Someone explain this defensive formation to me please

K-State attempted 11 passes and we never adjusted. These guys are retarded.

Lol. Yep. But they did complete a seam pass for a td on the 2nd or 3rd drive, so you know, we better play soft cover 2 for the rest of the game.


I freakin hate prevent bend but don't break defense. It's not Miami football. The defense's job is not to eventually stop them by waiting for them to make a mistake. The defense's job is to go take the **** ball away. These guys are baby tigers that are being taught they're golden retrievers. I hate it.
 
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I finally watched the tape of the game. One play stood out that I hadn't noticed in person. Arkansas State intentionally checked out of a play to take advantage of one of our defensive formations. It worked perfectly for their final touchdown. And it looked like something they had picked up based on an earlier example.

In the game at Louisville, Chickillo at right end in a 3 man front pinched inside, with his outer shoulder well inside the frame of the tackle. Louisville easily caved him to the inside. Everything broke open. That was the touchdown run in which Crawford made a flailing tackle attempt.

Since we led 41-14 I guess I wasn't paying full attention when it happened again last Saturday. Very similar, and ominous down the road. This time Chickillo was at left end in a 3 man front. But again he was pinched tight toward the nose guard and had virtually no help to his outside. Third down play. Arkansas State noticed the vulnerability and changed the play call and offensive formation to take advantage of Chickillo. Anybody who saved the tape can see this easily. The back shifts from right to left. But that doesn't mean the play is headed left. Just the opposite. Chickillo is confused and doesn't know exactly what to do based on the altered formation. He looks around and eventually moves slightly further to his left, but not enough. The blockers still have ideal angle to wall Chickillo to the inside. And that's exactly what happened. The back being on the left allows enough time for him to take the handoff and circle to his right. He cuts inside and darts unchallenged into the end zone just as Chickillo is easily turned and nullified. He wasn't wiped out, similar to the Louisville game. But the bottom line is identical. The Arkansas State player immediately assumed outside positioning on Chickillo and arm wrestled him sideways, creating the perfect seam for the back. Timing was perfect.

Otherwise only two aspects jumped out at me. John Congemi was absolutely correct to point out that Arkansas State failed to take advantage of wide open spaces several times, particularly on screen passes in the first half. It wasn't obvious on the TV coverage how open those plays were, compared to watching at the stadium. We were quite fortunate. Also, Flowers didn't struggle as much as many fans in the stadium were suggesting. When flags pile up on the same guy naturally there is some grumbling. In this case there was plenty of it, especially given the first round projections. "What is Flowers doing out there?" I heard versions of that several times. Meanwhile, he was fine, often dominant. One of the calls was very shaky after he essentially pancaked his man. You could see the bewildered expression on Flowers' face. Still, there have been posts on the draft forums, even prior to the Arkansas State game, that Flowers has been somewhat disappointing this year. He's on the "dropping" lists while Dorsett is on the "rising" lists on those specialized sites.

I still have no idea how that long 3rd down completion by Arkansas State in the first quarter was ruled incomplete. It looked like a clear cut reception when I watched it live, the replays in the stadium indicated the same thing, and watching the TV version was equally definitive. Our yards allowed were aided by that mistake and also the long snap fiasco that Arkansas State suffered on their first possession. We didn't stop a play on that drive but the 25+ yard loss meant they had negative yards for the possession.
 
I finally watched the tape of the game. One play stood out that I hadn't noticed in person. Arkansas State intentionally checked out of a play to take advantage of one of our defensive formations. It worked perfectly for their final touchdown. And it looked like something they had picked up based on an earlier example.

In the game at Louisville, Chickillo at right end in a 3 man front pinched inside, with his outer shoulder well inside the frame of the tackle. Louisville easily caved him to the inside. Everything broke open. That was the touchdown run in which Crawford made a flailing tackle attempt.

Since we led 41-14 I guess I wasn't paying full attention when it happened again last Saturday. Very similar, and ominous down the road. This time Chickillo was at left end in a 3 man front. But again he was pinched tight toward the nose guard and had virtually no help to his outside. Third down play. Arkansas State noticed the vulnerability and changed the play call and offensive formation to take advantage of Chickillo. Anybody who saved the tape can see this easily. The back shifts from right to left. But that doesn't mean the play is headed left. Just the opposite. Chickillo is confused and doesn't know exactly what to do based on the altered formation. He looks around and eventually moves slightly further to his left, but not enough. The blockers still have ideal angle to wall Chickillo to the inside. And that's exactly what happened. The back being on the left allows enough time for him to take the handoff and circle to his right. He cuts inside and darts unchallenged into the end zone just as Chickillo is easily turned and nullified. He wasn't wiped out, similar to the Louisville game. But the bottom line is identical. The Arkansas State player immediately assumed outside positioning on Chickillo and arm wrestled him sideways, creating the perfect seam for the back. Timing was perfect.

When I posed this exact thought (less eloquently) on gameday I was told by one of the experts here that there was nothing wrong with our defensive formation on that play and that TD was all Jamal Carter's fault.

http://www.canesinsight.com/threads/78544-The-D-is-still-****ing-horrible
 
I'm just kinda confused as to what we're trying to accomplish. What's our identity on defense? Personally i think we're doing too much. Sound defense is sound defense. There's no reason to run a plethora of ****.

K.I.S.S.

Didn't you sit down with Doritos for hours and fell in love with him after he whispered sweet X's and O's nothings in your ear?

You came out of that meeting saying you understood what we were doing and that the players weren't executing.

Here we are two games into the season and it you sound just like the rest of us again.
 
Re: Awsi, Over the first 3 games, especially the Louisville game, I noticed how easy it is to get the edge on us. Often times we walk our OLBs out over the slot and give the DE (Chick/Pierre/Kamalu) contain responsibility while trying to 2-gap. That **** doesn't work. We constantly get our-flanked because our 300 pound DEs aren't athletic enough to turn the RB inside.

I don't understand the reasoning. We walk LBs over the slop and play softer coverage versus EVERYBODY. Not just teams like Louisville, but even FAMU and ASU. We shouldn't have to play soft like that against any team in the country. That includes the UF's and FSU's of the world.

This defense is built for less-talented teams like Virginia and Temple. It's so frustrating.
 
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I'm just kinda confused as to what we're trying to accomplish. What's our identity on defense? Personally i think we're doing too much. Sound defense is sound defense. There's no reason to run a plethora of ****.

K.I.S.S.

Didn't you sit down with Doritos for hours and fell in love with him after he whispered sweet X's and O's nothings in your ear?

You came out of that meeting saying you understood what we were doing and that the players weren't executing.

Here we are two games into the season and it you sound just like the rest of us again.

LOL, seriously. That thread was hilarious.
 
Re: Awsi, Over the first 3 games, especially the Louisville game, I noticed how easy it is to get the edge on us. Often times we walk our OLBs out over the slot and give the DE (Chick/Pierre/Kamalu) contain responsibility while trying to 2-gap. That **** doesn't work. We constantly get our-flanked because our 300 pound DEs aren't athletic enough to turn the RB inside.

I don't understand the reasoning. We walk LBs over the slop and play softer coverage versus EVERYBODY. Not just teams like Louisville, but even FAMU and ASU. We shouldn't have to play soft like that against any team in the country. That includes the UF's and FSU's of the world.

This defense is built for less-talented teams like Virginia and Temple. It's so frustrating.

What's so absurd is there are ways to defend 3,4, and 5 WR sets while still rushing four, still having a strong box, and still playing zone.

But those solutions require a degree of risk of getting beat deep (quarters and rip Liz). And it's clear this staff is not willing to risk even slightly. They'd prefer to drop 8. The only other defense I can remember that played so scared was the Eric Mangini Jets (another Belichick/Groh/Parcells guy).
 
I'm just kinda confused as to what we're trying to accomplish. What's our identity on defense? Personally i think we're doing too much. Sound defense is sound defense. There's no reason to run a plethora of ****.

K.I.S.S.

Didn't you sit down with Doritos for hours and fell in love with him after he whispered sweet X's and O's nothings in your ear?

You came out of that meeting saying you understood what we were doing and that the players weren't executing.

Here we are two games into the season and it you sound just like the rest of us again.

Glad others noticed this too.
 
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I finally watched the tape of the game. One play stood out that I hadn't noticed in person. Arkansas State intentionally checked out of a play to take advantage of one of our defensive formations. It worked perfectly for their final touchdown. And it looked like something they had picked up based on an earlier example.

In the game at Louisville, Chickillo at right end in a 3 man front pinched inside, with his outer shoulder well inside the frame of the tackle. Louisville easily caved him to the inside. Everything broke open. That was the touchdown run in which Crawford made a flailing tackle attempt.

Since we led 41-14 I guess I wasn't paying full attention when it happened again last Saturday. Very similar, and ominous down the road. This time Chickillo was at left end in a 3 man front. But again he was pinched tight toward the nose guard and had virtually no help to his outside. Third down play. Arkansas State noticed the vulnerability and changed the play call and offensive formation to take advantage of Chickillo. Anybody who saved the tape can see this easily. The back shifts from right to left. But that doesn't mean the play is headed left. Just the opposite. Chickillo is confused and doesn't know exactly what to do based on the altered formation. He looks around and eventually moves slightly further to his left, but not enough. The blockers still have ideal angle to wall Chickillo to the inside. And that's exactly what happened. The back being on the left allows enough time for him to take the handoff and circle to his right. He cuts inside and darts unchallenged into the end zone just as Chickillo is easily turned and nullified. He wasn't wiped out, similar to the Louisville game. But the bottom line is identical. The Arkansas State player immediately assumed outside positioning on Chickillo and arm wrestled him sideways, creating the perfect seam for the back. Timing was perfect.

Otherwise only two aspects jumped out at me. John Congemi was absolutely correct to point out that Arkansas State failed to take advantage of wide open spaces several times, particularly on screen passes in the first half. It wasn't obvious on the TV coverage how open those plays were, compared to watching at the stadium. We were quite fortunate. Also, Flowers didn't struggle as much as many fans in the stadium were suggesting. When flags pile up on the same guy naturally there is some grumbling. In this case there was plenty of it, especially given the first round projections. "What is Flowers doing out there?" I heard versions of that several times. Meanwhile, he was fine, often dominant. One of the calls was very shaky after he essentially pancaked his man. You could see the bewildered expression on Flowers' face. Still, there have been posts on the draft forums, even prior to the Arkansas State game, that Flowers has been somewhat disappointing this year. He's on the "dropping" lists while Dorsett is on the "rising" lists on those specialized sites.

I still have no idea how that long 3rd down completion by Arkansas State in the first quarter was ruled incomplete. It looked like a clear cut reception when I watched it live, the replays in the stadium indicated the same thing, and watching the TV version was equally definitive. Our yards allowed were aided by that mistake and also the long snap fiasco that Arkansas State suffered on their first possession. We didn't stop a play on that drive but the 25+ yard loss meant they had negative yards for the possession.

Dorito's response: "Yards don't matter."

smh
 
the defensive call from the sidelines:

CharlieSheen.gif


Translation: bend but dont break
 
I'm just kinda confused as to what we're trying to accomplish. What's our identity on defense? Personally i think we're doing too much. Sound defense is sound defense. There's no reason to run a plethora of ****.

K.I.S.S.

Didn't you sit down with Doritos for hours and fell in love with him after he whispered sweet X's and O's nothings in your ear?

You came out of that meeting saying you understood what we were doing and that the players weren't executing.

Here we are two games into the season and it you sound just like the rest of us again.

Glad others noticed this too.

WCD aka CityBoyCane aka Macho is the same dude who defends Swasey bc he was nice to him. It's a shame bc the dude knows football, but his opinion on corches depends on if they give him attention.
 
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In all seriousness, I'm interested to know what D'onofrio showed City to have him see the light. Was it only the good plays and the obvious player ****-ups? You know, Highsmith's flute play at FSU last season, Rodgers powering down against FSU a couple seasons back.

Did he avoid all plays where the opposing offenses were in 3+ wide and we stayed in base and walked our LBs out?

I really want to know the type of things that Macho saw as to where he'd come back here in D'onofrios corner. Maybe Golden isn't the only con man on the staff.
 
In all seriousness, I'm interested to know what D'onofrio showed City to have him see the light. Was it only the good plays and the obvious player ****-ups? You know, Highsmith's flute play at FSU last season, Rodgers powering down against FSU a couple seasons back.

Did he avoid all plays where the opposing offenses were in 3+ wide and we stayed in base and walked our LBs out?

I really want to know the type of things that Macho saw as to where he'd come back here in D'onofrios corner. Maybe Golden isn't the only con man on the staff.

my someone said it earlier, coach d is an economist. He knows everything about the Xs and Os. Everything. But none of his theories work in practice
 
In all seriousness, I'm interested to know what D'onofrio showed City to have him see the light. Was it only the good plays and the obvious player ****-ups? You know, Highsmith's flute play at FSU last season, Rodgers powering down against FSU a couple seasons back.

Did he avoid all plays where the opposing offenses were in 3+ wide and we stayed in base and walked our LBs out?

I really want to know the type of things that Macho saw as to where he'd come back here in D'onofrios corner. Maybe Golden isn't the only con man on the staff.

my someone said it earlier, coach d is an economist. He knows everything about the Xs and Os. Everything. But none of his theories work in practice

This.

Most failed coaches really know their stuff. Unfortunately they are unable to implement what they know into an effective scheme.
 
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Somebody who knew a lot about X's and O's wouldn't have a pass rushing OLB/DE covering slot WR's on two consecutive plays that led to first downs like Corch D does.
 
It was the one play the rok pointed out. The next play McCord was part of a 4-man front that had 6 in the box. Howard was the boundary corner.
 
And it was only one morning September 11, 2001 or one squeeze of the trigger or for want of a nail the kingdom was lost.

It was the one play the rok pointed out. The next play McCord was part of a 4-man front that had 6 in the box. Howard was the boundary corner.
 
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