Understated part of our downfall

[1mg of Epi]

I'm not sure where that came from at all. We went from one extreme to the other between Coker and Shannon. People don't know this, Shannon was one of the first to realize Coker wasn't the guy. He saw it crumbling. Saw the country club attitude. Almost all of that was on the offensive side of the ball.

Yea he wasn’t some warm fuzzy dude. I remember he took the names off their jerseys, and generally was a strict disciplinarian with no sunshine.

So apparently a coach needs to bring more than structure and discipline.

 

[ElJefe3]

Coaching is the name of the game...recruiting comes 2nd.
What sells a program more:

A) Hey kid, did you see my awesome recruiting class last season and my crappy record?
or
B) Hey kid, I turn 3 starts into NFL draft picks. Come play for me and I'll level up your game.

B!!! Oh and then - magically - recruiting sorts itself out. You guys think Saban is some sort of charmer??

 

[nobeastofburden]

He also got the best South Florida players. The two are not mutually exclusive.

He got guys that fit his system but the majority of starters on our team were not from Sfla. Most of the guys we view as studs, weren't rated all that high.

Dorsey, Winslow, Shockey, DJ, majority of oline and dline, Reed, Portis, etc etc. They weren't from Sfla. What he did, with the limitations, scholarship and financial, is nothing short of amazing. Focusing on Sfla I feel has been our weakness. Butch didn't care where they came from. He loaded up on the skill positions in Fla and went elsewhere for other positions.

 

[Tad Footeball]

Shannon and Golden weren't stereotypical "nice guys" or "players coaches". You just lose control of your team or your team's personality when you're exposed as a corch. Kids will stop buying into your structure when they stop buying into your competence-especially so in a sport as physically taxing as football.

 

[jsy]

Something that is rarely discussed from Coker to Shannon to Golden to Richt to Diaz is their inability to effectively manage our players/staff. A couple things all of them have in common is they are all labeled as "nice guys" and being "good people". The other being them all citing "recruiting" as the way to fix our problems. Obviously, recruiting does play a major part in getting better and we have won a couple of battles against other elite programs for some key recruits. The point is none of these guys have been killers with only Richt having P5 Head Coaching experience but we got him on his way out. We are located in the most fertile recruiting ground in the country and yearly have lost countless recruits to other programs who pan out. A lot that plays into the culture they are entering which starts with how they are managed. South Florida kids need structure and discipline as their natural talent is something they rely in at the high school level that just isn't enough at the college level. All of these nice guys all have taken the approach of "stacking classes" to get us back and clearly all of them have missed the boat on creating an environment that brings the most out of them. You can bring on the top recruits to campus all day long but if the tune of the current team isn't aligned with their vision or what they are hearing from other established programs we will lose most of those kids, which we have. There is a reason we have lost most of the heads up battles with kids that didn't grow up loving Miami and wins and losses isn't the only reason why. Just offering a perspective that isn't discussed very often.

Coaches love to use recruiting as the excuse
Bc that effectively excuses them of subpar coaching
So the focus instead is deflected to something besides their coaching ability

 

[Silver King]

Something that is rarely discussed from Coker to Shannon to Golden to Richt to Diaz is their inability to effectively manage our players/staff. A couple things all of them have in common is they are all labeled as "nice guys" and being "good people". The other being them all citing "recruiting" as the way to fix our problems. Obviously, recruiting does play a major part in getting better and we have won a couple of battles against other elite programs for some key recruits. The point is none of these guys have been killers with only Richt having P5 Head Coaching experience but we got him on his way out. We are located in the most fertile recruiting ground in the country and yearly have lost countless recruits to other programs who pan out. A lot that plays into the culture they are entering which starts with how they are managed. South Florida kids need structure and discipline as their natural talent is something they rely in at the high school level that just isn't enough at the college level. All of these nice guys all have taken the approach of "stacking classes" to get us back and clearly all of them have missed the boat on creating an environment that brings the most out of them. You can bring on the top recruits to campus all day long but if the tune of the current team isn't aligned with their vision or what they are hearing from other established programs we will lose most of those kids, which we have. There is a reason we have lost most of the heads up battles with kids that didn't grow up loving Miami and wins and losses isn't the only reason why. Just offering a perspective that isn't discussed very often.

Florida encompasses the west coast too - not as many pure athletes - but they usually come with better fundamentals and discipline. Programs in Naples (couple state titles), Ft Myers , Punta Gorda (Charlotte 1st west coast team to be ST Thomas Aquinas), and Venice (Couple state titles) had long-term 20+year coaches (two of which recently retired). Our staff in Punta Gorda had four previous head coaches on it . The kid who intercepted Miami and started the downfall in the FIU game was from Charlotte - no one from Miami noticed him, he went in the 7th round and is in his 2nd year as CB for the Caroina Panthers 2nd on dept chart and got some playing time his rookie season. The point is, its easy to recruit Miami Dade hop in the car and you're home to dinner with the wife. Put the **** effort in to getting out and recruiting other parts of the state, because Miami Dade doesn't work for us anymore, hasn't for years.

 

[Bird4um]

Down fall for us was the Internet.

 

[The canesman]

Any success manny might of had came from the portal.

 

[clg003]

We need someone who teaches these kids the discipline they need to be professional athletes. We have to break them from off their pedestals and build them up as structured team players. Randy tried to do that and he was the closest of all these coaches to the Miami athlete, but he was lacking in so many other areas that he simply wasn't head coaching material. At this point the only way we move from a top 20 avg recruiting class to a top 5 is we have to stop losing to less talented teams. Discipline will do that. Any coach with half way decent recruiters will fill a 4 year top 20 rated recruiting team every year, because its Miami. If we can go on a run of top 20 ranked seasons then the chips will begin to fall. Its my main concern with Mario... his teams lack discipline. Pederson would be the perfect coach for us.

 

[KANE]

Manny and Shannon were hired from failing regimes.

Bad hiring practice. Ok to keep good staff but you dont promote someone from a failing regime to run the show.

To me the two were almost identical hires

This

 

[nycane]

Manny is nevin Shapiro with a whistle. he just wants to be around.
Shannon wasn't to nice, he nearly broke jacory Harris.

 

[Category69]

You can be nice and win but if you look at the most recent championships, the coaches are pretty hard asses. Saban, Swinney, Orgeron, Meyer, Fisher. Oh and Scott Frost, I keed.

But guys who want the best usually have a pretty big ego. They are harder to manage, that's why the University goes towards guys with a connection, lazy and easier to manage.

 

[Marcelo2988]

All kids coming in need structure.

Coker let the players run the show. I give him credit for being smart enough to let Ed and crew be the real coaches. Shannon and Golden I wouldn't call players coaches though. Manny is the coaching version of Nevin Shapiro.

Coker---recruited based on rankings
Shannon---In over his head. His doghouse was 3 stories high.
Golden--Bond with NoD did him in, debatable whether he could actually succeed or not with a new dc
Manny--No qualities at all, and the fact he has recruited somewhat decent, tells me the U isn't as dead as we actually think it is.

Your post is why I prefer Lane. We need real swagger not some cuban chain nonsense false bravado. I want a guy that runs up the score. I miss being hated by all of college football.

I feel like Lane’s personality is exactly what we need right now. His F U attitude is perfect for Miami. He would kill it down here IMO

 

[nobeastofburden]

I feel like Lane’s personality is exactly what we need right now. His F U attitude is perfect for Miami. He would kill it down here IMO

That is how I see it also. I think he would do well, but also admit it could be an unmitigated disaster. I don't want the safe cozy hire.

 

[mdhhdm]

A lot of good points made throughout this thread. Hiring a quality head coach is probably the hardest thing to do in sports. Just are not that many “ great coaches” out there. Sam Jankovich had a belief which served him well, eliminate anyone who has never been a head coach before. No on the job training. Eliminated one variable which he felt was most essential for the job ( experience). Sure, there are guys who went from coordinator to being excellent coaches (Lincoln Riley, Dabo, jimbo Fischer and others. However, there are far more examples of Coker’s, Shannon, manny failures. There seems to be a few guys who fit the bill this time, and I would take any of them:

Mario
Matt Campbell
Kiffin
Mark Stoops
Fickell

All of these guys have overachieved or exceeded expectations at one point in their careers, and all seem to be able to recruit and manage a program.

 

[nobeastofburden]

A lot of good points made throughout this thread. Hiring a quality head coach is probably the hardest thing to do in sports. Just are not that many “ great coaches” out there. Sam Jankovich had a belief which served him well, eliminate anyone who has never been a head coach before. No on the job training. Eliminated one variable which he felt was most essential for the job ( experience). Sure, there are guys who went from coordinator to being excellent coaches (Lincoln Riley, Dabo, jimbo Fischer and others. However, there are far more examples of Coker’s, Shannon, manny failures. There seems to be a few guys who fit the bill this time, and I would take any of them:

Mario
Matt Campbell
Kiffin
Mark Stoops
Fickell

All of these guys have overachieved or exceeded expectations at one point in their careers, and all seem to be able to recruit and manage a program.

Good post. Cross Campbell off your list though. I said this for years on cane sites when his name got brought up. Unless he changed his whole thought process, he ain't leaving that part of the country. That comes on about as good authority as you can get.

 

[SWFLHurricane]

I'm not sure where that came from at all. We went from one extreme to the other between Coker and Shannon. People don't know this, Shannon was one of the first to realize Coker wasn't the guy. He saw it crumbling. Saw the country club attitude. Almost all of that was on the offensive side of the ball.

Shannon's sidelines were a complete F-ing mess....looked like the Keystone Cops....absolutely atrocious...And his misuse of timeouts is legendary....MFer would call 2 timeouts in the 1st 10mins...

 

[nobeastofburden]

Shannon's sidelines were a complete F-ing mess....looked like the Keystone Cops....absolutely atrocious...And his misuse of timeouts is legendary....MFer would call 2 timeouts in the 1st 10mins...

No argument with any of that. Shannon was in way way way over his head. You know that guy was all cane though. He wasn't head coach material. Everybody knew it. You also know he brought attention to most of the stuff that was crumbling in the Coker regime. Might even be why he got the job.

 

[HarrietTubmanCane]

I completely agree with this. A lot of the South Florida kids are exposed to a cesspool of scumbags and don’t know how to deal with things they will face in college like competition and adversity. We need a coach who will be a boss and run the show, not a guy who will be pals with the players.

I get your overall point but it isn’t just “South Florida” kids who are exposed to a cesspool of scumbags. No one on Earth knows how to deal with like competition and adversity like black, urban/inner-city kids. Competition and adversity is created by the intentional lack of opportunities, education, employment, state funding, and prevalence of guns and drugs from outside the community. There are no kids more accustomed to adversity than these kids. They just know a fraud when they see one and that’s all the University of Miami has been hiring. Hire the real deal and the kids will come and respond accordingly.

 

[ball915]

Something to add from my OP is why do all of these coaches mentioned just have zero concept of our fanbase? The hog wash that comes out of their mouth is simply staggering. It's like they believe their own BS so much and have zero pulse on how we as a fan base operate and are wired. This only expedites the "noise" they all talk about having to block out. You'd think someone making millions would be smart enough to figure out how to help themselves with an exhausted fan base that has a short fuse.

Blandito - "The walk from the locker room is really long (Duke)"
Golden - everything that came out of his mouth
Manny - "The fans are costing us recruits" and plenty other things