Wow

[Alex_Dynamix]

Was beautiful to watch, now let’s do the same in the Draft going forward , we’re on the right track

 

[Alex_Dynamix]

For the millionth time, winning doesn’t matter 1/2 as much as you guys think it does. Kids don’t give a **** if they win. They want to play, they want to get to the league, and most importantly they want to get PAID.

Falling on deaf ears in here , we beat Texas A&M 2 years ago bring on ALL the 5 stars !!!

 

[WeBallinBoyz]

This is a question, not an attack or even disagreement. Do you think some of the imbalance with the recruiting across positions - holes/depth was how you referred to it - is due to a lack of talent at certain positions in certain years? In other words, I personally think this is a down year for DTs in terms of quantity of high quality dudes. There’s Lamar Brown and JJ, then I feel a decent drop off. (Pardon me if I missed someone). Thoughts?

I think that’s part of it. It’s also how we allocate whatever budget is set forth in recruiting.

I don’t have a perfect answer because I think some positions are showing more value in portaling for rather than HS. It’s something I’ve been trying to build a model for at work to help project preseason ratings, it’s just really hard. But this is where evaluations could certainly help out, particularly at the HS level.

For example, portal DT and QB has a massive price tag because they’re so rare. Everyone needs them, and everyone wants them - they’ll pay whatever is necessary to stay relevant and not experience a drop-off at that position. Imagine if you had two recruits at DT, you nailed the evaluations, they’re ready to not only contribute significant snaps the following season…but could potentially start. Or you had a QB in the wings that you felt confident in (aka Sayin for Ohio State, Carr at ND or Moore for Oregon, who I have personal doubts on but regardless)….think of how much money you have to allocate towards other positions now, either portal or dropping a bag on a surefire HS kid.

It’s all a big dance, and wayyyy above my pay grade lol. I’m just a diehard on a message board but that gets frustrated with underachieving. Been frustrated for 20+ years, so maybe I’m just becoming impatient. But I do think your point has substance, because we see certain positions have an abundance of talent some years, and others not so much.

The one constant is that the elite programs manage to get those talented players - even if there’s only a few at that particular position.

When we get a larger sample size with the portal and how each position has performed relative to national average, I think an answer will be somewhat a little more clear to formulate. Right now, I’ve been trying to model what to expect from a player year 1 to year 4/5 ranked X in HS based on previous history. Lot of work though

 

[BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati]

I think that’s part of it. It’s also how we allocate whatever budget is set forth in recruiting.

I don’t have a perfect answer because I think some positions are showing more value in portaling for rather than HS. It’s something I’ve been trying to build a model for at work to help project preseason ratings, it’s just really hard. But this is where evaluations could certainly help out, particularly at the HS level.

For example, portal DT and QB has a massive price tag because they’re so rare. Everyone needs them, and everyone wants them - they’ll pay whatever is necessary to stay relevant and not experience a drop-off at that position. Imagine if you had two recruits at DT, you nailed the evaluations, they’re ready to not only contribute significant snaps the following season…but could potentially start. Or you had a QB in the wings that you felt confident in (aka Sayin for Ohio State, Carr at ND or Moore for Oregon, who I have personal doubts on but regardless)….think of how much money you have to allocate towards other positions now, either portal or dropping a bag on a surefire HS kid.

It’s all a big dance, and wayyyy above my pay grade lol. I’m just a diehard on a message board but that gets frustrated with underachieving. Been frustrated for 20+ years, so maybe I’m just becoming impatient. But I do think your point has substance, because we see certain positions have an abundance of talent some years, and others not so much.

The one constant is that the elite programs manage to get those talented players - even if there’s only a few at that particular position.

I feel the frustration. The top dogs haven’t had a 20 year drop off (semi-excuse, semi-valid) which certainly helps in stacking.

The financial component between HS, portal and roster retention is high level calculus computated on a moving target. Beyond your pay grade? Oh yeah. Me too. It’s the biggest obstacle of them all. How the F do you juggle all that? Being a fan has its perks I suppose.

 

[canesdude]

Apologies in advance for my longest post ever ha! I have less than zero contact with our staff right now so I can only speak from recruits, high school coaches, 7 on, other college coaching staffs and parents. My opinion is from talking to people is UM staff has a nice plan and does a great job communicating. But they tend to misread where they stand with some out of state recruits often. This has been persistent in years past. They underestimate the chances with some kids and overestimate with some. Money is not an issue and have no issues there. Side note USC class has exactly zero chance of holding together.

We have had a better chance at Lamar than JJ (this years JJ) Nolan and others people around the UM program misread. Cantwell visited UGA 5 times and was trying to convince himself. That's not always a tell tale sign of where someone is going and I've seen our staff firsthand be deterred by that.

I might add we have to hit Houston, LA and Chicagoland and the god damned DMV harder. Those kids will line up to come here.

Do you think the staff has realized they have a real shot at Lamar or is it too late?

 

[grover]

Just curious - why does Mario get the benefit of the doubt for “stacking”, but not his predecessors?

Not even trying to start an argument, just looking for takes from the other side of fandom. Trying to understand the rationale and break down the perspective. I agree the sky is not falling, but it’s not sunshine and daisies either. We’ve underachieved three seasons in a row. That’s not arguable, and that should not be the standard under Mario. I think all of us would agree we expect more, or at least were sold on more.

Year 4 is his make or break here imo. And again imo, he has more than enough talent that anything less than 10-2 and an ACCCG appearance is an utter failure; consequently, he should be put on the lukewarm seat (won’t happen even if we miss the ACCCG).

There’s also another argument to be made that we’re not stacking classes efficiently, but rather skewed positionally year over year. Chasing our tail at the culmination of a season, rather than jumping in front of the issue. One year it’s because of X. The next year it’s because of Y. Then it’s because of Z. But again, another discussion for another day. I’ve taken the approach this offseason of keeping it in PMs to people that actually have football intelligence, and enjoying the ride / the inevitable war that is to come in late August against ND.

I agree with you on the bolded part. He needs to at least reproduce a 10 win team and get to the ACCCG. It's time.

The reasons I'm giving Mario the benefit of the doubt are 1. the impressive effectiveness of the offense last year, and 2. what I "believe" to be the quality of the young talent on the DL topped off by the portal DB adds.

I've been tracking this team for 40 years now, through good and lots of recent bad. And my impression is the balance of talent across the team is stronger than it has been since early Coker. I still have 3 concerns -- S, DT and to some degree LB. But I think general breadth and depth of talent is nearing where it needs to be.

 

[Kn[]_[]ckles3o5]

I’ll just say had we won that “meaningful” bowl game the same cast of characters would’ve been on here claiming that 11-2 was a fake mirage because we missed out on the ACCCG n Playoffs (which i actually agree with)…… but fast forward all of a sudden now them same will tell u that the tarts bowl was a must win game for the trajectory and perception of our program ..ain’t nannn elite recruit gave 2 ***** about the outcome of the pop tart bowl. Choose another excuse

It's all the same ****. Going into the GT game whole CFB world was focused on Cam Ward, PSU, and Jeremiah Smith. We swoon down the stretch and pull a "Miami" and the media gets to ignore us and laugh.

Save some "bad" pub for Ward and the joke that was the flop tarts bowl we were dismissed through the entirety of post season coverage. We went from smoke to joke that quick, it slowed our momentum and allowed those negative narratives that are associated with the program and coaching staff to persist.

Clemson and Dabo went through the same **** and he (and Deshaun Watson) managed to get them over the hump and establish them as an elite program in CFB. It was their defense that put them in that position.

Bottomline is the defensive build out has been difficult. It is way behind schedule. Gotta fix the defense and get that consistent. Once we do that with the o line being stacked and stocked we are always just a piece or two away from big things

 

[Angry Ibis]

Naw I don't get upset. I just get tired of the negative sh@t on here. Your not n the loop you don't know sh@t. Your not speaking factual sh@t. Just your opinion which don't mean sh@t. But its a free board. So speak but when you do speak. Speak like you got some knowledge. Not just throwing out stupid opinionated bs

You are definitely big mad... the sky isn't falling... follow the process...

and good luck cleansing a message board of opinions... mario918

 

[Angry Ibis]

I agree with you on the bolded part. He needs to at least reproduce a 10 win team and get to the ACCCG. It's time.

The reasons I'm giving Mario the benefit of the doubt are 1. the impressive effectiveness of the offense last year, and 2. what I "believe" to be the quality of the young talent on the DL topped off by the portal DB adds.

I've been tracking this team for 40 years now, through good and lots of recent bad. And my impression is the balance of talent across the team is stronger than it has been since early Coker. I still have 3 concerns -- S, DT and to some degree LB. But I think general breadth and depth of talent is nearing where it needs to be.

These have been the same concerns almost all 4 years, cycles and portals, and also include WR#1 and QB#1...

In terms of "stacking", we knocked the jenga tower down when we "stacked" a 13th ranked class. No one envisioned an elite recruiter with top resources to "stack" classes outside the Top 10, really the Top 5 with Super Mario Recruiter Guy... (in before people shoot back with the portal ranking that was proclaimed to be "not sustainable" by the biggest bros on the board -- )...

 

[TRick72]

The staff just needs to quit ******* around and make 2 key hires off the field. They know who they are. I promise you WR and DB recruiting would be the best we have ever had.

Isn’t Rumph our off field DB recruiter? Or is it someone else?

 

[Alex_Dynamix]

It's all the same ****. Going into the GT game whole CFB world was focused on Cam Ward, PSU, and Jeremiah Smith. We swoon down the stretch and pull a "Miami" and the media gets to ignore us and laugh.

Save some "bad" pub for Ward and the joke that was the flop tarts bowl we were dismissed through the entirety of post season coverage. We went from smoke to joke that quick, it slowed our momentum and allowed those negative narratives that are associated with the program and coaching staff to persist.

Clemson and Dabo went through the same **** and he (and Deshaun Watson) managed to get them over the hump and establish them as an elite program in CFB. It was their defense that put them in that position.

Bottomline is the defensive build out has been difficult. It is way behind schedule. Gotta fix the defense and get that consistent. Once we do that with the o line being stacked and stocked we are always just a piece or two away from big things

I agree 100%. Hopefully Hetherman is the real deal, if we can have a 2017 type turnaround on that side of the ball we’re in for a special season.

 

[bobbydigius]

I think that’s part of it. It’s also how we allocate whatever budget is set forth in recruiting.

I don’t have a perfect answer because I think some positions are showing more value in portaling for rather than HS. It’s something I’ve been trying to build a model for at work to help project preseason ratings, it’s just really hard. But this is where evaluations could certainly help out, particularly at the HS level.

For example, portal DT and QB has a massive price tag because they’re so rare. Everyone needs them, and everyone wants them - they’ll pay whatever is necessary to stay relevant and not experience a drop-off at that position. Imagine if you had two recruits at DT, you nailed the evaluations, they’re ready to not only contribute significant snaps the following season…but could potentially start. Or you had a QB in the wings that you felt confident in (aka Sayin for Ohio State, Carr at ND or Moore for Oregon, who I have personal doubts on but regardless)….think of how much money you have to allocate towards other positions now, either portal or dropping a bag on a surefire HS kid.

It’s all a big dance, and wayyyy above my pay grade lol. I’m just a diehard on a message board but that gets frustrated with underachieving. Been frustrated for 20+ years, so maybe I’m just becoming impatient. But I do think your point has substance, because we see certain positions have an abundance of talent some years, and others not so much.

The one constant is that the elite programs manage to get those talented players - even if there’s only a few at that particular position.

When we get a larger sample size with the portal and how each position has performed relative to national average, I think an answer will be somewhat a little more clear to formulate. Right now, I’ve been trying to model what to expect from a player year 1 to year 4/5 ranked X in HS based on previous history. Lot of work though

Hitting on Evals solves a bunch of this but we havent exactly done that. Now that doesnt mean there have been zero good evals because there have been some great ones in OJ and Cooper(if you count the 22 class...).

Right now the foundational part of the roster should be the 23 class which would be going into its 3rd year. The problem is we missed a ton on evals there and 2/3rds of the class is no longer here. If thats how its going to be, you will always be putting out positional fires and be behind the proverbial 8 ball.

 

[CanesFan93]

This is a question, not an attack or even disagreement. Do you think some of the imbalance with the recruiting across positions - holes/depth was how you referred to it - is due to a lack of talent at certain positions in certain years? In other words, I personally think this is a down year for DTs in terms of quantity of high quality dudes. There’s Lamar Brown and JJ, then I feel a decent drop off. (Pardon me if I missed someone). Thoughts?

Not attacking you either. Maybe I'm in the minority here, but hearing this every year is a bit agitating especially under Mario. We obviously focus on recruiting in our backyard, which doesn't always have the top talent, but the staff has prioritized recruiting out of state too. There's other talented (highly-rated too if that's your thing) kids throughout country besides the 4-5 the staff seem to fixate on. 1m even said that we need to hit certain states harder. They should at least scour and evaluate Florida harder if they're not going to do that.

I also don't believe it's a down year for DT, the big schools just took most of the top players. It's a down year for WR so I understand why that side is having trouble; I wonder what happened with Wingo.

 

[htownkidd]

Not attacking you either. Maybe I'm in the minority here, but hearing this every year is a bit agitating especially under Mario. We obviously focus on recruiting in our backyard, which doesn't always have the top talent, but the staff has prioritized recruiting out of state too. There's other talented (highly-rated too if that's your thing) kids throughout country besides the 4-5 the staff seem to fixate on. 1m even said that we need to hit certain states harder. They should at least scour and evaluate Florida harder if they're not going to do that.

I also don't believe it's a down year for DT, the big schools just took most of the top players. It's a down year for WR so I understand why that side is having trouble; I wonder what happened with Wingo.

Nothing happened. St Aug kids typically go to UF, and he has former UF players coaching him. He was always theirs to lose.

 

[WeBallinBoyz]

Hitting on Evals solves a bunch of this but we havent exactly done that. Now that doesnt mean there have been zero good evals because there have been some great ones in OJ and Cooper(if you count the 22 class...).

Right now the foundational part of the roster should be the 23 class which would be going into its 3rd year. The problem is we missed a ton on evals there and 2/3rds of the class is no longer here. If thats how its going to be, you will always be putting out positional fires and be behind the proverbial 8 ball.

Couldn’t have said it better. As of right now, July 9th, the 2023 class is pretty close to an abject failure. Of course guys blossom late and conversely, naturally not everyone is going to live up to lofty rankings. But for all intensive purposes, it’s been a very disappointing class for what it finished rankings-wise. Not a whole lot of instant-impact guys.

What is left of it - hopefully takes a massive leap this year. Or we’ll be having different discussions at the culmination of the 2025 season. They are a massive key to the success of this team.

 

[JHallCanes]

Couldn’t have said it better. As of right now, July 9th, the 2023 class is pretty close to an abject failure. Of course guys blossom late and conversely, naturally not everyone is going to live up to lofty rankings. But for all intensive purposes, it’s been a very disappointing class for what it finished rankings-wise. Not a whole lot of instant-impact guys.

What is left of it - hopefully takes a massive leap this year. Or we’ll be having different discussions at the culmination of the 2025 season. They are a massive key to the success of this team.

Mario’s first year really put us in a tough spot

He had to rebuild a rebuild (I don’t agree with that word for us but just for arguments sake)

The 2022 class was a colossal failure and even worse his 2022 coaching staff has had to be entirely replaced, and not because they got promotions

Follow that up with a bad 2023 class and more coaches needing replaced

People can talk to me about patience all day long, and in some ways it’s correct, but we ****ed up. Badly. Here we are still trying to fix it.

I feel like we have turned the corner very slowly but we are there. But it’s also why I get agitated when people start defending him because we are in a better spot than we were

We are in a better spot. The one HE created.

You can blame Manny all you want but this is Mario’s mess he’s cleaning up

 

[TRick72]

I think that’s part of it. It’s also how we allocate whatever budget is set forth in recruiting.

I don’t have a perfect answer because I think some positions are showing more value in portaling for rather than HS. It’s something I’ve been trying to build a model for at work to help project preseason ratings, it’s just really hard. But this is where evaluations could certainly help out, particularly at the HS level.

For example, portal DT and QB has a massive price tag because they’re so rare. Everyone needs them, and everyone wants them - they’ll pay whatever is necessary to stay relevant and not experience a drop-off at that position. Imagine if you had two recruits at DT, you nailed the evaluations, they’re ready to not only contribute significant snaps the following season…but could potentially start. Or you had a QB in the wings that you felt confident in (aka Sayin for Ohio State, Carr at ND or Moore for Oregon, who I have personal doubts on but regardless)….think of how much money you have to allocate towards other positions now, either portal or dropping a bag on a surefire HS kid.

It’s all a big dance, and wayyyy above my pay grade lol. I’m just a diehard on a message board but that gets frustrated with underachieving. Been frustrated for 20+ years, so maybe I’m just becoming impatient. But I do think your point has substance, because we see certain positions have an abundance of talent some years, and others not so much.

The one constant is that the elite programs manage to get those talented players - even if there’s only a few at that particular position.

When we get a larger sample size with the portal and how each position has performed relative to national average, I think an answer will be somewhat a little more clear to formulate. Right now, I’ve been trying to model what to expect from a player year 1 to year 4/5 ranked X in HS based on previous history. Lot of work though

While part of it and there’s some validity to it, it’s also often used as an excuse and we only hear about how weak a class is at a particular position if we don’t do well recruiting it.

For instance, in 2023 we signed 2 out of the 4 Five Star OT’s in what was a strong OT class. In 2024 the reasoning for taking a bunch of projects at OT was that we had spent a lot on the position the previous year which was smart and made sense.

Then in 2025 the reasoning became it was a weak OT class when in fact on paper it was as strong if not stronger than the 2023 class. This year we haven’t heard a peep about how weak the OT class is when in fact it is shaping up to be the weakest OT class of the last 4 years. Why? Because we got Cantwell committed so no one mentions it.

Here are the 247 OT Composite rankings

2023
Four 5 stars
10 top 100 OTs

2024
Three 5 stars
7 top 100 OTs

2025
Four 5 stars
12 top 100 OTs

2026
Three 5 stars
6 Top 100 OTs

 

[Cajuncane]

I know it’s 2025 but men can’t get pregnant

yea but SOME women can get women pregnant nowadays......

 

[786Cane]

I agree 100%. Hopefully Hetherman is the real deal, if we can have a 2017 type turnaround on that side of the ball we’re in for a special season.

I hope so too! Not 100 in him... yet! I wasn't sold on Dawson or Guidry either. Still not sold on Dawson as I believe that a lot of that was Cam; but I hope that he proves me wrong. I will gladly take the L!

 

[BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati]

Not attacking you either. Maybe I'm in the minority here, but hearing this every year is a bit agitating especially under Mario. We obviously focus on recruiting in our backyard, which doesn't always have the top talent, but the staff has prioritized recruiting out of state too. There's other talented (highly-rated too if that's your thing) kids throughout country besides the 4-5 the staff seem to fixate on. 1m even said that we need to hit certain states harder. They should at least scour and evaluate Florida harder if they're not going to do that.

I also don't believe it's a down year for DT, the big schools just took most of the top players. It's a down year for WR so I understand why that side is having trouble; I wonder what happened with Wingo.

I didn't write that as an excuse nor an explain-away. We have come up short in some positions, no doubt. The point I was trying to make was that some years, the number of truly elite kids at certain position groups are high and other years they are low, regardless of what they are ranked. And I was making the comment nationally, not locally. I get your feelings of nausea because for whatever reason, a lot of what is written on this forum is shrouded in Slurper/Mope colors. My comments were neither, but I can see the nausea reaction reading it in the context of this thread.

Try this. Each year in the NFL draft, several QBs are taken early (1st 2/3 rounds). Most of them don't pan out. Some are obvious flops before they're even taken (Will Levis), but they're still taken and considered a highly ranked prospect. Why? Because there aren't very many elite prospects and by default, someone has to fill that void (pause). It's the Bradley Beal phenomenon - someone has to score the points on a crappy team, which he did, which drove up his stats and got him on a better team where he was no longer the only option so his stats declined. This sort of works in conjunction with your last sentences. I'll have to dig into the DTs a little more (but for now I can assume you're right and I was wrong, but I reserve the right to stick to my guns after I research a little harder specifically for height and weight of the DTs), but the WR side you and I see the same - which was my point the whole time. Not every year has top end dudes.

I hope this isn't too much word salad. I wrote in between doing 6 other things at work.