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OT: Was Kobe the most competitive player in league history?

CaneSince4Ever said:
Correction, without Red Auerbach Johnson & Parish wouldn't be HOFers, Johnson & Parish were already Made Men before Auerbach swung those deals to acquire them...Bird had nothing to do with that.

And LOL, LMAO, BOL, & LMFO at using steals as the only metric to judge defensive prowess.
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i know we love playing what if’s here but Len bias on those Celtics teams - wooohee
 
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competitive desire WOW, Bird, Magic, MJ, Russel class is small and Kobe is in it
but top of charts ?????
 
HarryCarayisGoat said:
I don’t recall Kobe being loved this much when he was alive. And I did like Kobe a lot but all this hype is nuts.
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I’m going to assume you you weren’t born in the 90’s because he is the Michael Jordan or Lebron of that generation without a doubt. The dude is loved not just in the US but worldwide. All of this love being shown by people is real.
 
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Ksoze8 said:
I’m going to assume you you weren’t born in the 90’s because he is the Michael Jordan or Lebron of that generation without a doubt. The dude is loved not just in the US but worldwide. All of this love being shown by people is real.
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I get that and I was raised in the MJ era, but I was still young when KOBE arrived. I was a big fan but still didn’t realize he was loved this much. There was a huge faction of people that felt Shaq carried him to 3 titles, a faction of people that felt he was a ball hog, a faction of people that felt he was a rapist...etc. All that being said, it’s clear he was a bigger icon than I previously was aware of and I do see that the love he is getting now is real.
 
For sure K Bryant is among NBAs greatest. THE #1 in any category?

Tough to say with the standards also set by other greats--Bird, Johnson, Chamberline, West, Abdul-Jabbar, James, oh...and some dude named Jordan...
 
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craval85 said:
He's by far one of the most transcendent athletes in the history of sports. If you don't realize that, then you're simply not paying close enough attention.
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Huh?

What does that even mean? Seriously?

I would offer you start throwing that around, you better come with Jim Brown, Jackie Robinson, Arthur Ashe, Billie Jean King, Muhammed Ali kind of thunder.

20 years from now, I suspect people won't be talking bout Bryant like they still talk about most of those names above today.

If anything, this next year will be interesting. Some powerful media forces aren't feeling the Saint Kobe crowd for sure. Complicated legacy that will ALWAYS (right or wrong) have an asterisk.
 
Empirical Cane said:
Huh?

What does that even mean? Seriously?

I would offer you start throwing that around, you better come with Jim Brown, Jackie Robinson, Arthur Ashe, Billie Jean King, Muhammed Ali kind of thunder.

20 years from now, I suspect people won't be talking bout Bryant like they still talk about most of those names above today.

If anything, this next year will be interesting. Some powerful media forces aren't feeling the Saint Kobe crowd for sure. Complicated legacy that will ALWAYS (right or wrong) have an asterisk.
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If you think he was only a basketball player, and nothing more, then there's really nothing for me & you to discuss. Complicated legacy because he was ACCUSED of rape almost 20 yrs ago??? Do you also realize what he was doing for women empowerment and women's basketball at the time of his death or did you accidentally forget that? If you're going to say someone has a complicated legacy, make sure you also examine the totality of one's life, and not just one incident.
 
OFFICIAL Top 10 players in NBA History list...

1. Lebron James and it’s not even close

2a. Kobe Bryant - took what Jordan did and made it better. Jordan never scored 81.

2b. Michael Jordan - Great player but will continue to move down the list by the time other current players retire.

4. Kevin Durant - could eventually be the 2nd best player of all time behind Lebron.

5. Shaq O’Neal - Permanently In the top 5.

6. Kawhi Leonard - could eventually be a top 3 player all time with Lebron and KD.

7. Allen Iverson
8. Giannis Antenkompou - could eventually be in the top 5 all time.
9. Magic Johnson
10a. Anthony Davis
10b. James Harden
 
craval85 said:
If you think he was only a basketball player, and nothing more, then there's really nothing for me & you to discuss. Complicated legacy because he was ACCUSED of rape almost 20 yrs ago??? Do you also realize what he was doing for women empowerment and women's basketball at the time of his death or did you accidentally forget that? If you're going to say someone has a complicated legacy, make sure you also examine the totality of one's life, and not just one incident.
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Please tell me about the elite athlete who was accused of rape AND kidnapping AND was forced to read an apology in court AND paid a massive civil settlement AND empowered girls sports.

Like I said, he will (right or wrong) have an asterisk.

Not attacking the guy, but it is a fascinating psych lab on the Saint Kobe crowd who then go all pollo loco on [insert celebrity/politico] for thematically what the absolve of his own acknowledged behaviors.
 
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KrazyCane said:
OFFICIAL Top 10 players in NBA History list...

1. Lebron James and it’s not even close

2a. Kobe Bryant - took what Jordan did and made it better. Jordan never scored 81.

2b. Michael Jordan - Great player but will continue to move down the list by the time other current players retire.

4. Kevin Durant - could eventually be the 2nd best player of all time behind Lebron.

5. Shaq O’Neal - Permanently In the top 5.

6. Kawhi Leonard - could eventually be a top 3 player all time with Lebron and KD.

7. Allen Iverson
8. Giannis Antenkompou - could eventually be in the top 5 all time.
9. Magic Johnson
10a. Anthony Davis
10b. James Harden
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This is precisely what it's like talking about sports with my son (not a compliment).

Let me guess you've got Patrick Mahomes ahead of Tom Brady?
 


Wish I could have been there for this.

All the greats were highly competitive. It's what made them great.
 
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KrazyCane said:
OFFICIAL Top 10 players in NBA History list...

1. Lebron James and it’s not even close

2a. Kobe Bryant - took what Jordan did and made it better. Jordan never scored 81.

2b. Michael Jordan - Great player but will continue to move down the list by the time other current players retire.

4. Kevin Durant - could eventually be the 2nd best player of all time behind Lebron.

5. Shaq O’Neal - Permanently In the top 5.

6. Kawhi Leonard - could eventually be a top 3 player all time with Lebron and KD.

7. Allen Iverson
8. Giannis Antenkompou - could eventually be in the top 5 all time.
9. Magic Johnson
10a. Anthony Davis
10b. James Harden
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Lmao
 
Kobe is definitely one of the most competitive athletes/people ever but we are arguing something that is immeasurable. I love Some of the old school basketball players and think MJ is also the best or one of the best ever but with all due respect the competition at that time (aside from the Birds or Magic’s) was not on the same level of competition that Kobe or LeBron have played against. Simply put athletes now are bigger, stronger, faster and more athletic. I’m not saying that makes Kobe better I’m just saying it’s something to consider. As people get older they have a hard time accepting that who or what they thought was the best can be surpassed. (Like people who genuinely believe that in his prime Mike Tyson wouldn’t beat a Muhammad Ali or that some 70’s/ 80’s football team would somehow not get stomped by a modern day one) we should stop calling people the best ever and just accept that they were the best of their time/era. I’m so grateful to have watched him play and have been a lifelong laker fan. He was most certainly more than just special. He was amazing and his haters can suck a fat one.

2 of the GOATS
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sdaly12 said:
competitive desire WOW, Bird, Magic, MJ, Russel class is small and Kobe is in it
but top of charts ?????
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It's MJ imo, and it ain't even close. I'd even put Zeke over Kobe.

Those dudes had to slay legendary dragons to get to the top of the mountain.

Kobe, while a dog, had a bit of an easier path. He basically had to get by Tim Duncan and that was it (who was no pushover, btw).
 
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