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Tetragrammaton Cane said:
Tremendous restraint when he was clearly overwhelmed? Is that what you mean? Because I’m not the one who’s nuts if you can watch that entire video and come to the conclusion that he showed “tremendous restraint”. Some restraint yes, but he could’ve been SMARTER; discretion is the better part of valor and he had backup on the way. Just doing something because you think you’re right can be the wrong thing sometimes. His “boss” attitude could have resulted in either of them dying that night. That’s not smart.
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The fact that the cop was “overwhelmed” makes the point. “Overwhelming” a cop is the same thing as assaulting a cop. He was lucky he didn’t get a different cop, who would have reacted in a much different manner.

I honestly don’t get your point. There is no excusing McDowell’s behavior and he’s lucky to be standing.

As far as the cop’s tactics, I’m not in law enforcement so I don’t know what he did wrong from a tactical perspective.
 
OriginalCanesCanesCanes said:
The fact that the cop was “overwhelmed” makes the point. “Overwhelming” a cop is the same thing as assaulting a cop. He was lucky he didn’t get a different cop, who would have reacted in a much different manner.

I honestly don’t get your point. There is no excusing McDowells behavior and he’s lucky to be standing.

As far as the cop’s tactics, I’m not in law enforcement so I don’t know what he did wrong from a tactical perspective.
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He didn't do anything wrong and the use of the taser was justifiable force. I'm surprised anyone is criticizing him and not McDowell, who clearly should have sat his *** in the car instead of acting like he's on PCP and refusing to obey.
 
Tetragrammaton Cane said:
True story:

A police officer pulls over a driver. Realizes that he has a warrant out for his arrest. Officer standing 5’7” maybe 140 calls for backup as driver is the 6’3”, 260 lb bodybuilder-type. Another incident happens at the same time so there would be no officers to back him up is what his Sarge told him. His Sarge told him to handle it himself or let him go. He let him go.
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Hopefully he retired from the police force soon thereafter
 
BoxingRobes said:
That was just a ****ty situation for all involved. Both sides showed restraint until the situation was escalated and ultimately, it doesn't look good for either party.

It was a simple roadside stop. Those should never get to the point it just did and its a breakdown by all involved, including the current culture (police culture, too) we are in.

Malik McDowell being told he was going to be shot by a white police officer, who at any time, could have justified shooting him with lethal intent...yeah, I am not sure many of you in the same situation wouldn't have tried to fight for your life. I'll agree in part with @Tetragrammaton Cane that one of the main issues is that an officer is the "boss" or has the mentality of one in that situation. How difficult was it to simply have a conversation with the man. It starts as a very confrontational situation and an officer expects people to remain cool and compliant with the constant worry or an officer escalating the situation. If you're Malik McDowell...a 6-foot-6 black man...why wouldn't you walk in the store? You know the store has cameras. Many other cops wouldn't have had their body cam or dash cam on - conveniently - in a situation like that.

idk guys...just a ****ty situation for both guys that likely could have been handled by both, in a different manner.

Roadside stops...should be as simple as...here is your citation, if you have an issue, see you in court. No signature needed. Hand it to the guy and be gone. Would wager that curbs a lot of roadside police issues.
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The officer tried to talk to him, but he kept asking for a supervisor. You just don't do that.
Tetragrammaton Cane said:
You’re purposely looking for a fight because nowhere have I said that McDowell was not wrong. Which would obviously mean that I believe he assaulted the officer. But the idea, that the officer had the right to use extreme force (kill him) because he disobeyed some orders is nonsense.
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I guess I missed the part where the officer killed him.
 
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BoxingRobes said:
...

Roadside stops...should be as simple as...here is your citation, if you have an issue, see you in court. No signature needed. Hand it to the guy and be gone. Would wager that curbs a lot of roadside police issues.
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Ok so here's a thought experiment.

You're a cop.

You pull someone over and they refuse to identify themselves.

How do you go about writing them a citation?
 
Tetragrammaton Cane said:
You’re purposely looking for a fight because nowhere have I said that McDowell was not wrong. Which would obviously mean that I believe he assaulted the officer. But the idea, that the officer had the right to use extreme force (kill him) because he disobeyed some orders is nonsense.
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No I’m not looking for a fight.

And I’m not saying that the officer had the right to use extreme force because of disobeying orders, that’s not even the issue.

But when McDowell got up and physically overwhelmed him, there was a huge risk of his gun being taken away from him and being used on him. It’s happened before. That’s when the shlt gets real.

If you don’t see that there was ample opportunity and justification for that policeman to draw his service weapon and shoot, you’re not analyzing the situation correctly.

McDowell needs to man up, go apologize to that cop and thank him for not shooting him.

And when I was younger I had my run ins. But I knew how to act. Rule number one, don’t get shot by the cop.
 
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OriginalCanesCanesCanes said:
No I’m not looking for a fight.

And I’m not saying that the officer had the right to use extreme force because of disobeying orders, that’s not even the issue.

But when McDowell got up and physically overwhelmed him, there was a huge risk of his gun being taken away from him and being used on him. It’s happened before. That’s when the shlt gets real.

If you don’t see that there was ample opportunity and justification for that policeman to draw his service weapon and shoot, you’re not analyzing the situation correctly.

McDowell needs to man up, go apologize to that cop and thank him for not shooting him.

And when I was younger I had my run ins. But I knew how to act. Rule number one, don’t get shot by the cop.
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Live to ride another day . . .
 
Tetragrammaton Cane said:
And, McDowell, also showed “restraint”; he could’ve hurt him, but he didn’t. Even saying at one point, “I’m not going to let you shoot me again”.

The officer showed a lot of unprofessionalism with that “restraint”. He had back up on the way, and he wasn’t a threat in the store. He should’ve just arrested him when he came out the store. That said, if McDowell stays in the car, it never goes there.


That’s part of the problem.
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Cop tells him to get out of the car. McDowell doesn't do as he's told. Not seeing the problem.

Maybe McDowell should've done as he was told.
 
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Tetragrammaton Cane said:
You didn’t miss it, among your many problems is the ability to read and comprehend.

Someone can ask for whatever they want, it has no bearing on whether they’ll get it. But another brilliant observation...well, not really.
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Man, comprehend this. Hope I never meet you.
 
Tetragrammaton Cane said:
It’s a true story. And he did retire from the police force.

I have many friends who are police officers and they’ll tell me that when dealing with drunks, crazies, domestic disputes (I’ve heard the homosexual ones were the worst) try to calm the situation first and always call back up. Always.
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Helmsleysalmons is a repeat offender, eh?
 
BoxingRobes said:
That was just a ****ty situation for all involved. Both sides showed restraint until the situation was escalated and ultimately, it doesn't look good for either party.

It was a simple roadside stop. Those should never get to the point it just did and its a breakdown by all involved, including the current culture (police culture, too) we are in.

Malik McDowell being told he was going to be shot by a white police officer, who at any time, could have justified shooting him with lethal intent...yeah, I am not sure many of you in the same situation wouldn't have tried to fight for your life. I'll agree in part with @Tetragrammaton Cane that one of the main issues is that an officer is the "boss" or has the mentality of one in that situation. How difficult was it to simply have a conversation with the man. It starts as a very confrontational situation and an officer expects people to remain cool and compliant with the constant worry or an officer escalating the situation. If you're Malik McDowell...a 6-foot-6 black man...why wouldn't you walk in the store? You know the store has cameras. Many other cops wouldn't have had their body cam or dash cam on - conveniently - in a situation like that.

idk guys...just a ****ty situation for both guys that likely could have been handled by both, in a different manner.

Roadside stops...should be as simple as...here is your citation, if you have an issue, see you in court. No signature needed. Hand it to the guy and be gone. Would wager that curbs a lot of roadside police issues.
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McDowell wasn't cooperating from the very beginning. Let's not make this about race.
 
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Tetragrammaton Cane said:
Go back and check the last sentence in the second paragraph.
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"That said, if McDowell stays in the car, it never goes there. "

Fully aware of what you posted. But again, the cop asked him to get out of the car, especially after McDowell refused to comply. It sounded like he was possibly intoxicated, hence why he was probably being asked in the first place.

Regardless, McDowell acted like a child and could've cooperated and all of this would've been avoided. I mean, the cop just saw him driving recklessly why he was pulled over in the first place.
 
Tetragrammaton Cane said:
He wasn’t possibly intoxicated, he was definitely intoxicated did you see the BAC?

Yes, of course, McDowell was wrong, but why tempt fate? Just wait for backup and arrest his *** when he steps outside the store.
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So again, how is the cop in the wrong here? The cop followed procedure, McDowell's lucky he wasn't shot.
 
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