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Honest question - do we really have better talent???

I'm not saying he's my top guy or anything...but imagine Miami with a coach like Scott Satterfield who just gets the very best out of all of his players no matter where he's been.

Imagine what our perception of our players would be. We'd be having different discussions about them all.

Miami has talent, but the culture stinks and it permeates the roster. The upperclassmen just constantly pass it down to the underclassmen and its a terrible cycle we are in. They really don't give a fvck about winning or losing. No one gets mad when we're losing or take a loss. We're still dancing on the sideline and then just walking back to the locker room like they are clocking in and out of work.

If you were to somehow get a coach to change that, we're not talking about a massive talent deficit. Currently, we get like 50 cents on the dollar out of most of our players on a good week. Part of it is on them, part of it is on coaching and culture. Just a shameful display.

While some will continue to point out the number of Miami is putting into the league...I think you'd find their careers and roles in the league are diminishing by the year. We're not far from a time when Miami players no longer get the benefit of the doubt.
 
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rascani said:
It is easy to quantify that we have more "blue chip" recruits than most of our opponents. The more difficult question is whether those "blue chip" recruits were overrated by the recruiting services or whether the coaches are not developing them. Either way, in college football, the coaches are responsible for both prospect evaluation and player development, so the fault still lies with the coaching staff here. You could give some of the offensive coaches a pass since they mostly inherited the players, but they still blew it with Martell and OL recruiting.
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Jeezuz, really? You think our recruits are overrated but everybody else's are pretty accurate? That's not at all a difficult question.
 
rascani said:
I don't think comparing UF's 4-7 season to the current UM situation is necessarily applicable. Yes, both teams underachieved and UF drastically improved with better coaching and UM would as well...but the two teams are composed of entirely different players. My point was just that you really can't tell the difference between an underachiever and a bust with our current poor coaching staff.
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Good Gawd, man. It starts and ends with coaching. All of it. If UF isn’t a perfect example of that for you there’s no reason to even evaluate the game.

kryptonite said:
Jeezuz, really? You think our recruits are overrated but everybody else's are pretty accurate? That's not at all a difficult question.
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Like seriously. I just can’t. We definitely need a better draft board. I mean WTF.
 
filmcane said:
Yes, we have more talent than the 12 teams we will face this coming season. How do I measure this? By the overall recruiting rankings of the players we have in contrast to the recruiting rankings that our opponents have. The only team we'll play in this coming regular season who has similar talent is FSU and I believe we've actually passed them; especially with Cam, their only legit source of offense for the past 3 years, leaving for the draft.
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Funny that we share talent with FSU and have the exact same win loss record. I wonder if there is a culture shared by both talent pools. Low football IQ players with speed and self entitlement expecting an easy path to the NFL?
 
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TheEye said:
Funny that we share talent with FSU and have the exact same win loss record. I wonder if there is a culture shared by both talent pools. Low football IQ players with speed and self entitlement expecting an easy path to the NFL?
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Both teams need to get fixed. Only time will tell, but I think Norvell was a really good hire for them. I was baffled by the Taggart hire, but I was bummed by Norvell, because I know he'll be good.
 
MrMachete said:
Good Gawd, man. It starts and ends with coaching. All of it. If UF isn’t a perfect example of that for you there’s no reason to even evaluate the game.



Like seriously. I just can’t. We definitely need a better draft board. I mean WTF.
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No sht, but that's not one of our top 10 problems, so why worry about it right now?
 
Initially the players have higher ceilings as recruits coming in as freshman. Ratings = potential ceiling. They don’t develop in the system, coaches don’t develop them, attitudes take a bad turn due to the “culture” etc. So they’re either slightly bigger and just as skilled as they came in or have regressed.
 
BoxingRobes said:
I'm not saying he's my top guy or anything...but imagine Miami with a coach like Scott Satterfield who just gets the very best out of all of his players no matter where he's been.

Imagine what our perception of our players would be. We'd be having different discussions about them all.

Miami has talent, but the culture stinks and it permeates the roster. The upperclassmen just constantly pass it down to the underclassmen and its a terrible cycle we are in. They really don't give a fvck about winning or losing. No one gets mad when we're losing or take a loss. We're still dancing on the sideline and then just walking back to the locker room like they are clocking in and out of work.
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Yep. Scott did a masterful job in Louisville considering the pieces he had in place. Coaching matters. Fans at UL and UF were talking about their players, a lack of talent, poor culture, and no drive to win as well - before a real coach showed up.

Same story at USC before Pete. OSU before Tressel. UF before Urban. Those UF players were sliding down as to not get hit while playing us in the bowl game. Sofffffffffft before Urban arrived.

Coaching matters.
 
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sdaly12 said:
we can notice guys who want to play Dejay Dallas an old time cane as well as Quarterman , but head scratcher are guys like V.Donaldson fat and out of shape.... B.Herbert, Z.Hillary who seemingly are really not interested in playing or Martell who takes a pass on the whole season
give me a team that shows up and competes and a staff that develops players i am ok, we will win our share and then some
to many Dogs with Fleas
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It makes no sense to me these divas who quit on the team. Oh you're team isn't the best so you quit? You don't think the scouts are watching you loaf against FIU? I've never hated a Miami team more than this one. I hope every guy who leaves early besides Deejay ends up working at Mcdonald's. Losing to FIU? The coaches suck but so do you.
 
Miami does not have the talent to compete with teams in the top 10-12 in the country. The players are more talented, on paper, than the results on the field. The talent wearing coaches polos on the sideline is cellar-dweller G5 level. A good coaching staff with this roster wins a weak ACC Coastal but loses to Clemson by 30 in the ACCCG. Dabo could pick the spread.
 
The players look devoid of talent when they aren't trying. Enos was an ******* and he sucked. If you're going to be an *******, you better be **** good. Otherwise these kids are going to tune you out. And that's what happened. We had enough talent to win 10 games this year with better coaching. Same with next year.
 
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I think we have different players today than we did in the 1980's. In the 80's and 90's the players were edgy, they weren't recruited higher than FSU most years but they were hungry to prove that the recruiting services, which were weak at the time, underrated them, and it was true. We had players who weren't afraid to get in an opponent's face and back any talk up completely. They didn't think they were better because of the uniform they wore but who they were as men. Those guys were warriors. They weren't thugs but they worked harder than any team in America regardless of the facilities they worked in, which just happened to be some of the poorest funded in the country. But they mostly came from the poorest funded high school in the country and they said F that, we are better and they just refused to lose for like a decade. These players today are not like them. They abide by the 20 hour a week rule while our players in the 1980's and 90's probably spent twice that amount of time preparing for games. They did so because first, they wanted to be the top dog, and once they attained that status, they refused to let anyone else out work or hustle them. And yes, they got lucky a few times (wide left or wide right) but they were awesome men of character.

We now have players who protect themselves from playing in a bowl game because they might drop from the 5th round to the 6th round of the NFL draft, who admit to "going through the motions" in a bowl game over trying to win the **** thing, and who don't care whether we beat FIU, Duke and La Tech. The last player I have watched who you could tell it mattered to him whether his team won or loss, more than life itself, was Duke Johnson. I know he isn't popular and he made more than his share of mistakes, but Randy Shannon only tried to recruit players who were champions on the high school level. He knew champions have something within themselves that is different than other players. Jarren Williams' team in high school was like 5-5. He got used to losing in high school and so he doesn't have the refuse to lose attitude. So he plays a game "going through the motions". That isn't the type of player we recruited in the 1980's and 90's.
 
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TemplarCane said:
Miami does not have the talent to compete with teams in the top 10-12 in the country. The players are more talented, on paper, than the results on the field. The talent wearing coaches polos on the sideline is cellar-dweller G5 level. A good coaching staff with this roster wins the ACC Coastal but loses to Clemson by 30 in the ACCCG. Dabo could pick the spread.
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There is a galaxy between some of the top 12 ranked teams - and Clemson. We have the talent to be ranked in the top 12, win the Division, and still get whipped by Clemson. Because only Bama, OSU, and LSU are on their level. Think Utah/Baylor here.
 
kryptonite said:
Jeezuz, really? You think our recruits are overrated but everybody else's are pretty accurate? That's not at all a difficult question.
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I neither said our recruits are overrated nor everybody else's were pretty accurate. I said it is hard to tell the difference between underachievers vs overrated players because our coaching staff does not appear capable of getting the best out of players.
 
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MrMachete said:
Good Gawd, man. It starts and ends with coaching. All of it. If UF isn’t a perfect example of that for you there’s no reason to even evaluate the game.
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I don't disagree with the importance of coaching. You're 100% correct that it starts and ends with coaching. Especially since CFB basically combines the front office and coaching roles. And UF's improvement under Mullen is a great example of what good coaching can do. However, I'm not convinced that even if you took that exact Mullen staff and gave them the current Canes roster, that you'd get 10 wins. But that's mostly just because I'm not convinced these kids actually give a **** about winning.
 
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It’s all on the coaches but our issue is mainly depth and failures in development....

We are too thin at spots like cornerback which stalls development bc of lack of competition. And our olineman dont develop only the couple good enough to make it to the NFL after their cfb careers are over.

Combined with the fact that we don’t have enough elite talent overall to compete with the top 15 teams in cfb.

We have some ballers and potential ballers but half of the potentials never develop and the other half don’t come close to filling the gap needed to catch up to the top teams in the country.

Those teams have underclassmen in the 2nd and 3rd string that are good enough to start. But they also have a couple upperclassmen that’s also former 5 stars balling or players that are products of good coaching and development that’s doing their jobs at a high level, in front of them making plays. We are not there yet and won’t ever be with this staff.
 
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