Beckham, Shalala discuss partnering on stadium

[SFbayCane]

Heel,
Its a tough pill for folks to swallow. Donna has a long history of style of substance dating back to her time at Wisconsin. She has consistently failed to deal with the stadium issue. Couple that with her oversight of the decline of UM football and folks are naturally going to be of the opinion that she is only pursuing this for personal reasons.

Lets also note her (reported) objection to al golden's termination because of the timing of leadership change and you SHOULD be able to understand the fan base's disbelief in her motives. Yes??

Oh, I totally agree that the crapstorm that has been UM football over the last decade-plus makes it easy to blame Shalala. My point is--and always has been--that what's easy ain't always right. When you actually examine the timeline, it doesn't make sense to claim that she's only just now getting interested in the stadium situation to put a feather in her own cap.

I'm not aware of her (reported) objection to the Golden firing. Who was it reported by?

I do not share the portion of your opinion in bold. Her accelerated interest now leads me to believe its primarily because she is trying to put a band aid on a weak link in her legacy.

This is also a somewhat unsubstantiated opinion on my part but I never felt like she negotiated aggressively when the OB-Marlins boondoggle was going down. I think she always felt like Joe Robbie Stadium (the only name I accept ) was a suitable fallback plan, so she gave a cursory effort to have the OB renovated but was content with her C+ effort. Remember, a big issue was the ACC mandate of X number of sky boxes for the tobacco road elites to watch games without having to come in contact with the proletariat fans. IIRC, that added a significant cost to the OB renovation price tag that hurt any potential deal. The ACC overlords probably liked the idea of the Canes moving to Joe Robbie.

All that said, I do agree that the OB was nearing end of life and probably wasnt doable without a near total rebuild. Im just not about to give that mini-marxist troll any latitude. lol (old man yelling at clouds!!!)

 

[cane since birth]

You really think she gives a **** if people think she cares? You guys truly underestimate her and the politics involved with major land/stadium deals in municipalities. Would you rather have 1/4 to 1/2 billion dollar land and stadium deal on your resume or bunch of thanks yous from a thankless fanbase. She's out for herself no doubt but this time we could benefit from it.

well im saying that too in the other thread, this is a personal move on her part it has nothing to do with the fans or the school thats my point

Pretty clear that you'd blame her either way. If she does nothing, then you can complain that she hates UM. If she tries to get with Beckham now, you can complain that she's only doing it for her legacy and doesn't care about UM.

Whatever, man. Like I said, it's clear that she and UM have been interested in the Beckham thing and have had talks with his group dating back to early 2014. This ain't something she decided to pursue just now.

Im not blaming anything im just stating what it is, since she has been here the program has went to crap, she messed up with the whole U health stuff, they had "talks" but it never mounted to anything till now, come on man look at what this is it is a image move for her, something to put on her resume, why didnt she heavily pushed this back then? Now she cares about the stadium thing? come on man

Dude, again, you're just ignoring the facts.

They had initial talks (and admitted that publicly) back in 2014.

They couldn't "mount" anything further because Beckham and MLS didn't know whether they were actually going to do anything in Miami. The city was pushing them away from the areas that they wanted, and they were fielding offers from other cities.

At that point, it's not UM's decision to make. They have to wait until Beckham decides which way he's going to go. And they've obviously been in constant contact with Beckham's people.

Im not ignoring anything your just blind to see it, with all that pushing and such she was never around now she all of a sudden is and why is that? Because she wants to do one last thing to put on her crappy legacy/resume

 

[cane since birth]

Heel,
Its a tough pill for folks to swallow. Donna has a long history of style of substance dating back to her time at Wisconsin. She has consistently failed to deal with the stadium issue. Couple that with her oversight of the decline of UM football and folks are naturally going to be of the opinion that she is only pursuing this for personal reasons.

Lets also note her (reported) objection to al golden's termination because of the timing of leadership change and you SHOULD be able to understand the fan base's disbelief in her motives. Yes??

Oh, I totally agree that the crapstorm that has been UM football over the last decade-plus makes it easy to blame Shalala. My point is--and always has been--that what's easy ain't always right. When you actually examine the timeline, it doesn't make sense to claim that she's only just now getting interested in the stadium situation to put a feather in her own cap.

I'm not aware of her (reported) objection to the Golden firing. Who was it reported by?

I do not share the portion of your opinion in bold. Her accelerated interest now leads me to believe its primarily because she is trying to put a band aid on a weak link in her legacy.

This is also a somewhat unsubstantiated opinion on my part but I never felt like she negotiated aggressively when the OB-Marlins boondoggle was going down. I think she always felt like Joe Robbie Stadium (the only name I accept ) was a suitable fallback plan, so she gave a cursory effort to have the OB renovated but was content with her C+ effort. Remember, a big issue was the ACC mandate of X number of sky boxes for the tobacco road elites to watch games without having to come in contact with the proletariat fans. IIRC, that added a significant cost to the OB renovation price tag that hurt any potential deal. The ACC overlords probably liked the idea of the Canes moving to Joe Robbie.

All that said, I do agree that the OB was nearing end of life and probably wasnt doable without a near total rebuild. Im just not about to give that mini-marxist troll any latitude. lol (old man yelling at clouds!!!)

This right here, if she was doing this years ago i would have no problem with it but since shes doing it now its making me question her intentions

 

[CaneInHeelCountry]

Heel,
Its a tough pill for folks to swallow. Donna has a long history of style of substance dating back to her time at Wisconsin. She has consistently failed to deal with the stadium issue. Couple that with her oversight of the decline of UM football and folks are naturally going to be of the opinion that she is only pursuing this for personal reasons.

Lets also note her (reported) objection to al golden's termination because of the timing of leadership change and you SHOULD be able to understand the fan base's disbelief in her motives. Yes??

Oh, I totally agree that the crapstorm that has been UM football over the last decade-plus makes it easy to blame Shalala. My point is--and always has been--that what's easy ain't always right. When you actually examine the timeline, it doesn't make sense to claim that she's only just now getting interested in the stadium situation to put a feather in her own cap.

I'm not aware of her (reported) objection to the Golden firing. Who was it reported by?

I do not share the portion of your opinion in bold. Her accelerated interest now leads me to believe its primarily because she is trying to put a band aid on a weak link in her legacy.

This is also a somewhat unsubstantiated opinion on my part but I never felt like she negotiated aggressively when the OB-Marlins boondoggle was going down. I think she always felt like Joe Robbie Stadium (the only name I accept ) was a suitable fallback plan, so she gave a cursory effort to have the OB renovated but was content with her C+ effort. Remember, a big issue was the ACC mandate of X number of sky boxes for the tobacco road elites to watch games without having to come in contact with the proletariat fans. IIRC, that added a significant cost to the OB renovation price tag that hurt any potential deal. The ACC overlords probably liked the idea of the Canes moving to Joe Robbie.

All that said, I do agree that the OB was nearing end of life and probably wasnt doable without a near total rebuild. Im just not about to give that mini-marxist troll any latitude. lol (old man yelling at clouds!!!)

I think the reason for any perceived "acceleration" in her interest is likely due to the fact that a deal seems more doable now than it was a year ago. There were a lot of hurdles then, and there are still some hurdles left, to be sure...but it seems like things might be coming together. That's enough reason for a spike in enthusiasm and interest.

I also think we'll never agree on this one, but appreciate your comments, mini-marxist notwithstanding, heh.

 

[SFbayCane]

I also think we'll never agree on this one, but appreciate your comments, mini-marxist notwithstanding, heh.

Indeed. Good conversation. You present the U's point of view well here. Thank you for that.

And I should not have used the word "mini"...

















As she is a maxi-marxist. :hunt_dog_lol:

 

[Republicane]

If we want 40k seats, and MLS wants 25k, I don't see why we could not build a 30k stadium with the option to add on an extra 10k for big games like Florida State. Miami does not need anything bigger than 40k, and soccer stadiums are built close to the field, meaning the atmosphere at those games would be crazy. It would be loud as ****, and it would look a lot better if we sold out every game, instead of 40 thousand seats being empty on national television.

The seats in soccer stadiums are built close to the soccer field. As a football field isn't nearly as wide, you're still going to end up with this no matter how close they build them:

Playing in a stadium that seats 30k also robs you of the other 42k seats that you can sell tickets for at SLS, and the revenue created from concessions, parking, merchandise etc (besides the ticket revenue that you get even if they don't show up) UM's football program is currently on life support and moving to some FCSesque stadium will be the death knell.

 

[hickory70]

I really don`t care what her intentions are as long as it gets done.

 

[BigDikCane]

Ill **** on that lil thot grave

 

[thinkkaz]

Heel,
Its a tough pill for folks to swallow. Donna has a long history of style of substance dating back to her time at Wisconsin. She has consistently failed to deal with the stadium issue. Couple that with her oversight of the decline of UM football and folks are naturally going to be of the opinion that she is only pursuing this for personal reasons.

Lets also note her (reported) objection to al golden's termination because of the timing of leadership change and you SHOULD be able to understand the fan base's disbelief in her motives. Yes??

Oh, I totally agree that the crapstorm that has been UM football over the last decade-plus makes it easy to blame Shalala. My point is--and always has been--that what's easy ain't always right. When you actually examine the timeline, it doesn't make sense to claim that she's only just now getting interested in the stadium situation to put a feather in her own cap.

I'm not aware of her (reported) objection to the Golden firing. Who was it reported by?

I do not share the portion of your opinion in bold. Her accelerated interest now leads me to believe its primarily because she is trying to put a band aid on a weak link in her legacy.

This is also a somewhat unsubstantiated opinion on my part but I never felt like she negotiated aggressively when the OB-Marlins boondoggle was going down. I think she always felt like Joe Robbie Stadium (the only name I accept ) was a suitable fallback plan, so she gave a cursory effort to have the OB renovated but was content with her C+ effort. Remember, a big issue was the ACC mandate of X number of sky boxes for the tobacco road elites to watch games without having to come in contact with the proletariat fans. IIRC, that added a significant cost to the OB renovation price tag that hurt any potential deal. The ACC overlords probably liked the idea of the Canes moving to Joe Robbie.

All that said, I do agree that the OB was nearing end of life and probably wasnt doable without a near total rebuild. Im just not about to give that mini-marxist troll any latitude. lol (old man yelling at clouds!!!)

You're "accelerated timeline" comment just doesn't work when it's the other parties who are now advancing timelines. The MLC & DB's group are the one's who have to move forward more quickly. The school is at the mercy of advancing talks as those two parties move forward at their pace. Very simple.

 

[CaneInHeelCountry]

Republicane...

My understanding is that a soccer pitch is about 20 yds wider than a football field. 10 yds on each side.

If a soccer pitch doesn't require much of a sideline at all (you note that many soccer stadiums are build nearly up to the sidelines), wouldn't that extra 10 yds on each side be accommodated for by the fact that football requires deep sidelines?

The sidelines at SLS are too deep for football, no doubt. But it looks like the stands start a good 15-20 yds from the field. Which is far more than they need to be in order to accommodate soccer and football in a decent set-up. The SLS pic simply isn't representative of "a decent set-up."

 

[Republicane]

Republicane...

My understanding is that a soccer pitch is about 20 yds wider than a football field. 10 yds on each side.

If a soccer pitch doesn't require much of a sideline at all (you note that many soccer stadiums are build nearly up to the sidelines), wouldn't that extra 10 yds on each side be accommodated for by the fact that football requires deep sidelines?

The sidelines at SLS are too deep for football, no doubt. But it looks like the stands start a good 15-20 yds from the field. Which is far more than they need to be in order to accommodate soccer and football in a decent set-up. The SLS pic simply isn't representative of "a decent set-up."

Soccer fields aren't like football fields where every one is the same size. (We'll ignore Cananda) Your field just has to be within the minimum and maximum dimensions allowed. For domestic club matches, that is determined by the host.

The two goal lines must be between 45 and 90 m (50 and 100 yd) and be the same length.The two touch (side) lines must also be of the same length, and be between 90 and 120 m (100 and 130 yd) in length.

International matches are different though:

For international matches the field dimensions are more tightly constrained; the goal lines must be between 64 and 75 m (70 and 80 yd) long and the touchlines must be between 100 and 110 m (110 and 120 yd).

Presumably Beckham would see the potential for profit in hosting friendlies between Caribbean, Central, and South American teams. Not to mention US matches as well as the possibility for World Cup matches if the US ever gets it again. So the seats would have to be built to allow for a field that's at least 80yd. wide.

 

[pimpcane1]

Republicane...

My understanding is that a soccer pitch is about 20 yds wider than a football field. 10 yds on each side.

If a soccer pitch doesn't require much of a sideline at all (you note that many soccer stadiums are build nearly up to the sidelines), wouldn't that extra 10 yds on each side be accommodated for by the fact that football requires deep sidelines?

The sidelines at SLS are too deep for football, no doubt. But it looks like the stands start a good 15-20 yds from the field. Which is far more than they need to be in order to accommodate soccer and football in a decent set-up. The SLS pic simply isn't representative of "a decent set-up."

Soccer fields aren't like football fields where every one is the same size. (We'll ignore Cananda) Your field just has to be within the minimum and maximum dimensions allowed. For domestic club matches, that is determined by the host.

The two goal lines must be between 45 and 90 m (50 and 100 yd) and be the same length.The two touch (side) lines must also be of the same length, and be between 90 and 120 m (100 and 130 yd) in length.

International matches are different though:

For international matches the field dimensions are more tightly constrained; the goal lines must be between 64 and 75 m (70 and 80 yd) long and the touchlines must be between 100 and 110 m (110 and 120 yd).

Presumably Beckham would see the potential for profit in hosting friendlies between Caribbean, Central, and South American teams. Not to mention US matches as well as the possibility for World Cup matches if the US ever gets it again. So the seats would have to be built to allow for a field that's at least 80yd. wide.

The stands were 30 yards away from the field at SLS (read the consumption and construction sec on the link I provided).

American football fields are 53.3 yds wide so even if you need the field to be 80 yards wide for international soccer play that would still leave 15 yards or so on each side for the sidelines.

SLS new construction just moved the sidelines 24 feet/8 yds closer to the field so it would still be much closer than SLS

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_Life_Stadium

 

[Hurracanes]

For the record, even with the renovations, SLS plans on continuing to host soccer games.

 

[JgDaCane]

meanwhile Al Golden is our coach

 

[Republicane]

Republicane...

My understanding is that a soccer pitch is about 20 yds wider than a football field. 10 yds on each side.

If a soccer pitch doesn't require much of a sideline at all (you note that many soccer stadiums are build nearly up to the sidelines), wouldn't that extra 10 yds on each side be accommodated for by the fact that football requires deep sidelines?

The sidelines at SLS are too deep for football, no doubt. But it looks like the stands start a good 15-20 yds from the field. Which is far more than they need to be in order to accommodate soccer and football in a decent set-up. The SLS pic simply isn't representative of "a decent set-up."

Soccer fields aren't like football fields where every one is the same size. (We'll ignore Cananda) Your field just has to be within the minimum and maximum dimensions allowed. For domestic club matches, that is determined by the host.

The two goal lines must be between 45 and 90 m (50 and 100 yd) and be the same length.The two touch (side) lines must also be of the same length, and be between 90 and 120 m (100 and 130 yd) in length.

International matches are different though:

For international matches the field dimensions are more tightly constrained; the goal lines must be between 64 and 75 m (70 and 80 yd) long and the touchlines must be between 100 and 110 m (110 and 120 yd).

Presumably Beckham would see the potential for profit in hosting friendlies between Caribbean, Central, and South American teams. Not to mention US matches as well as the possibility for World Cup matches if the US ever gets it again. So the seats would have to be built to allow for a field that's at least 80yd. wide.

The stands were 30 yards away from the field at SLS (read the consumption and construction sec on the link I provided).

American football fields are 53.3 yds wide so even if you need the field to be 80 yards wide for international soccer play that would still leave 15 yards or so on each side for the sidelines.

SLS new construction just moved the sidelines 24 feet/8 yds closer to the field so it would still be much closer than SLS

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_Life_Stadium

The field is 80 yards wide yes, but soccer isn't hockey. The size of the playing surface isn't defined by walls and you can't put fans inches away. There will be the sideline, then several feet to the advertising signage that surrounds the field, then a few more yards behind that for photographers, security etc. then the first row of seats. This is the stadium that Columbus built specifically for their MLS franchise.

Their field is 75 yards wide, and their seats are 10 or 11 yards behind that. So they would be about 22 yards away on either side from a football sideline.

My larger point is that nobody should expect the seating to be that much closer to the field just because it's in a purpose built soccer stadium as opposed to SLS. It's the dimensions of the field that necessitate the seats being farther away than people like, not the ill suited stadium.

 

[LuCane]

Lol you're wrong just give it up. What could Donnas career or reputation have to gain from just feigning interest in athletics. She has a lot more to gain if she makes this happen anybody who can see past their dirt driveway knows that.

you kidding me?

why is she doing this now? right before she leaves, shes doing this for her image, shes been blasted by everyone for her lack of help for athletics and even for her U health fiasco, whether we get the stadium or not she can say that she cared, its the timing that gives it away

You really think she gives a **** if people think she cares? You guys truly underestimate her and the politics involved with major land/stadium deals in municipalities. Would you rather have 1/4 to 1/2 billion dollar land and stadium deal on your resume or bunch of thanks yous from a thankless fanbase. She's out for herself no doubt but this time we could benefit from it.

To be clear, what you are stating is that a noted politician does not care what people think of her, yes?

Instead, what she cares about is bolstering her resume, at her age, because...

Why?

What if we change the word 'resume' to 'legacy?'

Her legacy is intertwined with the stories people will tell of her. So, while she may not give three f*cks what the common fan may have to say (or, frankly, about the common fan), she certainly cares about the stories people will tell of her. I'm not pretending that Shalala has some genuine desire to please fans. I'm stating she has a desire to please fans to the extent it helps her craft a message and influence perception.

 

[TRock305]

Why are we even talking about this? I thought UM couldn't even afford Golden's buyout... Evidently they can; use the money to purchase a REAL staff.

 

[mirednmediocrity2]

meanwhile Al Golden is our coach

....And therein lies the big problem.

 

[Jedi Master Cane]

meanwhile Al Golden is our coach

....And therein lies the big problem.

Negative...the BIG problem is Donna and the administration. For as big of a piece of **** that Al Golden is, he represents the THIRD successive miserable hire this administration has made. He sucks at what he does...but he's not THE problem. THE problem is much deeper and more pervasive....it's the fact that the only people who care about the well being of the football program post on these types of boards.

It's an absolute injustice that people that incompetent and apathetic with regards to the program are charged with it's safekeeping. It's hilarious when you really stop to think about it.

 

[mirednmediocrity2]

meanwhile Al Golden is our coach

....And therein lies the big problem.

Negative...the BIG problem is Donna and the administration. For as big of a piece of **** that Al Golden is, he represents the THIRD successive miserable hire this administration has made. He sucks at what he does...but he's not THE problem. THE problem is much deeper and more pervasive....it's the fact that the only people who care about the well being of the football program post on these types of boards.

It's an absolute injustice that people that incompetent and apathetic with regards to the program are charged with it's safekeeping. It's hilarious when you really stop to think about it.

You're absolutely right! They are making sure this idiot and his bankrupt coaching philosophy will ruin yet another season in 2015. ****, I don't think he gets fired even if he goes 3-9 or 4-8. They're trying to find a stadium for a ruined team with a decimated and deteriorating fan base. It's almost getting so we may lose the entire program soon. People don't want to watch this chit and I can't blame them. Sunlifeless sucks because the coaches make the team suck.