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Mike Smith- 247 Reevaluation

D$, Would you say it was talent or development at DT? IMO, King flashed several times in the Spring, and Hamilton looked good, too. I just got the sense that their bodies weren't ready. I hope by this time next year, they're totally different players.
 
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grover said:
D$, Would you say it was talent or development at DT? IMO, King flashed several times in the Spring, and Hamilton looked good, too. I just got the sense that their bodies weren't ready. I hope by this time next year, they're totally different players.
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Talent.

Recruiting DTs is tough. There are only so many big, athletic and mean guys around. Moore and King will get better with more strength training and development, but they aren't particularly big or athletic. Coach Golden knows he needs a different caliber of defensive linemen to get Miami where it needs to be.
 
Not D$ but I think its a talent and number issue with the young DTs. We only have 3 underclassman DTs on the roster at the moment. King and Moore to me are rotation guys. I think Hamilton can be good in the Pierre role. We are going to have to patchwork the DTs for another year or 2 before the 2014 kids are ready. Right now we are looking at this for 2014

NT(Porter): Stuckey (JUCO), King, Moore, Valentine (FR), Jenkins (FR)
DT(Pierre): Pierre, Hamilton, Kamalu, (Moten)

At the moment the NT spot is pretty scary, more comfortable with the other spot. I think we will continue to search the waiver wire (5th year SRs) and JUCO ranks to try to fill those roles more.
 
DMoney said:
The Franchise said:
That's why I'm one of the few not worried about our DT situation. The Don's a master evaluator, recruiter and developer. If he likes the guys we're bringing in to play DT or to grow into the DT position, then so do I.
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I don't think he does, which is why he hit the "waiver wire" so hard and pursued every decent JUCO. Aside from Pierre, the 2011 and 2012 classes look pretty barren in terms of DTs.

But that's what good leaders do. They recognize errors and act quickly. I have confidence he will get it right, just like he did this year with Renfrow and Kamalu.
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I think he hit the waiver wire because there were good veteran players there that are a clear upgrade over the young guys who aren't really ready to play at that position yet. Freshmans and sophomores should almost never see the field at DT unless they're man-children like Wilfork. We got fcked by Shanntard's sht recruiting at that position and had to play guys before they were ready last year. Some of those same guys will be good players for us next year and the year after.
 
The Franchise said:
DMoney said:
The Franchise said:
That's why I'm one of the few not worried about our DT situation. The Don's a master evaluator, recruiter and developer. If he likes the guys we're bringing in to play DT or to grow into the DT position, then so do I.
Click to expand...

I don't think he does, which is why he hit the "waiver wire" so hard and pursued every decent JUCO. Aside from Pierre, the 2011 and 2012 classes look pretty barren in terms of DTs.

But that's what good leaders do. They recognize errors and act quickly. I have confidence he will get it right, just like he did this year with Renfrow and Kamalu.
Click to expand...

I think he hit the waiver wire because there were good veteran players there that are a clear upgrade over the young guys who aren't really ready to play at that position yet. Freshmans and sophomores should almost never see the field at DT unless they're man-children like Wilfork. We got fcked by Shanntard's sht recruiting at that position and had to play guys before they were ready last year. Some of those same guys will be good players for us next year and the year after.
Click to expand...

We've already lost four of them (Ivery, Briscoe, Grimble, Alexis).

Jelani Hamilton is a guy to watch on Saturday. I hope he continues to trust the process and get stronger because he has some talent.
 
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DMoney said:
The Franchise said:
DMoney said:
The Franchise said:
That's why I'm one of the few not worried about our DT situation. The Don's a master evaluator, recruiter and developer. If he likes the guys we're bringing in to play DT or to grow into the DT position, then so do I.
Click to expand...

I don't think he does, which is why he hit the "waiver wire" so hard and pursued every decent JUCO. Aside from Pierre, the 2011 and 2012 classes look pretty barren in terms of DTs.

But that's what good leaders do. They recognize errors and act quickly. I have confidence he will get it right, just like he did this year with Renfrow and Kamalu.
Click to expand...

I think he hit the waiver wire because there were good veteran players there that are a clear upgrade over the young guys who aren't really ready to play at that position yet. Freshmans and sophomores should almost never see the field at DT unless they're man-children like Wilfork. We got fcked by Shanntard's sht recruiting at that position and had to play guys before they were ready last year. Some of those same guys will be good players for us next year and the year after.
Click to expand...

We've already lost four of them (Ivery, Briscoe, Grimble, Alexis).

Jelani Hamilton is a guy to watch on Saturday. I hope he continues to trust the process and get stronger because he has some talent.
Click to expand...

Yep. It's tough to predict that a guy like Ivery would be a total knucklehead and get kicked out of school. I think that guy had very good talent. Briscoe was a late and poor pickup. I never liked that signing because I hated his motor. A guy that size should have dominated in HS, but he did nothing until he got in the playoffs. Alexis was a late filler in a class that The Don was scrambling to put together. Hard to recruit great DTs when you take over for a guy who had 2 or 3 commits in late December.

People are overreacting to the DT position because they see quick results at other positions. Problem is that it takes a lot longer to develop guys at that position, and some guys who wind up being great DTs didn't even come in at that position. For instance, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Chick weighing 290 pounds next year and being a **** good DT. Kamalu will also be a devastating force there eventually. And guys see Moore as a "rotation" guy, but I think he'll be a very good player too down the road.
 
Consigliere said:
Peter Ariz said:
This is why the star system is funny to me. Us in South Florida have been watching Smith wreak havoc for a year and a half and now a national guy goes to see him and "gives" him the 4th star, which then outsiders will look at him as a better prospect than he was before he had the star.
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Then when you arrive at college your star ranking is meaningless and your just a guy trying to earn some time.
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It's the same in the NFL.

It doesn't matter where you're drafted, it just matters what you do on the field.

Of course a highly drafted (or 4/5 star!) guy gets a longer leash, but if they're out performed they don't see the field.
 
DMoney said:
grover said:
D$, Would you say it was talent or development at DT? IMO, King flashed several times in the Spring, and Hamilton looked good, too. I just got the sense that their bodies weren't ready. I hope by this time next year, they're totally different players.
Click to expand...

Talent.

Recruiting DTs is tough. There are only so many big, athletic and mean guys around. Moore and King will get better with more strength training and development, but they aren't particularly big or athletic. Coach Golden knows he needs a different caliber of defensive linemen to get Miami where it needs to be.
Click to expand...

never saw either of the two as um dt's.

Thing is King is already pretty strong weightroom wise it just doesnt translate on the field he has no bulk, and gets roadgraded on the regular, same as Moore. Thing is both would fit in better in diff schemes....King would do pretty good in VT'S scheme...where he can shoot some gaps..Moore im not sure of...I was never high on either one...hopefully Moore can take a shirt this yr and we can see more out of them down the road...imo guys like Travonte Valentine and Stuckey can come in and take their lunch money right away.
 
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saban kind of jumped ahead of the curb....he recruits dl like nobodies business, and just offers **** near every one in the nation. But he consistently brings in a juco guy EVERY year..and thats something i think we should do @ the dt spot...so we can shirt the young pups in the wings...

Guys like RENFROW are a god send as a post grad player because he logs snaps and gives CP a break and the drop off isnt that big at all. In fact he puts in work....

I think we need in this recruiting class...one more influx either Pelon, or another tackle...or maybe a post grad that wants in...That Renfrow waiver wire pick up is paying dividends as is Gilbert.
 
gogeta4 said:
saban kind of jumped ahead of the curb....he recruits dl like nobodies business, and just offers **** near every one in the nation. But he consistently brings in a juco guy EVERY year..and thats something i think we should do @ the dt spot...so we can shirt the young pups in the wings...

Guys like RENFROW are a god send as a post grad player because he logs snaps and gives CP a break and the drop off isnt that big at all. In fact he puts in work....

I think we need in this recruiting class...one more influx either Pelon, or another tackle...or maybe a post grad that wants in...That Renfrow waiver wire pick up is paying dividends as is Gilbert.
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Not sure if you meant Saban brings in a Juco guy every year at the DT spot or you meant any position. For the '12 and '13 recruiting clases Saban hasn't brought in one Juco guy for the Dline. Think BAMA only has 2 Juco guys on scholly on their squad this season. only guys they have brought in the past two years where Travell Dixon who wound up transferring. Deon Belue who's at corner and a tackle.

Do agree about bringing in a Juco guy IF Golden is unable to sign talented or what he considers elite level high school Dlineman. Probably why Saban hasn't had to take Juco guys as much because at this point he was able to recruit enough talented depth at most positions since he has-been at BAMA.
 
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