Coaching v Talent

[90scane]

LSU says hello? Dude. Lol. Don’t be that guy, bro. Orgeron is 45-15 in his 5 going on 6 yrs there & just won a Nat’l championship 1.1 yrs ago!

Did u forget the lesser talented UNC team just ran for a record against us, and played in a NY6 bowl game last season?

Since I’ve never seen u post, I’ll say this same thing I’ve been saying since, chit, since 2013:

How is that for 12 yrs, **** near every 4 & 5 star player that come here is an underachiever/bust, yet at other places they thrive? It’s almost impossible & inconceivable for **** near every recruiting services to be wrong about the rankings of majority of just “our” players, but correct on their ranking on majority of the other teams players….not for 12 yrs.

I have my money on LSU firing Ed O. Ed O had his run and it was a good one. LSU has no problem firing him if he doesn't produce and another 500 season after 5-5 in 2020 won't cut it.

Mack Brown was similar to Miami with CMR. Good for a boost but Mack is OLD. They also were even more talented in '20 than '21 with 4 NFL skills guys while we didn't have as many blue-chip kids. Don't get me wrong- it was an ugly loss and we seem to continue to have the same issue of DE not eating the pulling guard to set the edge.

I don't disagree that Miami has underperformed and coaching is a major part of it. I'd just put talent evaluation in the mix as well which falls on the coaches. You can't take 5.0 40 times at Safety and expect to perform well no matter how good the scheme. The other point, we have a ton of blue-chippers that aren't playing which is 100% on the coaches for either not evaluating correctly OR developing them.

 

[CBurrr93]

I didn't know that. It's better he did that than the coaches.

Shouldn’t even be a run read on 3rd and 7. I don’t care. It shouldn’t be an option.

 

[supacane]

I have my money on LSU firing Ed O. Ed O had his run and it was a good one. LSU has no problem firing him if he doesn't produce and another 500 season after 5-5 in 2020 won't cut it.

Mack Brown was similar to Miami with CMR. Good for a boost but Mack is OLD. They also were even more talented in '20 than '21 with 4 NFL skills guys while we didn't have as many blue-chip kids. Don't get me wrong- it was an ugly loss and we seem to continue to have the same issue of DE not eating the pulling guard to set the edge.

I don't disagree that Miami has underperformed and coaching is a major part of it. I'd just put talent evaluation in the mix as well which falls on the coaches. You can't take 5.0 40 times at Safety and expect to perform well no matter how good the scheme. The other point, we have a ton of blue-chippers that aren't playing which is 100% on the coaches for either not evaluating correctly OR developing them.

Your tactic is to brush a side coaching issue then proceed to talk about Talent. Cut thw ****ry. We outclass UNC on the field. Their players performing and becomong NFL players were a result of coaching not them recruiting like Bama. Our #1 problem has been coaching. It's not the only problem, but it is the main problem.

 

[90scane]

Your tactic is to brush a side coaching issue then proceed to talk about Talent. Cut thw ****ry. We outclass UNC on the field. Their players performing and becomong NFL players were a result of coaching not them recruiting like Bama.

I've said that the coaching has been an issue. We don't outclass UNC like Bama outclasses Miami. Miami also replaced most of the defensive staff so I'd rather give them a chance to turn this around. It is also year 2 of the offensive staff. I don't understand the benefit of ****ting on our staff in week 2 when we really don't know if we are going to have a real chance vs Clemson or drop 5 games.

 

[supacane]

I've said that the coaching has been an issue. We don't outclass UNC like Bama outclasses Miami. Miami also replaced most of the defensive staff so I'd rather give them a chance to turn this around. It is also year 2 of the offensive staff. I don't understand the benefit of ****ting on our staff in week 2 when we really don't know if we are going to have a real chance vs Clemson or drop 5 games.

Manny Diaz has been at Miami for 6 years now. Take the excuse for the offense. I will give you that. We have 5th year guys who cant tackle and he had 2 4 year starters give him time to build up the LB position, look at the state of it and look at the recruitment now. Yall crying about we small there, now we have a 5'11 project for Texas as our only commit there. Defense doesnt take 6 years to fix. As Golden players left, the D got worse. And Btw, last time we played UNC 62-24 at home. Explain that ****

 

[Rellyrell]

I have my money on LSU firing Ed O. Ed O had his run and it was a good one. LSU has no problem firing him if he doesn't produce and another 500 season after 5-5 in 2020 won't cut it.

Mack Brown was similar to Miami with CMR. Good for a boost but Mack is OLD. They also were even more talented in '20 than '21 with 4 NFL skills guys while we didn't have as many blue-chip kids. Don't get me wrong- it was an ugly loss and we seem to continue to have the same issue of DE not eating the pulling guard to set the edge.

I don't disagree that Miami has underperformed and coaching is a major part of it. I'd just put talent evaluation in the mix as well which falls on the coaches. You can't take 5.0 40 times at Safety and expect to perform well no matter how good the scheme. The other point, we have a ton of blue-chippers that aren't playing which is 100% on the coaches for either not evaluating correctly OR developing them.

I, too, have Ed being fired, but I don’t think it has anything to do w/ on field results vs the absolute chit show LSU have been off the field. So if he don’t win “big” this season, like 11 wins big, which I don’t think they remotely come close to, he’s gone. He would’ve been gone last season if not for Covid from what I understood. A lot of recklessness allowed to go on.

Regarding talent evaluation, I definitely agree w/ u. However, sometimes talent evaluation is also a byproduct of scheme & fit. I’ve asked the ? before, what is our identity? For instance, when Golden was here, he recruited TFL/sack type DEs & DTs here to play, but then he fattened them up so they could hold the line. He brought in bump & run corners, just to play them 10 yards off the WR.

Richt wanted to run a UGA type of offense, but the OLs recruited were not trench bullies.

Diaz wants to run an aggressive defense, yet the LBs he recruits either had their hands in the ground to rush, are former Safeties, or simply too small.

All that plays a role, so for us us, it’s a chicken or the egg situation. Are we lacking talent b/c of coaching or is our coaching suspect b/c of the lack of talent? Due to the player ratings, combined with the pedigree of 4 of the last 5 coaches, I’m going to opt for the former & not the latter. It’s no wonder that the 1 coach that had even a little cache to his name had the most success w/ a 3 yr window for us (w/ the same talent) that 3 of the last four had combined.

 

[90scane]

Manny Diaz has been at Miami for 6 years now. Take the excuse for the offense. I will give you that. We have 5th year guys who cant tackle and he had 2 4 year starters give him time to build up the LB position, look at the state of it and look at the recruitment now. Yall crying about we small there, now we have a 5'11 project for Texas as our only commit there. Defense doesnt take 6 years to fix. As Golden players left, the D got worse. And Btw, last time we played UNC 62-24 at home. Explain that ****

There is no way to explain or excuse Miami for UNC. Two NFL edge guys decided to not set the edge (some plays) and when they did our SLOW AS F linebackers couldn't get to the RBs to make tackles OR they simply missed tackles. We could rehash that game but what is the point?

Again, we are in week 2 and Miami has more talent than everyone on the schedule except Clemson. Even the numbers for Clemson are nowhere near Bama which is why I posted them. It doesn't have to be an all or nothing. We have 2 coaches that have been on the staff since 2019! The rest are new along with a large percentage of the blue-chippers being new. I'm willing to give Manny the rest of the year to get those blue-chippers deployed(on the field) before I call for his head. Talent wins games especially top 300 kids. Miami is landing more top 300 kids than almost every program in the ACC sans Clemson. We are closing the gap on Clemson SO at worst we hand off a talented team to another coach. The other issue, we know Miami isn't willing to pay for an $8M/yr coach so we are going to land another coach that could hit or miss. You are also talking out of both sides: Manny had a good D with below-average Golden talent so he clearly can coach. Thus back to the Eval side of finding the right talent to fit your scheme.

 

[Gsugradcanefan]

Tulane lost to OU by 5 only points, Minnesota put up a fight against Ohio State. An FCS team beat the University of Washington, a team expected to compete for a Pac-12 title. Tell me all about those schools and how many resources they allocate to football.

 

[90scane]

I, too, have Ed being fired, but I don’t think it has anything to do w/ on field results vs the absolute chit show LSU have been off the field. So if he don’t win “big” this season, like 11 wins big, which I don’t think they remotely come close to, he’s gone. He would’ve been gone last season if not for Covid from what I understood. A lot of recklessness allowed to go on.

Regarding talent evaluation, I definitely agree w/ u. However, sometimes talent evaluation is also a byproduct of scheme & fit. I’ve asked the ? before, what is our identity? For instance, when Golden was here, he recruited TFL/sack type DEs & DTs here to play, but then he fattened them up so they could hold the line. He brought in bump & run corners, just to play them 10 yards off the WR.

Richt wanted to run a UGA type of offense, but the OLs recruited were not trench bullies.

Diaz wants to run an aggressive defense, yet the LBs he recruits either had their hands in the ground to rush, are former Safeties, or simply too small.

All that plays a role, so for us us, it’s a chicken or the egg situation. Are we lacking talent b/c of coaching or is our coaching suspect b/c of the lack of talent? Due to the player ratings, combined with the pedigree of 4 of the last 5 coaches, I’m going to opt for the former & not the latter. It’s no wonder that the 1 coach that had even a little cache to his name had the most success w/ a 3 yr window for us (w/ the same talent) that 3 of the last four had combined.

I actually consider scheme & fit is a massive part of talent evaluation. How can Manny's D be top 10 with Golden's non-blue chip kids? Golden's staff evaluated differently and they didn't always suck at finding good kids (sans the 5.0 40 safety HAHA). Golden's staff was beyond bad at deploying the talent! LBers 7 yards deep on goal line. 3/4 OLBs asked to add 40-50lbs to play DE.

Miami has a ton of talent! Why doesn't it show up on Saturdays? One of the bigger reasons: 14 of the 46 blue-chippers are true freshmen. We replaced 2 NFL guys along with 2 transfers (Tate/Christian Williams). We also added 2 transfer blue-chippers. Net Net +14 from 2020. That is after adding 10 from 2019 and those 10 have produced 1 starter (Rivers) with more expected to start (Chaney, Chantz, Tae) with some others on the 2-deep (Rooster, TVD, Redding, Dunson). over 50% of the blue-chip kids have been on-campus for around 18 months or less. I'd much rather know that '22 brings in another 15 4-5* kids than hitting the reboot button. Why? Even at 50% hit/miss, Manny has shown he can take Al Golden recruits and produce a top 10 D. The bigger question, is Lashlee+King good enough to score points vs UNC, FSU, Clemson,+Bowl Game.

 

[supacane]

There is no way to explain or excuse Miami for UNC. Two NFL edge guys decided to not set the edge (some plays) and when they did our SLOW AS F linebackers couldn't get to the RBs to make tackles OR they simply missed tackles. We could rehash that game but what is the point?

Again, we are in week 2 and Miami has more talent than everyone on the schedule except Clemson. Even the numbers for Clemson are nowhere near Bama which is why I posted them. It doesn't have to be an all or nothing. We have 2 coaches that have been on the staff since 2019! The rest are new along with a large percentage of the blue-chippers being new. I'm willing to give Manny the rest of the year to get those blue-chippers deployed(on the field) before I call for his head. Talent wins games especially top 300 kids. Miami is landing more top 300 kids than almost every program in the ACC sans Clemson. We are closing the gap on Clemson SO at worst we hand off a talented team to another coach. The other issue, we know Miami isn't willing to pay for an $8M/yr coach so we are going to land another coach that could hit or miss. You are also talking out of both sides: Manny had a good D with below-average Golden talent so he clearly can coach. Thus back to the Eval side of finding the right talent to fit your scheme.

No Golden has good players that were properly coached fundamentally. Playing in a passive scheme. Now here is how u people speak out of both sides of your mouth and don't realize the crap you saying. You are saying oh we need to close talent gap blah blah right? Then i ask you to explain the UNC game, your answer, OUR NFL ENDS DECIDED not to set the edges. Yep they decided not to set the edge to a tune of 62 points. You man are absolutely hopeless i swear. No wonder americans keep voting for the same scammers who rob them blind.

Btw get rid of that you need 8M a year for coach. There are plenty of coaches who will do a better job than Diaz. We laugh at Norvell and that dude use a dud QB and beat UNC, yes the same UNC that assualted us at home to the point where Dade police almost arrested them. And new season gave ND all they could handle. Norvell is not making 8M a year. Thats the same zero sum stuff u claim people are doing. Diaz has been here for 6 years, i dont care how many coaches been here. He has been the constant which means the D should be constant. Fraud alert is what Diaz is on.

 

[90scane]

No Golden has good players that were properly coached fundamentally. Playing in a passive scheme. Now here is how u people speak out of both sides of your mouth and don't realize the crap you saying. You are saying oh we need to close talent gap blah blah right? Then i ask you to explain the UNC game, your answer, OUR NFL ENDS DECIDED not to set the edges. Yep they decided not to set the edge to a tune of 62 points. You man are absolutely hopeless i swear. No wonder americans keep voting for the same scammers who rob them blind.

Btw get rid of that you need 8M a year for coach. There are plenty of coaches who will do a better job than Diaz. We laugh at Norvell and that dude use a dud QB and beat UNC, yes the same UNC that assualted us at home to the point where Dade police almost arrested them. And new season gave ND all they could handle. Norvell is not making 8M a year. Thats the same zero sum stuff u claim people are doing. Diaz has been here for 6 years, i dont care how many coaches been here. He has been the constant which means the D should be constant. Fraud alert is what Diaz is on.

Oh you mean the same norvell that was beat into 2019 by Miami?

I also said it was the slow *** LBers and not tackling.

it takes both: talent and coaching. The data above validates it: who has won the nattys! The teams with the most talent. Yes, they also have good coaches. Coaching only gets you so far. Talent only gets you so far.

 

[supacane]

Oh you mean the same norvell that was beat into 2019 by Miami?

I also said it was the slow *** LBers and not tackling.

it takes both: talent and coaching. The data above validates it: who has won the nattys! The teams with the most talent. Yes, they also have good coaches. Coaching only gets you so far. Talent only gets you so far.

You dont get from not being competitive to winning national titles. Can he get competitive that's the question. Do you need NFL talent to get competitive? If so, you are trash. Also norvell losing to us shows that he can raise the play level but they can also drop. The man was there for 1 year, not Diaz who been there for 6. You talking **** about him and blowing Diaz, not a single signature win. Not even a signature competitive game. And we shall not talk about losing to a UNC team that was 2-10 the year before. Whats the excuse there. Tell us MR all we need to do is wait 6 more yeard to find good players

 

[90scane]

You dont get from not being competitive to winning national titles. Can he get competitive that's the question. Do you need NFL talent to get competitive? If so, you are trash. Also norvell losing to us shows that he can raise the play level but they can also drop. The man was there for 1 year, not Diaz who been there for 6. You talking **** about him and blowing Diaz, not a single signature win. Not even a signature competitive game. And we shall not talk about losing to a UNC team that was 2-10 the year before. Whats the excuse there. Tell us MR all we need to do is wait 6 more yeard to find good players

I get it. You want Manny fired today because he lost to Bama, OkSt, UNC. Now come back to earth and realize we are in week 2. He isn't getting fired over Bama and 2021's team isn't the same as 2020's. Furthermore, the Miami BOT isn't going to fire Manny in year 3 of a 5 year deal so you better get on-board with Manny being here in '22 and likely '23. Thus, **** on him all you want OR become an FSU fan. All this talk is just internet BS. We can find the best coach in the world but the BOT are the guys writing the checks.

If you want to discuss how Manny doesn't deploy talent correctly, be my guest! If you want to discuss how Manny misses on evals, be my guest! If you want to just **** on Manny and talk up Norvell, the FSU board is at a different URL.

 

[Heart of The Playmaker]

L-M-A-O

The funniest chit on this board going, u believing the bull chit u post. Lol.

So let me understand:

B/c we don’t have the “resources” that’s why we couldn’t beat FIU or La Tech in 2019? That’s why our 4 & 5 star Top247 ranked players allowed the most rushing yards in a single game last season? B/c we’re broke, that’s why we allowed a team full of 2 and 3 stars race out to a 28-0 lead against us?

Wait, wait…so b/c of lack of resources & finances, we were forced to spend $4m to pay Temple a buyout fee for Diaz?? Lol.

So let me get this straight, so b/c of resources, it tied our hands to do a coaching search after Richt gave us a blank check???!

LMAO, so U’re telling me, the reason y we got smoked 48-0 at our house was b/c Shannon’s 1st round picks couldn’t compete w/ UVA’s future grocery & shoe salesmen?? So we can’t win a DIVISION full of UDFAs on majority of our opponent’s roster, b/c everyone’s No star & 2 star players are better than our 4 & 5 star player b/c, wait for it, they play for a school w/ better resources??

MAN-O-MAN, where were u at when Bobby Bowden needed the goal post to move on all them wide rights? Lol.

I learned something new today, and I thank u for it; here it was I thought we had a global warming issue due to over utilizing earth’s natural resources. Nope, I realize it’s all the hot gas coming out ur *** to defend this school’s incompetency due to lack of resources. Lol.

This was literally Cis version of...Ether. Nas would be proud.
Savagely correct

 

[supacane]

I get it. You want Manny fired today because he lost to Bama, OkSt, UNC. Now come back to earth and realize we are in week 2. He isn't getting fired over Bama and 2021's team isn't the same as 2020's. Furthermore, the Miami BOT isn't going to fire Manny in year 3 of a 5 year deal so you better get on-board with Manny being here in '22 and likely '23. Thus, **** on him all you want OR become an FSU fan. All this talk is just internet BS. We can find the best coach in the world but the BOT are the guys writing the checks.

If you want to discuss how Manny doesn't deploy talent correctly, be my guest! If you want to discuss how Manny misses on evals, be my guest! If you want to just **** on Manny and talk up Norvell, the FSU board is at a different URL.

Don't be telling me about not bot and all that nonsense. You don’t only fight fights you are gonna win. You saying its all about talent and resources mean we should fire Diaz because we are never getting Texas or SEC money so why exactly should we believe Diaz can make this team into a winner? We lose to teams that are better and teams that are worse. Make all the excuse u want about Bama and Clemson, u cannot mske any excuse about the other losses. Thats why u cant convince elite talent from home to come help you.

Alot of you dont remember Nebraska, we beat them for our last national title, they were elite.... and they got alot of money u claim the lack of is holding us back. Not 1 of the top players from the state of Nebraska us committed or considering them. Holding on to terrible coaches gets your program to that level. No high school kid remembers Miami or Nebraska being good. We are heading to Nebraska without the money. Yall are telling us to be ok with that

 

[90scane]

Don't be telling me about not bot and all that nonsense. You don’t only fight fights you are gonna win. You saying its all about talent and resources mean we should fire Diaz because we are never getting Texas or SEC money so why exactly should we believe Diaz can make this team into a winner? We lose to teams that are better and teams that are worse. Make all the excuse u want about Bama and Clemson, u cannot mske any excuse about the other losses. Thats why u cant convince elite talent from home to come help you.

Alot of you dont remember Nebraska, we beat them for our last national title, they were elite.... and they got alot of money u claim the lack of is holding us back. Not 1 of the top players from the state of Nebraska us committed or considering them. Holding on to terrible coaches gets your program to that level. No high school kid remembers Miami or Nebraska being good. We are heading to Nebraska without the money. Yall are telling us to be ok with that

I'm not seeing a ton of people saying "be ok with losing." There may be a few Manny slirpers but most of the posters are not happy with the coaching. They are also realistic about the position Miami is in. Miami has landed two good classes. Miami is 0-1 vs #1 with 11 more games to play. All the complaining isn't going to change what happens tomorrow evening. Miami could go 9-3/10-2, sign another top class, see flashes, maybe even beat another ranked team... They could also have the wheels fall off forcing the AD or BOT to take action.

 

[supacane]

I'm not seeing a ton of people saying "be ok with losing." There may be a few Manny slirpers but most of the posters are not happy with the coaching. They are also realistic about the position Miami is in. Miami has landed two good classes. Miami is 0-1 vs #1 with 11 more games to play. All the complaining isn't going to change what happens tomorrow evening. Miami could go 9-3/10-2, sign another top class, see flashes, maybe even beat another ranked team... They could also have the wheels fall off forcing the AD or BOT to take action.

Thats exactly what you are saying when you keep making excuse for everything and blaming everyone else except Diaz. At no point have i ever heard you said, this is on Diaz. Always someone else fault. Just like Golden

 

[Rellyrell]

In a min after I work out, I’m going to do a history of recruiting from the ACC Coastal over a 4 yr period per class (Fresh, Soph, Jr, Sr) to where we’ve been.

It won’t be 100% accurate as some kids did transfer or move on early before their Sr yr, but it’ll give a general premise to see if it’s truly talent or coaching.

 

[90scane]

Thats exactly what you are saying when you keep making excuse for everything and blaming everyone else except Diaz. At no point have i ever heard you said, this is on Diaz. Always someone else fault. Just like Golden

The second time I'll say this in this thread:

I've said that the coaching has been an issue.

I don't disagree that Miami has underperformed and coaching is a major part of it.


Either you missed those comments or are ignoring him.

 

[90scane]

In a min after I work out, I’m going to do a history of recruiting from the ACC Coastal over a 4 yr period per class (Fresh, Soph, Jr, Sr) to where we’ve been.

It won’t be 100% accurate as some kids did transfer or move on early before their Sr yr, but it’ll give a general premise to see if it’s truly talent or coaching.

I was trying to provide some data to discuss. I have no dog in the fight outside of wanting Miami to win more. The last time I knew a coach or player personally was in the 90s.

Just looking at Miami from our lens doesn't provide us answers without looking at other schools.

Since UNC is considered a contender for the coastal and beat the doors off Manny the last two years:

UNC -
29 blue chippers 2021

2020 -
Key Losses: 5 NFL guys, 1 was 4*, 2 4* transfers (QB, OL) = -3
Key Additions: 4* RB transfer in, 11 4* 2021 kids, 1 5* 2021 kid = +13

29-10 = 19 blue chippers for 2020 UNC