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Durham to no longer host the ACC tourney

g8rh8rMD said:
Surely you recognize that there is a lot more that goes into winning a baseball tournament than where it is held?

Also, you can surely recognize that there are other benefits to the power brokers that run the Atlantic Coast Carolina Cabal by keeping the tournament close to home other than any on-field edge that may benefit one of their favorite North Carolina teams?
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You're seeing black helicopters, aren't you. They hold the tournament where most of the teams are. It is the only thing that makes sense.
 
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CaneInHeelCountry said:
And surely you recognize the financial benefits to the league of hosting a baseball tourney in NC instead of FL.




Sooooo.... your post is irrelevant to a discussion about the ACC baseball tourney, then. Got it.
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OK Carolina boy.

To your first point, I get that Durham or wherever is your home, but no, I don't grant your sacred cow that it is better to host a baseball tournament in NC than anywhere else in ACC territory, Florida included.

Here's a crazy idea, let's put out an open solicitation for bids to any city in FL, GA, SC, NC, VA, KY, PA, MA, NY, you get the idea..., and see who will provide the best atmosphere, nicest stadium, most reasonably priced hotel rooms in a short circumference of the stadium, and most importantly, the highest guaranteed payout to the conference, and see who wins?? Sounds nuts, right? I mean, it works for the Super Bowl, the NFL Draft, NCAA Basketball Tournament and countless other annual events. It's so crazy, maybe we should just give it a shot. Or, you know, the All Carolina Cabal can just keep issuing hosting duties to the conferences premier events to whomever they want on whatever terms they want with no transparency whatsoever, and people like you can keep defending it because "driving distance". Either way is fine, I guess.

To your second point, pffffffff.
 
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Jaromir Jagr said:
You're seeing black helicopters, aren't you. They hold the tournament where most of the teams are. It is the only thing that makes sense.
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See post below yours. It's not good for a conference to hold a tournament where only the die hardest of fans from teams such as Syracuse will ever come see the tournament, while fans from Duke and Wake are there every year because it's in their backyard.

If it makes the most sense, then an open bid process would prove that. Even then, the conference should consider rotating the tournament for the benefit of all members and fans. That's what makes sense.
 
g8rh8rMD said:
See post below yours. It's not good for a conference to hold a tournament where only the die hardest of fans from teams such as Syracuse will ever come see the tournament, while fans from Duke and Wake are there every year because it's in their backyard.

If it makes the most sense, then an open bid process would prove that. Even then, the conference should consider rotating the tournament for the benefit of all members and fans. That's what makes sense.
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You're going to feel weird when you realize that Syracuse doesn't have a baseball team.

What open bid process are you talking about? You don't think they've already run every number possible? The thing that makes sense is to hold the tournament where the greatest number of fans can attend. Your idea is to occasionally hold it in Pittsburgh so that UNC and Miami can play in front of 500 fans while Pitt doesn't make the tournament.
 
I think the part a couple of you missed in my OP was "accommodation", as with everything else the ACC does it seems the only concern is for the Carolina teams.

If that's not entirely the case then they would put it out to bid. ****, the NCAA let's teams "bid" on regionals. The surest way to guarantee that it stays exactly where you want it is to not issue an RFP.
 
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Jaromir Jagr said:
You're going to feel weird when you realize that Syracuse doesn't have a baseball team.

What open bid process are you talking about? You don't think they've already run every number possible? The thing that makes sense is to hold the tournament where the greatest number of fans can attend. Your idea is to occasionally hold it in Pittsburgh so that UNC and Miami can play in front of 500 fans while Pitt doesn't make the tournament.
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There is no "bid process" you issue an RFP and see what you get, and IIRC the attendance in Durham mostly sucks save for a few games anyway...
 
QuatroCane said:
I think the part a couple of you missed in my OP was "accommodation", as with everything else the ACC does it seems the only concern is for the Carolina teams.

If that's not entirely the case then they would put it out to bid. ****, the NCAA let's teams "bid" on regionals. The surest way to guarantee that it stays exactly where you want it is to not issue an RFP.
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Guys, they DO accept bids. It's in every article about the location of the tournament. So please stop saying that they need to accept bids. They already do.
 
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Jaromir Jagr said:
Or you could have asked or done research instead of demanding a bid process.
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Or you could have said that when you first posted considering the second post of the thread was questioning a bid process.
You intentionally withed information.


//I'm kidding
 
It feels weird to side with Jagr, but ****, a lot of you guys are really off the mark. I know it feels good to play the "Us against the world" card...but sometimes you guys need to drop the BS and look at things logically. No one's trying to ***** UM here.
 
Jaromir Jagr said:
You're going to feel weird when you realize that Syracuse doesn't have a baseball team.

What open bid process are you talking about? You don't think they've already run every number possible? The thing that makes sense is to hold the tournament where the greatest number of fans can attend. Your idea is to occasionally hold it in Pittsburgh so that UNC and Miami can play in front of 500 fans while Pitt doesn't make the tournament.
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OK, strike NY off the bid list. Why doesn't Syracuse not have a baseball team? Is that a Title IX thing or something? Whatever, topic for a different conversation...

What would make you, or me, or anyone, think that "they've" run every number possible?

I don't see what's so confusing. You put together what is called an RFP, "request for proposals", and you send out a press release that the ACC is requesting proposals to host their baseball tournament and you include a format for cities to respond and cite the criteria based upon which the responses will be judged. Cities, major conferences/trade shows, and companies do this sort of thing all the time. Usually, you bid a couple of years in advance. So right now, the conference should be looking at proposals for, say, 2023, to be decided and announced this summer. There's really nothing all that complicated about it.

The way these events are currently being awarded would be considered extremely shady and even illegal in almost any other enterprise, but I guess since it's sports and "driving distance" most people don't bat an eye, even though their team are among the fans that need to "drive" the furthest to see their team play. But if a city wants to build a new building, let's say a police precinct, the mayor can't just go to his biggest donor (usually a developer) and say, hey, sell the city some of your land and build us a building on it. No, the city has to put out an RFP outlining their requirement, listing the criteria on which they will make their ultimate decision on which proposal to select, and ask any and all qualified developers to issue a bid to the city to provide the land and build the police building. Why should these games be any different? If Durham or Charlotte still have the best bid, ok cool, so be it. But let other ACC cities have at least a chance at these events, and by doing so, you maximize revenue to the league and therefore back to the member schools.

It constantly amazes me to get such pushback to this basic concept of fairness and maximization of utility to the conference on a Miami Hurricanes message board. Guess I'm just crazy.
 
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g8rh8rMD said:
What would make you, or me, or anyone, think that "they've" run every number possible?
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Because they want to maximize revenue and minimize expenses.

g8rh8rMD said:
I don't see what's so confusing. You put together what is called an RFP, "request for proposals", and you send out a press release that the ACC is requesting proposals to host their baseball tournament and you include a format for cities to respond and cite the criteria based upon which the responses will be judged. Cities, major conferences/trade shows, and companies do this sort of thing all the time. Usually, you bid a couple of years in advance. So right now, the conference should be looking at proposals for, say, 2023, to be decided and announced this summer. There's really nothing all that complicated about it.

The way these events are currently being awarded would be considered extremely shady and even illegal in almost any other enterprise, but I guess since it's sports and "driving distance" most people don't bat an eye, even though their team are among the fans that need to "drive" the furthest to see their team play. But if a city wants to build a new building, let's say a police precinct, the mayor can't just go to his biggest donor (usually a developer) and say, hey, sell the city some of your land and build us a building on it. No, the city has to put out an RFP outlining their requirement, listing the criteria on which they will make their ultimate decision on which proposal to select, and ask any and all qualified developers to issue a bid to the city to provide the land and build the police building. Why should these games be any different? If Durham or Charlotte still have the best bid, ok cool, so be it. But let other ACC cities have at least a chance at these events, and by doing so, you maximize revenue to the league and therefore back to the member schools.

It constantly amazes me to get such pushback to this basic concept of fairness and maximization of utility to the conference on a Miami Hurricanes message board. Guess I'm just crazy.
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They do accept bids and proposals. Read the articles.
 
Jaromir Jagr said:
Guys, they DO accept bids. It's in every article about the location of the tournament. So please stop saying that they need to accept bids. They already do.
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I've never seen any article referring to a bid process for the ACC football championship game, particularly not at the time that they just extended a long term contract with Charlotte. Apologies for not doing research, but if you've happened to read one, I'd appreciate you passing it along.

I didn't see anything in the article posted by the OP about a bid process for hosting the ACC baseball championship either. I did catch this piece, about a recent four year deal and the reporters assertion that the ACC hoped Durham could be a permanent home. To me, that contradicts the idea that the opportunity to host would be subject to any type of open bid process that is available to the ACC region.

When the ACC agreed to a four-year deal to hold its baseball tournament at the Durham Bulls Athletic Park beginning in 2015, both the league and the Bulls hoped that Durham could be the event’s permanent home just as Omaha, Nebraska, is for the College World Series.

If this thing really is bid out and offered to all ACC cities and it just happens that either only central NC towns want it or are able to guarantee reasonable levels of revenue, then we are all on the same page and I will readily admit when I am wrong. Any help in pointing me to press releases or articles about the bid process, towns/cities that were offered the chance to bid and either elected or declined to do so, etc, would be much appreciated. My impression has not been that there has been a bid process, but that the ACC has selected locales where it wanted to host games and then negotiated individually. Again, if my understanding is incorrect, thank you for pointing it out.
 
While I agree the ACC is predicated on triangle teams I love having it where I can go every year. It’ll for sure stay in NC. We have some of the best minor league stadiums in America. It was great the year they had it in Greensboro. And not to mention you also have Winston Salem and Charlotte as great options as well.
 
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Jaromir Jagr said:
Because they want to maximize revenue and minimize expenses.



They do accept bids and proposals. Read the articles.
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If the former is the case, then why lock into a greater than ten year term at Charlotte for ACCFCG? We all know that the ACC has done a poor job and has been behind the curve in many areas when it comes to maximizing revenue compared to other conferences. Maybe you are just more confident or optimistic than I, but I am not so prepared to take that for granted.

Regarding the latter, I'd appreciate any reading material you would be kind enough to share regarding the bid process. The OP article did not mention one and I have not read anything regarding such, so I apologize for my ignorance, but I have not been exposed to any press regarding an open bid process for ACC football, basketball, or baseball championship events.

Thanks
 
The Charlotte Knights hope to stave off International League rivals Durham and Louisville — not on the field, but for the Atlantic Coast Conference baseball tournament. Dan Rajkowski, Knights chief operating officer, told CBJ the Triple-A minor league team intends to bid to host the tournament beginning with the 2020 season. Representatives from the ACC and the International League confirmed anticipated bids from all three teams.
 
CaneInHeelCountry said:
I don't get the "Carolina favoritism" angle.

Nobody plays at DBAP (or in Greensboro or Charlotte), so no team knows the bounces or the lines any better than the others. And it's not like football or basketball, where you're going to get home-crowds with a lot of noise. There are usually no more than 4k or 5k fans in the stands for the champ game (in a 10k stadium) and I've seen a good number of UM fans each year.

IMO, this is and has always been about $$ and attendance. And it pays to hold the tourney in NC because that's where a good chunk of schools are in or near, and it's pretty equidistant to the furthest reaches of the conferences.
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Are you ******* kidding? You are yapping about crowd noise, and "bounces", and "lines", and whatnot?

Football championship - usually in Charlotte. Basketball tournament - usually in the Carolinas. Baseball tournament - usually in the Carolinas.

You are bragging about the "$$ and attendance" in Durham? WHAT money? WHAT attendance? We don't even have a conference TV contract with a regional sports network (presumably this will change with the ACC Network).

The fact remains, nearly every conference championship that COULD rotate among host cities is played in the Carolinas, and for baseball, you are acting as if there are mountains of money that get built up from FIVE THOUSAND people attending.

The truth is, if you move the championship around to other cities within the ACC footprint, you would build interest, media coverage, and attendance in all of these other areas.

Instead, our conference is run by the same Carolina dipsh!tes who gave our football regional TV contract to Jefferson Pilot on the basis of nepotism.

I wouldn't care if we made all the ACC baseball tournament tickets free (and passed on the $10,000 of revenue), just move the tournament around to major league stadiums and let all the baseball fans come out and see the ACC in action. Maybe then we would have a whole generation of kids who don't mind taking 30% scholarship equivalencies to play NCAA baseball.
 
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