Talent

[jerzeycane]

My Shalala criticism is that we've now hired three consecutive coaches, 14 years, of guys who don't lead in the aggressive, cutting edge way that made this program great. If you're worried about the school's brand, and you happen to be trying to build a Health District associated with the cutting edge, wouldn't you try to build the football program - essentially your organization's biggest marketing/branding tool - in a way that coincides? It's almost too easy. The school benefits and the football program benefits.

I don't blame her for Coker and Golden. She didn't want Coker, and Golden seemed like a good hire at the time. Shannon was not a good hire but our program was a mess and a lot of people turned us down. And while the buck stops with her, she's not a football person. Golden was really DiMare's choice.

That's my point. If she's not a football person, surround yourself with people who are. Dimare's influence should not be an excuse or a crutch. Ultimately, she is accountable.

Say Gary Patterson just simply says "I don't like the city of Miami and I don't like Palm Trees"

What does your wish list look like after that?

I don't have a wish list because I don't think Golden will be fired after this season. We'll see what progresses over the next year. It doesn't have to be a big name. I'll be looking for the next Patterson or Sumlin. They weren't the names they are now when they were possibilities for us. Both have had their ups and downs, but those were my choices in previous scenarios because they fit what I think coincides with this program's greatness: aggressively on the cutting edge of some aspect of football.

Well hopefully, our administration will in some way shape or form acknowledge the embarrassment.

If they do, a guy I've been keeping my eye on as the year goes on...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jzb9zHIypEA

 

[LuCane]

Her personal legacy is not tied to one of those two things mentioned in your last sentence.....

Her personal legacy is tied to the health district...

Coincidence that one suffers as it is neglected...?

Real talk: they're both operating at less than optimal levels. The University of Miami has had significant hiccups in their management. Their successes have revolved around [Sergio Gonzalez's] incredible fundraising ability. The Health District has not worked out as planned, though. Their seeming plan to rape the County hospital and swim in money has been met with significant resistance. Their idea to overpay for a hospital (Cedars) and somehow make it a destination despite being in the middle of an existing ghetto is not on its anticipated pace. It may happen in the future. It may not. Big questions for something most thought was a slam dunk.

My point above is they can actually *use* the football program to benefit the overall brand, trickling to its Health plans. Instead, they turn their noses up at football, while having a Health System fraught with controversies. Ironic.

Not to quibble, but isn't "ghetto" a little harsh.

Maybe. It is certainly an impoverished area. Jackson Main isn't flooded unfunded patients from the surrounding areas by coincidence. It fits within the most liberal definition of the word, but I understand your point. My point, perhaps having used the word for emphasis, was that it's contrary to their target market.

I guess a get a little sensitive ever since someone on a non-football board once called my old neighbor a ghetto. Other than most people there being a certain color, that was far from the truth.

But carry on with your truth-saying and ignore my girlie moment.

My dad's entire family grew up literally across the street from the area. It is what it is. There are family portions and there are some seedy portions. "Crack row" is across from Jackson Behavior Health, which is across the street from some UM's fanciest buildings.

 

[McGahee2TheHouse]

I work in that area. It's not a nice part of town, sorry.

 

[fivecent]

I work in that area. It's not a nice part of town, sorry.

I only driven through there. It looked poor, but I didn't think ghetto.

 

[Canesfan1899]

Well said and even more reason for this staff to go.

 

[Mbecks22]

can someone post a list of the "Camp Offers"?

I'd love to see a compiled list of all the kids that got offered at the Golden Camps.


thanks in advance to anyone that can do so.

 

[Juanka]

Regardless of what happens these next 2 games you have to fire Golden. Idk why they keep him, forget "the cloud", and forget this class/16 class. This guy cannot develop talent period. It's CFB, and sometimes coaches have to adjust so their players can exceed, yet the players are being asked to adjust and they regress, and for what? It has helped the team 0. Golden just seems to wanna coach to were he is comfortable, only making minor adjustments when a banner goes up. Tired of his crap, and my beloved U needs someone who can come in and fix it right away not another 4 year process.
Butch Davis is the answer. He will keep most of the class, develop the talent, and most importantly win! Dec. 13th right around the corner the U part 2 coming out. Recruits will see, and they will know. BBB. Save the U

 

[fivecent]

My point above is they can actually *use* the football program to benefit the overall brand, trickling to its Health plans. Instead, they turn their noses up at football, while having a Health System fraught with controversies. Ironic.

I think of the new stadium issue along these lines as well. In a sports era of diminishing attendance and better home viewing experience, the Marlins made the right move by going smaller and more comfortable. The Marlins just did it with the wrong product and wrong owner. UM would have a lot more success. I understanding wanting to wait to see how the renovations to SLS turn out, but the future is still about quality over quantity and SLS would still be too big. If they started making plans for it now, the could build the premier smaller venue location in the country, charge a premium and be ahead of the curve for a change.

 

[trueskool]

I totally disagree that Golden develops talent better than Shannon. The dude has been here 4 yrs and you can only reference 4 players to support an argument that Golden develops players?
I can list name after name that Shannon developed as defensive coordinator and head coach. **** I can name a list of players who regressed under Golden in 2011 and 2012 who played better in 2009 and 2010.
IMO the only thing Golden does better than Shannon is lie to the media and fan base

 

[Miami Nights]

Golden was a failure here from day 1. There was simply no excuse for going 6-6 his first year with the talent on the team. No more of this "give the coach four years" bull****. The next guy better put up results within two years, or it'll be obvious he's not the guy.

I see u can't stand alone golden.. That is clear. Do t sit and pretend u didn't like the guy from day 1. U didn't.

 

[weownfsu]

Golden was a failure here from day 1. There was simply no excuse for going 6-6 his first year with the talent on the team. No more of this "give the coach four years" bull****. The next guy better put up results within two years, or it'll be obvious he's not the guy.

I see u can't stand alone golden.. That is clear. Do t sit and pretend u didn't like the guy from day 1. U didn't.

Don't pretend you didn't defend Randy Shannon past his firing, nites.

 

[lauderdaleballer]

Why did you wait so long to post this? Smh.

ive been saying this for the longest. All the people who claimed Golden inherited a " dumpster fire" we're just off as usual. Of course you will have people who don't know anything parrot these silly claims.

I've said this before, the b.c. Loss was one of the worse losses in modern miami history. For the people who think Miami was handicapped that first game vs Maryland 2011...that's nothin compared to the handicapped 3-8 garbage squad bc marched into miami and won.

Golden always had talent... Dude inherited 4 NFL backs... Lamar Miller, Mike James, Storm Johnson and Duke Johnson (committed to RS his sophomore year). His best players right now were either RS commits or priorities. Walford was a RS player; Duek and Dorsett committed to RS and Perryman was an RS priority. I don't know if its true, but isn't the rumor that Barrow had to beg AG to accept his commitment? Al should have won no less than 9 games during his 1st year...

 

[Era66]

If your team has not improved by the end of year 4 then it will never will. I give a coach 4 years just like Randy got. Time to move on.

 

[CanadaCane]

In early 2012, I had a conversation with a former Miami staffer who landed at Alabama. I congratulated him on Alabama's championship and told him that it must be nice to coach so many studs. He looked at me and said, "Miami's good players are better than Alabama's good players."

I couldn't believe it. Alabama was the national champion. Miami was 6-6 and coming off an embarrassing home loss to BC. Alabama had multiple projected first round picks. Miami had a few mid and late-round guys. But he was insistent.

"Lamar Miller is better than Trent Richardson. Olivier Vernon is better than Courtney Upshaw. And Seantrel Henderson is better than any lineman we've got. Watch them in the pros."

Now that we've seen those guys in the NFL, we know he was dead-on. Why were the programs so far apart on the field? The coach said it came down to football infrastructure (training table, strength and conditioning, medical staff) and depth. He left out coaching, for obvious reasons, but you can assume that's another factor. Once those guys get to the NFL, he said, all the external things will become equal and raw talent will prevail.

Golden has done a better job than Shannon in terms of player development; specifically, strength and conditioning. Perryman, Dorsett, Walford and Duke all got bigger and stronger without losing their speed. But why is a team with so many elite players struggling in a talentless Coastal division?

Coaching is an obvious factor that is being addressed in every other thread on this board. The other factor is depth. In my view, there are three reasons depth is not where it needs to be:

1- We cannot identify undervalued South Florida talent. We are the anti-Louisville in this regard. These South Florida three-stars should be the main source of depth for this team, along with blue-chip young players.

2- The camp has produced nothing. I've discussed this before, but it bears repeating: the camp is the biggest indictment of the Temple crew's talent evaluation skills. If Paul "Delaware" Williams offers a kid at the camp, I just assume it's a wasted scholarship.

3- The Temple coaches have a Northeastern, Parcells approach that does not work here. This relates to numbers 1 and 2. Golden says that you support the star players with "coal shovelers." His idea of a coal shoveler is a low-rated, low-maintenance guy who has ideal measurables to develop. That's crap. The meat of this program should be South Florida ballers who may lack a measurable or two. The guys that go to Louisville and talk **** to our five-stars. Football players, not projects with good attitudes. If we had been stacking these guys for four years, this team would look much, much different.

Right now, our best players are better than anybody's best players. Anybody. Watch Perryman, Dorsett, Flowers, Duke and Walford in the pros. No other Power Five school can match those upperclassmen. Four years later, Miami is still undefeated on Sunday and .500 on Saturday.

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[lauderdaleballer]

Perryman and Dorsett were two of the best players in Florida in highschool. Golden didnt discover them they were just underratted bc they committed to UM.

They would have committed under Shannonm Golden gets no credit for their success. He is the worse coach in UM history and its not close

Dorsett committed to RS... I believe Perryman was going to but I heard a rumor that after his firing that Barrow had to beg for us to accept his commitment. I don't know if the Perryman story was true but Dorsett committed to RS...

 

[UMFarArcher]

Butch Davis has recruited some 34 first round draft picks, and the difference between Golden and for example Butch, is that Butch went after the very best athletes, and THEN put them in place to win. Our DT's weren't big - but they were really quick athletes. Butch downsized, whereas Golden upsizes - and we lost athleticism, quickness, and with few exceptions, speed.

Butch went hard after Sean Taylor. Sean Taylor was a running back, but we already had Willis McGahee, Clinton Portis, and Najeh Davenport - so Butch put him at safety where his unbelievable skill as a RB was extremely beneficial to him as a safety.

Consider how Butch saw Santana Moss, who had only caught a few passes while at Carol City - when Carol City wasn't throwing the ball. But he knew speed and athleticism when he saw it - Santana's numbers be damned. Golden can't pick up on these things, not at camps, not at the High Schools, and only lucks out with locals who want to remain local.

Clinton Portis was right there in Gainesville, but UF wasn't interested. Butch got hot on him and brought him in. Golden doesn't seem to be able to relate to or close on some of the talent that is very real, but not on the recruiting mainstream horizon. So he misses a LOT of talent that teams like UL picks up and then uses to push Golden's dookey in.

Golden has to go. Nice guy, but in way over his head, and he's too stubborn and entrenched with NE concepts.

It's like in South Florida - Golden is a stranger in a strange land.

 

[Miami Nights]

.

Golden was a failure here from day 1. There was simply no excuse for going 6-6 his first year with the talent on the team. No more of this "give the coach four years" bull****. The next guy better put up results within two years, or it'll be obvious he's not the guy.

I see u can't stand alone golden.. That is clear. Do t sit and pretend u didn't like the guy from day 1. U didn't.

Don't pretend you didn't defend Randy Shannon past his firing, nites.

I see u still fake. Actin like u hated golden from the jump. And Shannon sucked but not for the dumb *** reasons you parroted. Yes this is nights bich like I give a *** if you paid attention to someone else telling u who I was . U still a ***** ***.

 

[weownfsu]

.

Golden was a failure here from day 1. There was simply no excuse for going 6-6 his first year with the talent on the team. No more of this "give the coach four years" bull****. The next guy better put up results within two years, or it'll be obvious he's not the guy.

I see u can't stand alone golden.. That is clear. Do t sit and pretend u didn't like the guy from day 1. U didn't.

Don't pretend you didn't defend Randy Shannon past his firing, nites.

I see u still fake. Actin like u hated golden from the jump. And Shannon sucked but not for the dumb *** reasons you parroted. Yes this is nights bich like I give a *** if you paid attention to someone else telling u who I was . U still a ***** ***.

lmao

 

[OzarCaneSaw]

golden was the perfect hire this school needed.. he was thought to be an elite up and comer much like muschamp. I can't fault the hiring at that point

No. He wasn't. He was a fresh face. A good speaker. But was not an elite up and comer. You might have inferred that because of so many unknowns, but he was not known to be such.

elite may be a stretch youre right. but a lot of people were singing his praises for what he did @ Temple.

I think it was an over abundance of optimism. We will probably have the same response to our next hire. Hopefully after Coker/Shannon/Golden, we won't be so quick to crown someone. Temper our optimism and really wait for results. See, that's the biggest issue I've ever had with the now defunct Golden Girls Fan Club, there were absolutely NO results by which to base their support. It was always "he's turning things around" or "next year, we can judge him".

 

[lauderdaleballer]

My issue is that we were always on our way back with Golden... Its like our fanbase lowered its standards... Before the FSU game, we were saying we were on our way up and we're close to being back. How could that be the case when we already lost 3 games? We lowered our expectations and gave thus guy every opportunity to be successful... We even tried to validate his tenure by comparing him to a 1st time HC in RS... This guys should be better than every coach since JJ since he already had HC experience.