Do stars matter? A look at the top teams & what it means for UM

[blackvern]

Great this thread again for the 100th time

 

[Trafficante]

O God shoot me, here we go with this again some of yall need a hot tub time machine to stay stuck in the past cause the now aint for yall.

Don't worry Dwin..you'll become a believer sooner rather than later. I know the last 20 yrs has really F'd with your mind, but rest assured there's a new sheriff in town and he lives by the mindset coaching & talent evaluations/development always trump recruiting rankings & blue chip ratios. This more than any other reason is why he is going to be successful

 

[mossmadness]

People need to stop pretending like Clemson was the little engine that could.

They were in the blue chip ratio when they won the NC. They continued to spend more and more money. Which allowed them to sign more and more elite coaches. Build their facilities up more and more.

Clemson didn’t just “slowly” do this. They basically got their alumni together and said, “get out your ******* checkbooks, because we’re about to become elite.”

Remember. Jumbo Fisher left FSU because they wouldn’t guarantee him they would spend like Clemson. They aren’t the underdog that just slowly built a foundation.

 

[88]

We should keep a “do stars matter” tracker pinned to the top of the board. Between my time on canestime and here at least 350+ Threads have been started on it. Arguments always the same

 

[Ethnicsands]

Oddly, if they ran that same statistical study for the period from 1983 to 1993, they'll find the same pattern will hold. Even though there weren't camps and sites handing out stars, everyone knew who the "blue chips" were. Sure there were a couple of outliers (BYU 84, Colorado/Georgia Tech 90), but the teams that stacked the most "blue chips" (Ok, Neb, ND) , won the most. Miami on the other hand, more resembled Wisconsin and Stanford. They knew what their identify was. While there were some, they didn't land a lot of elite level prospects. They were deep in the positions that mattered (QB and DT). And they got the most of their talent (through development).

In other words, not much has changed. Including of course their number one item: that coaching matters.

If anything, the more you look at it, the more it appears that Dabo is following the pattern at Clemson that Howard and JJ set at Miami. It's only been recently they're stacking 5*s. The only 5* they got in his first 5 years was Sammy Watkins. Deshaun Watson, a 4*, came year 6 at a key position that turned into a generational talent. Then there were a string of a single 5*s until 2018 but they were all at DT or QB.

Drops iPhone.

Spoiler

Lollers.

Spoiler

Stares.

Spoiler

Vomits.

 

[Ethnicsands]

How about the DT from Houston. He wasn't highly rated yet he just went in the first round . Even Dono couldn't ***** him up. There are others but I'm not going to spend the time searching. The problem had been that most of them the last decade have not been Hurricanes. Which goes to the article's no. 1 point: coaching matters. How have we stacked up coaching wise the last decade? Particularly their evaluation and development skills?

We've had Golden trying to recruit big 10 dough boys and ballooning guys Chickillo at the same time disciplining others (like Luther Robinson the DT from Jacksonville) for making plays rather than doing their "assignment". Which incidentally violates their no. 2 point for schools that won’t land a lot of elite level prospects: they understand their identity.

FALSE. Totally false.

 

[NorthEastCane]

FALSE. Totally false.

I know I know. I already acknowledged it. Poor example, but I still believe my main point holds. I'm just too lazy right know to look for examples.

 

[NorthEastCane]

Drops iPhone.

Spoiler

Lollers.

Spoiler

Stares.

Spoiler

Vomits.

Reread the article. There's nothing in there we didn't know before or hasn't been tried before.

PS. Cute. I like the spoiler buttons.

 

[Ethnicsands]

The only thing that matters is the players, can they make plays or not, when it counts! To many guys getting rated based off of the camp circuits/7 on 7's with no pads. Why people keep trying to make this subject relevant is always comical to me, but worst of all, these b.s. ratings warp the minds of alot of people who post from reality. When you got people criticizing coach rumph and coach banda just because certain players went elsewhere, but we not only hac the #1 pass defense in the nation, but we had the #1 pass effiency defense in the nation to as well

It’s not that stars define players. It’s that recruiting services and other programs are good enough to pile onto the best kids, because the information superhighway makes it easier, and changes the game.

Say what you want about stars in the ‘80s and ‘90s, but the point is, we got the RIGHT GUYS. Hall of famers. Ballers. Ed Reed wasnt just a 3* from LA. He was ED REED. Folks here get excited by 3*s because ... Ed Reed. That’s insane. There have been thousands of 3*S since he came out of HS, and only one Ed Reed.

We must get the best kids. If they’re highly rated, because that’s the era, well, tough. Get them. Or stfu. We do not with in the ‘80s without Irvin, Jerome, Kelly, Kosar, Eddie brown, Maryland, Kennedy, Vinny, et al. Nor the ‘90s without another host of stars. You camn imagine those guys would be ‘under the radar’ today. Maybe. But then ... go find them. If our staff cant find them amongst 3*s, then aim higher.

 

[Trafficante]

It’s not that stars define players. It’s that recruiting services and other programs are good enough to pile onto the best kids, because the information superhighway makes it easier, and changes the game.

Say what you want about stars in the ‘80s and ‘90s, but the point is, we got the RIGHT GUYS. Hall of famers. Ballers. Ed Reed wasnt just a 3* from LA. He was ED REED. Folks here get excited by 3*s because ... Ed Reed. That’s insane. There have been thousands of 3*S since he came out of HS, and only one Ed Reed.

We must get the best kids. If they’re highly rated, because that’s the era, well, tough. Get them. Or stfu. We do not with in the ‘80s without Irvin, Jerome, Kelly, Kosar, Eddie brown, Maryland, Kennedy, Vinny, et al. Nor the ‘90s without another host of stars. You camn imagine those guys would be ‘under the radar’ today. Maybe. But then ... go find them. If our staff cant find them amongst 3*s, then aim higher.

Simply chasing stars and attempting to win recruiting ranking contests results in what we saw with Shannon's O8' and Coker's overrated classes. They were overrated precisely because both of those coaches were poor evaluators and developers of talent. Compare that to Butch who was able to hit on his highly rated recruits (DJ and Kellen) as well as his under the radar recruits like Moss, Wayne, and Reed

 

[Dwinstitles]

Don't worry Dwin..you'll become a believer sooner rather than later. I know the last 20 yrs has really F'd with your mind, but rest assured there's a new sheriff in town and he lives by the mindset coaching & talent evaluations/development always trump recruiting rankings & blue chip ratios. This more than any other reason is why he is going to be successful

I disagree about the stars but I hope you are right. And u are correct the last 15 years fuqed me up.

 

[Dwinstitles]

Simply chasing stars and attempting to win recruiting ranking contests..results in Shannon's O8' and Cokers overrated classes. They were overrated precisely because both of those coaches were poor evaluators and developers of talent. Compare that to Butch who was able to hit on his highly rated recruits (DJ and Kellen) as well as his under the radar recruits like Moss, Wayne, and Reed

The thing your not taking into account is that the best talent evaluators in the game right now dont leave left overs. Your right evals r important but when u have four monster schools taking everyone your getting the next batch which isnt always good.

 

[Trafficante]

The thing your not taking into account is that the best talent evaluators in the game right now dont leave left overs. Your right evals r important but when u have four monster schools taking everyone your getting the next batch which isnt always good.

I believe right now MIA has to at least prove/show that it can evaluate & develop talent at the level of Syracuse, Wisconsin, Iowa, Wash.St, etc. Once that happens the program will be in a much better position to challenge for those more highly contested recruits. Achieving the ideal 50-60% blue chip ratio, is a target that can be achieved very easily, and is something not even worth focusing on. It makes much more sense to examine/analyze how MIA is currently evaluating/developing talent. For example it is a legitimate argument to criticize Manny's LB recruiting with players like Steed, Wilder, and Jennings. I am hopeful that will improve moving forward with Baker, since he actually played LB for Tulane

 

[Dwinstitles]

I believe right now MIA has to at least prove/show that it can evaluate & develop talent at the level of Syracuse, Wisconsin, Iowa, Wash.St, etc. Once that happens the program will be in a much better position to challenge for those more highly contested recruits. Achieving the ideal 50-60% blue chip ratio, is a target that can be achieved very easily, and is something not even worth focusing on. It makes much more sense to examine/analyze how MIA is currently evaluating/developing talent. For example it is a legitimate argument to criticize Manny's LB recruiting with players like Steed, Wilder, and Jennings. I am hopeful that will improve moving forward with Baker, since he actually played LB for Tulane

We always have enough to win the coastal there isnt any excuse not to run the coastal.

 

[TruCane81]

We always have enough to win the coastal there isnt any excuse not to run the coastal.

This is my main point of contention.

Why the f*ck would blue chip players want to come here and play in schemes like D’no and Richt ran? Richt got blue chip offensive guys with hopes and dreams, but when players saw the product on the field, they completely checked out. He couldn’t sign ANYBODY up to play in that mess after the disaster 2018 turned into.

Why should guys come here to be embarrassed by the likes of Maryland, Duke and ole ******? Losing their division to schools we outrecruit soundly on paper year in year out. Our coastal ineptitude shows exactly what’s wrong with this program.

The fact we have signed any star guys at all is a f*ckin miracle. All we have to do is get results in line with our talent level. THAT’S IT!

We have good seasons and we recruit top 10-15 with ease. 2017 and 2018 classes are all the proof we need.

Run the ship right and win 10 plus for 3 years in a row. More blue chippers WILL take us seriously.

I want to see better results with defensive talent though. Those coaches could use some sales training.

 

[omaha]

Do people believe that the coaches started and ended recruiting with the three star? Is the thought that they never reached out to every top recruit in the south? I am sure the top 40 players at each position got some kind of mail and an invite to camps from Miami. Got to move on to the next man up when the top kids look elsewhere.

 

[westcoastcanes]

How about the DT from Houston. He wasn't highly rated yet he just went in the first round . Even Dono couldn't ***** him up. There are others but I'm not going to spend the time searching. The problem had been that most of them the last decade have not been Hurricanes. Which goes to the article's no. 1 point: coaching matters. How have we stacked up coaching wise the last decade? Particularly their evaluation and development skills?

We've had Golden trying to recruit big 10 dough boys and ballooning guys Chickillo at the same time disciplining others (like Luther Robinson the DT from Jacksonville) for making plays rather than doing their "assignment". Which incidentally violates their no. 2 point for schools that won’t land a lot of elite level prospects: they understand their identity.

You are a dumb ****, stay out of these conversations if you are too lazy to look a player up before you start.

 

[Dwinstitles]

This is my main point of contention.

Why the f*ck would blue chip players want to come here and play in schemes like D’no and Richt ran? Richt got blue chip offensive guys with hopes and dreams, but when players saw the product on the field, they completely checked out. He couldn’t sign ANYBODY up to play in that mess after the disaster 2018 turned into.

Why should guys come here to be embarrassed by the likes of Maryland, Duke and ole ******? Losing their division to schools we outrecruit soundly on paper year in year out. Our coastal ineptitude shows exactly what’s wrong with this program.

The fact we have signed any star guys at all is a f*ckin miracle. All we have to do is get results in line with our talent level. THAT’S IT!

We have good seasons and we recruit top 10-15 with ease. 2017 and 2018 classes are all the proof we need.

Run the ship right and win 10 plus for 3 years in a row. More blue chippers WILL take us seriously.

I want to see better results with defensive talent though. Those coaches could use some sales training.

I want this to happen so I can be on board with this win and they come stuff. I think bags are to much but I would like 2 winning seasons back to back so we can either find out if thats true or not so we can put it to rest forever.

 

[NorthEastCane]

You are a dumb ****, stay out of these conversations if you are too lazy to look a player up before you start.

Dumb! Look at what you've just said. Who the **** do you think you are ordering me or anyone else for that matter what to say or do after glossing over crux of the post and this thread. And acting like you haven't done or said anything impulsively while going full ******.

At least I had the balls to admit I made a mistake. It a shame you took offense that I didn't think it was worth the time to put in a Lance Roffers type analysis which wouldn't have convinced morons like yourself anyways.

 

[TruCane81]

I want this to happen so I can be on board with this win and they come stuff. I think bags are to much but I would like 2 winning seasons back to back so we can either find out if thats true or not so we can put it to rest forever.

Both positions are true.

We will get more blue chip players.

We probably won’t sign best of the best top 5 classes like we would if we were willing and able to use enhanced recruiting techniques like our competition.

We sign four stars and occasional five stars NOW while we have sucked. It will improve. Probably not 2000-2003 results but much more fun seasons like 2017 without the collapse.

There is a difference between a loss and a humiliation. I would prefer the former over the latter we have seen too much of.