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Year 2 Turnarounds for CFB HCs

The Franchise said:
My Year 2 hypothesis involved coaches at marquee programs. If you're a coach at a marquee program and don't have a significant turnaround or have the program humming by year 2, then the chances are you'll never get that marquee program where it belongs.
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This is pure facts.

As a P5 coach, if you don't win at the very least 9 games within the first 3 years of you being there you're going to fail.

Year 2 is the jump year, by year 3 you should be contending on a regular basis if you're worth your weight in salt.

There's just no arguing it, good coaches find a way to win & win fast, it doesn't take 4-5 years to put together a winning season when you're at P5 program, especially when you have access to great talent.

If you're in the middle of Midwest bubblefúck then yeah it might take a few years, but if you're at prestigious marquee schools that always have good recruits, you get 3 years to turn it around into a winner or else you're probably never going to get that plane off the ground.
 
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yessirking said:
Before Urban Meyer took over at Ohio State, the buckeyes record was 6-7 with a new head coach. His name was Luke Fickell and he was fired after 1 year.

Flash forward to 2017, Luke Fickell is named the head coach of U of Cincinnati.

His first year at UoC: 4-8
Second year: 11-2
Third year: 11-3 and east conference champs.

When I think of other CFB coaches, this is the guy that most reminds me of Manny Diaz.
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Fickell really didn't take over that easy of a situation. Sure, the team had a lot of talent. But it's hard to get the team motivated after the scandal that resulted in Tressel's firing.
 
YES ....

The TRULY TOP COACHES have consistently shown the ability to shine in their2nd year.

They also had good coaching acumen and most importantly previous good HC experience and results.

Unfortunately, that does NOT necessarily translate to OUR situation...since Manny is a 1st time HC and his coaching acumen is debatable.

That wont change expectations here ...NOR SHOULD IT. You know the expectations when you take the job...asking your team and its fans to wait until you can get yourself up to a high performance level beyond year two is only acceptable to those who want to be continuously fooled
 
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not an al golden fan said:
Manny Diaz, Miami

Year before hiring: 7-6

Year 1: 6-7

Year 2: 1-11 (Lone win over Wagner)

Yup, he really did turn the team around in year 2. He turned them around from bad to even worse.
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A time traveler. Let me guess, it went like this:

  • (L) Temple (3-10): King and Jarrin Williams stun Miami, transferring back to Houston shortly before kickoff. Van Dyke gets hurt in the first series, Perry in the second series, and Miami just runs the ball the rest of the game.
  • (W) Wagner (17-0): Despite the appearance of namesake actor Jack Wagner, who vainly tries to sing "Hot Tonight" to rally his team, the Hurricanes squeak by in an ugly game. New quarterback N'Kosi Perry throws for 2 touchdowns.
  • (L) UAB (6-9): N'Kosi Perry is injured in the first quarter and is replaced by Tate Martell. Martell in turn is injured scrambling in the next series. Peyton Matocha plays the rest of the game but is unable to move the offense
  • Lashley accepts a job to become an analyst for Alabama; Manny Diaz announces that former offensive coordinator Gary Stevens will be brought back to coach the Canes for the rest of the year.
  • (L) Michigan State (10-17): Fourteen of the fifteen offensive linemen miss the team flight after going to Disney World, leaving the Canes with just one available offensive linemen. Stevens counters by running a formation similar to this
    1592086036666.png
  • (L) Pittsburgh (18-19): After inexplicable waivers from the NCAA, Dan Marino and Larry Fitzgerald return to lead the Panthers to an improbably victory. Gary Stevens resigns after the game.
  • Manny Diaz announces that Paul Johnson has agreed to terms to become the new offensive coordinator; Johnson dubs his new Canes offense "The Triple Storm Surge"
  • (L) Wake Forest (3-34): Jamie Newman has transferred back to Wake Forest after a contentious Zoom practice session in Georgia, and Wake Forest is looking to catch Clemson. Several Miami wide receivers begin posting on Twitter that they had strange dreams about Florida.
  • (L) North Carolina (0-100): Sam Howell throws for 14 touchdowns in a farcical contest that sees fans throwing various debris on the field. The ramifications are serious - Mack Brown is hired back to become the head football coach at Texas. Manny Diaz announces a fundraising drive to build concrete fortifications for his team to prevent potential injuries from thrown objects
  • (L) Virginia (0-28): After holding the Cavaliers to zero points for the first 54 minutes, Miami commits three turnovers following a Virginia score. To add insult to injury Matocha is knocked out the game
  • Manny Diaz announces that Kenny Kelly has returned to Miami to finish his final year of eligibility
  • (L) Florida State (53-54): Miami's offense comes alive in the second half after a moribund two quarters. Kelly scrambles around and rallies Miami from a 35-6 deficit and gets them into game winning position for a chip shot field goal with two seconds left. Unfortunately a seismic vibration causes the goal post to fall wide right as the kick was delivered, and due to safety concerns referee Terry Porter calls the game
  • (L) Virginia Tech (0-17): Kenny Kelly is injured in the first quarter. An excited Paul Johnson attempts to run the ball for the remainder of the game but is unable to generate any offense.
  • The NCAA launches an investigation into allegations that Michael Irvin received a free small order of french fries at The Rathskeller in 1986; Select commentators on ESPN and Bleacher report call for a death penalty saying that such infractions ruin college football
  • (L) Georgia Tech (13-24): N'Kosi Perry is back, but Paul Johnson only lets him pass three times. Twenty eight players decide to take the game off and head to South Beach. Georgia's three touchdowns come off of fake punts.
  • Construction of concrete fortifications at Hard Rock Stadium are completed
  • (L) Duke (0-103): A pensive Manny Diaz awaits his players to show up within the safety of the new concrete dugout, but finds that most of them have gone to South Beach or are playing video games. Only thirty one players suit up, and that includes twenty nine walk ons. All of the Blue Devil touchdowns come off of punt returns that feature laterals.
 
GojiraCane said:
A time traveler. Let me guess, it went like this:

  • (L) Temple (3-10): King and Jarrin Williams stun Miami, transferring back to Houston shortly before kickoff. Van Dyke gets hurt in the first series, Perry in the second series, and Miami just runs the ball the rest of the game.
  • (W) Wagner (17-0): Despite the appearance of namesake actor Jack Wagner, who vainly tries to sing "Hot Tonight" to rally his team, the Hurricanes squeak by in an ugly game. New quarterback N'Kosi Perry throws for 2 touchdowns.
  • (L) UAB (6-9): N'Kosi Perry is injured in the first quarter and is replaced by Tate Martell. Martell in turn is injured scrambling in the next series. Peyton Matocha plays the rest of the game but is unable to move the offense
  • Lashley accepts a job to become an analyst for Alabama; Manny Diaz announces that former offensive coordinator Gary Stevens will be brought back to coach the Canes for the rest of the year.
  • (L) Michigan State (10-17): Fourteen of the fifteen offensive linemen miss the team flight after going to Disney World, leaving the Canes with just one available offensive linemen. Stevens counters by running a formation similar to thisView attachment 118780
  • (L) Pittsburgh (18-19): After inexplicable waivers from the NCAA, Dan Marino and Larry Fitzgerald return to lead the Panthers to an improbably victory. Gary Stevens resigns after the game.
  • Manny Diaz announces that Paul Johnson has agreed to terms to become the new offensive coordinator; Johnson dubs his new Canes offense "The Triple Storm Surge"
  • (L) Wake Forest (3-34): Jamie Newman has transferred back to Wake Forest after a contentious Zoom practice session in Georgia, and Wake Forest is looking to catch Clemson. Several Miami wide receivers begin posting on Twitter that they had strange dreams about Florida.
  • (L) North Carolina (0-100): Sam Howell throws for 14 touchdowns in a farcical contest that sees fans throwing various debris on the field. The ramifications are serious - Mack Brown is hired back to become the head football coach at Texas. Manny Diaz announces a fundraising drive to build concrete fortifications for his team to prevent potential injuries from thrown objects
  • (L) Virginia (0-28): After holding the Cavaliers to zero points for the first 54 minutes, Miami commits three turnovers following a Virginia score. To add insult to injury Matocha is knocked out the game
  • Manny Diaz announces that Kenny Kelly has returned to Miami to finish his final year of eligibility
  • (L) Florida State (53-54): Miami's offense comes alive in the second half after a moribund two quarters. Kelly scrambles around and rallies Miami from a 35-6 deficit and gets them into game winning position for a chip shot field goal with two seconds left. Unfortunately a seismic vibration causes the goal post to fall wide right as the kick was delivered, and due to safety concerns referee Terry Porter calls the game
  • (L) Virginia Tech (0-17): Kenny Kelly is injured in the first quarter. An excited Paul Johnson attempts to run the ball for the remainder of the game but is unable to generate any offense.
  • The NCAA launches an investigation into allegations that Michael Irvin received a free small order of french fries at The Rathskeller in 1986; Select commentators on ESPN and Bleacher report call for a death penalty saying that such infractions ruin college football
  • (L) Georgia Tech (13-24): N'Kosi Perry is back, but Paul Johnson only lets him pass three times. Twenty eight players decide to take the game off and head to South Beach. Georgia's three touchdowns come off of fake punts.
  • Construction of concrete fortifications at Hard Rock Stadium are completed
  • (L) Duke (0-103): A pensive Manny Diaz awaits his players to show up within the safety of the new concrete dugout, but finds that most of them have gone to South Beach or are playing video games. Only thirty one players suit up, and that includes twenty nine walk ons. All of the Blue Devil touchdowns come off of punt returns that feature laterals.
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Top 20 CIS post of all time.

Love the wit.
 
Rellyrell said:
My friend, you gets no argument from me. What I was highlighting is that in the case of Stoops and Richt, although first time head coaches, they came from a winning regime. My post was not to defend Manny, as oppose to highlight that those examples shouldn't give us hope. lol. Manny's pedigree is not stellar, and if he does succeed this year, I will give him even more credit.
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I feel you, but a big season this year won’t have me completely sold on Manny.

We got a quarterback that scored 50 ****** TOUCHDOWNS!

That is the type of talent that can carry an in over his head coach to a big year.

2021 is the year you will know if Manny is for real, unless he ***** the bed this year and we know he is probably toast. If he can bust heads with Saban, play a good game , and get 10 wins in 2021, it will be hard not to think we have a long term solution at head coach.
 
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GojiraCane said:
A time traveler. Let me guess, it went like this:

  • (L) Temple (3-10): King and Jarrin Williams stun Miami, transferring back to Houston shortly before kickoff. Van Dyke gets hurt in the first series, Perry in the second series, and Miami just runs the ball the rest of the game.
  • (W) Wagner (17-0): Despite the appearance of namesake actor Jack Wagner, who vainly tries to sing "Hot Tonight" to rally his team, the Hurricanes squeak by in an ugly game. New quarterback N'Kosi Perry throws for 2 touchdowns.
  • (L) UAB (6-9): N'Kosi Perry is injured in the first quarter and is replaced by Tate Martell. Martell in turn is injured scrambling in the next series. Peyton Matocha plays the rest of the game but is unable to move the offense
  • Lashley accepts a job to become an analyst for Alabama; Manny Diaz announces that former offensive coordinator Gary Stevens will be brought back to coach the Canes for the rest of the year.
  • (L) Michigan State (10-17): Fourteen of the fifteen offensive linemen miss the team flight after going to Disney World, leaving the Canes with just one available offensive linemen. Stevens counters by running a formation similar to thisView attachment 118780
  • (L) Pittsburgh (18-19): After inexplicable waivers from the NCAA, Dan Marino and Larry Fitzgerald return to lead the Panthers to an improbably victory. Gary Stevens resigns after the game.
  • Manny Diaz announces that Paul Johnson has agreed to terms to become the new offensive coordinator; Johnson dubs his new Canes offense "The Triple Storm Surge"
  • (L) Wake Forest (3-34): Jamie Newman has transferred back to Wake Forest after a contentious Zoom practice session in Georgia, and Wake Forest is looking to catch Clemson. Several Miami wide receivers begin posting on Twitter that they had strange dreams about Florida.
  • (L) North Carolina (0-100): Sam Howell throws for 14 touchdowns in a farcical contest that sees fans throwing various debris on the field. The ramifications are serious - Mack Brown is hired back to become the head football coach at Texas. Manny Diaz announces a fundraising drive to build concrete fortifications for his team to prevent potential injuries from thrown objects
  • (L) Virginia (0-28): After holding the Cavaliers to zero points for the first 54 minutes, Miami commits three turnovers following a Virginia score. To add insult to injury Matocha is knocked out the game
  • Manny Diaz announces that Kenny Kelly has returned to Miami to finish his final year of eligibility
  • (L) Florida State (53-54): Miami's offense comes alive in the second half after a moribund two quarters. Kelly scrambles around and rallies Miami from a 35-6 deficit and gets them into game winning position for a chip shot field goal with two seconds left. Unfortunately a seismic vibration causes the goal post to fall wide right as the kick was delivered, and due to safety concerns referee Terry Porter calls the game
  • (L) Virginia Tech (0-17): Kenny Kelly is injured in the first quarter. An excited Paul Johnson attempts to run the ball for the remainder of the game but is unable to generate any offense.
  • The NCAA launches an investigation into allegations that Michael Irvin received a free small order of french fries at The Rathskeller in 1986; Select commentators on ESPN and Bleacher report call for a death penalty saying that such infractions ruin college football
  • (L) Georgia Tech (13-24): N'Kosi Perry is back, but Paul Johnson only lets him pass three times. Twenty eight players decide to take the game off and head to South Beach. Georgia's three touchdowns come off of fake punts.
  • Construction of concrete fortifications at Hard Rock Stadium are completed
  • (L) Duke (0-103): A pensive Manny Diaz awaits his players to show up within the safety of the new concrete dugout, but finds that most of them have gone to South Beach or are playing video games. Only thirty one players suit up, and that includes twenty nine walk ons. All of the Blue Devil touchdowns come off of punt returns that feature laterals.
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Actually, Miami beat Wagner in triple overtime, and lost each of its first 10 FBS games by scores ranging from 56-0 against Wake Forest to 98-0 against FSU. In the 98-0 game, FSU missed a short field goal as time expired that would have made it 101-0.

Duke lead Miami 31-0, but foolishly brought in a bunch of backups because they thought they had clinched the game. As a result, Miami got up 35-31 with under 5 seconds to go. On Miami’s last drive, there was a controversial pass interference call that negated an interception, and it didn’t seem like Miami actually got the ball over the goal line on the TD. But that was all quickly forgotten because of what happened next.

As time expired, Duke got a 10 lateral kickoff return TD to win the game. The officials determined Duke had never been down after a really long review, but most of CFB thought Duke actually was down.
 
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Man I hate the Dabo and Saban comps. Plain silly. Manny has been here a while. Doesn’t/didn’t recruit well at LB.

The list of HC’s corches who had a poor first season and continued to struggle infinitely outnumbers the number of coaches at the second juggernauts who failed the first season
 
Rellyrell said:
Saban: Previous HC Experience at MSU prior to LSU. Previous HC Experience at LSU and NFLprior to Bama.

Pete Carroll: Previous NFL HC Experience

Mack Brown: Previous HC Experience

Bob Stoops: First time HC; but was a National Championship AHC/DC at UF

Jimmy Johnson: Previous HC Experience

Urban Meyers: Previous HC Experience

Mark Richt; First time HC at UGA, but was a National Championship AHC/OC at FSU
At Miami, previous HC Experience

Tom Herman: Previous HC Experience

Context is everything
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Great point but we now have like 3? Previous HCs on staff in coordinator roles. I think this is huge in keeping manny afloat and pushing the program forward. He's not having to deal with staff that doesn't know what they're doing and naturally should make the job easier
 
GojiraCane said:
A time traveler. Let me guess, it went like this:

  • (L) Temple (3-10): King and Jarrin Williams stun Miami, transferring back to Houston shortly before kickoff. Van Dyke gets hurt in the first series, Perry in the second series, and Miami just runs the ball the rest of the game.
  • (W) Wagner (17-0): Despite the appearance of namesake actor Jack Wagner, who vainly tries to sing "Hot Tonight" to rally his team, the Hurricanes squeak by in an ugly game. New quarterback N'Kosi Perry throws for 2 touchdowns.
  • (L) UAB (6-9): N'Kosi Perry is injured in the first quarter and is replaced by Tate Martell. Martell in turn is injured scrambling in the next series. Peyton Matocha plays the rest of the game but is unable to move the offense
  • Lashley accepts a job to become an analyst for Alabama; Manny Diaz announces that former offensive coordinator Gary Stevens will be brought back to coach the Canes for the rest of the year.
  • (L) Michigan State (10-17): Fourteen of the fifteen offensive linemen miss the team flight after going to Disney World, leaving the Canes with just one available offensive linemen. Stevens counters by running a formation similar to thisView attachment 118780
  • (L) Pittsburgh (18-19): After inexplicable waivers from the NCAA, Dan Marino and Larry Fitzgerald return to lead the Panthers to an improbably victory. Gary Stevens resigns after the game.
  • Manny Diaz announces that Paul Johnson has agreed to terms to become the new offensive coordinator; Johnson dubs his new Canes offense "The Triple Storm Surge"
  • (L) Wake Forest (3-34): Jamie Newman has transferred back to Wake Forest after a contentious Zoom practice session in Georgia, and Wake Forest is looking to catch Clemson. Several Miami wide receivers begin posting on Twitter that they had strange dreams about Florida.
  • (L) North Carolina (0-100): Sam Howell throws for 14 touchdowns in a farcical contest that sees fans throwing various debris on the field. The ramifications are serious - Mack Brown is hired back to become the head football coach at Texas. Manny Diaz announces a fundraising drive to build concrete fortifications for his team to prevent potential injuries from thrown objects
  • (L) Virginia (0-28): After holding the Cavaliers to zero points for the first 54 minutes, Miami commits three turnovers following a Virginia score. To add insult to injury Matocha is knocked out the game
  • Manny Diaz announces that Kenny Kelly has returned to Miami to finish his final year of eligibility
  • (L) Florida State (53-54): Miami's offense comes alive in the second half after a moribund two quarters. Kelly scrambles around and rallies Miami from a 35-6 deficit and gets them into game winning position for a chip shot field goal with two seconds left. Unfortunately a seismic vibration causes the goal post to fall wide right as the kick was delivered, and due to safety concerns referee Terry Porter calls the game
  • (L) Virginia Tech (0-17): Kenny Kelly is injured in the first quarter. An excited Paul Johnson attempts to run the ball for the remainder of the game but is unable to generate any offense.
  • The NCAA launches an investigation into allegations that Michael Irvin received a free small order of french fries at The Rathskeller in 1986; Select commentators on ESPN and Bleacher report call for a death penalty saying that such infractions ruin college football
  • (L) Georgia Tech (13-24): N'Kosi Perry is back, but Paul Johnson only lets him pass three times. Twenty eight players decide to take the game off and head to South Beach. Georgia's three touchdowns come off of fake punts.
  • Construction of concrete fortifications at Hard Rock Stadium are completed
  • (L) Duke (0-103): A pensive Manny Diaz awaits his players to show up within the safety of the new concrete dugout, but finds that most of them have gone to South Beach or are playing video games. Only thirty one players suit up, and that includes twenty nine walk ons. All of the Blue Devil touchdowns come off of punt returns that feature laterals.
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I call bull crap. Not ONCE did you mention a dance party!
 
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GojiraCane said:
A time traveler. Let me guess, it went like this:

  • (L) Temple (3-10): King and Jarrin Williams stun Miami, transferring back to Houston shortly before kickoff. Van Dyke gets hurt in the first series, Perry in the second series, and Miami just runs the ball the rest of the game.
  • (W) Wagner (17-0): Despite the appearance of namesake actor Jack Wagner, who vainly tries to sing "Hot Tonight" to rally his team, the Hurricanes squeak by in an ugly game. New quarterback N'Kosi Perry throws for 2 touchdowns.
  • (L) UAB (6-9): N'Kosi Perry is injured in the first quarter and is replaced by Tate Martell. Martell in turn is injured scrambling in the next series. Peyton Matocha plays the rest of the game but is unable to move the offense
  • Lashley accepts a job to become an analyst for Alabama; Manny Diaz announces that former offensive coordinator Gary Stevens will be brought back to coach the Canes for the rest of the year.
  • (L) Michigan State (10-17): Fourteen of the fifteen offensive linemen miss the team flight after going to Disney World, leaving the Canes with just one available offensive linemen. Stevens counters by running a formation similar to thisView attachment 118780
  • (L) Pittsburgh (18-19): After inexplicable waivers from the NCAA, Dan Marino and Larry Fitzgerald return to lead the Panthers to an improbably victory. Gary Stevens resigns after the game.
  • Manny Diaz announces that Paul Johnson has agreed to terms to become the new offensive coordinator; Johnson dubs his new Canes offense "The Triple Storm Surge"
  • (L) Wake Forest (3-34): Jamie Newman has transferred back to Wake Forest after a contentious Zoom practice session in Georgia, and Wake Forest is looking to catch Clemson. Several Miami wide receivers begin posting on Twitter that they had strange dreams about Florida.
  • (L) North Carolina (0-100): Sam Howell throws for 14 touchdowns in a farcical contest that sees fans throwing various debris on the field. The ramifications are serious - Mack Brown is hired back to become the head football coach at Texas. Manny Diaz announces a fundraising drive to build concrete fortifications for his team to prevent potential injuries from thrown objects
  • (L) Virginia (0-28): After holding the Cavaliers to zero points for the first 54 minutes, Miami commits three turnovers following a Virginia score. To add insult to injury Matocha is knocked out the game
  • Manny Diaz announces that Kenny Kelly has returned to Miami to finish his final year of eligibility
  • (L) Florida State (53-54): Miami's offense comes alive in the second half after a moribund two quarters. Kelly scrambles around and rallies Miami from a 35-6 deficit and gets them into game winning position for a chip shot field goal with two seconds left. Unfortunately a seismic vibration causes the goal post to fall wide right as the kick was delivered, and due to safety concerns referee Terry Porter calls the game
  • (L) Virginia Tech (0-17): Kenny Kelly is injured in the first quarter. An excited Paul Johnson attempts to run the ball for the remainder of the game but is unable to generate any offense.
  • The NCAA launches an investigation into allegations that Michael Irvin received a free small order of french fries at The Rathskeller in 1986; Select commentators on ESPN and Bleacher report call for a death penalty saying that such infractions ruin college football
  • (L) Georgia Tech (13-24): N'Kosi Perry is back, but Paul Johnson only lets him pass three times. Twenty eight players decide to take the game off and head to South Beach. Georgia's three touchdowns come off of fake punts.
  • Construction of concrete fortifications at Hard Rock Stadium are completed
  • (L) Duke (0-103): A pensive Manny Diaz awaits his players to show up within the safety of the new concrete dugout, but finds that most of them have gone to South Beach or are playing video games. Only thirty one players suit up, and that includes twenty nine walk ons. All of the Blue Devil touchdowns come off of punt returns that feature laterals.
Click to expand...
Nobody, but nobody, can convince me that you didn't spend hours writing letters to Penthouse.
 
TruCane81 said:
I feel you, but a big season this year won’t have me completely sold on Manny.

We got a quarterback that scored 50 ****** TOUCHDOWNS!

That is the type of talent that can carry an in over his head coach to a big year.

2021 is the year you will know if Manny is for real, unless he ***** the bed this year and we know he is probably toast. If he can bust heads with Saban, play a good game , and get 10 wins in 2021, it will be hard not to think we have a long term solution at head coach.
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One step at a time. Sometimes when you start looking to far ahead you trip. So lets complain about something that's one year off when a million things can happen before then...
 
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I was saying Year 2 last year until FIU happened... I didn't think anybody could recover from that. However, Manny delivered an incredible offseason so it seems he recovered.

Year 2 is it. If you can't win with this roster and schedule then you can't win.
 
ElJefe3 said:
Great point but we now have like 3? Previous HCs on staff in coordinator roles. I think this is huge in keeping manny afloat and pushing the program forward. He's not having to deal with staff that doesn't know what they're doing and naturally should make the job easier
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Yep; which is y I keep saying, there’s no excuses this season.
 
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