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Off-Topic Mass killings

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NC_Canes_11 said:


No such thing as “common sense gun control/reform.”

Constitutional carry nationwide and repeal the NFA.

Also here’s a video in case someone wants to waste their time writing what they think the 2A means.
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All due respect but if you think every person who wants to CC should be able to without a permit or even a cursory showing that they know how to properly handle a firearm, you just haven't spent enough time around other people, let alone other people handling firearms.
 
ben said:
i dont think there is data. they are mostly used for fun, right? gun ranges and target practice and stuff.
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This is true of most guns, obviously - the vast majority are used for things other than mass shootings. But let's not play dumb and pretend like it wasn't favored by those who did most of the really major mass shootings of the last 10 years or so. It's not a mystery why, just from a practical standpoint the weapons hold a lot of rounds and do a lot of damage. The takeaway from this isn't necessarily that they should all be banned. Just from a pragmatic perspective that's unworkable at this point, given how ubiquitous they are. But they should be harder to get. I own one myself and definitely don't think it's something 99.99% of 18 year old kids should be able to buy on their own, as is the case in much of the country.
 
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JD08 said:
I'll be happy to write my Congressman if you think it will help.
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Do what you feel, but my point is the “mental health problem” has just been a sound bite with no detail added on. What are the policies that improve mental health? I know a list of proposals on gun control, but there’s no reason to clam up when it comes to mental health policy.
 
TheEye said:
Do what you feel, but my point is the “mental health problem” has just been a sound bite with now detail added on. What are the policies that improve mental health? I know a list of proposals on gun control, but there’s no reason to clam up when it comes to mental health policy.
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Part of the problem is the "solution" to mental health is more funding and more prescriptions. That's the lazy answer. People will take the easy way out if offered to them.
 
JD08 said:
Part of the problem is the "solution" to mental health is more funding and more prescriptions. That's the lazy answer. People will take the easy way out if offered to them.
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Then if people are taking the lazy way out, that’s where new laws need to be proposed and supported. I just suspect that those interjecting the argument are also not willing to change the law.
 
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TheEye said:
Then if people are taking the lazy way out, that’s where new laws need to be proposed and supported. I just suspect that those interjecting the argument are also not willing to change the law.
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For a change to realistically take place, the mental health industry needs to acknowledge that a better solution has to exist. Then they'll face headwinds from the providers who rely on prescriptions and the companies that produce them. This isn't like when JFK got upset about his sister and pushed for a change in the approach. If that happened now, the sanitarium lobby would be all over him and calling for members of his party to suggest less drastic measures.
 
JD08 said:
For a change to realistically take place, the mental health industry needs to acknowledge that a better solution has to exist. Then they'll face headwinds from the providers who rely on prescriptions and the companies that produce them. This isn't like when JFK got upset about his sister and pushed for a change in the approach. If that happened now, the sanitarium lobby would be all over him and calling for members of his party to suggest less drastic measures.
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Well, the pundits are not elected officials. You are not an elected official. My advice when someone proposes gun reform, ignore the argument. Present your own solution. Otherwise, it’s just Groundhog Day.
 
CaneintheWilderness said:
All due respect but if you think every person who wants to CC should be able to without a permit or even a cursory showing that they know how to properly handle a firearm, you just haven't spent enough time around other people, let alone other people handling firearms.
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The VAST majority of people who want a CC are responsible and are comfortable and equipped enough to be fine. The people who you are talking about don’t tend to carry bc they aren’t comfortable doing it.
 
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NC_Canes_11 said:
As a society we don’t value life. We idolize and worship things that don’t matter. One parent households are too common. Medications are handed out like candy. Crimes aren’t prosecuted. Blame is not given to the actual perpetrators. Instead everyone is a victim of something that made them do this. They are trying to repeal “stand your ground laws” in some places for ***** sake. Can you imagine crime spiking through the roof and acting like the solution is stopping law abiding citizens from protecting themselves? Absolute insanity.

Had nothing to do with weapons of any kind. We accept the crime and the violence. Period.
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I like your summation. Gotta say though that the kid knocking on the wrong door getting shot twice by the 84 yr old; and the young girl killed in upstate NY by a crochety old hermit when the car she was in wrongly turned down his driveway aren't exactly stellar examples of Stand Your Ground.
 
Criminals don't care about any laws so Permitless Carry etc. doesn't apply to them. Heck, I believe I read 70% or so of mass shooters purchased weapons legally.
 
JD08 said:
For a change to realistically take place, the mental health industry needs to acknowledge that a better solution has to exist. Then they'll face headwinds from the providers who rely on prescriptions and the companies that produce them. This isn't like when JFK got upset about his sister and pushed for a change in the approach. If that happened now, the sanitarium lobby would be all over him and calling for members of his party to suggest less drastic measures.
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The answer was always to not close mental hospitals. But now that they are closed, opening them would require too much money. You’d get push back like you said from big pharma, also the insurance lobby. They push these cheap advantage plans that don’t cover anything. You think they’re gonna add a mental health stay to those plans? No. So you’re gonna have people that would have to pay out of pocket and they couldn’t afford it, so it wouldn’t matter anyway.

It’s a battle that will never be won.
 
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hotshot said:
I like your summation. Gotta say though that the kid knocking on the wrong door getting shot twice by the 84 yr old; and the young girl killed in upstate NY by a crochety old hermit when the car she was in wrongly turned down his driveway aren't exactly stellar examples of Stand Your Ground.
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Stand your ground is the only thing preventing people from becoming prey.
 
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NC_Canes_11 said:
Stand your ground is the only thing preventing people from becoming prey.
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And yet every day, hundreds of millions of people in the developed world without stand your ground laws get along just fine and don't become "prey." Despite all its faults, our society is such that for the vast majority of people things like stand your ground laws - a modern invention, by the way - never affect their lives at all. This kind of fear and hysteria is common in radical 2A circles, and understandably so because it serves the ultimate beneficiaries of the contemporary 2A movement: gun manufacturers. After all, if people aren't terrified all the time, who's going to keep buying guns? There's only so many hunters and sportsmen out there.

NC_Canes_11 said:
The VAST majority of people who want a CC are responsible and are comfortable and equipped enough to be fine. The people who you are talking about don’t tend to carry bc they aren’t comfortable doing it.
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Clearly you've never heard of the Dunning-Kruger effect. This response just further convinces me you either haven't spent a whole lot of time around the average gun owner or have a near-delusional amount confidence in your fellow man. A quick search of Florida's or Texas' statistics on road rage shootings will yield dozens of stories of people who probably described themselves as "responsible" gun owners right up until someone cut them off on the turnpike.

A fun thought experiment is wondering whether people who think that everyone should be able to conceal/open carry without a permit also think that the average American is competent enough to vote without passing a basic civics test.
 
CaneintheWilderness said:
And yet every day, hundreds of millions of people in the developed world without stand your ground laws get along just fine and don't become "prey." Despite all its faults, our society is such that for the vast majority of people things like stand your ground laws - a modern invention, by the way - never affect their lives at all. This kind of fear and hysteria is common in radical 2A circles, and understandably so because it serves the ultimate beneficiaries of the contemporary 2A movement: gun manufacturers. After all, if people aren't terrified all the time, who's going to keep buying guns? There's only so many hunters and sportsmen out there.



Clearly you've never heard of the Dunning-Kruger effect. This response just further convinces me you either haven't spent a whole lot of time around the average gun owner or have a near-delusional amount confidence in your fellow man. A quick search of Florida's or Texas' statistics on road rage shootings will yield dozens of stories of people who probably described themselves as "responsible" gun owners right up until someone cut them off on the turnpike.

A fun thought experiment is wondering whether people who think that everyone should be able to conceal/open carry without a permit also think that the average American is competent enough to vote without passing a basic civics test.
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Road rage shootings are less than .5 a day in Florida and Texas. They are not an issue anywhere. In fact guns at large are not an issue. There are more guns than people in this country. If it was an actual problem, you would know. The crime rate by CC permit holders is minuscule. That simple fact shows the vast majority of CC gun owners are responsible.

The rest of the developed world means nothing to me. But they are prey if someone wanted to do something about it. If you didn’t come out of Covid with a sense that the 2A is more important now, than ever, you’ll never have an understanding of it.
 
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NC_Canes_11 said:
What’s an assault rifle?
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Not even the politicians know what that answer is. I’ve never been a gun guy, **** I’ve never owned or shot one but even I know more than these idiots lol. If you think an AR15 is a machine gun or anything close you’ve never seen how one works. It’s not even a powerful gun or in the stratosphere of a machine gun. Each shot you need to pull the trigger.
 
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