MEGA Everything & Everybody Sucks Megathread for Miserable Mopes & Sorry Slurpers (aka The Basura Bin)

[Rellyrell]

Most people beg us to run man to man until we run man to man and our CBs (at least 3 different ones today) get straight cooked on 4 easy go routes for 80yards a pop.

It isn't scheme when your CBs just get ran past by a 5'7" 155lb WR. Like what do you want Steele to do run 2 deep safeties all game, for the couple plays they throw deep? It's not like Cover 3 or Cover 4 would have changed any of the results from the deep passes. It's not like Ivey playing off would have resulted in him not getting cooked...

This board legit be having amnesia. All off-season, they cheered for man-press coverage. Lol. Now? “What an idiot Steele is for running that!”

I legit be wondering do they remember this roster or nah? This is yrs & yrs of convincing themselves THAT EVERYONE is elite that gets recruited. I still remember the back & forths regarding Flagg & Dykstra, more specifically. Lol; good times.

I begged & pleaded for patience at the opening of the season b/c of the roster make up, & I knew as soon as adversity hit, FIRE EVERYONE; EVERYONE’S A BUM. Lol. It’s y I love it here & hate it here, too.

 

[calinative umstudent]

That's not quite right.

Yes, if you have 4 WRs and 4 CB, and 2 safeties, the safeties could only double 2 WRs leaving 2 CBs 1v1, but the safties playing zone are covering area not people. It's their job to be the last line of defense. They should be able to react and support where the ball is going especially the deep routes. That can always be covered up in dime and Quarters coverage. It can also be schemed to a Nickel coverage with J. Williams in the box as a 2nd LB sliding out to coverage for the 6th DB giving a 4-1-4-2 Dime coverage.

On the 4 huge MTSU deep passing plays, I saw no safeties back either by design or they were out of position.

As I stated, Dime and Quarters coverage have 2 safeties over the top. Actually, Quarters can have 2 or 3 which I'd prefer with James, Cam, and Avante.

With J Williams, you can play Nickel coverage all day as the base defense with him in the box and sliding out to Dime in pass coverage without substitution. This is effective against teams that like to go fast.

Nickel Defense

View attachment 209828

Dime Defense

View attachment 209829

Quarters Defense

View attachment 209830

These are just the basics. It's not complicated. We have 3 good safeties that give us versatility.

What Are Nickel, Dime and Quarter Defenses? - vIQtory Sports

As the passing game advances, defenses need to match personnel and scheme. Defenses have used personnel groupings like nickel, dime, and quarter defenses to

www.viqtorysports.com

Nickel, Dime, and Quarters are a formation groupings referring to number of DBs on the field, that is it. That's all it is. It isn't a coverage.

So whether you are running Cover 3, Cover 4, or Man the outside corner has the outside WR on a go route with no safety help - basically man coverage. The way you're getting safety help is man with 1 or 2 deep safeties -cover 1/man 2 deep (which leaves someone open short or hurts you in run D), or cover 2. Sure technically in Cover 4 you have 4 deep guys but theres basically a guarantee that the interior deep defender will have a threat that he has to cover inside. Just think about it - you have outside WR running a go/Post, and another running a deep in. The safety has to pick up the In route, and the Corner is left 1 on 1 with the outside WR.

 

[Number1CanesFan]

Nickel, Dime, and Quarters are a formation groupings referring to number of DBs on the field, that is it. That's all it is. It isn't a coverage.

So whether you are running Cover 3, Cover 4, or Man the outside corner has the outside WR on a go route with no safety help - basically man coverage. The way you're getting safety help is man with 1 or 2 deep safeties -cover 1/man 2 deep (which leaves someone open short or hurts you in run D), or cover 2. Sure technically in Cover 4 you have 4 deep guys but theres basically a guarantee that the interior deep defender will have a threat that he has to cover inside. Just think about it - you have outside WR running a go/Post, and another running a deep in. The safety has to pick up the In route, and the Corner is left 1 on 1 with the outside WR.

Its basic football. Read the article. I made it simple. These are the formations where you can have 2 safeties over the top against 4 WRS. Yah, you can do all that other **** if you want to, but you don't have to. You can play nickel coverage with James in the box. On the hike of the ball, if it's a pass play, he rotates to the outside safety in the flat and that safety rotates back giving you 2 high safeties. You need those formations to be able to cover 4 WRs, so I don't get the point your making saying those are just formations because all the 4 WR coverages are out of those formations.

Yes, the safeties have to make a choice, but the rule of thumb is nobody gets behind you. That's their job. They don't have to help the underneath coverage either. Steele could tell the safeties to help on the deep coverage so nothing gets behind them and if they beat us underneath then we live to play another down. On the plays we got bombed there were no safeties over the top or in the vicinity either by design of the coverage/personnel or player mistake.

We don't have to run man under either. That's a choice. You can play all zone and 2 safeties high. So, stop with the BS!!! See Iowa and Wisconsin. Far less team speed on defense, but they always have good DB play. They play zone not man. We should stop playing man as a base coverage because we're not good at it. There are options. It's a choice.

 

[Coach Macho]

That's not quite right.

Yes, if you have 4 WRs and 4 CB, and 2 safeties, the safeties could only double 2 WRs leaving 2 CBs 1v1, but the safties playing zone are covering area not people. It's their job to be the last line of defense. They should be able to react and support where the ball is going especially the deep routes. That can always be covered up in dime and Quarters coverage. It can also be schemed to a Nickel coverage with J. Williams in the box as a 2nd LB sliding out to coverage for the 6th DB giving a 4-1-4-2 Dime coverage.

On the 4 huge MTSU deep passing plays, I saw no safeties back either by design or they were out of position.

As I stated, Dime and Quarters coverage have 2 safeties over the top. Actually, Quarters can have 2 or 3 which I'd prefer with James, Cam, and Avante.

With J Williams, you can play Nickel coverage all day as the base defense with him in the box and sliding out to Dime in pass coverage without substitution. This is effective against teams that like to go fast.

Nickel Defense

View attachment 209828

Dime Defense

View attachment 209829

Quarters Defense

View attachment 209830

These are just the basics. It's not complicated. We have 3 good safeties that give us versatility.

What Are Nickel, Dime and Quarter Defenses? - vIQtory Sports

As the passing game advances, defenses need to match personnel and scheme. Defenses have used personnel groupings like nickel, dime, and quarter defenses to

www.viqtorysports.com

I fvckin' love this site.

Only on this board can a fan try to teach/correct a guy who's been calling defensive plays himself for 15 years.
Gotta love it.

Sir...
2-man coverage requires dime personnel and gives the defense A FIVE MAN BOX! Those diagrams you just showed me have a five man box! You cannot play defensive football with a five-man box unless it is 3rd and long.

Steele runs Rip/Liz Match coverage versus all 2x2 formations...and "Stubbie" coverage versus all 3x1 formations. (I'm betting you know what neither one of these are)
Both are Saban/Smart staples.

Both of those coverages leave the Cornerbacks 1-on-1 versus any vertical route by the outside WR. They have no safety help because the safeties are playing inside out and are worried about slot receivers first.

Safeties cannot help outside cornerbacks versus spread formations unless there is dime personnel on the field... Because that would leave the slot receivers wide open.

And finally...
You mentioned quarters coverage. Quarters is basically man to man on the outside, John Madden. The cornerbacks are in charge of the outside quarter of the field. Guess where that leaves them on the deep routes...
Yep, one on one.


This is why I can't stand this board during the season. SMH

 

[Coach Macho]

Its basic football. Read the article. I made it simple. These are the formations where you can have 2 safeties over the top against 4 WRS. Yah, you can do all that other **** if you want to, but you don't have to. You can play nickel coverage with James in the box. On the hike of the ball, if it's a pass play, he rotates to the outside safety in the flat and that safety rotates back giving you 2 high safeties. You need those formations to be able to cover 4 WRs, so I don't get the point your making saying those are just formations because all the 4 WR coverages are out of those formations.

Yes, the safeties have to make a choice, but the rule of thumb is nobody gets behind you. That's their job. They don't have to help the underneath coverage either. Steele could tell the safeties to help on the deep coverage so nothing gets behind them and if they beat us underneath then we live to play another down. On the plays we got bombed there were no safeties over the top or in the vicinity either by design of the coverage/personnel or player mistake.

We don't have to run man under either. That's a choice. You can play all zone and 2 safeties high. So, stop with the BS!!! See Iowa and Wisconsin. Far less team speed on defense, but they always have good DB play. They play zone not man. We should stop playing man as a base coverage because we're not good at it. There are options. It's a choice.

WE DON'T PLAY MAN AS A BASE COVERAGE.

 

[Number1CanesFan]

I fvckin' love this site.

Only on this board can a fan try to teach/correct a guy who's been calling defensive plays himself for 15 years.
Gotta love it.

Sir...
2-man coverage requires dime personnel and gives the defense A FIVE MAN BOX! Those diagrams you just showed me have a five man box! You cannot play defensive football with a five-man box unless it is 3rd and long.

Steele runs Rip/Liz Match coverage versus all 2x2 formations...and "Stubbie" coverage versus all 3x1 formations. (I'm betting you know what neither one of these are)
Both are Saban/Smart staples.

Both of those coverages leave the Cornerbacks 1-on-1 versus any vertical route by the outside WR. They have no safety help because the safeties are playing inside out and are worried about slot receivers first.

Safeties cannot help outside cornerbacks versus spread formations unless there is dime personnel on the field... Because that would leave the slot receivers wide open.

And finally...
You mentioned quarters coverage. Quarters is basically man to man on the outside genius. The cornerbacks are in charge of the outside quarter of the field. Guess what that leaves them on the deep routes...
Yep, one on one.


This is why I can't stand this board during the season. SMH

No Phuking ****!!! You say impossible. What did I say? Dime and Quarters, but you say it can only be run in Dime which is what I said.

Now, you're just being an *******!!!

 

[Coach Macho]

No Phuking ****!!! You say impossible. What did I say? Dime and Quarters, but you say it can only be run in Dime which is what I said.

Now, you're just being an *******!!!

YOU CAN'T LINE UP IN DIME PERSONNEL UNLESS IT'S 3RD AND LONG.

What don't you understand about FIVE MAN BOX?

 

[Number1CanesFan]

I fvckin' love this site.

Only on this board can a fan try to teach/correct a guy who's been calling defensive plays himself for 15 years.
Gotta love it.

Sir...
2-man coverage requires dime personnel and gives the defense A FIVE MAN BOX! Those diagrams you just showed me have a five man box! You cannot play defensive football with a five-man box unless it is 3rd and long.

Steele runs Rip/Liz Match coverage versus all 2x2 formations...and "Stubbie" coverage versus all 3x1 formations. (I'm betting you know what neither one of these are)
Both are Saban/Smart staples.

Both of those coverages leave the Cornerbacks 1-on-1 versus any vertical route by the outside WR. They have no safety help because the safeties are playing inside out and are worried about slot receivers first.

Safeties cannot help outside cornerbacks versus spread formations unless there is dime personnel on the field... Because that would leave the slot receivers wide open.

And finally...
You mentioned quarters coverage. Quarters is basically man to man on the outside, John Madden. The cornerbacks are in charge of the outside quarter of the field. Guess where that leaves them on the deep routes...
Yep, one on one.


This is why I can't stand this board during the season. SMH

Quarters is NOT man to man genius!!! The DBs cover space. A section of the field. Man vs man is to cover a player wherever he goes all over the field.

 

[Number1CanesFan]

YOU CAN'T LINE UP IN DIME PERSONNEL UNLESS IT'S 3RD AND LONG.

What don't you understand about FIVE MAN BOX?

You can play dime any time want. Yah, you may be venerable to the run, but you can do whatever you want. You don't have to line up in a 4-3 on 1st down. I explained playing nickel as a base with James in the box which is basically disguising a dime because you have the same personnel on the field when you run dime. We can roll James into dime coverage with the underneath safety bailing and James replacing him to the flat. This also gets our 3 best safeties on the field at the same time.

This is basically what Clemson did with Isaiah Simmons. Clemson even borrowed ISU's 3-3-5 defense as their base. So, basically they ran a hybrid nickel/dime moving Simmons all over the field in and out of the box.

Also, the context of the posts are about going against 4WR sets.

FYI, this is a fan site.

 

[Coach Macho]

Quarters is NOT man to man genius!!! The DBs cover space. A section of the field. Man vs man is to cover a player wherever he goes all over the field.

Holy fvck.

And what happens when the outside WR runs vertical through my "space" Einstein?

IT TURNS INTO MAN!

 

[Coach Macho]

You can play dime any time want. Yah, you may be venerable to the run, but you can do whatever you want. You don't have to line up in a 4-3 on 1st down. I explained playing nickel as a base with James in the box which is basically disguising a dime because you have the same personnel on the field when you run dime. We can roll James into dime coverage with the underneath safety bailing and James replacing him to the flat. This also gets our 3 best safeties on the field at the same time.

This is basically what Clemson did with Isaiah Simmons. Clemson even borrowed ISU's 3-3-5 defense as their base. So, basically they ran a hybrid nickel/dime moving Simmons all over the field in and out of the box.

Also, the context of the posts are about going against 4WR sets.

FYI, this is a fan site.

I apologize, there's really no nice way to say this, but you don't know what the fvck you're talking about.

Offensive personnel dictates what kind of defensive personnel you can line up in. You can't line up and dime personnel when it's first down and the offense lines up with double tight ends. (Which is what the offense did on the 98 yard touchdown pass)

The worst thing about your posts is that you're trying to educate a man who has been calling defensive plays for 15 years. You're also going against the logic of a man who has been coaching college football for over 40.

The audacity of you to think that you know more about covering receivers than a man who has been coaching college football for four decades and learned under Nick Saban.

 

[TrumpyCane]

I fvckin' love this site.

Only on this board can a fan try to teach/correct a guy who's been calling defensive plays himself for 15 years.
Gotta love it.

Sir...
2-man coverage requires dime personnel and gives the defense A FIVE MAN BOX! Those diagrams you just showed me have a five man box! You cannot play defensive football with a five-man box unless it is 3rd and long.

Steele runs Rip/Liz Match coverage versus all 2x2 formations...and "Stubbie" coverage versus all 3x1 formations. (I'm betting you know what neither one of these are)
Both are Saban/Smart staples.

Both of those coverages leave the Cornerbacks 1-on-1 versus any vertical route by the outside WR. They have no safety help because the safeties are playing inside out and are worried about slot receivers first.

Safeties cannot help outside cornerbacks versus spread formations unless there is dime personnel on the field... Because that would leave the slot receivers wide open.

And finally...
You mentioned quarters coverage. Quarters is basically man to man on the outside, John Madden. The cornerbacks are in charge of the outside quarter of the field. Guess where that leaves them on the deep routes...
Yep, one on one.


This is why I can't stand this board during the season. SMH

TrumpyCane wants to know if you meant stubbie or chubbie

 

[Boots]

again. it doesn't matter if we bring in Alabama staff tomorrow. if we lost to UNC yall would be yelling fire them too. Everybody needs to be yelling "RECRUIT BETTER" because it's different coaches with the same results. Sooner or later you have to realize it's not the coaches. who does that leave?

“Their five and four stars are better than our four and five stars!!!1!!1”

Coaches develop and scheme with the people they have

 

[Number1CanesFan]

I apologize, there's really no nice way to say this, but you don't know what the fvck you're talking about.

Offensive personnel dictates what kind of defensive personnel you can line up in. You can't line up and dime personnel when it's first down and the offense lines up with double tight ends. (Which is what the offense did on the 98 yard touchdown pass)

The worst thing about your posts is that you're trying to educate a man who has been calling defensive plays for 15 years. You're also going against the logic of a man who has been coaching college football for over 40.

The audacity of you to think that you know more about covering receivers than a man who has been coaching college football for four decades and learned under Nick Saban.

I didn't say I know more than anyone. So, youn stop making **** up!! It just make you look like an ***!!

You're moving the goal post to make yourself look good. The posts were specific to 4WRs. Then you started adding BS to and things I didn't say.

I didn't ask for your 2 cents to begin with.

Clemson ran 3-3-5, Iowa State runs 3-3-5 and Gary Patterson ran it for years as a top 10 defense at TCU. All base defenses and I wasn't even talking about that until your *** jumped in saying you can't have 2 safties with 4 WRs which is complete BS!!! Dime has 6 DBs. 4 on WRs and 2 safties over the top. Then start popping of that you can only do that in Dime which I said in the and Quarters in the 1st place.

I gave my opinion of what I think the defense can do with personnel it has. No different than any other fan wanting a new offensive scheme, etc.

You're completely FOS just trying to flex. I didn't say anything that isn't true and it has been run by other coaches at the schools I pointed out. I didn't dream this **** up. I got it from them.

Perhaps you should look for a new profession.

 

[90scane]

I apologize, there's really no nice way to say this, but you don't know what the fvck you're talking about.

Offensive personnel dictates what kind of defensive personnel you can line up in. You can't line up and dime personnel when it's first down and the offense lines up with double tight ends. (Which is what the offense did on the 98 yard touchdown pass)

The worst thing about your posts is that you're trying to educate a man who has been calling defensive plays for 15 years. You're also going against the logic of a man who has been coaching college football for over 40.

The audacity of you to think that you know more about covering receivers than a man who has been coaching college football for four decades and learned under Nick Saban.

I couldn't believe my eyes seeing DIME vs 12 in a bunch set! Was thinking they are either giving up 10 yards running or a TD over the top. Then 3 DB standing at the 5 yard line doing next to nothing with 4 (LB) delayed blitz.

 

[JD08]

I fvckin' love this site.

Only on this board can a fan try to teach/correct a guy who's been calling defensive plays himself for 15 years.
Gotta love it.

When Covid broke out I was told that I'd been reporting deaths to the state incorrectly for almost as long.

Some of us appreciate your contribution. Don't get discouraged by those who don't.

 

[CoachKevinSteel]

Please don't. These Dade county dymes are not the frugal sort.

 

[skeeter]

The worst thing about your posts is that you're trying to educate a man who has been calling defensive plays for 15 years. You're also going against the logic of a man who has been coaching college football for over 40.

The audacity of you to think that you know more about covering receivers than a man who has been coaching college football for four decades and learned under Nick Saban.

Your point is understood for sure Macho...BUT it is alarming that this staff needs to learn the hard way...why on earth would ANYONE...FAN OR COACH...Be surprised that bum *** DJ Ivey got ran by like a statue for 98 yards by a fast wr on the biggest defensive series of the game?

It's only on tape for 4 god **** years lol!

He had a nice game vs. TAMU. Every now and then he makes a tackle in the run game...But any play in pass defense he's ever made was basically in the middle of the field (been beat there plenty too)...This kid is too slow and has no natural feel for corner, no hips, and no ball skills. I don't give a **** if he's first in line every drill.

Same with Corey Flagg... looking like he was stuck in cement in the catch and run that went for 80 down to the 5. Was anyone here shocked?

 

[Number1CanesFan]

I apologize, there's really no nice way to say this, but you don't know what the fvck you're talking about.

Offensive personnel dictates what kind of defensive personnel you can line up in. You can't line up and dime personnel when it's first down and the offense lines up with double tight ends. (Which is what the offense did on the 98 yard touchdown pass)

The worst thing about your posts is that you're trying to educate a man who has been calling defensive plays for 15 years. You're also going against the logic of a man who has been coaching college football for over 40.

The audacity of you to think that you know more about covering receivers than a man who has been coaching college football for four decades and learned under Nick Saban.

Maybe this will help you out and you can learn something.

Look Mom, 4 WRs and 6 DBs in a base defense.

As the YouTube poster says, it turns into a Dime on a pass play post snap. It hides the coverage.

I didn't even suggest playing this as a base defense. I said play 2 safeties over the top against 4 WRs. They have safties, but rotate to Dime. You said it couldn't be done. Not only can it be done, it can be done as a base defense. They're not the only team running it.

The defensive wrinkle Clemson learned from Iowa State that could decide the national title

The Tigers' spin on Iowa State's odd stack came from Brent Venables' trip to Ames to study how the Cyclones slow the nation's best offenses.

theathletic.com

 

[KANE]

Holy fvck.

And what happens when the outside WR runs vertical through my "space" Einstein?

IT TURNS INTO MAN!

Funny as ****, but it’s correct.