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Get ‘em, Bear!
 
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TheOriginalCane said:
I like the bear, and I am probably headed for some heartbreak (i.e., finding out the bear is just a new NYSOM schtick).

As a big fan of the James Bond books/movies, I enjoy witty double entendres, hence my suggestion for the bear to be more subtle.
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TrumpyCane is offended the thought of that came through your mind

I do however have a surprise coming soon hopefully
 
I support the bears right to free speech, that woman tweets all day and most of the time its just BS. When she gets called out for it she plays the woman card.
 
RVACane said:
All private. They’re just bragging that they’re up there academically with NYU and Tufts.

I can guaran-dam-tee you in the real world that NYU and Tufts degrees hold more weight than a gaytor degree.
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That's like guaranteeing me you can buy more with a $5 bill than a $1 bill.

I know the academic space guys, this isn't even a conversation. UF is hysterical.
 
wspcane said:
Right, but Georgia has had a comparable option in state.
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I think the question is really "comparable". I agree that GaTech is a state school, not a private school. But in all other respects, it has not nearly been a "close option" if a student doesn't get into UGa, until maybe recently.

From GaTech's small (undergraduate) size, selective majors (heavy on the engineering side), and high academic standards, it hasn't been much of a "second choice" comparable state school option to UGa. A southern state comp to GaTech would be Auburn or Clemson, but both of those schools are larger and have more of a traditional undergrad-grad ratio. Those schools also offer more diversity of study than GaTech offers (at least at the undergrad level).

What I was referring to is a phenomenon in southern states with huge population growth. Look at the top 10 states (by population). Five are northern states, and when you add massive California and Texas, you have seven states that need to offer a lot of college education opportunities to a lot of people in a lot of locations. Some of these states (Pennsylvania, Ohio) have created massive "flagship" schools by concentrating the best educational opportunities in one location (Penn State, Ohio State). Other large states have a more diverse set of "state" universities, and while one state university may be "the best" (UC-Berkeley, UT-Austin), there are still a lot of other good state schools if you can't get into the flagship.

The three southern states that have recently boomed into the Top 10 population are Florida, Georgia, and North Carolina. The State of Florida had a long history of inequality for state schools (F$U was for women, FAMU was for blacks, even the funding was disproportionate until the 1990s). In short, UiF's "flagship" status was more than just a product of "excellence", it was created through a number of circumstances that became self-fulfilling prophecies.

GaTech is a great state school because of its mission, its standards, and its policies. UiF and UGa have benefited from being fake "flagship" schools in states with rapidly increasing populations. North Carolina allows the UNC name to be used in cities other than Chapel Hill. Florida and Georgia do not. UiF and UGa are just artificial "flagships" that have moved up the rankings due to fake "selectivity" stats.
 
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TheOriginalCane said:
I think the question is really "comparable". I agree that GaTech is a state school, not a private school. But in all other respects, it has not nearly been a "close option" if a student doesn't get into UGa, until maybe recently.

From GaTech's small (undergraduate) size, selective majors (heavy on the engineering side), and high academic standards, it hasn't been much of a "second choice" comparable state school option to UGa. A southern state comp to GaTech would be Auburn or Clemson, but both of those schools are larger and have more of a traditional undergrad-grad ratio. Those schools also offer more diversity of study than GaTech offers (at least at the undergrad level).

What I was referring to is a phenomenon in southern states with huge population growth. Look at the top 10 states (by population). Five are northern states, and when you add massive California and Texas, you have seven states that need to offer a lot of college education opportunities to a lot of people in a lot of locations. Some of these states (Pennsylvania, Ohio) have created massive "flagship" schools by concentrating the best educational opportunities in one location (Penn State, Ohio State). Other large states have a more diverse set of "state" universities, and while one state university may be "the best" (UC-Berkeley, UT-Austin), there are still a lot of other good state schools if you can't get into the flagship.

The three southern states that have recently boomed into the Top 10 population are Florida, Georgia, and North Carolina. The State of Florida had a long history of inequality for state schools (F$U was for women, FAMU was for blacks, even the funding was disproportionate until the 1990s). In short, UiF's "flagship" status was more than just a product of "excellence", it was created through a number of circumstances that became self-fulfilling prophecies.

GaTech is a great state school because of its mission, its standards, and its policies. UiF and UGa have benefited from being fake "flagship" schools in states with rapidly increasing populations. North Carolina allows the UNC name to be used in cities other than Chapel Hill. Florida and Georgia do not. UiF and UGa are just artificial "flagships" that have moved up the rankings due to fake "selectivity" stats.
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Bright Futures allowed UF to be more selective and tout its status on academics. All those other reasons built it to what it is, now they claim academics because of a very recent development.
 
JD08 said:
Bright Futures allowed UF to be more selective and tout its status on academics. All those other reasons built it to what it is, now they claim academics because of a very recent development.
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Bright Futures is definitely helpful, but that didn't start until 1997.

By then, UiF had built up a huge and insurmountable lead as the state's "flagship" university over decades of unfair practices, such as unequal funding, racial and gender discrimination, preventing the use of the name "University of Florida" by any other state university, and artificially limiting the size of the undergraduate student body and keeping tuition artificially low.

And UiF's "selectivity" has become particularly potent as Florida has boomed to become the third-largest state in the US (by the way, this is the exact same reason that F$U has "mysteriously" risen up in the rankings as well).

There are simply too many Florida residents applying to too few spots at UiF and F$U, and this is the primary reason why both schools have seen better rankings without doing anything in particular to improved themselves academically. UiF has run through a raft of university presidents over the past 20 years, and F$U had jock-sniffers/former p-analytical hacks Sandy D'Alemberte and TK Wetherell as president for nearly two decades. Not exactly the recipe for building academic excellence in an organic fashion.

Let's not forget, it was Tad Foote who kick-started UM's rise up the rankings...BY CUTTING THE SIZE OF THE STUDENT BODY. Of course, Miami is a private school, so that was his prerogative. UiF and F$U are state schools funded by the Florida taxpayers. UiF and F$U should be EXPANDING the size of their undergrad populations. ****, they are land-grant colleges in cheap-****e rural areas. They shouldn't be forcing urban campuses in Miami and Boca and Orlando and Tampa to expand their campuses at enormous cost.

And every one of those schools should be UF-Miami or UF-Boca Raton or UF-Orlando or UF-Tampa. And they should all be able to share UiF's academic resources. And apply for UiF's government research grants.
 
TheOriginalCane said:
Bright Futures is definitely helpful, but that didn't start until 1997.

By then, UiF had built up a huge and insurmountable lead as the state's "flagship" university over decades of unfair practices, such as unequal funding, racial and gender discrimination, preventing the use of the name "University of Florida" by any other state university, and artificially limiting the size of the undergraduate student body and keeping tuition artificially low.

And UiF's "selectivity" has become particularly potent as Florida has boomed to become the third-largest state in the US (by the way, this is the exact same reason that F$U has "mysteriously" risen up in the rankings as well).

There are simply too many Florida residents applying to too few spots at UiF and F$U, and this is the primary reason why both schools have seen better rankings without doing anything in particular to improved themselves academically. UiF has run through a raft of university presidents over the past 20 years, and F$U had jock-sniffers/former p-analytical hacks Sandy D'Alemberte and TK Wetherell as president for nearly two decades. Not exactly the recipe for building academic excellence in an organic fashion.

Let's not forget, it was Tad Foote who kick-started UM's rise up the rankings...BY CUTTING THE SIZE OF THE STUDENT BODY. Of course, Miami is a private school, so that was his prerogative. UiF and F$U are state schools funded by the Florida taxpayers. UiF and F$U should be EXPANDING the size of their undergrad populations. ****, they are land-grant colleges in cheap-****e rural areas. They shouldn't be forcing urban campuses in Miami and Boca and Orlando and Tampa to expand their campuses at enormous cost.

And every one of those schools should be UF-Miami or UF-Boca Raton or UF-Orlando or UF-Tampa. And they should all be able to share UiF's academic resources. And apply for UiF's government research grants.
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My point was that all of the past artificial measures you mentioned are whitewashed by the affordability that Bright Futures offers. It allows UF to portray itself as academically exclusive based on merit alone and not any past history designed to make it that way. They stacked the deck to set them up for this.

Bright Futures effectively guarantees a steady supply of academically gifted students destined for FL's public universities. The best are going to want to go to UF, which is academically the best of the bunch. That's raised the status of UF for the past 23 years, allowing them to be even more exclusive. In effect, they created their own supply of top potential students.
 
JD08 said:
My point was that all of the past artificial measures you mentioned are whitewashed by the affordability that Bright Futures offers. It allows UF to portray itself as academically exclusive based on merit alone and not any past history designed to make it that way. They stacked the deck to set them up for this.

Bright Futures effectively guarantees a steady supply of academically gifted students destined for FL's public universities. The best are going to want to go to UF, which is academically the best of the bunch. That's raised the status of UF for the past 23 years, allowing them to be even more exclusive. In effect, they created their own supply of top potential students.
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OK, gotcha, my bad.

Yes, I believe that Bright Futures stacked up with all the other issues, and it has helped to create artificial "selectivity" at UF.

But you are right, all of these things have really skyrocketed over the past 20-30 years.

Think about this:

1980 - 9.7 million population (+2.8 million from 1970)
1990 - 12.9 million population (+3.2 million)
2000 - 16.0 million population (+4.9 million)
2010 - 18.8 million population (+2.8 million)

And now the population is about to exceed 22 million (we are at 21.5 million currently, an increase of 2.7 million in 10 years). And then you make the tuition (effectively) cheaper with Bright Futures? Wow.

In that time, the ONLY new state university that was created was Florida Gulf Coast. In 1991. (And, no, I'm not counting Florida Poly in Lakeland, as it is tiny and is only teaches STEM subjects).

We have essentially added the population of an entire US state (and I'm talking about the smaller US states that are ranked anywhere from 30 to 50 in population) EVERY SINGLE DECADE for five decades.

It's insane. We should have built a new state university in every decade from 1980 until now. But we haven't.

****, states like Iowa (3.1 million population) and Mississippi (3.0 million population) have 2 Power Five universities, while Florida GROWS by nearly 3 million people every decade for 50 years, and we only have 3 Power Five universities.

Fvck "Flagship Florida" UiF. And F$U. Their "selectivity" is fake. Skyrocketing population (and Bright Futures) means that millions of kids apply to UiF and F$U and get "rejected".
 
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