If we self-impose, DO IT NOW

[Bigtip]

I think its a bad sign if we self impose another. the school will probably get some kind of guidance from the NCAA and IF they self impose AGAIN, then I believe the findings are really bad.

I'm hoping we dont self impose because I believe that will signal that we are for the most part in the clear and will be looking at some scholly reductions (in the range of 9-12 per year)

 

[CanesAreAble]

Miami has fully cooperated with the NCAA which means they're in contact with them regularly. If Miami self imposes then they're doing it because they know more than we do and the NCAA was either going to give the program two bowl bans or it will reduce the number of scholarships lost.

Self impose and reduce the punishment now...

Or they don't know anything.

I find that hard to believe. No way in **** Miami is flying blind in this situation.

CBS- "Emmert went out of his way to compliment Miami president Donna Shalala and her role in the ongoing investigation that the NCAA started in the spring. For a sitting NCAA CEO to comment on such a high-profile case as Miami’s is almost unprecedented. For him to drop in compliments in the middle of the case, well, it’s hard to remember if that has ever occurred.

“The reality is that Miami, the university, has been incredibly cooperative,” Emmert said. “[Miami] President Shalala is doing an incredible job of interacting with us. Donna is doing a great job. She is being very, very helpful.”"

I'm familiar with the quote. I've posted it maybe half a dozen times on this board.

But cooperation isn't a two-way street with the NCAA.

 

[WhatTheHell]

We gonna win 9+ games next year. Just take the ban now.

 

[Picksix]

Miami has fully cooperated with the NCAA which means they're in contact with them regularly. If Miami self imposes then they're doing it because they know more than we do and the NCAA was either going to give the program two bowl bans or it will reduce the number of scholarships lost.

Self impose and reduce the punishment now...

Or they don't know anything.

I find that hard to believe. No way in **** Miami is flying blind in this situation.

CBS- "Emmert went out of his way to compliment Miami president Donna Shalala and her role in the ongoing investigation that the NCAA started in the spring. For a sitting NCAA CEO to comment on such a high-profile case as Miami’s is almost unprecedented. For him to drop in compliments in the middle of the case, well, it’s hard to remember if that has ever occurred.

“The reality is that Miami, the university, has been incredibly cooperative,” Emmert said. “[Miami] President Shalala is doing an incredible job of interacting with us. Donna is doing a great job. She is being very, very helpful.”"

I'm familiar with the quote. I've posted it maybe half a dozen times on this board.

But cooperation isn't a two-way street with the NCAA.

It takes two parties to interact. Like I said, no way in **** Miami is flying blind right now.

 

[Consigliere]

Please explain why do it before the Duke game.

ACC rules state if you go to the ACC Championship game, you have to goto a bowl, you can't self impose after the ACCCG

So what does that have to do with banning before the Duke game?

 

[Consigliere]

We gonna win 9+ games next year. Just take the ban now.

We could win 9 games and lose 3 in the ACC.

5-3 in the ACC doesn't guarantee an ACCCG appearance.

 

[Consigliere]

Miami has fully cooperated with the NCAA which means they're in contact with them regularly. If Miami self imposes then they're doing it because they know more than we do and the NCAA was either going to give the program two bowl bans or it will reduce the number of scholarships lost.

Self impose and reduce the punishment now...

Or they don't know anything.

Don't know what they (the school) know believe or think but the fans know little to nothing.

 

[Dingaan1828]

It takes two parties to interact. Like I said, no way in **** Miami is flying blind right now.

I've been the subject of an interrogation. It's an interaction too. They ask the questions, and you answer. So, while this interaction is probably a two way street, it's likely that one lane goes toward you with questions and requests for documentation. Three lanes run back to them with the stuff they request from you. But, sure, UM can seek guidance from the NCAA, if the NCAA is close enough to wrapping this up, they might give a hint at possible sanctions.

 

[GhostofVenice01]

The NCAA already agknowledged that us taking post season bans hurt us more than the average state school money wise, and they see this as a big loss to us



I can only see the post season bans helping out situation, especially since the NCAA already agknowledged it hurts our program more than most.

 

[JimmyJohnsonsHair]

I doubt the University is flying blind in this situation. If they don't take the ban it's probably a really good sign, but I fully expect that they'll take it because I doubt the NCAA will be content with a one year bowl ban.

 

[Consigliere]

I doubt the University is flying blind in this situation. If they don't take the ban it's probably a really good sign, but I fully expect that they'll take it because I doubt the NCAA will be content with a one year bowl ban.

Just out of curiosity, besides Penn State (and their criminal charges), how many schools over the last five years received a 2 year bowl ban?

 

[Larry]

I ride with Able on this one...ain't fair to the kids to have them work their asses off and go out there with hopes of winning the Coastal for the first time ever, only to pull the rug out from underneath them after they won it.

 

[Jedi Master Cane]

I do not understand the hesitation.

Something about facing your bitter rival with an Orange Bowl birth on the line (and yeah, we'll be double digit underdogs, so?), or maybe that our conference really, really doesn't seem to want us to.


Come on, Lu, there are good arguments both ways; it's not an easy decision, either way.

Sorry dude...it's the easiest decision in the history of decisions.

It's right up there with realizing Shannon was a ****** *** coach and shouldn't have been extended...which is the only reason we are discussing it on these boards because this *** backwards administration of capable of anything. It does not change the fact that self imposing is the only LOGICAL decision here.

 

[Consigliere]

I do not understand the hesitation.

Something about facing your bitter rival with an Orange Bowl birth on the line (and yeah, we'll be double digit underdogs, so?), or maybe that our conference really, really doesn't seem to want us to.


Come on, Lu, there are good arguments both ways; it's not an easy decision, either way.

Sorry dude...it's the easiest decision in the history of decisions.

It's right up there with realizing Shannon was a ****ty *** coach and shouldn't have been extended...which is the only reason we are discussing it on these boards because this *** backwards administration of capable of anything. It does not change the fact that self imposing is the only LOGICAL decision here.

Easiest decision. How do you pick your financial investments? Throw darts, choose cards from a deck, watch cars drive by. There is no information but it is the "easiest decision in the history of decisions."

This is a terrible comparison by the way.

For one, the fans had enough information on Shannon's tenure to make an educated decision. With Nevingate, we the fans have little to none.

I don't care that people agree or disagree with me (on whether to take a ban or not) but the idea that people think this decision is a "no brainer" or "the easiest decision in the history of decisions" is scary.

Will you admit the following (maybe I will get why this is the easiest decision in the history of decisions)

1. We have little to no information on the process,

2. We have already taken a ban,

3. No team has ever taken a second self imposed ban, and

4. The NCAA has been handing out one year bowls bans almost across the board (minus PSU and the criminal acts).

Please help me.

 

[LuCane]

I do not understand the hesitation.

Something about facing your bitter rival with an Orange Bowl birth on the line (and yeah, we'll be double digit underdogs, so?), or maybe that our conference really, really doesn't seem to want us to.


Come on, Lu, there are good arguments both ways; it's not an easy decision, either way.

I've tried, man. For real. I really don't think anything measures up even close to wiping the slate clean and giving recruits the feeling (warranted or otherwise) that they're coming into a fresh situation. Bitter rival and an Orange Bowl (especially considering what kind of team I acknowledge we are right now) are shortsighted with the type of program I expect in the next 2-3 years.

That is the thing here, you are making a tremendous assumption.

It doesn't guarantee we are "wiping the slate clean." It is a good faith gesture to the NCAA. The NCAA could hit us with a third ban, they could have been fine with the one we self imposed already. We don't know and we have little information as fans.

This decision is an incredibly complicated and almost idiotic without any information (i.e. the fan's opinion on what we should do). With no deadlines by the NCAA on declaring, I am, at the very least, waiting till after the Duke game to make a decision.

You're going to wait till after Duke to tell kids? Here's something that isn't a presumption: you risk alienating your kids and losing their trust. I appreciate your analysis, but you're overthinking this one.

 

[Larry]

I do not understand the hesitation.

Something about facing your bitter rival with an Orange Bowl birth on the line (and yeah, we'll be double digit underdogs, so?), or maybe that our conference really, really doesn't seem to want us to.


Come on, Lu, there are good arguments both ways; it's not an easy decision, either way.

I've tried, man. For real. I really don't think anything measures up even close to wiping the slate clean and giving recruits the feeling (warranted or otherwise) that they're coming into a fresh situation. Bitter rival and an Orange Bowl (especially considering what kind of team I acknowledge we are right now) are shortsighted with the type of program I expect in the next 2-3 years.

You also give up the opportunity for this team to experience what it means to be winners. Winning teams play in games like this before they become winners. It teaches them something. A healthy dose of humble pie perhaps...or, perhaps a healthy dose of "so this is what it takes, to win"...or perhaps something to keep'em hungry going into next year...you are also pushing that ahead one year...a year that might not offer the same opportunity by season's end. Or, ****, it isn't out of the realm of reality that we beat FSU and go to a BCS bowl game.

Learning how to win is something that has been missing from the 'Canes program for the past decade.

I am aware of the pros of the situation and understand if we take the hit, but there are tangible cons to this situation as well...the opportunity may not come again.

 

[LuCane]

I do not understand the hesitation.

Something about facing your bitter rival with an Orange Bowl birth on the line (and yeah, we'll be double digit underdogs, so?), or maybe that our conference really, really doesn't seem to want us to.


Come on, Lu, there are good arguments both ways; it's not an easy decision, either way.

I've tried, man. For real. I really don't think anything measures up even close to wiping the slate clean and giving recruits the feeling (warranted or otherwise) that they're coming into a fresh situation. Bitter rival and an Orange Bowl (especially considering what kind of team I acknowledge we are right now) are shortsighted with the type of program I expect in the next 2-3 years.

You also give up the opportunity for this team to experience what it means to be winners. Winning teams play in games like this before they become winners. It teaches them something. A healthy dose of humble pie perhaps...or, perhaps a healthy dose of "so this is what it takes, to win"...or perhaps something to keep'em hungry going into next year...you are also pushing that ahead one year...a year that might not offer the same opportunity by season's end. Or, ****, it isn't out of the realm of reality that we beat FSU and go to a BCS bowl game.

Learning how to win is something that has been missing from the 'Canes program for the past decade.

I am aware of the pros of the situation and understand if we take the hit, but there are tangible cons to this situation as well...the opportunity may not come again.

Do you realistically think we're going to get off without any other post-season ban? Even if so, is that worth the risk of having that penalty pushed to next year?

 

[Consigliere]

I do not understand the hesitation.

Something about facing your bitter rival with an Orange Bowl birth on the line (and yeah, we'll be double digit underdogs, so?), or maybe that our conference really, really doesn't seem to want us to.


Come on, Lu, there are good arguments both ways; it's not an easy decision, either way.

I've tried, man. For real. I really don't think anything measures up even close to wiping the slate clean and giving recruits the feeling (warranted or otherwise) that they're coming into a fresh situation. Bitter rival and an Orange Bowl (especially considering what kind of team I acknowledge we are right now) are shortsighted with the type of program I expect in the next 2-3 years.

That is the thing here, you are making a tremendous assumption.

It doesn't guarantee we are "wiping the slate clean." It is a good faith gesture to the NCAA. The NCAA could hit us with a third ban, they could have been fine with the one we self imposed already. We don't know and we have little information as fans.

This decision is an incredibly complicated and almost idiotic without any information (i.e. the fan's opinion on what we should do). With no deadlines by the NCAA on declaring, I am, at the very least, waiting till after the Duke game to make a decision.

You're going to wait till after Duke to tell kids? Here's something that isn't a presumption: you risk alienating your kids and losing their trust. I appreciate your analysis, but you're overthinking this one.

I think you are confusing what I meant by the above, I was only saying that taking a ban doesn't guarantee we "wipe the slate clean."

Also, I fear a Boston College game on our hands. That is why I would recommend waiting. There is a lot of risk in taking the ban or not taking the ban. It seems that the kids (at least Duke Johnson) understands it may be coming regardless of the timing. So, I would just wait another week IMO if we are going to declare a ban.

 

[Consigliere]

Lu cane,

How many teams have received 2 year post season bans over the last 3 years?

 

[Larry]

I do not understand the hesitation.

Something about facing your bitter rival with an Orange Bowl birth on the line (and yeah, we'll be double digit underdogs, so?), or maybe that our conference really, really doesn't seem to want us to.


Come on, Lu, there are good arguments both ways; it's not an easy decision, either way.

I've tried, man. For real. I really don't think anything measures up even close to wiping the slate clean and giving recruits the feeling (warranted or otherwise) that they're coming into a fresh situation. Bitter rival and an Orange Bowl (especially considering what kind of team I acknowledge we are right now) are shortsighted with the type of program I expect in the next 2-3 years.

You also give up the opportunity for this team to experience what it means to be winners. Winning teams play in games like this before they become winners. It teaches them something. A healthy dose of humble pie perhaps...or, perhaps a healthy dose of "so this is what it takes, to win"...or perhaps something to keep'em hungry going into next year...you are also pushing that ahead one year...a year that might not offer the same opportunity by season's end. Or, ****, it isn't out of the realm of reality that we beat FSU and go to a BCS bowl game.

Learning how to win is something that has been missing from the 'Canes program for the past decade.

I am aware of the pros of the situation and understand if we take the hit, but there are tangible cons to this situation as well...the opportunity may not come again.

Do you realistically think we're going to get off without any other post-season ban? Even if so, is that worth the risk of having that penalty pushed to next year?

I have no idea what is coming.

But, do you think realistically, this opportunity that we are on the doorstep of, is going to be there next year...the year after? VaTech just had their worst season in 20 (TWENTY) years...essentially offering up this opportunity for Miami to get somewhere they've never gone.

We can belittle the opportunity and say how this opportunity is somehow below us (not you, but plenty of people have)...but not this guy.

I think a moment like this is MORE vital to success in the future than simply pushing back a sanction that we don't even know is coming. I think there are sides of this people don't look at, and just think "Well, Miami sucks! Better luck next year!"...yeah, we aren't very good, but we can take something legitimate and substantial from this season that could lead to a resurgence in the program. Is it a guarantee? No. Of course not. But neither is taking a bowl ban and hoping for success in 2013.