It's not going to happen

[Ammok]

 

[g8rh8rMD]

This team isn't going to wake up and start to perform. They aren't going to turn a corner. The team we've seen is the team we've got.

I keep seeing people talk about how the upcoming game will tell us what the team is about, but that's bullsht. We know what their about, they've shown it for 5 games. They have no intensity or leadership. They can execute sometimes, but not all the time. They are mistake prone. They talk but don't do. And worst of all, they don't seem to mind so much.

So at least for this season, that's who we've got, let's stop acting like this is all a gag and the real team will show up any minute now. They won't. They can't because they're already here.

This is one of those "we roll" threads isn't it?

2019 Canes style, baby! That's how we "roll"!!!!!

 

[ElJefe3]

I'd love to see some fight in this team and maybe, MAYBE the cleanest game they've had all season but I'm going in expecting a L. I refuse to believe anything else. Happy if we win but not surprised if we lose.

 

[305to954]

That’s the point.

The coaches themselves can’t get the little things right.

Half our plays are dead BEFORE THE BALL IS EVEN SNAPPED due to alignment on both sides of the ball.

Our personnel decisions are terrible on both sides of the ball.

The undisciplined play is NOT just youth. It’s the type of thing that happaens when the coaching staff is internally out of control.

I have seen this first hand. The most disturbing part of all this is the lost look Díaz has on his face when things are not going well.

When you see that look (and I have personally seen it on my own teams), it means that the coach is losing it on the inside and his resolve is completely shaken.

Players ALWAYS notice that look and it puts a fog over the whole team and kills their confidence and focus.

False starts, shoestring tackles and tripping over grass, dropped passes, missed blocks, blown coverages, muffed punts, overlooked receivers, missed tackles, and all the other errors associated with bad football can be traced to that lost look.

A football team is much more than just the sum of its parts. It is a living entity made of various “components” that come together to function as one body. The minds of the players and coaches come together to form one singular mind with a singular task.

Just like any other collection of minds, when the strongest minds begin to falter, the effect avalanches through the whole entity.

You see this play out every game through momentum. That is what momentum is. The minds leading these players have shown themselves to be not up to the task in many ways.

There many on the team that want it bad but they have never had quality coaching as a whole, so they don’t know what winning looks like.

People talk about the “disease” and “cancers”. But you know what causes “disease” and “cancers” more than anything else?

Favoritism and incompetence.

We heard rumors of both in the offseason, but didn’t want to believe.

We see both in full display on the field where it can’t be hidden.

We can nitpick talent and execution if we want to, but it is completely obvious we are a poorly coached team and THAT is the most serious hurdle we need to get over to turn this around.

I mean..idk neither do u because your not in the building...your just going off the results and a bird’s eye view, as am I..from my view point I see a team struggling for a identity and with deficiencies we knew we had up front and in the backend defensively and it’s come to light..now it’s on manny and co to right the ship

 

[TruCane81]

I mean..idk neither do u because your not in the building...your just going off the results and a bird’s eye view, as am I..from my view point I see a team struggling for a identity and with deficiencies we knew we had up front and in the backend defensively and it’s come to light..now it’s on manny and co to right the ship

All the signs are there for anyone who knows what to look for.

 

[#1cane]

Thing is this...

The team has been in position to win every game so far, so clearly the talent is there.

We are probably 6 plays or so from being undefeated.

The talent is there. Coaches have to do a better job from first quarter to last.

Good teams win close games. Bad teams lose close games. Miami took the 1st quarter off against UNC and got beat. Clemson took the whole game off against UNC and won. The mistakes clearly show this is a bad team.

 

[mirednmediocrity2]

2-10.

 

[NE Canes]

Absolutely 100% false. This is an old school cliche that has been disproven repeatedly. Modern analytics have completely disproven it, but all you need is common sense to know that you are not what your record says you are.

Was the ND team that rolled into the title game vs. Bama really better than Bama because they had the better record? Heck no. They weren't even close to being as good as Bama. Analytics would have told you that, and so would common sense: they won a lot of close games vs. mediocre teams.

On a more sophisticated note...the analytic rankings have proven to be much better predictors of future success than past W-Ls (mainly due to adjusting for schedule and margin).

So no, you're not what your record says you are. You might have been in the past (although even that's debatable due to in-game luck), but you are not in the present nor in the future.

How exactly has analytics disproved this?

They lost the games and they deserved to lose them. Count all the yards and TOP and completion % and it all means nothing. They lost to awful teams because they played awful. They got a bunch of stats because they were playing awful teams.

This is not some tough team with 3 losses to Bama, Clemson and UGA. They lost to awful teams and barely beat an awful team. How does analytics account for that. Does your analytics explain why they are a bunch of undisciplined players. Does it explain why they make terrible calls in the red zone or play the wrong players or can't get the ball to their play makers.

Going by your analytics they should have won the VT game....

Oh and BTW
Everyone knew ND was a Paper Tiger. It is a bad example. They got in a championship game because of a flawed system not because they deserved it. With the same schedule UCF would not have gotten in. It was a bias decision for ND and has nothing to do with analytics showing records don't matter.

 

[305to954]

All the signs are there for anyone who knows what to look for.

You claiming to know what to look for after 5 games?..you coached at a college level?..honest question

 

[SSCane]

Thing is this...

The team has been in position to win every game so far, so clearly the talent is there.

We are probably 6 plays or so from being undefeated.

The talent is there. Coaches have to do a better job from first quarter to last.

That's the problem, our coaches suck and that is not going to change over night. They are not good at game planning, player development, personnel selection, play calling or recruiting. They are literally not good at anything!!
We are what our record says we are. We are not ALMOST undefeated. We are 2-3, having lost to all P5 teams we played, won 1 cupcake game, and almost lost CMU, a team we were favored by 5 TDs.

They had 2 weeks to prepare to play VT, the 2nd worst team in the coastal (we are the worst). A must win game at home and we come out so unprepared we are down 28-0 within a blink of an eye, to a team that has been blown out of almost every game the last 2 years. VT is a horrible football team.

They had 2 weeks to prepare for UNC the 3rd worst team in the coastal, got behind 18 pts in the 1st quarter and lost the game. UNC is not a good team either.

They had WEEKS to prepare for UF, same result.

This is a bad football team and we are not done losing! It is poorly coached, with weaknesses all over the roster. I see several loses on the horizon. I just hope we can stay bowl eligible.

 

[Fluffhead]

This is the kind of stuff all the fans from teams having ****** seasons always say. We want to believe our teams have 10 win talent and it’s the coaches running it aground. But at some point you have to face the reality that our team is just not that good. Coaching can certainly be better, but we just don’t have enough studs out there.

This team is certainly not good and is lacking top end talent to compete with a Clemson. But it also has more talent than UNC and VT. This is not binary. We do not have top talent to compete with the top level teams, but we also lose an incredible number of games in an incredible number of ways to teams that we do have more talent than. That is coaching.

A side note - If we do not have the talent, particularly on the defensive side, then that falls on Manny's head as well, since, you know, he has been here 4 years now and recruited **** near the full roster on that side of the ball.

 

[NE Canes]

Nobody is coached to jump off sides..nobody is coached to miss blocking assignments..nobody is coached to miss tackles or blow coverages..BUT it’s up to the coaches and leaders to set a standard and let them know it not acceptable..that’s this staffs biggest challenge rn

It is not just about setting a standard. "Hey, don't do that"

Coaches are responsible for line discipline. They work on it and practice it. If an OL or DL lacks discipline it is because a coach has been too lackadaisical with them. Line discipline is a direct result of coaches instilling that discipline into the line.

Same with blocking. If some misses a blocking assignment it probably means the coaches did not bang it into his head enough.

This is not difficult. If you fail a test it is probably because you did not spend enough time preparing for it. The more you prepare the better you will perform....every single time. The more you prepare players the better they will perform. Lack of preparation means players miss blocking assignments. They jump offsides. They lack discipline. This is the difference between well coached and poor coaching.

 

[ALLoverCANE]

That is great for future prognosis, but when I look at the first 5 games of the season, we won 2 and lost 3, regardless of how close we may have been in those other three.

In 2017 we got a lot of lucky bounces, relied on turnovers, and won 4 close games. We also started 10-0 and rose to the top 3. Our analytics were likely not that high, but we won all 10 games and were in the top 3. We were what our record says we were at the time.

You can spend all the time you want in S&P, S&P+, FPI or whatever else and relish how based on statistics we should be 4-1 or 5-0 and how close we were and what our odds were to win with 7:24 left in the third quarter and whatever else. I will use my eyes and common sense, look at our penalties, missed tackles, **** poor discipline and execution, questionable substitution patterns and playing time, and a defense that buckles in the 4th quarter and say "we are what our record says we are" - a below average to bad football team.

Edit - this is not to say that analytics does not have its place in everything or in-game decisions, but spare me with using it to justify what could have or should have been once the game has been played.

So you can say "we were what our record says we were". I don't necessarily agree, but that's not what this thread is about.

The topic of this thread is that our team is not going to turn a corner and all of a sudden improve, and one of the arguments given was "that we are what our record says we are". That is categorically false. In the present and future, we are not what our record says we are. Our record is a backwards-looking metric.

 

[305to954]

It is not just about setting a standard. "Hey, don't do that"

Coaches are responsible for line discipline. They work on it and practice it. If an OL or DL lacks discipline it is because a coach has been too lackadaisical with them. Line discipline is a direct result of coaches instilling that discipline into the line.

Same with blocking. If some misses a blocking assignment it probably means the coaches did not bang it into his head enough.

This is not difficult. If you fail a test it is probably because you did not spend enough time preparing for it. The more you prepare the better you will perform....every single time. The more you prepare players the better they will perform. Lack of preparation means players miss blocking assignments. They jump offsides. They lack discipline. This is the difference between well coached and poor coaching.

lol none of that is true...a coach can go over **** with a guy or guys in practice, but in game situations, when the bullets are flying, it’s up to the player to rely on the training and technique. Ultimately it’s up to the coaches to get these guys level of play up..

 

[TruCane81]

You claiming to know what to look for after 5 games?..you coached at a college level?..honest question

I know what a coach who is in over his head looks like.

The internal resolve of a head coach is literally the difference between winning the championship and going .500.

It’s VERY, VERY rare to have a team win it all in spite of their head coach like the 2001 Hurricanes.

Blake is not up to snuff and Diaz let everyone know it by stating his intention to get “more involved “ with the defense. Who thought it was a good idea to have Rousseau and Pinckney anchoring the defense on any play?

Enos’ under center offense is mostly trash for THIS team and we prove it EVERY GAME.

Rolling Jarren out there hurt to throw pick after pick?

This ain’t even the tip of the iceberg of coaching sins.

You don’t have to be Nick Saban to see it’s amateur hour on the sideline.

This staff WILL NOT WORK as is, whether you give them 5 games or 500 games.

I hope Diaz can make the difficult decisions and turn this around, but people closer to the program don’t think he has the juice. Could just be emotions from lost games but my own personal experience with football teams tells me he probably isn’t the guy.

Hope I am wrong because I hate the losing and really bought into what he was selling.

 

[ALLoverCANE]

How exactly has analytics disproved this?

They lost the games and they deserved to lose them. Count all the yards and TOP and completion % and it all means nothing. They lost to awful teams because they played awful. They got a bunch of stats because they were playing awful teams.

This is not some tough team with 3 losses to Bama, Clemson and UGA. They lost to awful teams and barely beat an awful team. How does analytics account for that. Does your analytics explain why they are a bunch of undisciplined players. Does it explain why they make terrible calls in the red zone or play the wrong players or can't get the ball to their play makers.

Going by your analytics they should have won the VT game....

Oh and BTW
Everyone knew ND was a Paper Tiger. It is a bad example. They got in a championship game because of a flawed system not because they deserved it. With the same schedule UCF would not have gotten in. It was a bias decision for ND and has nothing to do with analytics showing records don't matter.

Analytics have proven that winning close games is not a skill. It is basically random. Good teams win close games about 50% of the time. They win blowouts >80% of the time (i.e. they blow teams out and rarely get blown out).

Correct, we should have won the VT game, as well as the UNC game. We should have lost the UF game by more than we did (we had extremely positive turnover luck). What "should" happen doesn't always happen. It generally does over the long-term, but not over the short-term.

ND is a perfect example. They were 12-0 that year. They were the only unbeaten (excluding Boise or any other G5 team). So if you believe "you are what your record says you are" - that's a full-stop right there: ND was 12-0. Their record says they were the best team.

If you want to introduce nuance into the argument and say it was a biased decision or a flawed system or whatever...well, then I guess you (rightly) believe there's more to it than your record. You (right) look at ND's record and say, "that was not the best team". You (rightly) realize that you are NOT what your record says you are.

 

[NE Canes]

lol none of that is true...a coach can go over **** with a guy or guys in practice, but in game situations, when the bullets are flying, it’s up to the player to rely on the training and technique. Ultimately it’s up to the coaches to get these guys level of play up..

Find this unbelievable but at the same time I am not surprised.

If you have ever been a part of those practices where they kill you for jumping at the wrong snap count you would understand. When you are tired an exhausted after practice and they decide to do line discipline drills and then kill you some more for jumping at the wrong count you would understand.

I have to keep saying this but you guys have no idea what coaches do. Where do you think training and technique comes from? Some of you literally think the players just read the play on a board and go out and play.

 

[rok]

Undefeated?
We BC and barely beat CM.
Lost to VT and NC and Gaytors.
You guys crack me up.

Agree. The cmu game was a disaster.

 

[Mrfree]

I know what a coach who is in over his head looks like.

The internal resolve of a head coach is literally the difference between winning the championship and going .500.

It’s VERY, VERY rare to have a team win it all in spite of their head coach like the 2001 Hurricanes.

Blake is not up to snuff and Diaz let everyone know it by stating his intention to get “more involved “ with the defense. Who thought it was a good idea to have Rousseau and Pinckney anchoring the defense on any play?

Enos’ under center offense is mostly trash for THIS team and we prove it EVERY GAME.

Rolling Jarren out there hurt to throw pick after pick?

This ain’t even the tip of the iceberg of coaching sins.

You don’t have to be Nick Saban to see it’s amateur hour on the sideline.

This staff WILL NOT WORK as is, whether you give them 5 games or 500 games.

I hope Diaz can make the difficult decisions and turn this around, but people closer to the program don’t think he has the juice. Could just be emotions from lost games but my own personal experience with football teams tells me he probably isn’t the guy.

Hope I am wrong because I hate the losing and really bought into what he was selling.

Preach fam. These boys still blinded by minnie diaz and they want to wait 3 more years. FOH

 

[dantheman349]

Ive been waiting for it. i dont think the lights will come on, but i think they win Friday night, and i think Perry goes off! this team has the capability of winning every game.