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Mirrored Concepts

duke4heisman said:
Lol, sorry friend. Obviously your QB experience and extensive film review FAR exceeds our QB corch. Damnit mane, no offense. I really appreciate your insight and breakdowns but the "everything is peachy mob" will make every excuse imaginable to justify it.
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No. We are all good. I know you showed blitz. And it is my job to beat it. ;)
 
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Roman Marciante said:
It is time to break the glass. Miami is running a TON of mirrored concepts and it is limiting some of the potential of this offense in my opinion. (Especially on third downs) A mirrored concept is when you have two receivers on one side of the field running the exact same thing as the other side. I am going to parallel two clips in which I will show you two teams from 2x2 sets. Both will go up against a blitz.

In Miami's instance you will see that the mirrored concept Miami runs really wasn't designed to beat the blitz. The routes were running longer then the quarterback had time to throw. Kosi was flushed from the pocket and looked to run. Honestly that was his only option. (Great blitz design by Pitt-Got Miami to set protection one way and Pitt came from the other side)



Now you will note Georgia in a 2x2 set. (tight) Essentially this is a play designed to attack more of the field and has good field spread with a natural blitz beater. (The drag) The design to have the opposite slot run across the field allowed a third receiver to come into view of the quarterback. This played dividends. If you mirrored this concept and the slot ran an out on the opposite side, he never comes into view and this play probably goes for a sack. (UGA runs a switch)



From the Perch this year highlighted how Miami needs to get better vs the blitz. Ultimately you do that by allowing the quarterback to survey the field and identify the blitzer instead of mandating the quarterback just wait for the snap while the offensive line sets the protections. Then you need to have routes that come into the field of view of the quarterback that are "hot" vs the blitz. You cannot really do that with mirrored concepts.

Time to have a more mature system and have the quarterback/OC tandem get to the level in which I saw last night. UGA did not run a single mirrored concept vs Alabama last night (I am not completely anti mirrored routes btw) But the UGA offense showed multiple formations, spread concepts, motions and it was one of the more brilliant game plans I saw this year. Very impressed. Just figured I would share a random thought.
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How do you know that wasn't a QB recognition problem from Perry? To adjust the call according to blitz? I also like what I saw from UGA and expected that from Richt.
 
Are we running mirrored concepts and such basic plays over and over because of Kosis lack of experience / the OCs lack of faith in the QB so he’s trying to simplify?
 
Roman Marciante said:
I knew this was coming. That is why I was strategic in posting a clip of both offensive lines being beaten by the blitz.

UGA has a better offensive line. I won't deny that. I could start a thread how they created mismatch in the run game using DUO blocks and spread concepts.
UGA has a very good smart QB.

But I wasn't blown away by UGA's wide receiver talent and I think our running backs are very comparable to theirs this year. (not last year) Also I think Brevin is a stud and bows down to no tight end. I really won't argue and say we have better talent than UGA although in certain areas I think we do.
But I asked an ESPN analyst specifically this question and he replied "Oh no, Miami definitely has the talent." (Sorry for the big league moment there :)

I think we can recruit better along the offensive line. I think we can get more out of our quarterbacks. I think our offensive system needs a complete overhaul. I am a mixture of everything.
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I was at this game since no Canes game yesterday (just being honest ) and their running backs seem to have a different gear. Maybe I am just beat up from our crap season but it seemed like they would wait for a block or the pass (yes a pass to a RB) and they would turn on the jets.

Also, we have talent ... we have some dudes. But we are missing leadership , process , structure etc. Some of the guys on here have been saying this for a real long time. I don’t think it necessarily has to do with money either. Although that might help. Lol
 
Mahoney-Pearson said:
How do you know that wasn't a QB recognition problem from Perry? To adjust the call according to blitz? I also like what I saw from UGA and expected that from Richt.
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For several reasons. Miami has shown a propensity for mirrored switch concepts the whole year regardless of blitz or not. (The HB releasing can be the blitz beater) But when you make a concerted effort to use slide protection (in this case) the hb got involved and went right to block. So the offensive line absolutely knew a blitz was coming. (They just slid the protection the wrong way because of a pre snap disguise by pitt)

So that was the issue for me. QB needs to know this is coming too. And if you are using slide protection with an hb to block there is no designed blitz beater here when the receivers are running mirrored switch routes.

A mature system, would have a qb understand the protection see the blitz, and adjust something. None of that happened here. But when you see it week to week you are either teaching it that way or allowing it to happen.
 
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Rd745 said:
Are we running mirrored concepts and such basic plays over and over because of Kosis lack of experience / the OCs lack of faith in the QB so he’s trying to simplify?
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That would be a perfectly good explanation for this. But there is also so many easy concepts, other than mirrored routes, that could help Kosi out in the passing game that are simply not utilized.
 
Roman Marciante said:
That would be a perfectly good explanation for this. But there is also so many easy concepts, other than mirrored routes, that could help Kosi out in the passing game that are simply not utilized.
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right, maybe this why it's taken him so long to play despite his "talent"?

You're saying the protection demonstrated blitz recognition but the QB didn't, which tells me it's a QB recognition or processing problem. Our offense isn't one that checks with the sideline to adjust plays and he should have the ability to adjust the call to the blitz, which I'm sure is the case. I could see an argument for why he isn't developed well enough to "get us in the right play", but criticizing the concept suggests a rigidity in our offense that I don't believe is there.

You're making the assumption that Perry can't adjust the play in this situation, which is huge assumption that I don't believe to be true. If you know for a fact this is the case then I completely agree with you, but if it's not then you're shooting from the hip.
 
Roman Marciante said:
I knew this was coming. That is why I was strategic in posting a clip of both offensive lines being beaten by the blitz.

UGA has a better offensive line. I won't deny that. I could start a thread how they created mismatch in the run game using DUO blocks and spread concepts.
UGA has a very good smart QB.

But I wasn't blown away by UGA's wide receiver talent and I think our running backs are very comparable to theirs this year. (not last year) Also I think Brevin is a stud and bows down to no tight end. I really won't argue and say we have better talent than UGA although in certain areas I think we do.
But I asked an ESPN analyst specifically this question and he replied "Oh no, Miami definitely has the talent." (Sorry for the big league moment there :)

I think we can recruit better along the offensive line. I think we can get more out of our quarterbacks. I think our offensive system needs a complete overhaul. I am a mixture of everything.
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You feel we have talent on offense. Your ESPN contact feels we have talent. Our o line is terrible. Our receivers can’t get separation and when they do often drop the ball. Our QBs are a disaster. Homer and Dallas are average running backs. There are probably 10 rbs in acc as good and better. That covers our offensive lineup. Can you advise me with players names of talented players we currently have on offense.
 
Formation makes a big difference too. You made that a footnote at the end but the UGA play you showed is an example of what tight splits can do for an offense. With Richt it's wide spread isolation routes every time - pretty much eliminates the middle of field, makes crossers less effective, switch releases are slower and less effective, etc. Richt is not a student of the game and there's ample evidence that he's on what amounts to paid retirement.
 
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Mahoney-Pearson said:
right, maybe this why it's taken him so long to play despite his "talent"?

You're saying the protection demonstrated blitz recognition but the QB didn't, which tells me it's a QB recognition or processing problem. Our offense isn't one that checks with the sideline to adjust plays and he should have the ability to adjust the call to the blitz, which I'm sure is the case. I could see an argument for why he isn't developed well enough to "get us in the right play", but criticizing the concept suggests a rigidity in our offense that I don't believe is there.

You're making the assumption that Perry can't adjust the play in this situation, which is huge assumption that I don't believe to be true. If you know for a fact this is the case then I completely agree with you, but if it's not then you're shooting from the hip.
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I wouldn't say I am shooting from the hip here. You are correct in saying that there is no check with me system. There isn't. The offensive line sets the protections. True statement. By going silent count, the quarterback (by design) is not checking into right plays based on late walk ups simply because he is waiting for the snap to come intently while the offensive line is still actively setting protections. While that process is going on, the qb mental picture can change and the offense has been victimized multiple times this year by these blitz varieties. That I could gladly show you on film.

The natural blitz beater built into this offense is usually the boundary side slant flat progression. On 2x2 it is the halfback check or flat. Those are both ture. When Miami kept more into block this game vs pitt, it came with a cost. The mirrored 2x2 had none of the customary blitz beaters attached with it.. It essentially put the qb on an island. It relied on the offensive line protecting right and having the quarterback read the field beyond that.

I have never once caught miami audibling this year from 2x2 and running a split call. I had Mark Richt actually calling the same mirrored switch combo 5 out of 6 times on third and long going over the course of two games. That was run vs varied coverages and never once sight adjusted. The mirrored routes run the mirrored routes that is as rigid as it gets.

I don't want to say "trust me" beyond that. But I had a way to double check my math on this one. If I looked at my paper right that is. But some concepts in this offense have adjusted capabilities, in this case. No.

Still, the over reliance of mirrored concepts is extremely evident in this offense, and it was my opinion that it limits this offense at times. That's all. Great counter argument though.
 
Hemsleysalmons said:
You feel we have talent on offense. Your ESPN contact feels we have talent. Our o line is terrible. Our receivers can’t get separation and when they do often drop the ball. Our QBs are a disaster. Homer and Dallas are average running backs. There are probably 10 rbs in acc as good and better. That covers our offensive lineup. Can you advise me with players names of talented players we currently have on offense.
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Wide receiver took at hit with the loss of jt4 and ahmmon. No doubt. Miami not as deep as it once was. Need some of the younger guys like, pope, ezzard, hightower to take a step. We need them to.

Home is about to be a 1000 yard back. Needs like 31 more yards. That is not bad. Dallas is our playmaker (don't get me started on how we use him) I think that is a better one two punch than you allude to.

Brevin and Mallory, although young, are special talents. Brevin was going to be an all acc tight end if he didn't get hurt. Freshman all american type.

Quarterback? I predicted on the pod earlier with d$ that he would usurp rosier. I wasn't too far off there although there was some bumps. But we need better play at the moment from that position. Both guys didn't perform at a level needed that we needed them to.

That is my honest assessment of the players. But in the same breath, that was enough talent to win the worst division in p5. :)
 
Earnest T. Bass said:
Every team mentioned have real offensive lines and running attacks that take over games against good opponents.

You can scheme your **** off and a poor offensive line will make the best offensive coordinator appear to be inept.

Mark Richt didn't suddenly become a bad offensive mind and coach as the Herd claims. He has been dogged over the last two years by an offensive line that wouldn't see even one player being good enough to qualify as a back-up for Alabama, Clemson, Georgia and a gaggle of other top 10 teams.

Fix the offensive line and just like how the Herd now worships Diaz, they will be claiming that all along they were telling everyone that Richt is an offensive genius, and start attacking Blake James for not giving him a longer contract extension.
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Mark Richt had the offense taken away from him at uga. More than a decade ago. So you’re right, mark didn’t become a bad offensive mind. He always has been.
 
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HighSeas said:
Formation makes a big difference too. You made that a footnote at the end but the UGA play you showed is an example of what tight splits can do for an offense. With Richt it's wide spread isolation routes every time - pretty much eliminates the middle of field, makes crossers less effective, switch releases are slower and less effective, etc. Richt is not a student of the game and there's ample evidence that he's on what amounts to paid retirement.
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Oh yes. I am a spread guy by default. (Preference) But I would gladly infuse a lot of those tight and bunch formations in certain circumstances. If anything, I would say I am definitely a big multi-formational type. I believe you can go static without a tun of formations but you need to have more mismatch capability and utilize tempo when you do.

But honestly I think if you go slower paced, the more formations you throw at a defense you can add an advantage. (like uga did last night) People always talk about physical fatigue right? When a team runs like 95 plays at you. But Bama definitely go out of position a few times this game and I think they were suffering from mental fatigue.

Here look at this tight bunch mesh concept. Bama got confused with the motion and simply got out of position and lost track of the hb on the wheel. (I have been seeing a lot of these accessory mesh components and they have been super successful. Lincoln Riley had a dirty little number vs texas as well) But hard to prepare for right. Uga ran quads, empty, tight, bunch, 2x2, trips, off set I, unbalanced, etc etc etc. Brilliant game plan last night.

"Do not need to confuse the opposing coach, just confuse his players."

 
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Roman Marciante said:
Oh yes. I am a spread guy by default. (Preference) But I would gladly infuse a lot of those tight and bunch formations in certain circumstances. If anything, I would say I am definitely a big multi-formational type. I believe you can go static without a tun of formations but you need to have more mismatch capability and utilize tempo when you do.

But honestly I think if you go slower paced, the more formations you throw at a defense you can add an advantage. (like uga did last night) People always talk about physical fatigue right? When a team runs like 95 plays at you. But Bama definitely go out of position a few times this game and I think they were suffering from mental fatigue.

Here look at this tight bunch mesh concept. Bama got confused with the motion and simply got out of position and lost track of the hb on the wheel. (I have been seeing a lot of these accessory mesh components and they have been super successful. Lincoln Riley had a dirty little number vs texas as well) But hard to prepare for right. Uga ran quads, empty, tight, bunch, 2x2, trips, off set I, unbalanced, etc etc etc. Brilliant game plan last night.

"Do not need to confuse the opposing coach, just confuse his players."

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Honestly, It doesn’t matter what concept we run rather it’s tight bunch, smash concept, mills, stick, etc. We can’t block. We can come out there running Mike leach’s concepts but if we can’t win 1 vs. 1 consistently and pick up disguises/blitzes it’ll be the same result over and over again.
 
Earnest T. Bass said:
Every team mentioned have real offensive lines and running attacks that take over games against good opponents.

You can scheme your **** off and a poor offensive line will make the best offensive coordinator appear to be inept.

Mark Richt didn't suddenly become a bad offensive mind and coach as the Herd claims. He has been dogged over the last two years by an offensive line that wouldn't see even one player being good enough to qualify as a back-up for Alabama, Clemson, Georgia and a gaggle of other top 10 teams.

Fix the offensive line and just like how the Herd now worships Diaz, they will be claiming that all along they were telling everyone that Richt is an offensive genius, and start attacking Blake James for not giving him a longer contract extension.
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ESPN showed that in his 18 years of being a head coach, he's had an offense ranked in the top 20 one time. He certainly wasn't great at any point.
 
Hemsleysalmons said:
You feel we have talent on offense. Your ESPN contact feels we have talent. Our o line is terrible. Our receivers can’t get separation and when they do often drop the ball. Our QBs are a disaster. Homer and Dallas are average running backs. There are probably 10 rbs in acc as good and better. That covers our offensive lineup. Can you advise me with players names of talented players we currently have on offense.
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My lord...just stop.
 
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