Scrimmage thoughts

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Jun 19, 2013
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JW is unquestionably more polished than Perry. Better footwork, release, and placement. And yet, his completion percentage was identical (shouldve been worse actually) against the lesser defense, and worse the previous game.

Fundamentals are awesome, but you gotta put down that work as well. JW gotta outperform Perry.

So far, he has not.

I don't wanna hear about who looks better.

Who is making plays?
 
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Cribby

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Jan 30, 2012
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How do we know who goes through progressions better than who? By his head turning? We have no idea who the keys are, who he is looking at and how fast or accurately he is seeing what's happening. This is an absurd assessment based on nothing. One damn scrimmage that you likely did not attend cannot tell you who goes through their reads better.

I said this in another thread and will say it again. JW played against the two defense with walk ons at dt, safety and lbs. OF COURSE HE LOOKED GOOD IN A CLEAN POCKET. He didnt have Nesta collapsing **** on him. Let's stop making **** up to feed whatever narrative you are hoping plays out. Lol. We have seen Jarren throw 30 passes in the stuff they show us and the couple of scrimmages. How can we come to any definitive conclusions? The only thing we know is he hasn't played in a game yet and hasn't lost the faith of the fans. He is the shiny new toy and now everyone wants to crown him with a very limited data set.

He looks good and made some good throws and made a few really bad decisions. One could argue based on the bad decisions that he was not seeing things well and not going through his progressions well on those plays. Just sayin.
First off this isn’t saying who’s better , just like Kosi has the best arm talent. Williams has always looked more natural in the pocket , even last year as a freshmen.


Pocket presence is easy to tell , and so is going through progressions. Kosi stares down his first read most times , even in the scrimmage he was throwing to first progression. Which is good an all , but that’ll burn you in the end.

Kosi has average to below average pocket prescence. He has never moved the pocket well or felt the rush.

I don’t have a dog in the fight but mechanically and pocket fundamentals is all Williams. Does that mean he’ll win the job? Nah, Kosi is a work in progress , still.

He was an absolute mess when he arrived , horrible mechanics and had never been properly coached up to play the position:

William has the advantage there.
 
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TheU 4ever

Freshman
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Jan 25, 2019
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445
For those that weren't able to go, here are my random thoughts:

1. Saw a lot of big sets from Enos. There were a lot of 2 TE sets and plenty of Realus George. A lot of plays were run under center.
2. It is a two-man race between Kosi and Jarren. Tate is clearly well behind both. I'll discuss Tate later.

Kosi and Jarren were pretty close from what I saw. I'm no pro scout, but if I had to say, I'd say Jarren throws a better ball. I'd guess that the job will go to the QB that displays better maturity and really digs into the playbook. I have a feeling the stuff we don't see (locker room, meetings, etc.) will determine who wins the job. I wonder if Kosi's conduct last year will stain this coaching staff's views or expectations of him.

3. Tate. Rough day. Candidly, if I didn't know better, I'd say he was a non-scholarship kid. He struggled. He reminded me of that lefty UNC kid. He's got some real skills running the ball, but he's way behind the other 2. Also, at least from what we saw of the offense, if a majority of plays will be run under center, it doesn't seem like Enos' offense is built for him. Without the benefit of replay and a crappy vantage point, it seemed to me he couldn't set his feet because balls were landing several feet in front of receivers. I don't think the issue was a lack of arm strength. There was a slant to Njoku that was thrown well behind him.

4. KJ Osborn looks like he'll be this team's Braxton Berrios. They have a different game, but he looks like he'll be Mr. Dependable. Physically, he's also more developed than the other WRs on the roster. He'll be a solid rotation guy and catch 25-40 this year. I'd expect him to be the guy the QBs look to on critical downs. He had 5 catches (I was there through the 3rd) from what I saw, although I think he dropped a TD pass on what looked to me like a well-thrown ball by Jarren.

5. Will Mallory strikes me as an NFL player. It's a small sample size but he looks and plays the part. He had a really nice play getting away from a tackler and extending the play.

6. Cam'ron Harris was the player of the day, IMO. He had a long run and two "wow" moves that drew ahhs from the crowd. Deejay is awesome but Cam'ron looks like a home run hitter, particularly when he gets outside. I suspect Deejay will get more carries between the tackles and will be the go-to back when Enos wants to tire out a defense. Deejay craves contact. I suspect Cam'ron will have more opportunities to get outside in space and bake. RB is a strength of this team (and we didn't get a chance to see Lingard). I thought we'd miss Homer but we'll be fine.

7. Bethel and Pope took KRs to the house. There was a nice fake punt that Deejay (I think) nearly returned to the house.

8. Baxa missed one, but otherwise made 3 or 4. He'll be solid.

9. Neither JT4 nor Big Jon Ford played. Jon Ford is bigger than nearly everyone even without pads!

10. Jordan Miller looks the part. Thick, stocky kid.

11. Njoku is an interesting guy. There was one pass that he snared and high-pointed and looked great doing so. It seems to me that he has the capability to make highlight plays. Does he have the every-down consistency to be trustworthy though? I don't know. He looks like a boom or bust career here.

12. Pope took an end-around nearly to the house. That kid looks like a nightmare in the open field. Quick, shifty, and twitchy.

13. Rousseau in the huddle looks like the varsity guy that snuck onto JV. I've seen him in person and he's a legit 6'5." In cleats on the field, he towers over everyone else. He likely would've had a sack.

14. I'm concerned about OL play. I wasn't observing who was where but overall, the unit struggled I thought.

15. Sightings: Sheldrick Redwine, Malek Young and Jaelan Phillips.
Excellent overview! Thank you for sharing! I greatly appreciate it.
 

305to404CANE

Freshman
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Aug 4, 2016
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607
When Tate becomes comfortable coming from under center, I think he'll be fine. Now, will he is the 64k question. It's not natural for him yet, and his drops are dam awkward. His height affects his drop depth, and throws the whole timing off on the routes. That's why he has some many duck passes. Jarren looks good, so does Kosi, but they keep this quiet until the week before the UF game. This is probably going to be biggest summer for these QB developments in their lives. May the best man win!
 

mydas77

Sophomore
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Jul 24, 2012
Messages
621
First off this isn’t saying who’s better , just like Kosi has the best arm talent. Williams has always looked more natural in the pocket , even last year as a freshmen.


Pocket presence is easy to tell , and so is going through progressions. Kosi states down his first read most times , even in the scrimmage he was throwing to first progression. Which is good an all , but that’ll burn you in the end.

Kosi has average to below average pocket prescence. He has never moved the pocket well of felt the rush.

I don’t have a dog in the fight but mechanically and pocket fundamentals is all Williams. Does that mean he’ll win the job? Nah, Kosi is a work on prigrsss , still.

He was an absolute mess when he arrived , horrible mechanics and had never been properly coached up to play the position:

Willians has the advantage there:
He looks calm and completed passes. That is what I can see. I refuse to speak to how well he goes through progressions because I dont know what he is supposed to be doing. Is he doing the right things and identifying keys? I have not seen him coming off guy 1 and two to hit guy three. I seen him throw the ball to open people and covered people. He has good ball placement. Throws a pretty ball. Almost threw a few picks.

All that presence you are talking about is not real yet. These are controlled situations with them not being live. DTs really collapsing the pocket and real d-ends coming at him will determine if he has all this awareness and presence. Let's not make things up. We build these guys up based on nothing then turn on them when they dont posses the characteristics we heap on them blindly.
 

swampcougar1

Redshirt Freshman
Joined
Nov 5, 2011
Messages
819
Enjoyed reading the thoughts. My belief is the players who put s in the most effort during the summer will be ahead this fall . Right now all are learning a totally new offense.
 
Joined
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Messages
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How do we know who goes through progressions better than who? By his head turning? We have no idea who the keys are, who he is looking at and how fast or accurately he is seeing what's happening. This is an absurd assessment based on nothing. One damn scrimmage that you likely did not attend cannot tell you who goes through their reads better.

I said this in another thread and will say it again. JW played against the two defense with walk ons at dt, safety and lbs. OF COURSE HE LOOKED GOOD IN A CLEAN POCKET. He didnt have Nesta collapsing **** on him. Let's stop making **** up to feed whatever narrative you are hoping plays out. Lol. We have seen Jarren throw 30 passes in the stuff they show us and the couple of scrimmages. How can we come to any definitive conclusions? The only thing we know is he hasn't played in a game yet and hasn't lost the faith of the fans. He is the shiny new toy and now everyone wants to crown him with a very limited data set.

He looks good and made some good throws and made a few really bad decisions. One could argue based on the bad decisions that he was not seeing things well and not going through his progressions well on those plays. Just sayin.
I keep telling people he played against the backups and walk ons. I saw 4 to 5 white dudes on defense😁
 

brock

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Dec 4, 2011
Messages
29,267
Not going to glean too much from Tate performance, he made a few good throws and a couple of bad ones but bottom line his drives were pretty damn short with not a lot of plays to get a feel of what he really can do. Just think about it, first drive 3 and out I think. Next one after a great throw to Osborn for 15-20 yards he had an int(I believe It was pass interference on that play). Next series after that he got a first down with a throw to pope. A walk on dropped a passed that was spot on(i believe Marshall few) .Then he tripped on a roll out which was for a sack. After that threw a bad pass so basically only a handful of plays there. Next drive he had a pass to Dallas for 10 yards and then deejay bust one for 40 or so. Too little of a sample size for the way people was sh*tting on martell the other day IMO
 
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Canemang

Senior
Joined
Nov 2, 2011
Messages
4,734
How do we know who goes through progressions better than who? By his head turning? We have no idea who the keys are, who he is looking at and how fast or accurately he is seeing what's happening. This is an absurd assessment based on nothing. One damn scrimmage that you likely did not attend cannot tell you who goes through their reads better.

I said this in another thread and will say it again. JW played against the two defense with walk ons at dt, safety and lbs. OF COURSE HE LOOKED GOOD IN A CLEAN POCKET. He didnt have Nesta collapsing **** on him. Let's stop making **** up to feed whatever narrative you are hoping plays out. Lol. We have seen Jarren throw 30 passes in the stuff they show us and the couple of scrimmages. How can we come to any definitive conclusions? The only thing we know is he hasn't played in a game yet and hasn't lost the faith of the fans. He is the shiny new toy and now everyone wants to crown him with a very limited data set.

He looks good and made some good throws and made a few really bad decisions. One could argue based on the bad decisions that he was not seeing things well and not going through his progressions well on those plays. Just sayin.
Is your last name Martell or Perry?
 

BoxingRobes

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Aug 24, 2013
Messages
3,579
I'd be careful to write off Tate Martell. He looked like sh!t, but I'd still be careful here.

One...his ability to run the football at the very least gets him packages both situational and drive specific. Its a skill set the other two do not have. Even Ohio State with a first round QB worked to get him on the field. We'd be foolish not to do the same at the least, in the red zone and in short yardage situations.

Two...its the spring game and your takeaways on the negatives should always be cautious...you just really cant tell much.

Otherwise, good write up.
 
Joined
Jul 21, 2012
Messages
1,927
For those that weren't able to go, here are my random thoughts:

1. Saw a lot of big sets from Enos. There were a lot of 2 TE sets and plenty of Realus George. A lot of plays were run under center.
2. It is a two-man race between Kosi and Jarren. Tate is clearly well behind both. I'll discuss Tate later.

Kosi and Jarren were pretty close from what I saw. I'm no pro scout, but if I had to say, I'd say Jarren throws a better ball. I'd guess that the job will go to the QB that displays better maturity and really digs into the playbook. I have a feeling the stuff we don't see (locker room, meetings, etc.) will determine who wins the job. I wonder if Kosi's conduct last year will stain this coaching staff's views or expectations of him.

3. Tate. Rough day. Candidly, if I didn't know better, I'd say he was a non-scholarship kid. He struggled. He reminded me of that lefty UNC kid. He's got some real skills running the ball, but he's way behind the other 2. Also, at least from what we saw of the offense, if a majority of plays will be run under center, it doesn't seem like Enos' offense is built for him. Without the benefit of replay and a crappy vantage point, it seemed to me he couldn't set his feet because balls were landing several feet in front of receivers. I don't think the issue was a lack of arm strength. There was a slant to Njoku that was thrown well behind him.

4. KJ Osborn looks like he'll be this team's Braxton Berrios. They have a different game, but he looks like he'll be Mr. Dependable. Physically, he's also more developed than the other WRs on the roster. He'll be a solid rotation guy and catch 25-40 this year. I'd expect him to be the guy the QBs look to on critical downs. He had 5 catches (I was there through the 3rd) from what I saw, although I think he dropped a TD pass on what looked to me like a well-thrown ball by Jarren.

5. Will Mallory strikes me as an NFL player. It's a small sample size but he looks and plays the part. He had a really nice play getting away from a tackler and extending the play.

6. Cam'ron Harris was the player of the day, IMO. He had a long run and two "wow" moves that drew ahhs from the crowd. Deejay is awesome but Cam'ron looks like a home run hitter, particularly when he gets outside. I suspect Deejay will get more carries between the tackles and will be the go-to back when Enos wants to tire out a defense. Deejay craves contact. I suspect Cam'ron will have more opportunities to get outside in space and bake. RB is a strength of this team (and we didn't get a chance to see Lingard). I thought we'd miss Homer but we'll be fine.

7. Bethel and Pope took KRs to the house. There was a nice fake punt that Deejay (I think) nearly returned to the house.

8. Baxa missed one, but otherwise made 3 or 4. He'll be solid.

9. Neither JT4 nor Big Jon Ford played. Jon Ford is bigger than nearly everyone even without pads!

10. Jordan Miller looks the part. Thick, stocky kid.

11. Njoku is an interesting guy. There was one pass that he snared and high-pointed and looked great doing so. It seems to me that he has the capability to make highlight plays. Does he have the every-down consistency to be trustworthy though? I don't know. He looks like a boom or bust career here.

12. Pope took an end-around nearly to the house. That kid looks like a nightmare in the open field. Quick, shifty, and twitchy.

13. Rousseau in the huddle looks like the varsity guy that snuck onto JV. I've seen him in person and he's a legit 6'5." In cleats on the field, he towers over everyone else. He likely would've had a sack.

14. I'm concerned about OL play. I wasn't observing who was where but overall, the unit struggled I thought.

15. Sightings: Sheldrick Redwine, Malek Young and Jaelan Phillips.
i was there and i concur with this opinion generally. Mallory is Greg Olsen Jr. (the NFL version). I think it was Bandy that ran the fake punt.

Jordan Miller is not going to sniff the field. We have major depth issues at LB, CB and safety. Can't wait to see the incoming freshmen.
 

brock

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i was there and i concur with this opinion generally. Mallory is Greg Olsen Jr. (the NFL version). I think it was Bandy that ran the fake punt.

Jordan Miller is not going to sniff the field. We have major depth issues at LB, CB and safety. Can't wait to see the incoming freshmen.
Was reading one of their spring reports but even Bama says they have major depth issues at multiple spots including safety. Happens every where
 

D RevLee

Graduated from hungry, and made it to greedy
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How many top 25 offenses from past year got under center as much as we have seen from Enos thus far? Just something to think about.
 

loeTed92

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Nov 24, 2017
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How many top 25 offenses from past year got under center as much as we have seen from Enos thus far? Just something to think about.
Georgia and slightly Alabama. Also I get where you’re trying to go with this. I think top 50 offense is more realistic for us.
 

D RevLee

Graduated from hungry, and made it to greedy
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Georgia and slightly Alabama. Also I get where you’re trying to go with this. I think top 50 offense is more realistic for us.
Those are both teams that would put up numbers running any offense bc of how much talent they have. Meanwhile u have teams like UCF, Houston, Utah St. averaging 500+ yds a game and never going under center.

I'd say around 90% the top 25 offenses last year rarely, if ever, got under the center. All 3 of are QBs are more comfortable in the spread and the majority of high school recruits are coming from a spread offense. I'm going to wait and see what it looks like in an actual game, but if Enos thinks going under center and calling plays from the huddle is going to work he will not be here long.
 
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How do we know who goes through progressions better than who? By his head turning? We have no idea who the keys are, who he is looking at and how fast or accurately he is seeing what's happening. This is an absurd assessment based on nothing. One damn scrimmage that you likely did not attend cannot tell you who goes through their reads better.

I said this in another thread and will say it again. JW played against the two defense with walk ons at dt, safety and lbs. OF COURSE HE LOOKED GOOD IN A CLEAN POCKET. He didnt have Nesta collapsing **** on him. Let's stop making **** up to feed whatever narrative you are hoping plays out. Lol. We have seen Jarren throw 30 passes in the stuff they show us and the couple of scrimmages. How can we come to any definitive conclusions? The only thing we know is he hasn't played in a game yet and hasn't lost the faith of the fans. He is the shiny new toy and now everyone wants to crown him with a very limited data set.

He looks good and made some good throws and made a few really bad decisions. One could argue based on the bad decisions that he was not seeing things well and not going through his progressions well on those plays. Just sayin.
Well since were just making stuff up he went against the ones as well as they rotated QBs with the ones. But carry on against those pushing an agenda, dont want facts to get in the way of your argument.
 
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