleticism. This is simply manny wants his hands on every step of the process and most coaches who are established would never allow that.
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Come on, man, don't be ridiculous.

Manny and Blake's time at Texas was not identical, and Blake was a freakin' GA. Blake was a GA for TWO YEARS (2011-2012) at Texas while Manny was the DC. They were also at LaTech together for ONE year (2014). There is no way in **** that Blake's career was instrumental in boosting Manny up the coaching ladder over Manny's 19 years of coaching, and it was FOUR YEARS since they worked together before Manny hired Blake at UM.

On the other hand, Al and Mark were teammates at Ped State for 4 years. They coached together, as assistants, for 2 years at UVa. Then they were together for 5 years at Temple with Al as HC. They also coached together at UM for (almost) 5 years.

Completely different levels of friendship/loyalty/parallel careers. You are trying to compare 3 years of pre-UM relationship (Manny-Blake) to 11 years for Al and Mark.
 
508lavU47 said:
It’s alarming that we don’t have a single coach on our staff that has nfl experience
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I would consider going from NFL back to college a demotion. Most of our coaches have advanced to the NFL and have stayed there. The only coach I can think of at the moment who went from pro back to college is Saban and he has made the most of his situation. End goal for most coaches like players is to make it to the pros and stay there
 
Cookie917 said:
I wasn’t talking Baker specifically. More so meant any defensive coach. Then Aside from optics comes $. I’m not going to even pretend to know a lot of the BOT or boosters. Only people I talk to are stu and Paul (more so Paul’s kids because I do legal work for them) and they seem to care about the program and get ****ed at other BOT members who believe as long as we are decent resources are better spent elsewhere so it’s not only the people we see every day that are a hurdle.
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I've tried to explain that to people. If it was up to Paul and stu things would be turned around real quick now.
 
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TimeB0mb said:
Those are mutually exclusive choices. There is no logical way it could be both. If Miami botched the recruitment and he decided to flip, why would UF pay him 250k+? Because they like giving money away to guys who have already decided to sign with them?
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We have been down this path countless times but they absolutely both could have happened. Commit to the coaches, not want to de commit once it goes public/it is locked down, between those points the coaches say or do something to make him reconsider, coach reaches out to Florida and they lock it up with recent draft successes and a bag. It is absurd to think it was one or the other but absolutely impossible for both to happen in concert. However, we do not need another thread hypothesizing. At the end of the day, for one reason or another, Marshall is going to UF and we’re caught with our pants down at CB, again.
 
TheOriginalCane said:
Come on, man, don't be ridiculous.

Manny and Blake's time at Texas was not identical, and Blake was a freakin' GA. Blake was a GA for TWO YEARS (2011-2012) at Texas while Manny was the DC. They were also at LaTech together for ONE year (2014). There is no way in **** that Blake's career was instrumental in boosting Manny up the coaching ladder over Manny's 19 years of coaching, and it was FOUR YEARS since they worked together before Manny hired Blake at UM.

On the other hand, Al and Mark were teammates at Ped State for 4 years. They coached together, as assistants, for 2 years at UVa. Then they were together for 5 years at Temple with Al as HC. They also coached together at UM for (almost) 5 years.

Completely different levels of friendship/loyalty/parallel careers. You are trying to compare 3 years of pre-UM relationship (Manny-Blake) to 11 years for Al and Mark.
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I wasn't talking about blake. I was talking about ephraim. I thought u meant spent time together on previous staffs. Far as success I honestly see manny's success as minimal before he got here so I couldn't agree one way or the other. Ephraim had zero success before he got here. But since u brought it up that's his tie and his weakness to all 3 of them. They've been on staffs together previously and that's why they have the bond and allegiance to each other in the first place. He's the one who recommended baker for the position at la tech and and he's the one responsible for bringing each of them here under cmr or himself in bakers case. I was really optimistic on the defensive side of the ball when manny was hired cause I hoped that he'd let go of the reigns and bring in an independent dc and I was especially optimistic because I knew the people who were genuinely interested in this job. **** who were interested in filling out the staff on both sides of the ball. He could have an amazing staff on both sides of the ball right now. My blame in him offensively with Enos wasn't the hire in itself. It was bringing in a coach with a questionable track record and giving him 100% authority to the point he didn't even know the resumes of the people Enos hired. But I understood the thought misguided or not. However on the defensive side of the ball from second #1 he turned away at every position some legit monsters... He did that because of the sole reason he wanted his system ran exactly his way and with no one that would question his decisions or his process. His fundamental approach or his lack of one. What separates dominant teams from basic teams beyond talent is the details... That's all. Now we have what we have and we probably have it for a long time. So get a snickers and buckle up.
 
dsddcane said:
I wasn't talking about blake. I was talking about ephraim. I thought u meant spent time together on previous staffs. Far as success I honestly see manny's success as minimal before he got here so I couldn't agree one way or the other. Ephraim had zero success before he got here. But since u brought it up that's his tie and his weakness to all 3 of them. They've been on staffs together previously and that's why they have the bond and allegiance to each other in the first place. He's the one who recommended baker for the position at la tech and and he's the one responsible for bringing each of them here under cmr or himself in bakers case. I was really optimistic on the defensive side of the ball when manny was hired cause I hoped that he'd let go of the reigns and bring in an independent dc and I was especially optimistic because I knew the people who were genuinely interested in this job. **** who were interested in filling out the staff on both sides of the ball. He could have an amazing staff on both sides of the ball right now. My blame in him offensively with Enos wasn't the hire in itself. It was bringing in a coach with a questionable track record and giving him 100% authority to the point he didn't even know the resumes of the people Enos hired. But I understood the thought misguided or not. However on the defensive side of the ball from second #1 he turned away at every position some legit monsters... He did that because of the sole reason he wanted his system ran exactly his way and with no one that would question his decisions or his process. His fundamental approach or his lack of one. What separates dominant teams from basic teams beyond talent is the details... That's all. Now we have what we have and we probably have it for a long time. So get a snickers and buckle up.
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Do Saban and Smart run their same defenses, year in and year out or does it change with who they bring in? Serious question as I don’t know but I’m curious. Whatever Manny’s doing on that side isn’t working and won’t hold up.
 
@dsddcane this is what I don’t understand. In all of football the alumni/family bond with UM is tighter and more outspoken (rightfully so) than any other university... historically. The alumni has always demanded excellence even stacking the sidelines at games... but now a 12 year old fan has enough common sense to know no one on the defensive side of the ball is qualified, but none of the alums are approaching manny about this bull****?! I don’t get it! It’s clear as day Manny has his boys backs over team success and development but nothing is being said outside of this forum. Atleast that’s the impression I have.
One of the reasons people “came to the University of Miami” was to be a part of the family and stand on the sideline and hold the next generation accountable. When did that change?
When did we accept this weak *** defensive staff? FIU wouldn’t hire a single one of these dudes
 
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CoachChin said:
@dsddcane this is what I don’t understand. In all of football the alumni/family bond with UM is tighter and more outspoken (rightfully so) than any other university... historically. The alumni has always demanded excellence even stacking the sidelines at games... but now a 12 year old fan has enough common sense to know no one on the defensive side of the ball is qualified, but none of the alums are approaching manny about this bull****?! I don’t get it! It’s clear as day Manny has his boys backs over team success and development but nothing is being said outside of this forum. Atleast that’s the impression I have.
One of the reasons people “came to the University of Miami” was to be a part of the family and stand on the sideline and hold the next generation accountable. When did that change?
When did we accept this weak *** defensive staff? FIU wouldn’t hire a single one of these dudes
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With one of those ex-players you're speaking on being COS. I can't imagine Ed sitting back and biting his tongue if he sees something like that going on. The main reason he's here is to help guide decisions like putting together a legitimate staff.
 
Usafcane88 said:
With one of those ex-players you're speaking on being COS. I can't imagine Ed sitting back and biting his tongue if he sees something like that going on. The main reason he's here is to help guide decisions like putting together a legitimate staff.
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You would think... but the reason AH wasn’t hired was because they didn’t wanna be challenged... so makes me think otherwise now.
 
RVACane said:
Do Saban and Smart run their same defenses, year in and year out or does it change with who they bring in? Serious question as I don’t know but I’m curious. Whatever Manny’s doing on that side isn’t working and won’t hold up.
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Smart I've noticed subtle tweeks to the system with the same base. Saban is constantly adapting everything he's running independent of the line. One game to the next he's running base 5-2, 4-3, 3-4.
 
CoachChin said:
@dsddcane this is what I don’t understand. In all of football the alumni/family bond with UM is tighter and more outspoken (rightfully so) than any other university... historically. The alumni has always demanded excellence even stacking the sidelines at games... but now a 12 year old fan has enough common sense to know no one on the defensive side of the ball is qualified, but none of the alums are approaching manny about this bull****?! I don’t get it! It’s clear as day Manny has his boys backs over team success and development but nothing is being said outside of this forum. Atleast that’s the impression I have.
One of the reasons people “came to the University of Miami” was to be a part of the family and stand on the sideline and hold the next generation accountable. When did that change?
When did we accept this weak *** defensive staff? FIU wouldn’t hire a single one of these dudes
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He's held accountable. Just in a More private setting. They're not wrong either cause social media is the devil... Main issue we encounter now is our own board is actively sabotaging us so they can at large profit from the situation. With that in mind alot of us that are more outspoken simply are dismissed. Also I hate to admit it but I think even as a alumni base the last 15 years has basically broken us. I hate to say that but outside of here I barely even speak on football anymore than I need to.
 
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dsddcane said:
He's held accountable. Just in a More private setting. They're not wrong either cause social media is the devil... Main issue we encounter now is our own board is actively sabotaging us so they can at large profit from the situation. With that in mind alot of us that are more outspoken simply are dismissed. Also I hate to admit it but I think even as a alumni base the last 15 years has basically broken us. I hate to say that but outside of here I barely even speak on football anymore than I need to.
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Rally the troops. Culture starts at the top (Blake James and Manny) but you guys can help these youngins and the incomers be proud to be a cane. Instill the mindset. This generation doesn’t have a patient or buckle down and grind mindset. It’s a what can you do for me today mindset. The clemsons and Alabamas of the world have that grind or don’t complain mindset. Our older teams had that. And our future is the hope for that.

man I know I’m wishful thinking...
 
dsddcane said:
He's held accountable. Just in a More private setting. They're not wrong either cause social media is the devil... Main issue we encounter now is our own board is actively sabotaging us so they can at large profit from the situation. With that in mind alot of us that are more outspoken simply are dismissed. Also I hate to admit it but I think even as a alumni base the last 15 years has basically broken us. I hate to say that but outside of here I barely even speak on football anymore than I need to.
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so we’re being sabotaged by the BOT

and Manny is essentially self sabotaging with the unwillingness to make defensive staff changes.

Would you mind elaborating on the BOT part? Manny situation is self explanatory.
 
dsddcane said:
I get it. I know what youre saying. For me I'm not much for him for several reasons. #1 his scheme doesn't really allow for success with adaptability. It's based upon flashing from the edges and the backers. Blitz packages are easily picked up by any well coached line with communication (especially when we've been struggling at tackle) people may not have noticed the success of the line last few weeks has been based upon better tackle play and some consistency out of nesta and even the non dancing tackle from ny. He's getting better when it relates to being able to make in game adjustments. But he's still seriously lacking in that capacity. My main issue with him as a dc is he puts no value on several positions which in turn don't allow us to develop substance. This level of defense is only capable against certain levels of opponents (consistently)honestly because the system doesn't allow us to simply line up and dominate the man on the opposite side of the ball with aggression. We win based on speed and misdirection. That isn't as valuable against better line play.
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Thank you for your response. I value your opinion for reasons previously stated.

It will be interesting to see what moves (if any) are made this offseason. I'm on record as saying Baker, Rumph, and Patke (in that order of probability) could all lose their jobs in the off-season. My reasons are not solely based on football competence but a combination of recruiting prowess (or lack thereof) and ability to develop players. Two of those coaches are linked closely to Many so let's see what he does.
 
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CoachChin said:
Rally the troops. Culture starts at the top (Blake James and Manny) but you guys can help these youngins and the incomers be proud to be a cane. Instill the mindset. This generation doesn’t have a patient or buckle down and grind mindset. It’s a what can you do for me today mindset. The clemsons and Alabamas of the world have that grind or don’t complain mindset. Our older teams had that. And our future is the hope for that.

man I know I’m wishful thinking...
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Personally I'd love to see it. But it starts with core values. With parents taking more active roles in their children's moral values than simply their sporting achievements. With coaches capable of understanding what kids should be buying into and most importantly a group of kids & coaches who share one common goal. For us we actively ran off people who put themselves before the team goals. Now it's prevalent. Now there's nothing but lil cliques and coaches who side with them. It's all about individual success. For us we knew success came most importantly as a whole. The Clemson's and the alabama's are able to thrive as they do because they have strong coaches and kids who for the most part understand the sacrifice necessary to be elite.
 
M3N said:
so we’re being sabotaged by the BOT

and Manny is essentially self sabotaging with the unwillingness to make defensive staff changes.

Would you mind elaborating on the BOT part? Manny situation is self explanatory.
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It's not that were being sabotaged. That's a bad choice of words on my part. Sabotage implies tearing us down. No one intends to do that. However their goals and most of ours are very different. Success isn't measured the same. For them a winning team is more than enough to justify the means. For me if we ain't competing at the top then we're simply failing. I don't wanna elaborate again on how those decisions were made. It's beating a dead horse at this point. Manny is going to be here for a long time most likely regardless of the motives behind his employment and mario has already basically moved beyond our payment scale.
 
M3N said:
so we’re being sabotaged by the BOT

and Manny is essentially self sabotaging with the unwillingness to make defensive staff changes.

Would you mind elaborating on the BOT part? Manny situation is self explanatory.
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Sabotaging at 7-1 ranked in the top ten with two five stars coming in next season. Got it.
 
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