NCAA maybe in a big trouble

[DCH]

They were probably subpoenaed as part of the bankruptcy proceeding. I dont know/care what it means in terms of criminal liability for the bank employees, but in all likelihood the checks and any evidence subsequently produced as a result will be tossed and its just more evidence that the investigation as a whole is irretrievably compromised.

 

[Andrew]

Would these bank records not have been requested in the bankruptcy trial?

 

[DCH]

Would these bank records not have been requested in the bankruptcy trial?

They are Frank Haith's personal records. Unless someone (i.e. Shapiro/Perez/the NCAA) suggested they might demonstrate that Haith possessed or received some of Shapiro's illegally obtained funds they would be of no relevance. Therefore its hard to imagine a scenario in which they came up in the bankruptcy proceeding unless it was at the suggestion of Shapiro/Perez/the NCAA

 

[MIA42178]

Would these bank records not have been requested in the bankruptcy trial?

They are Frank Haith's personal records. Unless someone (i.e. Shapiro/Perez/the NCAA) suggested they might demonstrate that Haith possessed or received some of Shapiro's illegally obtained funds they would be of no relevance. Therefore its hard to imagine a scenario in which they came up in the bankruptcy proceeding unless it was at the suggestion of Shapiro/Perez/the NCAA

Strong point DCH. Could likely be using the bankruptcy proceedings to issue subpoenas to obtain information it couldn't have otherwise.

Dayum

 

[sabrose]

Sounds like it was more of a Bank of America issue. They are the ones ultimately responsible for turning them over, unless the NCAA provided something making it look like they had the power to obtain the check images.

Sounds like the bank messed up. I highly doubt the NCAA had some court order to obtain these but at the same time I don't think they illegally obtained them. It could be as simple as they said "we're conducting an investigation and we need to see these checks." Stupid bank employee may have just turned them over.



Maybe it is nothing then.

It just is amazing and what keeps coming.

Sorry consigliere Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Its illegal to possess those copies unless authorized by Haith. These were NCAA attorneys and they should darn well know the law.

 

[MIA42178]

Yo DCH, can't remember but aren't subpoenas part of the docket and court record that can be searched by the public as long as you got a PACER account for the SFL US Bankruptcy court?

And, if so, where is the SFL UM lawyer with a PACER account who's gonna search it for us?

 

[Consigliere]

Sounds like it was more of a Bank of America issue. They are the ones ultimately responsible for turning them over, unless the NCAA provided something making it look like they had the power to obtain the check images.

Sounds like the bank messed up. I highly doubt the NCAA had some court order to obtain these but at the same time I don't think they illegally obtained them. It could be as simple as they said "we're conducting an investigation and we need to see these checks." Stupid bank employee may have just turned them over.



Maybe it is nothing then.

It just is amazing and what keeps coming.

Sorry consigliere Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Its illegal to possess those copies unless authorized by Haith. These were NCAA attorneys and they should darn well know the law.

I am aware. Just curious how these checks got into the NCAA hands.

 

[fatnasty187]

Trust me Consigliere...its not that simple. Try walking into a bank and say that your doing an investigation and you need to obtain records of one of their clients. First words out of their mouth is "Where is the court order for these documents". Privacy is a huge issue for banks and never taken lightly, even to those lowly bank employees. Trust that request would have went thru a manager on duty.

Sounds like it was more of a Bank of America issue. They are the ones ultimately responsible for turning them over, unless the NCAA provided something making it look like they had the power to obtain the check images.

Sounds like the bank messed up. I highly doubt the NCAA had some court order to obtain these but at the same time I don't think they illegally obtained them. It could be as simple as they said "we're conducting an investigation and we need to see these checks." Stupid bank employee may have just turned them over.

Maybe it is nothing then.

It just is amazing and what keeps coming.

I know first hand what it takes to get copies of checks, without going into detail, unless some brain dead teller made a grave error, now way in **** this happened without legal documentation. Considering if it was anything older than 18 months, certain requests have to be made, if by a third party there has to be a legal document with said request.

 

[canes1977]

I assume the NCAA's own internal investigation revealed this?

 

[eliteproxy]

Trust me Consigliere...its not that simple. Try walking into a bank and say that your doing an investigation and you need to obtain records of one of their clients. First words out of their mouth is "Where is the court order for these documents". Privacy is a huge issue for banks and never taken lightly, even to those lowly bank employees. Trust that request would have went thru a manager on duty.

Sounds like it was more of a Bank of America issue. They are the ones ultimately responsible for turning them over, unless the NCAA provided something making it look like they had the power to obtain the check images.

Sounds like the bank messed up. I highly doubt the NCAA had some court order to obtain these but at the same time I don't think they illegally obtained them. It could be as simple as they said "we're conducting an investigation and we need to see these checks." Stupid bank employee may have just turned them over.

Maybe it is nothing then.

It just is amazing and what keeps coming.

I know first hand what it takes to get copies of checks, without going into detail, unless some brain dead teller made a grave error, now way in **** this happened without legal documentation. Considering if it was anything older than 18 months, certain requests have to be made, if by a third party there has to be a legal document with said request.

this... i request canceled checks from banks all the time.

Even when its me they still take me through a long verification process AND.. they charge you for it! Bank of American may be a ***** up but they usually ***** you out of money.

And it would not be a teller that would of made mistake if it was B of A issue, someone in corporate office and they are allot smarter than an average teller.

I think this is Perez doings

 

[Ghandi]

At this point, I am more interested in the civil ramifications of this finding.

-Who gets ****ed? Jail time? Monetary damages?
-Who does the penetrating? Is it the justice department first then the civil stuff

 

[stat1124]

Civil ramifications will have no bearing on the fate of the NCAA. I am much more concerned with the criminal ramifications because they can be BIG DEAL!

At this point, I am more interested in the civil ramifications of this finding.

-Who gets ****ed? Jail time? Monetary damages?
-Who does the penetrating? Is it the justice department first then the civil stuff

 

[CanefaninBuckeyeland]

B of A's headquarters are here in Cleveland and a friend of mine is a VP. You better believe I'll be asking him about access to bank info.

B of A is not based out of Cleveland. The bank is based in Charlotte, NC and has been there for 20+ years. There's not even a branch in within a 100 miles of Cleveland.

Bank of America bought MBNA (who at the time was owned by the Lerner family, former Browns owner) circa 2005. Though the world headquarters are indeed based out of Charlotte (I will give you credit for that), the credit card division of BofA is based out of Cleveland. Basically, we're both correct. Anyway, I will still speak with my friend.

 

[CandyCane]

Bank of America has a large operation in Cleveland that was formerly MBNA. It's located in Beachwood.

 

[CandyCane]

Fact is the NCAA officials have probably already violated both Federal and State statutes. I believe the State of Florida is willing to jump in to the legal battle and as someone here pointed out indicted NCAA officials won't fall on a sword and they'll spill their guts. Discovery is going to be interesting and remember Miami is entitled to the Haith discovery.

 

[stat1124]

Tim Reynolds ‏@ByTimReynolds 9m

Miami's NCAA hearing in Indianapolis has been moved up one day to June 13. Committee on Infractions hoping to wrap it up in three days.

 

[eliteproxy]

Tim Reynolds ‏@ByTimReynolds 9m

Miami's NCAA hearing in Indianapolis has been moved up one day to June 13. Committee on Infractions hoping to wrap it up in three days.

just so everyone knows.. they mean the hearing wrapped up in 3 days not the entire process

 

[stat1124]

Man I wish that WAS the case. We will be lucky if we hear anything before late July after the hearing has concluded.

Tim Reynolds ‏@ByTimReynolds 9m

Miami's NCAA hearing in Indianapolis has been moved up one day to June 13. Committee on Infractions hoping to wrap it up in three days.

just so everyone knows.. they mean the hearing wrapped up in 3 days not the entire process

 

[BigCaneAl]

B of A's headquarters are here in Cleveland and a friend of mine is a VP. You better believe I'll be asking him about access to bank info.

B of A is not based out of Cleveland. The bank is based in Charlotte, NC and has been there for 20+ years. There's not even a branch in within a 100 miles of Cleveland.

Bank of America bought MBNA (who at the time was owned by the Lerner family, former Browns owner) circa 2005. Though the world headquarters are indeed based out of Charlotte (I will give you credit for that), the credit card division of BofA is based out of Cleveland. Basically, we're both correct. Anyway, I will still speak with my friend.

not a knock on your friend....but isn't just about everyone working for a bank a VP? Sure seems like it in Miami.

 

[DCH]

Yo DCH, can't remember but aren't subpoenas part of the docket and court record that can be searched by the public as long as you got a PACER account for the SFL US Bankruptcy court?

And, if so, where is the SFL UM lawyer with a PACER account who's gonna search it for us?

I don't know much about bankruptcy proceedings but generally in federal court subpoenas and other discovery documents aren't filed on the docket.