Gimmick Offense

Didn't realize that the air raid is a running spread? Also, does Texas A&M employ tempo now that Manziel is gone? Not running tempo allows Bama to rotate their players through keeping them fresh. How many times has Saban lost to an uptempo spread style team? Get Bama spread out and keep the tempo up and Bama's big slow guys dying on the field. Spreading them out works if you're not huddling, and not substituting.

Listen to Saban's HT interview during the game, He said NOTHING about HOW or WHAT Clemson was doing to em', but WHO was doing it to em'. Saban basically said that Watson's ability to extend plays was giving His defense fits...now tell me, how many CFB teams in America not named Ohio St. have a kid like Watson on their roster?...we certainly don't!
 
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LOL people still spouting the same tired misconceptions about the spread.

"It's finesse."

"Throwing 80 times isn't real football."

People need to wake up. The best spread teams have a strong run element. They want to spread the defense out and get a numbers advantage in the box so they can run up the gut. And when teams are spread out, it's harder to disguise the defense. It simplifies the reads for the QBs.

Tempo tires out the defense by not allowing them to substitute. It also forces DCs to keep defensive calls relatively simple.

People really dont get it AT ALL. Baylor, Oregon, TCU, Okla, UNC, Clemson, etc. all run some variation of spread but guess what? They all out rush a team like alabama.

And they all watched Alabama win another championship.

The problem isn't the spread. The problem is that teams like Baylor and Oklahoma State and Oregon try to win the whole thing by outscoring everyone. None of them has succeeded in doing that. You still have to have some semblance of defense and the ability to control the clock.

Those teams are never going to recruit national championship caliber teams. They can't get overwhelming defensive players because those players just aren't as common in those regions and the majority will go to traditional power. They have to rely on systems. However, teams like Ohio State does the best of both worlds and if they were in the playoffs, I wouldn't be surprised if they won it again. OSU's only loss was on a last second field goal I believe and they killed Bama last year with the same team returning

You can give them all the excuses you want, but their way of doing things has not allowed them to turn the corner.

And LULZ at the idea that Oklahoma State and Oregon "can't get players". This isn't 1974.
 
Most spread teams aren't getting the players though. Those teams aren't loaded with NFL guys, their coaches are simply coaching their a$$es off. Teams that run the spread but also have enough athletes in their area to recruit top level talent (for defense) have shown the ability to win big.
 
It's a lot easier to be physical against Bama when you get them out of the phone booth.

YUH?!

How's that worked out for TAMU the last 2 years?...I'll answer it for ya', they've lost to Bama by a combined score of 100-23!!!

So the simple answer is to get em' out the phone booth huh?!...YUH?!...LMFAO @ YOU!!!

Where did I say that that was the "simple answer", dummy?

Read my post again. I said it's "easier" to run on Bama when you get them out of a phone booth. You mention TAMU, I'll mention OSU.
 
Where did I say that that was the "simple answer", dummy?

Read my post again. I said it's "easier" to run on Bama when you get them out of a phone booth. You mention TAMU, I'll mention OSU.

"Easier to run on Bama"?

Alabama rush defense this year..468 rushes, 1136 yds., 2.43 YPC.

Bama rush defense against Ole Miss, the only team they lost to this year...32 rushes, 92 yds..

"Easier to run on Bama"?...YUH?!!!LMFAO @ YOU!!!...2-WICE!!!
 
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A spread team just raped Bama's defense in the title game. Don't see how anyone can still argue the spread doesn't work against elite teams.
 
A spread team just raped Bama's defense in the title game. Don't see how anyone can still argue the spread doesn't work against elite teams.

And Bama's Pro Style O put up 45 on Clemson...GOES BOTH WAYS!!!

But the discussion isn't about pro style offenses. The discussion is about what type of offenses have the best success against Alabama. You are trying to change the discussion because the facts do not help your argument.

Alabama has the most trouble against offenses that spread them out. That is fact.
 
A spread team just raped Bama's defense in the title game. Don't see how anyone can still argue the spread doesn't work against elite teams.

And Bama's Pro Style O put up 45 on Clemson...GOES BOTH WAYS!!!

But what does that have to do with Clemson's offense? Their job is to put points on the board. Not the offense's fault that the special teams and defensive backfield failed miserably.
 
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Didn't realize that the air raid is a running spread? Also, does Texas A&M employ tempo now that Manziel is gone? Not running tempo allows Bama to rotate their players through keeping them fresh. How many times has Saban lost to an uptempo spread style team? Get Bama spread out and keep the tempo up and Bama's big slow guys dying on the field. Spreading them out works if you're not huddling, and not substituting.

Listen to Saban's HT interview during the game, He said NOTHING about HOW or WHAT Clemson was doing to em', but WHO was doing it to em'. Saban basically said that Watson's ability to extend plays was giving His defense fits...now tell me, how many CFB teams in America not named Ohio St. have a kid like Watson on their roster?...we certainly don't!

Why would a coach openly admit that a scheme is killing his defense? Would you? I certainly wouldn't. The best part is that You don't need a Watson to do that defense dirty. Is Chad Kelly a Deshaun Watson? Not a chance. He's more Jacob Coker, but hey completely avoid the fact that the spread attack gave Alabama all it could handle. The point is, the key to beating a Saban defense is to spread them out and go no huddle. Really cool thing to watch and see that Clemson took what was given to them and pushed Bama to the brink.
 
Alabama runs all kinds of spread elements. They are not some conventional pro-style offense at all. In fact, they use all kinds of things they learned from Tom Herman.

Herman recalls what intrigued Saban the most during their time together: "If you go more up-tempo, how do you practice the spread way and the no-huddle way and yet stay physical and sound on defense?"

Here they are stealing plays from Urban:

At that point Urban Meyer turned to an old school gap scheme play with a wrinkle. The Buckeyes went with a power run play known as counter, but ran it out of an unbalanced set with jet motion.

And another:

The Buckeyes went with another counter out of a different set. This time Ohio State ran the jet motion counter out of a deuce formation.

The spread does not mean soft. The Buckeyes have as much run game diversity as any team I have studied. Whether it’s gap or zone schemes they always have multiple options and adjustments to make their running game effective and efficient. Often times just their motion "blocks" the play side force player before the ball is even snapped. Using timing and waiting for that S to run with the jet motion player until it is his time to pass him off, they snap the ball at the moment the force S is furthest away from the counter they are wanting to run. Essentially making the defense have 10 players to make the play.

Alabama saw this in their game with Ohio State and stole it. This again is a series of primary and secondary blocks. The primary block is set by the pulling right guard who neutralizes the outside linebacker/nickel corner. The secondary block is then the tight end who takes away any threat from the outside corner or the middle linebacker depending on if the run is between or outside the tackles. Ohio State runs it to the outside, and Alabama ran it as a counter to the outside as well Finally the outside wide receiver is able to engage the free safety as the defender’s first few steps were towards the middle of the field when the receiver in motion started to go across the backfield before the snap.

This is essentially the exact same play as what they saw from Ohio State and is a clear influence of Tom Herman and his power spread. All of that happened in a matter of three seconds, and all of it had to work in unison for the RB to have the space he did when he housed it for 70+ yards.

I don't want to disparage anyone on the board, but sometimes people get an idea in their head and instead of evolving as the evidence changes, they dig their heels in as to why things are the way they remember them.

PS- Tom Herman is going to be a star. His system evolves and changes and has an answer for everything the defense does. He is aggression personified in everything he does. Really happy with Richt, but as I've gotten to know Herman better and what he does as his own man now, he'd have been my #1 choice.
 
LOL people still spouting the same tired misconceptions about the spread.

"It's finesse."

"Throwing 80 times isn't real football."

People need to wake up. The best spread teams have a strong run element. They want to spread the defense out and get a numbers advantage in the box so they can run up the gut. And when teams are spread out, it's harder to disguise the defense. It simplifies the reads for the QBs.

Tempo tires out the defense by not allowing them to substitute. It also forces DCs to keep defensive calls relatively simple.

People really dont get it AT ALL. Baylor, Oregon, TCU, Okla, UNC, Clemson, etc. all run some variation of spread but guess what? They all out rush a team like alabama.

And they all watched Alabama win another championship.

The problem isn't the spread. The problem is that teams like Baylor and Oklahoma State and Oregon try to win the whole thing by outscoring everyone. None of them has succeeded in doing that. You still have to have some semblance of defense and the ability to control the clock.

Those teams are never going to recruit national championship caliber teams. They can't get overwhelming defensive players because those players just aren't as common in those regions and the majority will go to traditional power. They have to rely on systems. However, teams like Ohio State does the best of both worlds and if they were in the playoffs, I wouldn't be surprised if they won it again. OSU's only loss was on a last second field goal I believe and they killed Bama last year with the same team returning

You can give them all the excuses you want, but their way of doing things has not allowed them to turn the corner.

And LULZ at the idea that Oklahoma State and Oregon "can't get players". This isn't 1974.

"Can't get players" doesn't sound like "dominate defensive players are more rare on the west coast." It also doesn't sound like "the majority will go to traditional powers". Yes they will get players, but they will not get the same number of elite defensive talent. There's plenty of offensive and skill players to go around.
 
The best part is that You don't need a Watson to do that defense dirty. Is Chad Kelly a Deshaun Watson? Not a chance. He's more Jacob Coker, but hey completely avoid the fact that the spread attack gave Alabama all it could handle.

Kelly's "more Jacob Coker"?

Kelly...107-500-4.67-10 TDs
Coker...74-68-0.92-2 TDs

^^^^^ But "He's more Coker" huh?

According to your logic, I guess all we gotta do is go 5-Wide every down and Kaaya's the next Mike Vick huh?

LMFAO!!!
 
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Where did I say that that was the "simple answer", dummy?

Read my post again. I said it's "easier" to run on Bama when you get them out of a phone booth. You mention TAMU, I'll mention OSU.

"Easier to run on Bama"?

Alabama rush defense this year..468 rushes, 1136 yds., 2.43 YPC.

Bama rush defense against Ole Miss, the only team they lost to this year...32 rushes, 92 yds..

"Easier to run on Bama"?...YUH?!!!LMFAO @ YOU!!!...2-WICE!!!

How many rushing yards did Ohio State have on Alabama?
 
I think mobile QB thing is overstated.

That's only because there only 2 or 3 QB's in the country that can get through a progression like a Brad Kaaya
 
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Ohio State ran 42 times for 281 yards on Alabama. They can be gashed, but I don't think it will happen running straight at them in a pro-style offense.
 
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I think mobile QB thing is overstated.

That's only because there only 2 or 3 QB's in the country that can get through a progression like a Brad Kaaya
There's nothing overstated about a mobile QB who can throw. It puts a tremendous strain on the defense that an immobile QB doesn't.

Even Coker has enough mobility to make plays with his legs when his protection breaks down. That TD run he had was a perfect example. An immobile QB gets slaughtered by that DE who was killing Bama all night and had Coker in his sights for a tackle behind the LOS.

Bama's season turned around on Coker's legs. He won the team over running the football.
 
They can be gashed, but I don't think it will happen running straight at them in a pro-style offense.

Agreed...but also, if you abandon trying to run straight at them, you're playing into Saban's hands, IMHO. From watching their defense, I think they want you to run outside...East-West.
 
There's nothing overstated about a mobile QB who can throw. It puts a tremendous strain on the defense that an immobile QB doesn't.

Correct. That's what I meant by Saban being more worried about the WHO, than the HOW or the WHAT in His halftime interview. Ain't no defense for what guys like Watson can do.
 
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