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Donell Harris Decommits

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LuCane said:
This is honestly the weirdest debate I've probably ever seen in this board's history. If anyone has said winning isn't part of the equation, as I've repeated in nearly every post, they're nuts. And, if anyone can't acknowledge we've WAY underperformed through 4 coaching staffs, they're delusional. I feel the same, in reverse, about anyone not acknowledging the current landscape of "protected programs." It's not even that big of a deal. It just is what it is.
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I believe most are in agreement with this. The disagreement stems from D$ thinking winning means we get a majority of elite SFL talent vs others (me) that believe unless $$$ is no longer part of the equation in the future we will NOT get the majority of elite 5* players. We should still be able to crush it with the best of the rest from SFL and some elite sprinkled in.
 
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DMoney said:
Programs weren't paying twenty years ago? Keep flailing.

The only difference now is that we've sucked for 15 years.
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Yes and no brother. That bag game has become ALOT more aggressive and ALOT more prevalent. I'm not gonna discuss anything we've ever done one way or the other. No one in major p5 sports are saints. Just some are allowed tons more free reign than others. Reality is our program is and always will be a target for the NCAA. They look at us as a blemish and they'd like to fix that. Hasnt changed and most likely wont. But it does BEGIN with us showing we can win and compete with anyone annually
 
dsddcane said:
Did you read what I said in any other comments? Actually the history of our program was built on the guys you seem to think are aberrations. Our staff needs to be capable of doing their jobs and developing these kids. Otherwise put them out to pasture. Cause our reality IS theres alot more kids like Greg than you seem to think (which u go on to point out in ur second paragraph) reality is kids arent built the same. Not physically or mentally. If your staff knows the blue print to look for you'll hit plenty often. That's university of Miami football. I'm pretty sure I know what I'm talking about. Evals and talent development is pivotal. Both have been lacking for quite awhile. That's what happens when you employ people that are so clearly the opposite of this in nature at any point in life.
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Back in '86 or '87, I don't remember which, I had a sit-down with a guy from the UM athletic department. Don't even remember his name. He and athletic department and alumni staff were in D.C. for NFLPA annual meeting or banquet. That event was giving NFLPA awards to Fast Eddie Brown and Vinny T. Vinny came to our booster-alumni get-together at the hotel.

The AD guy said, "Look, we take kids nobody else wants." He made a point of naming Jerome Brown, who, despite being a Parade A-A, was a kid who had some traits and issues that made at least some schools wary.

We took the kids with a fire in the belly who were determined not to lose.

I still think there are kids like that in South Florida ( and elsewhere). We just have to find them and coach them up.

Again, for the umpteenth time, I'll say that many of the best players on whom we built our greatest teams were not elite recruits.
 
dsddcane said:
Yes and no brother. That bag game has become ALOT more aggressive and ALOT more prevalent. I'm not gonna discuss anything we've ever done one way or the other. No one in major p5 sports are saints. Just some are allowed tons more free reign than others. Reality is our program is and always will be a target for the NCAA. They look at us as a blemish and they'd like to fix that. Hasnt changed and most likely wont. But it does BEGIN with us showing we can win and compete with anyone annually
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This is basically all I'm repeating throughout the last couple pages of this thread. And, you know what, we can't really do **** about it. Just gotta work with what we have and come up with a creative solution to finding overlooked talent and matching it with the top ranked guys we'll get if we start winning.
 
Hurracanes said:
A couple of posters absolutely nailed it on this thread. I am in no way saying this kid isn’t needed; however, Miami has NEVER won any championships with recruiting class full of 5 stars. NEVER.

However, the question becomes, does Diaz have the eye for talent? Can he properly evaluate players? Can he run an effective Offensive system that is innovative much like his Defense? Is that enough in today’s College Football with all these bag schools? I’m not so sure anymore.
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What if I said 50/50
 
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DMoney said:
He said he wants to win a national championship and go to the next level. We've been losing for 15 years and our guys are getting drafted too low. People don't want to hear that, but it's the truth.

This one is simple to me. He wants to be here but he won't commit until he is confident in Miami's future. If we win and get momentum, guys like this will be jumping in the boat. It's not always about bags.
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Yet he just got a crystal ball to FSU. :02.47-tranquillity:
 
orange&green84 said:
At least Romancane has some respectability.

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Yep. If kid is from South Florida, of modest circumstances, and is offered a compensation package worth high five- or even six- figures, &hard to expect he'll say no.

To me, this racket involves massive underreporting of income and, I guess, tax fraud. It could even be criminal on both sides. But nothing will stop it unless and until IRS and DOJ decide to focus on it.

I'm somewhat incredulous about the amounts I'm seeing described here--houses, cars, jobs, and cash--but if it is, I don't see why it wouldn't be of interest to the feds. Since all the universities are beneficiaries of federal funds, I wonder if the federal government would have another interest (i.e. a legal nexus) even if the funding does not go directly to the athletic department.
 
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TheMatador said:
Back in '86 or '87, I don't remember which, I had a sit-down with a guy from the UM athletic department. Don't even remember his name. He and athletic department and alumni staff were in D.C. for NFLPA annual meeting or banquet. That event was giving NFLPA awards to Fast Eddie Brown and Vinny T. Vinny came to our booster-alumni get-together at the hotel.

The AD guy said, "Look, we take kids nobody else wants." He made a point of naming Jerome Brown, who, despite being a Parade A-A, was a kid who had some traits and issues that made at least some schools wary.

We took the kids with a fire in the belly who were determined not to lose.

I still think there are kids like that in South Florida ( and elsewhere). We just have to find them and coach them up.

Again, for the umpteenth time, I'll say that many of the best players on whom we built our greatest teams were not elite recruits.
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I've said that...and have known that for yrs...
 
ssvir said:
I believe most are in agreement with this. The disagreement stems from D$ thinking winning means we get a majority of elite SFL talent vs others (me) that believe unless $$$ is no longer part of the equation in the future we will NOT get the majority of elite 5* players. We should still be able to crush it with the best of the rest from SFL and some elite sprinkled in.
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In 2018 the top 10 in sfla was in order surtain, campbell, cook, nesta, samuel jr, pope, austin, blades, williams, and scaife. They got 4 out of the top 10. And they didn't recruit cook or samuel.

11-20 was schwartz, cam harris, joseph, hall, frierson, moore, chatfield, bonitto, hicks, wilson. Miami got 3 out of this group. They didn't recruit most of the guys in this group. Moore wanted to be at miami and they could have got bonitto, hicks, and schwartz if they went after them.

So all together that's 7 out of the top 20. But they got every guy they wanted except surtain and campbell. They easily could have had about 14 of the top 20 if they would have went after those other guys. And this was off of the first 10 win season since 03.
 
DMoney said:
But I thought the bag game is a new "revolution?" That is what @OriginalCanesCanesCanes is trying to peddle. You guys can't get your stories straight.

Colleges have been buying players for decades. It is nothing new. Miami has never been the big spender in terms of buying recruits. Even Nevin Shapiro admitted it. But it didn't stop us from signing the majority of five-star South Florida recruits when we were still a relevant program.
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I'm gonna assume I understand both of your points on this one d. I THINK what @originalcawas referring to is exactly what I was stating. At that time there was certainly SOME kids who would get paid. Not a majority by any stretch of the imagination but a decent percentage all the same. Those kids would get jobs for families. 50k 75k 100k but rarely would it go over that. Now however if you're a legit national recruit and you want to go the bag route you'll have a bidding war over who's gonna pay you the most. I know 4 kids that have been paid a mill now just to sign with a school. ***** the results. 3 in the sec one in the acc. I know TONS of kids getting 25k for an official visit. Getting 5 to 10k for a positive review in social media. 25k just to give out fake commitments. This **** wasnt going on back in my day. Dont get me wrong. What was going on in my day and the days yall are talking about STILL GOES ON EVERYWHERE. but the schools that seperate themselves are the heavyweights who have no repercussions behind what they do.
 
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I see wayyyy to many kids ball in south Florida at small schools and lower power 5 schools that I wonder what they would have done at Miami.

I think those kids are good enough to punish the coastal.

South Florida always has speed. We need monster QB evaluations.

Ever wonder how some programs that land underrated kids always seem to have them coached up and ready to play ball.
 
LuCane said:
Financial benefits have not always had the same advantage they do now ...The alignment of interests has changed (we can all agree on that). Much easier to operate with impunity...That's a significant change.
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Good insight. No pun intended.

“The alignment of interest“ is an excellent point and a factor that is usually not discussed any depth. Obviously as you already know, this intertwines with the incestuous relationship between the SEC and the NCAA, which did not exist to this extent in the past.
 
86Gang said:
That’s why Flagg from Houston is so important. Get Houston pipeline, offset this BS.
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We won't ever have a pipeline to Houston. A recruit every couple of years maybe, but there's a lot of closer to Houston competition there.
 
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dsddcane said:
Yes and no brother. That bag game has become ALOT more aggressive and ALOT more prevalent. I'm not gonna discuss anything we've ever done one way or the other. No one in major p5 sports are saints. Just some are allowed tons more free reign than others. Reality is our program is and always will be a target for the NCAA. They look at us as a blemish and they'd like to fix that. Hasnt changed and most likely wont. But it does BEGIN with us showing we can win and compete with anyone annually
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He was using a strawman argument. Of course schools have paid since forever. I never said they didn’t.
 
DMoney said:
He said he wants to win a national championship and go to the next level. We've been losing for 15 years and our guys are getting drafted too low. People don't want to hear that, but it's the truth.

This one is simple to me. He wants to be here but he won't commit until he is confident in Miami's future. If we win and get momentum, guys like this will be jumping in the boat. It's not always about bags.
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So then he's not Miami, D....
 
dsddcane said:
I'm gonna assume I understand both of your points on this one d. I THINK what @originalcawas referring to is exactly what I was stating. At that time there was certainly SOME kids who would get paid. Not a majority by any stretch of the imagination but a decent percentage all the same. Those kids would get jobs for families. 50k 75k 100k but rarely would it go over that. Now however if you're a legit national recruit and you want to go the bag route you'll have a bidding war over who's gonna pay you the most. I know 4 kids that have been paid a mill now just to sign with a school. ***** the results. 3 in the sec one in the acc. I know TONS of kids getting 25k for an official visit. Getting 5 to 10k for a positive review in social media. 25k just to give out fake commitments. This **** wasnt going on back in my day. Dont get me wrong. What was going on in my day and the days yall are talking about STILL GOES ON EVERYWHERE. but the schools that seperate themselves are the heavyweights who have no repercussions behind what they do.
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Had no idea it was that crazy - wow.
 
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