Wiltfong

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Legit question - what is an offer in your opinion?
I think "offers" at other positions are different than QB. We can take multiple players at skill positions, but we're only taking one QB this time. If we take 3 Oline for example, and we have 7 offers out - target 2, 3 & 6 commit. We can still make room for #1 if he wants in.

If #3 on our QB board has an "offer," & wants to commit, do we accept? Because I feel like our coaches have their sight set for #1 until he decides. Will move from there. Extending meaningless offers just doesn't make sense to me if you're not willing to accept their commit.

So in your opinion, what is an offer? If a recruit tries to commit with an "offer", but you say no we want you to do x, y, z before we accept. Okay, but school a, b, c want me to commit now.

I get you're argument to extend your board, just feel QB board is a bit different. If the available players & your board is Brady, Tannehill, Tyrod Taylor, & Rivers. You don't accept a commit from any of them until you hear from Brady. If he's your #1 guy, & you're only taking 1 QB then you're gonna have to wait.
Okay so I don't think we should send out like a **** load of non-committable offers or anything to players at every position. But I absolutely believe in casting a wide net, especially at such an important position like QB. Secondly, everyone here acting like there's no such thing as non-commitable offers are so full of ****. Everyone knows for a fucking fact teams offer guys all the time and they are not committable at that moment. This is simple imo. With MJjr as our top priority, we reserve the spot for him up until a certain date. At that date, if he had not committed, its open season. again, its not like we're choosing between Brady and Tyrod Taylor. This is like Picking Brady with Peyton Manning as the backup option...(to use your analogy). And put yourself in the shoes of that QB; Whats better, getting a non commitable offer that sets an outline of what exactly they want from you (grades up, come to paradise camp, etc, etc) before they'll accept your commitment, or just barely recruiting you without showing ANY tangible evidence that an offer may soon be on the way? I know which I'd choose.

Personally I view Taisun as a better player than MJjr, at least as a passer. And him being ranked the #1 DTQB by 247, is really good evidence that he really is a TOP Qb recruit in this class, or you can read the breakdowns of both qbs on here. That is why I've been saying I want us to offer him - I think he's better. I think MJjr has more potential strictly due to the fact he's probably the most athletically gifted QB in this entire class....but will he ever reach that potential HERE? idk. I'd honestly be happy with either.

Now, am I saying not to prioritize MJjr because I think Taisun is better? No. I'm saying I want us to continue recruiting the rest of the top DT QBs this cycle, because ultimately I don't have faith in a qb 3k miles away committing and signing with us. People like to point out that we have sent out a few more QB offers out, but we have 5 total Qb offers sent out right now, and 3 are to QBs already committed. And only 2 of them are guys that IMO truly fit what we are trying to do offensively. So sending out an offer to Mertz who is a pro style QB (with good mobility no question) that is already committed, I'm just not seeing the point. Whereas there are a bunch of TOP DTQBs that we could be recruiting as backup plans to MJjr. Right now we are basically just recruiting MJjr and not really having any backup option, and thats what I don't lie.

At the end of the day MJjr is a qb 3k miles away with a dad on a P5 coaching staff. I think everyone can admit that we would rarely even have a chance with a kid in this situation. Like could you imagine if Ron Dugans had a son who was a top DT QB, and was our top QB target, but he chose Cal over us? How insane would that be? That's exactly what is happening here. So for me I want us to keep our options open.
 

tampatony21

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Okay so I don't think we should send out like a **** load of non-committable offers or anything to players at every position. But I absolutely believe in casting a wide net, especially at such an important position like QB. Secondly, everyone here acting like there's no such thing as non-commitable offers are so full of ****. Everyone knows for a fucking fact teams offer guys all the time and they are not committable at that moment. This is simple imo. With MJjr as our top priority, we reserve the spot for him up until a certain date. At that date, if he had not committed, its open season. again, its not like we're choosing between Brady and Tyrod Taylor. This is like Picking Brady with Peyton Manning as the backup option...(to use your analogy). And put yourself in the shoes of that QB; Whats better, getting a non commitable offer that sets an outline of what exactly they want from you (grades up, come to paradise camp, etc, etc) before they'll accept your commitment, or just barely recruiting you without showing ANY tangible evidence that an offer may soon be on the way? I know which I'd choose.

Personally I view Taisun as a better player than MJjr, at least as a passer. And him being ranked the #1 DTQB by 247, is really good evidence that he really is a TOP Qb recruit in this class, or you can read the breakdowns of both qbs on here. That is why I've been saying I want us to offer him - I think he's better. I think MJjr has more potential strictly due to the fact he's probably the most athletically gifted QB in this entire class....but will he ever reach that potential HERE? idk. I'd honestly be happy with either.

Now, am I saying not to prioritize MJjr because I think Taisun is better? No. I'm saying I want us to continue recruiting the rest of the top DT QBs this cycle, because ultimately I don't have faith in a qb 3k miles away committing and signing with us. People like to point out that we have sent out a few more QB offers out, but we have 5 total Qb offers sent out right now, and 3 are to QBs already committed. And only 2 of them are guys that IMO truly fit what we are trying to do offensively. So sending out an offer to Mertz who is a pro style QB (with good mobility no question) that is already committed, I'm just not seeing the point. Whereas there are a bunch of TOP DTQBs that we could be recruiting as backup plans to MJjr. Right now we are basically just recruiting MJjr and not really having any backup option, and thats what I don't lie.

At the end of the day MJjr is a qb 3k miles away with a dad on a P5 coaching staff. I think everyone can admit that we would rarely even have a chance with a kid in this situation. Like could you imagine if Ron Dugans had a son who was a top DT QB, and was our top QB target, but he chose Cal over us? How insane would that be? That's exactly what is happening here. So for me I want us to keep our options open.
I gotcha, just trying to understand your train of thought here. IMO, I think the coaches (right or wrong) feel MJ is a far superior prospect. So in their eyes, their evaluations, maybe we aren't talking Brady/Manning type comparison, we are seeing MJ & then a far drop off. Not saying I agree or disagree.

Yes maybe we do have a deadline date with MJ & will then move on. Maybe Tai is aware of that, maybe not. But from what Dee said, Tai has more than held up his end so us not offering him (right or wrong) is for a reason. There are other offers at QB. They may just want to see more (which might fall in line with MJ's decision deadline).

Maybe we should be giving Tai more attention, but coaches are doing there evals & aren't ready to "cast the net" that far yet apparently. Once again, do we know our coaches aren't in contact or outlined guidelines?

QB is a different animal than other positions. The net can only go so far. To again put in NFL terms I guess, maybe a draftable grade has been assigned to certain players & others need to show more before getting any type of offer. You have to be picky with QB more so than other positions.

I feel like our disagreement is slight. While you recruit a wide range of QB's, they are clearly prioritized/ranked much more than other positions. Apparently Tai is ranked lower on the board (at the moment) than others. Not saying I agree, but right now the coaches I guess aren't ready to pursue Tai to the extent you want unless there's much more behind the scenes.
 

KrazyCane

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This narrative that Sitkowski was a "missed evaluation" is the definition of spin. He had offers from all over the country when he committed to Miami, which means Jon Richt beat his competition as a recruiter.

Then Sitkowski showed he wasn't good enough and he was out. Richt wasn't left with out any quality options went out and upgraded with Jarren Williams. Combined with last years qb class of Perry and Weldon, he's proven that hes one the best qb recruiters in the country.
 

KrazyCane

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Calinative has this pointless position about why we shouldve offered Taisun even though we already got our qb for 2019?? It doesnt matter, as long Miami recruits Johnson and he continues to show that he is UM caliber, Taisun isn't going to be in this class so let it go.
 

dsddcane

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I gotcha, just trying to understand your train of thought here. IMO, I think the coaches (right or wrong) feel MJ is a far superior prospect. So in their eyes, their evaluations, maybe we aren't talking Brady/Manning type comparison, we are seeing MJ & then a far drop off. Not saying I agree or disagree.

Yes maybe we do have a deadline date with MJ & will then move on. Maybe Tai is aware of that, maybe not. But from what Dee said, Tai has more than held up his end so us not offering him (right or wrong) is for a reason. There are other offers at QB. They may just want to see more (which might fall in line with MJ's decision deadline).

Maybe we should be giving Tai more attention, but coaches are doing there evals & aren't ready to "cast the net" that far yet apparently. Once again, do we know our coaches aren't in contact or outlined guidelines?

QB is a different animal than other positions. The net can only go so far. To again put in NFL terms I guess, maybe a draftable grade has been assigned to certain players & others need to show more before getting any type of offer. You have to be picky with QB more so than other positions.

I feel like our disagreement is slight. While you recruit a wide range of QB's, they are clearly prioritized/ranked much more than other positions. Apparently Tai is ranked lower on the board (at the moment) than others. Not saying I agree, but right now the coaches I guess aren't ready to pursue Tai to the extent you want unless there's much more behind the scenes.
U both have a point and cali u know we good bruh but at this point we might as well drop it. As I've alluded to before this is simply an ego play due to a move from last season. Not gonna get into too many details but like i said it wasnt lil richts idea to move on from art last season. Art decommiting was simply the end result. But the issue was art was looking around due to he had lost his confidence. Completely changed his tune from camp & spring game talking bout rosier & sherriffs questioning if we were good enough to questioning was he good enough to play here. Ultimately lil richt kept trying to talk art into sticking to his commitment & we workout any issues when he got here. But it got so bad at img with parents,players & other teams(his own included) he just didnt see himself as talented enough. At that point lil richt was told to start opening back up lines of communication with casey thompson,jarren,buddy that signed with byu & a transfer eligible qb parents. Once it became clear we had several options cmr told art good luck elsewhere... But hes held on to his feelings over the situation
 
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I gotcha, just trying to understand your train of thought here. IMO, I think the coaches (right or wrong) feel MJ is a far superior prospect. So in their eyes, their evaluations, maybe we aren't talking Brady/Manning type comparison, we are seeing MJ & then a far drop off. Not saying I agree or disagree.

Yes maybe we do have a deadline date with MJ & will then move on. Maybe Tai is aware of that, maybe not. But from what Dee said, Tai has more than held up his end so us not offering him (right or wrong) is for a reason. There are other offers at QB. They may just want to see more (which might fall in line with MJ's decision deadline).

Maybe we should be giving Tai more attention, but coaches are doing there evals & aren't ready to "cast the net" that far yet apparently. Once again, do we know our coaches aren't in contact or outlined guidelines?

QB is a different animal than other positions. The net can only go so far. To again put in NFL terms I guess, maybe a draftable grade has been assigned to certain players & others need to show more before getting any type of offer. You have to be picky with QB more so than other positions.

I feel like our disagreement is slight. While you recruit a wide range of QB's, they are clearly prioritized/ranked much more than other positions. Apparently Tai is ranked lower on the board (at the moment) than others. Not saying I agree, but right now the coaches I guess aren't ready to pursue Tai to the extent you want unless there's much more behind the scenes.
Obviously if we get him to sign here, thats huge. But I just prefer to have backup options in place, and to not push kids away that have shown interest. I just don't see ANY negative in offering a Non Committable offer to Taisun....So I really don't get all the negative responses when I suggest it. Again, Taisun is the only QB that has even visited us yet (he came for paradise last yr). MJjr Will be visiting at the end of this month though, so thats a huge positive sign for us. And Qbs Taisuns level aren't going to wait on us to come around for ever...if he is even interested any more. The chances we pull another Jarren Williams where we can steal a top QB in under a month are extremely slim, and I would like to not have to rely on lucky for a second time.

Basically imo if we pull MJjr, Jon Richt shows he's a great recruiter (whether he's a good on field coach is an entirely other matter)....but if he misses on MJjr, and we have to go to a lower tier option than Taisun because he committed somewhere else, I think it will show that our entire plan was stupid. This is shaping up to be either Really Great or really bad imo
 

KrazyCane

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Every coach in the country has players on the roster that didn't perform up to expectations. Those are "missed evaluations" so constantly throwing out that term doesnt help whatever your position is.
 
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U both have a point and cali u know we good bruh but at this point we might as well drop it. As I've alluded to before this is simply an ego play due to a move from last season. Not gonna get into too many details but like i said it wasnt lil richts idea to move on from art last season. Art decommiting was simply the end result. But the issue was art was looking around due to he had lost his confidence. Completely changed his tune from camp & spring game talking bout rosier & sherriffs questioning if we were good enough to questioning was he good enough to play here. Ultimately lil richt kept trying to talk art into sticking to his commitment & we workout any issues when he got here. But it got so bad at img with parents,players & other teams(his own included) he just didnt see himself as talented enough. At that point lil richt was told to start opening back up lines of communication with casey thompson,jarren,buddy that signed with byu & a transfer eligible qb parents. Once it became clear we had several options cmr told art good luck elsewhere... But hes held on to his feelings over the situation
Ay dude, what do you think about the qb competition this year though. Thats the thing I care most about entering this season.
Honestly I much rather go through the growing pains of Perry or Weldon than have to deal with Rosier this season.

If Rosier is our starter all year, I think we will still improve a lot just because we are going to be healthy and getting a serious talent infusion on offense, but man I'd be so damn disappointed. And if he's Qb I can't see us losing less than 3-4 games
 
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This narrative that Sitkowski was a "missed evaluation" is the definition of spin. He had offers from all over the country when he committed to Miami, which means Jon Richt beat his competition as a recruiter.

Then Sitkowski showed he wasn't good enough and he was out. Richt wasn't left with out any quality options went out and upgraded with Jarren Williams. Combined with last years qb class of Perry and Weldon, he's proven that hes one the best qb recruiters in the country.
Sitkowski showed he wasn't good enough EVERY SINGLE YR he played HS football. many here, like Franchise were heavily questioning taking Sitkowski as our QB. I personally didn't like it but was on board because I trusted the staff and saw that athletically, Sits had some talent However THE STAFF WAS WRONG. You're the one trying to spin it and make it seem like a positive.
How many offers from actual good programs did he have offers from? and how many of them were actually commitable? the answer is: so few that he went to Rutgers.

yeah nah, if JR gets MJjr to sign here, I'll say he's a great recruiter. He's hasn't earned that yet.. and I'm definitely not convinced hes a good on field coach. Rosier literally progressively got worse as the season went on. I guess you can argue it was a miraculous coaching effort that he was even playing at that level in the first place...i guess theres some merit to that argument. But I didn't like Qb recruiting or QB play last cycle. If he doesn't have Perry or Weldon ready to WIN the job this season, Idk wtf he's doing as a coach, cause Rosier sucks
 

brock

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U both have a point and cali u know we good bruh but at this point we might as well drop it. As I've alluded to before this is simply an ego play due to a move from last season. Not gonna get into too many details but like i said it wasnt lil richts idea to move on from art last season. Art decommiting was simply the end result. But the issue was art was looking around due to he had lost his confidence. Completely changed his tune from camp & spring game talking bout rosier & sherriffs questioning if we were good enough to questioning was he good enough to play here. Ultimately lil richt kept trying to talk art into sticking to his commitment & we workout any issues when he got here. But it got so bad at img with parents,players & other teams(his own included) he just didnt see himself as talented enough. At that point lil richt was told to start opening back up lines of communication with casey thompson,jarren,buddy that signed with byu & a transfer eligible qb parents. Once it became clear we had several options cmr told art good luck elsewhere... But hes held on to his feelings over the situation
Sheesh, you either swim or you drown in img environment. Hope that kid gets it together
 

brock

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Obviously if we get him to sign here, thats huge. But I just prefer to have backup options in place, and to not push kids away that have shown interest. I just don't see ANY negative in offering a Non Committable offer to Taisun....So I really don't get all the negative responses when I suggest it. Again, Taisun is the only QB that has even visited us yet (he came for paradise last yr). MJjr Will be visiting at the end of this month though, so thats a huge positive sign for us. And Qbs Taisuns level aren't going to wait on us to come around for ever...if he is even interested any more. The chances we pull another Jarren Williams where we can steal a top QB in under a month are extremely slim, and I would like to not have to rely on lucky for a second time.

Basically imo if we pull MJjr, Jon Richt shows he's a great recruiter (whether he's a good on field coach is an entirely other matter)....but if he misses on MJjr, and we have to go to a lower tier option than Taisun because he committed somewhere else, I think it will show that our entire plan was stupid. This is shaping up to be either Really Great or really bad imo
You keep saying luck, we happened to drop Sitkowski at the right time but make no mistake about it other elite programs were recruiting him too but we just beat them out for Williams period
 

brock

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Every coach in the country has players on the roster that didn't perform up to expectations. Those are "missed evaluations" so constantly throwing out that term doesnt help whatever your position is.
I do agree with your point that every coach has missed evaluations for sure
 

brock

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Sitkowski showed he wasn't good enough EVERY SINGLE YR he played HS football. many here, like Franchise were heavily questioning taking Sitkowski as our QB. I personally didn't like it but was on board because I trusted the staff and saw that athletically, Sits had some talent However THE STAFF WAS WRONG. You're the one trying to spin it and make it seem like a positive.
How many offers from actual good programs did he have offers from? and how many of them were actually commitable? the answer is: so few that he went to Rutgers.

yeah nah, if JR gets MJjr to sign here, I'll say he's a great recruiter. He's hasn't earned that yet.. and I'm definitely not convinced hes a good on field coach. Rosier literally progressively got worse as the season went on. I guess you can argue it was a miraculous coaching effort that he was even playing at that level in the first place...i guess theres some merit to that argument. But I didn't like Qb recruiting or QB play last cycle. If he doesn't have Perry or Weldon ready to WIN the job this season, Idk wtf he's doing as a coach, cause Rosier sucks
You didn’t “like” qb recruiting last cycle but we got a top 80 player in the country at the postion gtfoh.... That’s a stupid saying and equivalent to a bama fan sounding dumb in saying they didn’t like recruiting last cycle even though they closed pretty well.

And fact is both Brad kaaya and rosier put up 2 of Miami’s best statistical seasons at the postion in years even with their individual short comings
 

KrazyCane

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Sitkowski showed he wasn't good enough EVERY SINGLE YR he played HS football. many here, like Franchise were heavily questioning taking Sitkowski as our QB. I personally didn't like it but was on board because I trusted the staff and saw that athletically, Sits had some talent However THE STAFF WAS WRONG. You're the one trying to spin it and make it seem like a positive.
How many offers from actual good programs did he have offers from? and how many of them were actually commitable? the answer is: so few that he went to Rutgers.

yeah nah, if JR gets MJjr to sign here, I'll say he's a great recruiter. He's hasn't earned that yet.. and I'm definitely not convinced hes a good on field coach. Rosier literally progressively got worse as the season went on. I guess you can argue it was a miraculous coaching effort that he was even playing at that level in the first place...i guess theres some merit to that argument. But I didn't like Qb recruiting or QB play last cycle. If he doesn't have Perry or Weldon ready to WIN the job this season, Idk wtf he's doing as a coach, cause Rosier sucks
Lol what part of Sit had offers from all over the country don't u want to accept? You act like evaluations arent constant?? At the time Sit committed Ohio State, Tenn, LSU, Ole Miss, Michigan, Wisconsin and several other schools wanted him. By the time Miami moved on, I'm sure those other schools did as well,
 

The Franchise

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Was it Sands or that kid from Broward whose father had played at Oklahoma? He came in for a few plays when Dorsey was hurt against OSU in the Fiesta Bowl. There was a huge dropoff.

Neither guy was the type of QB we needed as the first QB off the bench.

I hope we go for the best available (and interested) QB we can find. I watched some of Johnson's highlights and he's a sensational athlete. Even if he's not as polished a passer I think he could make a lot happen on offense. We've never had an athlete like him at QB.
Crudup was almost as bad as Sands, but Sands was the backup QB the year prior to Crudup.
 

The Franchise

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Okay so I don't think we should send out like a **** load of non-committable offers or anything to players at every position. But I absolutely believe in casting a wide net, especially at such an important position like QB. Secondly, everyone here acting like there's no such thing as non-commitable offers are so full of ****. Everyone knows for a fucking fact teams offer guys all the time and they are not committable at that moment. This is simple imo. With MJjr as our top priority, we reserve the spot for him up until a certain date. At that date, if he had not committed, its open season. again, its not like we're choosing between Brady and Tyrod Taylor. This is like Picking Brady with Peyton Manning as the backup option...(to use your analogy). And put yourself in the shoes of that QB; Whats better, getting a non commitable offer that sets an outline of what exactly they want from you (grades up, come to paradise camp, etc, etc) before they'll accept your commitment, or just barely recruiting you without showing ANY tangible evidence that an offer may soon be on the way? I know which I'd choose.

Personally I view Taisun as a better player than MJjr, at least as a passer. And him being ranked the #1 DTQB by 247, is really good evidence that he really is a TOP Qb recruit in this class, or you can read the breakdowns of both qbs on here. That is why I've been saying I want us to offer him - I think he's better. I think MJjr has more potential strictly due to the fact he's probably the most athletically gifted QB in this entire class....but will he ever reach that potential HERE? idk. I'd honestly be happy with either.

Now, am I saying not to prioritize MJjr because I think Taisun is better? No. I'm saying I want us to continue recruiting the rest of the top DT QBs this cycle, because ultimately I don't have faith in a qb 3k miles away committing and signing with us. People like to point out that we have sent out a few more QB offers out, but we have 5 total Qb offers sent out right now, and 3 are to QBs already committed. And only 2 of them are guys that IMO truly fit what we are trying to do offensively. So sending out an offer to Mertz who is a pro style QB (with good mobility no question) that is already committed, I'm just not seeing the point. Whereas there are a bunch of TOP DTQBs that we could be recruiting as backup plans to MJjr. Right now we are basically just recruiting MJjr and not really having any backup option, and thats what I don't lie.

At the end of the day MJjr is a qb 3k miles away with a dad on a P5 coaching staff. I think everyone can admit that we would rarely even have a chance with a kid in this situation. Like could you imagine if Ron Dugans had a son who was a top DT QB, and was our top QB target, but he chose Cal over us? How insane would that be? That's exactly what is happening here. So for me I want us to keep our options open.
We are recruiting other QBs. We just haven’t offered the guy you like best. You’re painting the picture that we’re putting all our eggs in the MJ basket, but we aren’t. Just say you’re mad that we aren’t pursuing your guy as the number QB.
 

brock

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We are recruiting other QBs. We just haven’t offered the guy you like best. You’re painting the picture that we’re putting all our eggs in the MJ basket, but we aren’t. Just say you’re mad that we aren’t pursuing your guy as the number QB.
Yeah we have offered several qbs in the last 2 months. I’m sure one could come with Taisun it just hasn’t yet
 

No_Fly_Zone

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Obviously if we get him to sign here, thats huge. But I just prefer to have backup options in place, and to not push kids away that have shown interest. I just don't see ANY negative in offering a Non Committable offer to Taisun....So I really don't get all the negative responses when I suggest it. Again, Taisun is the only QB that has even visited us yet (he came for paradise last yr). MJjr Will be visiting at the end of this month though, so thats a huge positive sign for us. And Qbs Taisuns level aren't going to wait on us to come around for ever...if he is even interested any more. The chances we pull another Jarren Williams where we can steal a top QB in under a month are extremely slim, and I would like to not have to rely on lucky for a second time.

Basically imo if we pull MJjr, Jon Richt shows he's a great recruiter (whether he's a good on field coach is an entirely other matter)....but if he misses on MJjr, and we have to go to a lower tier option than Taisun because he committed somewhere else, I think it will show that our entire plan was stupid. This is shaping up to be either Really Great or really bad imo
Honest question: would a "non-committable offer" (whatever that even means... as far as I can tell, a non-committable offer is not a real offer) have a positive impact on Tai (or any recruit, for that matter)?

I guess he can ultimately make a post on Instagram or Twitter saying he's blessed to receive an offer from the U, and websites like rivals and 247 will list him as having a UM offer (whether it's committable or not), but if it's non-committable and that message is communicated to him, is that really any better or different than having no offer? And is a non-committable offer more/less insulting/disrespectful than no offer?
 

dsddcane

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Don't sleep on Jarren Williams.....
Jarren is my nephews roommate. Lord was i wrong about that kid in so many ways. Great humble hard working kid. Remains to be seen if the competition part is a difference or not but im sure hell be fine regardless. Kid is not scared in the least. He has something to say about this qb race this year. Definitely dont sleep on him.
 
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