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Does Valentine recommit to UM?

CANE4LIFE said:
TheMatador said:
CANE4LIFE said:
There is a whole racket with guys like Genron, where they work as "scouts" for bullsh*t recruiting services that have direct ties to certain schools and boosters from those schools. They are basically paid to hustle kids to certain schools, take them on unofficial visits, block out other programs, etc. The NCAA has tried digging into this before, including everyone's good friend Charles Fishbein's shady @ss operation that was employing street agents and he had to fire at least one after the NCAA came after them.

People dont realize the entire industry that exists in many places to hustle these kids and college programs.
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The NCAA doesn't have the savvy or wherewithal to dig into this shady racket in south Florida. They'd have to turn into an elite intelligence outfit with covert agents to penetrate this mess. They're a bunch of naive midwestern bureaucrats with no real power to investigate--heck, their investigative powers are so weak that they had to resort to threats and extortion just to try to get information in our case. The improprieties of their actions is just evidence of their weakness.

One of the problems that people have identified is the problem of coaches employed by the high schools. I don't know how many of these are public schools, but it seems like it might be a violation of some code of ethics, if not an outright crime, for public employees (which these coaches presumably are) to accept some kind of benefit for delivering, or at least, directing a kid, to a particular program. If it is not covered by a law, or at least an enforceable code of conduct, it should be.

If lawmakers in Florida cared enough---maybe they could write a law that would regulate, if not outright ban, the activities of the street agents. I said "maybe."

As far as the poster who said "prove" that LSU is paying, such as an ESPN article or something, you'll never find it. If courts required direct proof of every crime, and did not permit circumstantial proof, the criminals would really be running wild. You'll never find it. But what about all the stories about Dwayne Bowe?-if I'm sitting a thousand miles away and believe, based on dozens and dozens of message board posts over the years, that something was not right with Bowe's ending up at LSU, or Patrick Johnson Peterson, then I'm going to suspect LSU. Please remember, college football is the second religion of southerners, or maybe the third after their real religion and hunting and guns (the second religion). You don't mess with their religions. And don't call me anti-southern, anti-religious, or anti-gun----because I'm not.

I don't know what's at play in the Valentine case---but is it true Genron accompanied him? It might be one thing for a HS coach to go on the trip, which is unusual--but street agent, plus TV's mother? It all sounds like maybe the "closing" where they finalize a "deal." Sorry, something still smells.
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Its impossible for them to stop it. The NCAA has no subpoena authority. Most of that stuff is all done in cash. There is no way for them to actually catch most of these coaches and street agents doing anything. The only time they get anything done, is when they can tie one of these "services" to a program, like they did with Oregon, and start snooping around, and then the program has to suddenly cut all ties, or do the "mea culpa" and act all shocked that they were hiring a bunch of shady hustlers as "scouts". Its gotten 10 times worse now with the 7 on 7 stuff. Now you have yet ANOTHER layer of shady hustlers involved with that, so even if the HS coaches arent up to their eyeballs in it, the coaches and leeches hanging around the 7 on 7 teams are having a feast hustling these kids and their families.
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That's what I'm saying; I know the NCAA has no subpoena power, and all they can do for a witness who lies is to try to punish their school, and what good is that if the witness is a former player or coach who no longer has ties to the school.

There's no way the NCAA can come close to dealing with this. Maybe, just maybe, if the lawmakers were willing and could write a law that could regulate and restrict this stuff, just maybe it could be stopped or at least limited. I doubt that happens.

I remember back when I was in HS in the early '60's the education system tried to ban high school fraternities, and that was a joke. It could never be enforced. Can you imagine the school system or the state trying to regulate this kind of activity? Next thing you know, the kids will be more interested in 7-on-7 rather than HS football, because the former will be more connected to college football and their "business" decisions about where they go. The kids will continue to talk nonsense like facilities, playing time, "family" atmosphere, academics, etc., yet go to the highest bidder. Now, this will not be all kids, just maybe a certain percentage. Next thing you know, programs will have two kinds of players--those that are truly committed to the school and program when they are there, and those who are just there because that was their best deal. That will be a witch's brew for any program to deal with. Then you'll have the kids who are just playing to prep themselves for the league, will not play when hurt, will have less interest in education, and might not care that much about actually winning. Who cares, three years and out! Then you'll have the kids on the team who actually care about school and the team, and might even resent the kids who are in the other group. They'll know.
 
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So what if by some miracle during the in homes this week and WHEN he takes his ov (im not believing **** until I see Valentine himself say something) we see many positiives will everybody still believe LSU reporters or will some actually think that he actually will come back to UM?
 
CANE4LIFE said:
TheMatador said:
RiDLer80 said:
You're reading too much into the picture.

However, it is a good thing that he left without committing to them.
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A public commitment means nothing...if there is a deal going down. Why is Genron, the street agent, on the trip? Is he just an altruistic adviser who spends all this time just "advising" and "counseling" and "mentoring" a young man out of the goodness of his heart? What does Genron do for a living? He posts here occasionally, why doesn't he show up now and explain the nature of his livelihood and tell me he's not benefitting somehow from this?

I'm not saying he is doing something shady, but what is his role? Why does he do this? Again, how does he earn his living? Who is he? Does he report all his income to the IRS? Has he been audited? Maybe he should be.

Back in the mid-80's, when Jimmy Johnson was new on the scene, a kid he wanted badly, a track star and football player, was stolen from us at the last minute. I remember the kid, and the school where he ended up. It seemed very clear at the time that something went down to send him to that school. Our athletic director, Sam Jankovich, was seething mad--he made a public statement that the IRS should be auditing the parents of these kids who were apparently pocketing substantial income that was not being reported to the IRS. (I guess the IRS is too busy trying to cripple conservative groups).

And there were a couple of linemen from Illinois that our assistant coach Hubbard Alexander thought we had in the bag--until the Illinois DL coach who was a bagman himself bought the kids. That Illinois coach ended up our DL coach a few years later--irony of it all.

The whole business is dirty and we've been a victim much more than we've benefitted, yet we're the ones who end up punished--maybe because we're amateurs and the other schools are professionally dirty.

Now, I'm not saying this is the case at all with TV, but again, why is Genron on the visit, if indeed he is? Who is he? How does he support himself? What is his role?

Why does any HS player need a Genron?

Let him come back here and post, he can refute anything I'm implying, let him shoot me down.
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Were not the only program that has been caught, Bama has been caught I dont know HOW many times. The difference is, because UM was flashy and so hated nationally, it was much bigger news. Its also made worse because UM is a small private school, where even the local community cannot be counted on to back the program. The local media in So Fla spends more time digging for dirt and trying to make a name for itself trying to stir up "controversy" around UM as it does supporting anything it does. **** most of the alumni are from rival programs in the state.

Bama doesnt have to deal with that in Tuscaloosa, or the entire state for that matter. UT doesnt have to deal with that in Austin. OSU doesnt have to deal with that in Columbus. There, not only is the media totally compliant and supportive of the program, but the entire community bends over backwards to defend and support the program. UM has NO cover if/when things go bad. And it doesnt have the deeply rooted alumni and booster networks that those programs have. In Bama or Texas, all a coach has to do is pick up the phone, and players have no show jobs, players families get hired for jobs, new cars show up, etc. UM doesnt have that. So instead, one little sniveling jock sniffer gets butt hurt and creates a "national scandal" for supposedly buying a few dinners at Benihana and giving a few bucks to some kids playing pool or at a strip club. That kind of sh*t is a DAILY occurence in the $EC. Good buddy of mine who I have worked with for years is a former OL for Bama. He says after the games, he would have pockets STUFFED with envelopes and 100 bills from boosters giving them the post game "hand shakes".
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Agree. We get screwed by the vultures in the local press who would do us in in a heartbeat. A lot of them are UF journalism grads anyway, I guess. And I agree with that about the other communities. One of the schools that got Sam J. so mad was UT. It was a WR/KR from the D.C. area who was stolen. His father was a former NFL star who had fallen on hard financial times. You can easily figure it out. Do I have proof? No. JJ was dumbfounded when we lost the kid at the last minute. The kid himself has long been done with his NFL career. I can't figure out how guys can survive as college coaches. Having to deal with this kind of crap when you're trying to do things honestly would drive me stark raving mad.
 
1jamaicancane said:
So what if by some miracle during the in homes this week and WHEN he takes his ov (im not believing **** until I see Valentine himself say something) we see many positiives will everybody still believe LSU reporters or will some actually think that he actually will come back to UM?
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I'm hoping that this happens, and the kid stays home. I'm worried though, and when I see a street agent not only involved, but going on an OV (if he indeed has) than something makes me very suspicious. Instead of investigating their hometown program, like good reporters should do, the Picayune and other "reporters" are just shills for the hometown program.

Again, why was Genron on the OV if he was indeed there? What is his role? What is his source of income? How does he benefit from his activity?

If he doesn't like UM's staff, why is he so actively involved in trying to get kids to go to a certain school? Does he present himself to the parents of these kids as filling some kind of need?

Why are the kids and their parents so receptive to his involvement? Is it because he has sold them on the idea that he can get them the best possible deal?

You would think the UM staff would know.

Now, this whole thing with Genron might be way overblown. He might indeed be an adviser who truly has the kids' best interests at heart, but why somebody who cannot publicly show any credentials or other qualifications for his role?

Interesting that TV's stepfather, who is Hurlie's buddy, did not go on the trip to Baton Rouge. Maybe there is a good reason, but maybe TV's mom is playing the main role in the process, not the stepfather.

Even if I'm all wet, reading too much into all of this, too suspicious, i'm still left with the questions: who is Genron? Why Genron? What is his role? How does he earn a living? Is he paid for his activity with recruits? What is his interest?
 
TheMatador said:
RiDLer80 said:
You're reading too much into the picture.

However, it is a good thing that he left without committing to them.
Click to expand...

A public commitment means nothing...if there is a deal going down. Why is Genron, the street agent, on the trip? Is he just an altruistic adviser who spends all this time just "advising" and "counseling" and "mentoring" a young man out of the goodness of his heart? What does Genron do for a living? He posts here occasionally, why doesn't he show up now and explain the nature of his livelihood and tell me he's not benefitting somehow from this?

I'm not saying he is doing something shady, but what is his role? Why does he do this? Again, how does he earn his living? Who is he? Does he report all his income to the IRS? Has he been audited? Maybe he should be.

Back in the mid-80's, when Jimmy Johnson was new on the scene, a kid he wanted badly, a track star and football player, was stolen from us at the last minute. I remember the kid, and the school where he ended up. It seemed very clear at the time that something went down to send him to that school. Our athletic director, Sam Jankovich, was seething mad--he made a public statement that the IRS should be auditing the parents of these kids who were apparently pocketing substantial income that was not being reported to the IRS. (I guess the IRS is too busy trying to cripple conservative groups).

And there were a couple of linemen from Illinois that our assistant coach Hubbard Alexander thought we had in the bag--until the Illinois DL coach who was a bagman himself bought the kids. That Illinois coach ended up our DL coach a few years later--irony of it all.

The whole business is dirty and we've been a victim much more than we've benefitted, yet we're the ones who end up punished--maybe because we're amateurs and the other schools are professionally dirty.

Now, I'm not saying this is the case at all with TV, but again, why is Genron on the visit, if indeed he is? Who is he? How does he support himself? What is his role?

Why does any HS player need a Genron?

Let him come back here and post, he can refute anything I'm implying, let him shoot me down.
Click to expand...

When a guy like Genron goes to a place like Baton Rouge, I am interested to know who pays his expenses for such a trip? Does it come out of his pocket or does the LSU pay?
 
cubin10 said:
TheMatador said:
RiDLer80 said:
You're reading too much into the picture.

However, it is a good thing that he left without committing to them.
Click to expand...

A public commitment means nothing...if there is a deal going down. Why is Genron, the street agent, on the trip? Is he just an altruistic adviser who spends all this time just "advising" and "counseling" and "mentoring" a young man out of the goodness of his heart? What does Genron do for a living? He posts here occasionally, why doesn't he show up now and explain the nature of his livelihood and tell me he's not benefitting somehow from this?

I'm not saying he is doing something shady, but what is his role? Why does he do this? Again, how does he earn his living? Who is he? Does he report all his income to the IRS? Has he been audited? Maybe he should be.

Back in the mid-80's, when Jimmy Johnson was new on the scene, a kid he wanted badly, a track star and football player, was stolen from us at the last minute. I remember the kid, and the school where he ended up. It seemed very clear at the time that something went down to send him to that school. Our athletic director, Sam Jankovich, was seething mad--he made a public statement that the IRS should be auditing the parents of these kids who were apparently pocketing substantial income that was not being reported to the IRS. (I guess the IRS is too busy trying to cripple conservative groups).

And there were a couple of linemen from Illinois that our assistant coach Hubbard Alexander thought we had in the bag--until the Illinois DL coach who was a bagman himself bought the kids. That Illinois coach ended up our DL coach a few years later--irony of it all.

The whole business is dirty and we've been a victim much more than we've benefitted, yet we're the ones who end up punished--maybe because we're amateurs and the other schools are professionally dirty.

Now, I'm not saying this is the case at all with TV, but again, why is Genron on the visit, if indeed he is? Who is he? How does he support himself? What is his role?

Why does any HS player need a Genron?

Let him come back here and post, he can refute anything I'm implying, let him shoot me down.
Click to expand...

When a guy like Genron goes to a place like Baton Rouge, I am interested to know who pays his expenses for such a trip? Does it come out of his pocket or does the LSU pay?
Click to expand...

He would have to pay for it himself.

I went to Oklahoma with a player of mine and they mailed me a bill. If I didn't pay it would have been an NCAA violation on their part.
 
hollyhood27 said:
cubin10 said:
TheMatador said:
RiDLer80 said:
You're reading too much into the picture.

However, it is a good thing that he left without committing to them.
Click to expand...

A public commitment means nothing...if there is a deal going down. Why is Genron, the street agent, on the trip? Is he just an altruistic adviser who spends all this time just "advising" and "counseling" and "mentoring" a young man out of the goodness of his heart? What does Genron do for a living? He posts here occasionally, why doesn't he show up now and explain the nature of his livelihood and tell me he's not benefitting somehow from this?

I'm not saying he is doing something shady, but what is his role? Why does he do this? Again, how does he earn his living? Who is he? Does he report all his income to the IRS? Has he been audited? Maybe he should be.

Back in the mid-80's, when Jimmy Johnson was new on the scene, a kid he wanted badly, a track star and football player, was stolen from us at the last minute. I remember the kid, and the school where he ended up. It seemed very clear at the time that something went down to send him to that school. Our athletic director, Sam Jankovich, was seething mad--he made a public statement that the IRS should be auditing the parents of these kids who were apparently pocketing substantial income that was not being reported to the IRS. (I guess the IRS is too busy trying to cripple conservative groups).

And there were a couple of linemen from Illinois that our assistant coach Hubbard Alexander thought we had in the bag--until the Illinois DL coach who was a bagman himself bought the kids. That Illinois coach ended up our DL coach a few years later--irony of it all.

The whole business is dirty and we've been a victim much more than we've benefitted, yet we're the ones who end up punished--maybe because we're amateurs and the other schools are professionally dirty.

Now, I'm not saying this is the case at all with TV, but again, why is Genron on the visit, if indeed he is? Who is he? How does he support himself? What is his role?

Why does any HS player need a Genron?

Let him come back here and post, he can refute anything I'm implying, let him shoot me down.
Click to expand...

When a guy like Genron goes to a place like Baton Rouge, I am interested to know who pays his expenses for such a trip? Does it come out of his pocket or does the LSU pay?
Click to expand...

He would have to pay for it himself.

I went to Oklahoma with a player of mine and they mailed me a bill. If I didn't pay it would have been an NCAA violation on their part.
Click to expand...

So Genron supposedly paid his own way out of the goodness of his heart, seems very sketchy without considering some form of remuneration or income.
 
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Put 2 and 2 together folks.. This **** ain't rocket science. Genron accompanying TV and his mother on the OV... Bright as day he is the middle man. SoFla recruiting is most currupt it's been in years. This won't change anytime soon.
 
Valentine has been vocal since the VT game about our defense. It's not a fit for him and we retained the DC.

We lost him. Golden lost him because the kid saw the defense he'd be playing in and didn't want to be here, stop crying about people getting paid for once.
 
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Our defense doesnt help and Golden talking with PSU gave him a perfect way to back his third pledge to a school. Then you add in that pathetic, jock sniffing excuse for a man Genron to the mix he gone. Genron is just pimping out these kids to any school willing to pay for his own gain.
 
WhatTheHell said:
Valentine has been vocal since the VT game about our defense. It's not a fit for him and we retained the DC.

We lost him. Act like men and stop crying about people getting paid for once.
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This. If LSU is paying him, them I am happy as **** for him. The slavery NCAA system is a sess pool, and anything the kids can get out of it, more power to him. I just wish we had more money to play the game. (and I ain't hearing they get a free tuition crap, these kids make the corrupt system billions and don't get **** in return comparable).
 
So not only is the defensive scheme costing us games, its costing us from getting big time players... fml
 
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