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Davon Reed gets a start for Phoenix!

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TheOriginalCane said:
Glad to see him healthy and playing in The Association.

I know he's on a bad team, but as long as he keeps hitting 3s, it doesn't matter.
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Glad he is in the league and doing well. Great cane and I think he would be a really good coach (in the future).
 
tcgrad1014 said:
Davon is exactly the level of player and quality person L should be recruiting.
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Just because he had his biggest runs with lesser talented players doesn't mean he should actively stop recruiting top tier players. Do you really think that if instead of having Lonnie Walker we had signed Chris Duarte or Liangelo Ball then we would have done better?
 
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OriginalGatorHater said:
Just because he had his biggest runs with lesser talented players doesn't mean he should actively stop recruiting top tier players. Do you really think that if instead of having Lonnie Walker we had signed Chris Duarte or Liangelo Ball then we would have done better?
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He has his biggest runs with veteran teams. The way it works these days is that 5* players never get to be veteran players (with very few exceptions). Brown Jr. is leaving to be a marginal 2nd rounder. It's ridiculous. Therefore, L should be recruiting kids like Davon who will be here for 4 years aka not 5* players.
 
tcgrad1014 said:
He has his biggest runs with veteran teams. The way it works these days is that 5* players never get to be veteran players (with very few exceptions). Brown Jr. is leaving to be a marginal 2nd rounder. It's ridiculous. Therefore, L should be recruiting kids like Davon who will be here for 4 years aka not 5* players.
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He had 1 run and it wasn't even at our school so its not like we have much to base this on. Regardless there are very few teams(if any) that consistently make deep runs with a bunch of 3-4 stars. Even Nova has had a 5 star in almost all of their recent classes.
 
OriginalGatorHater said:
He had 1 run and it wasn't even at our school so its not like we have much to base this on. Regardless there are very few teams(if any) that consistently make deep runs with a bunch of 3-4 stars. Even Nova has had a 5 star in almost all of their recent classes.
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Nova has made it clear that they want guys that are going to stay for multiple years. Wright has even stated that he fell in love with the elite guys, but realized that it's tough to keep them engaged. Look at their roster this year, it was mostly guys who grew in the program. No one saying that Miami should go out and get scrubs from the street and keep them for four years, people are saying that L, and the Miami program has done well with guys who aren't looking for an out as soon as they hit campus. I don't think it's an accident that the two Sweet 16 years were dominated by mostly upperclass, mature guys that knew how to deal with things. Whether it was Kadji, Gamble, TMJ and others in 2012, or Angel, Sheldon and Tonye in 2016, there were adults on the floor. The things we saw this year, you rarely if ever saw when you had experienced guys in key spots. Instead of getting the obvious one and done guy, Miami should be looking at the guy who may need some seasoning, but can contribute immediately. Chris Lykes is that kind of guy. He's going to be a **** good college player, but due to his size won't be a threat to leave early, barring some kind of insane season.
 
OriginalGatorHater said:
He had 1 run and it wasn't even at our school so its not like we have much to base this on. Regardless there are very few teams(if any) that consistently make deep runs with a bunch of 3-4 stars. Even Nova has had a 5 star in almost all of their recent classes.
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Our Sweet 16 team was a very veteran squad outside of Larkin.
 
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Canedude08 said:
Nova has made it clear that they want guys that are going to stay for multiple years. Wright has even stated that he fell in love with the elite guys, but realized that it's tough to keep them engaged. Look at their roster this year, it was mostly guys who grew in the program. No one saying that Miami should go out and get scrubs from the street and keep them for four years, people are saying that L, and the Miami program has done well with guys who aren't looking for an out as soon as they hit campus. I don't think it's an accident that the two Sweet 16 years were dominated by mostly upperclass, mature guys that knew how to deal with things. Whether it was Kadji, Gamble, TMJ and others in 2012, or Angel, Sheldon and Tonye in 2016, there were adults on the floor. The things we saw this year, you rarely if ever saw when you had experienced guys in key spots. Instead of getting the obvious one and done guy, Miami should be looking at the guy who may need some seasoning, but can contribute immediately. Chris Lykes is that kind of guy. He's going to be a **** good college player, but due to his size won't be a threat to leave early, barring some kind of insane season.
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Villanova has a 5 star that doesn't fit that mold in their class this year. Some teams like Duke and Kentucky have tons of 1 and done guys and teams like UNC and Nova have a mix of vets and 5 stars. I can't think of any consistently elite teams that doesn't fit one of those molds. If L isn't capable of using elite 5*s in his lineup then we will never be able to win a ship.
 
OriginalGatorHater said:
Villanova has a 5 star that doesn't fit that mold in their class this year. Some teams like Duke and Kentucky have tons of 1 and done guys and teams like UNC and Nova have a mix of vets and 5 stars. I can't think of any consistently elite teams that doesn't fit one of those molds. If L isn't capable of using elite 5*s in his lineup then we will never be able to win a ship.
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You realize the odds of Miami ever winning a title are extremely small, right? Miami has never advanced past the round of 16, and has only made it that far three times in program history. Two of those trips have happened in the last five years, and yet people like you want to run the architect of those teams out of town. Winning the NCAA Tournament is more about luck in some instances, than it is about being the best team. Look at L's best team, it was short circuited by the best player in the ACC coming down with the flu. We don't know how that team would have performed with a healthy Shane Larkin. L's second best team ran into a buzzsaw in Villanova, a team that went on to win the title. The hilarious part about that Villanova game was that statistically, Miami played well. They shot 58.2% from deep, and 53.2% overall, and LOST BY 20+. Villanova had one of the most efficient offensive nights in tournament history, there was little Miami could do about that.

As as we've seen time and time again, you don't need 5* guys in order to win ships or advance to the Final Four, 'Nova and others have proven that in recent years. You need to have a system, and the ability to stick to it. Teams like Nova, UNC of late(Roy hasn't been getting the legions of talent that he once received), and others have shown that if you are good at developing talent, you can go on runs, but may need some help to get there. Miami has to become a consistent tournament participant(With good seeds) and keep knocking on that door. Eventually, you will break through. That's what has worked for Gonzaga, that's what worked for Arizona under Lute.
 
Canedude08 said:
You realize the odds of Miami ever winning a title are extremely small, right? Miami has never advanced past the round of 16, and has only made it that far three times in program history. Two of those trips have happened in the last five years, and yet people like you want to run the architect of those teams out of town. Winning the NCAA Tournament is more about luck in some instances, than it is about being the best team. Look at L's best team, it was short circuited by the best player in the ACC coming down with the flu. We don't know how that team would have performed with a healthy Shane Larkin. L's second best team ran into a buzzsaw in Villanova, a team that went on to win the title. The hilarious part about that Villanova game was that statistically, Miami played well. They shot 58.2% from deep, and 53.2% overall, and LOST BY 20+. Villanova had one of the most efficient offensive nights in tournament history, there was little Miami could do about that.

As as we've seen time and time again, you don't need 5* guys in order to win ships or advance to the Final Four, 'Nova and others have proven that in recent years. You need to have a system, and the ability to stick to it. Teams like Nova, UNC of late(Roy hasn't been getting the legions of talent that he once received), and others have shown that if you are good at developing talent, you can go on runs, but may need some help to get there. Miami has to become a consistent tournament participant(With good seeds) and keep knocking on that door. Eventually, you will break through. That's what has worked for Gonzaga, that's what worked for Arizona under Lute.
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No. I never said I wanted L gone. I know that there is 0 chance we could pull someone better than him. However, look at a team like Loyola that makes it to the final four. Do you think their fan base was saying: Well we haven't made the final four in almost 60 years we will never make it again. Of course we have fans like you that are very happy to make the NIT and getting knocked out the first round of the NCAAT makes you ecstatic. I am not one of those fans and luckily we have plenty of other fans like me that expect more out of an ACC team who has NBA players on campus all of the time and has kids all over the country wanting to go to that school.
 
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OriginalGatorHater said:
No. I never said I wanted L gone. I know that there is 0 chance we could pull someone better than him. However, look at a team like Loyola that makes it to the final four. Do you think their fan base was saying: Well we haven't made the final four in almost 60 years we will never make it again. Of course we have fans like you that are very happy to make the NIT and getting knocked out the first round of the NCAAT makes you ecstatic. I am not one of those fans and luckily we have plenty of other fans like me that expect more out of an ACC team who has NBA players on campus all of the time and has kids all over the country wanting to go to that school.
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Where did I say that I'm happy about getting knocked out in the first round of the NCAAT? Where did I say that I'm good with NIT appearances? What rational, knowledgable fans like myself understand is that this is a process, Miami isn't going to go from also ran to Duke, or UNC overnight. I'm not going to look a gift horse in the mouth, just so I can have something to complain about. Just remember the following: The run L has put together here, has never happened before in program history. Miami is one of the better programs in the ACC right now, and a couple of frustrating flameouts doesn't change that. There's always work to be done, but fans like you that have little to no understanding of how a program is built over the long term do more to hurt the perception of the program, than actually help. Look at Villanova, Wright had to build, and there were tons of flameouts along the way, and that's at a program with legit history and tradition.

Do you realize how utterly random the NCAA Tournament is? Syracuse was one of the last teams in the **** field, and managed to get to the Elite Eight. Does that mean that they were one of the best teams in the country, or does it mean that in a one game situation, crazy crap happens? Even in your example, Loyola had to have something happen that has NEVER happened before in the history of the tournament in order to advance. They had TWO last second victories, in a 48 hour window. They also were fortunate enough to have the bracket around them fall apart, making it easier for them to advance. It's a single elimination tournament, with dozens of teams, it's arguably the least efficient and effective way of determining a champion. What's funny is that fans like you love to believe that they are helping the program by being utterly unrealistic. Say it with me: L is by far the best coach this program has ever had, the odds of Miami finding someone that can merely tread water, much less be significant better long term is unlikely. When L is ready to retire, Miami should do everything they can to find a suitable replacement, but let's be honest: Mark Few isn't walking through that door, chances are Miami will have to take a chance on some mid major guy, or a highly touted assistant, and that's a complete crapshoot.
 
tcgrad1014 said:
Our Sweet 16 team was a very veteran squad outside of Larkin.
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OriginalGatorHater said:
I wouldn't really consider that a run, but if that is the type of run you are referring to then yes we can manage that with 3-4*s.
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Realistically we're not ever putting together a team full of one and done 5*s. The track record for teams like that winning championships is actually pretty crappy anyway (see 2018 Duke). Yes a sweet 16 appearance is a "run" by Miami standards, considering we've never been beyond that point ever.
 
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tcgrad1014 said:
Realistically we're not ever putting together a team full of one and done 5*s. The track record for teams like that winning championships is actually pretty crappy anyway (see 2018 Duke). Yes a sweet 16 appearance is a "run" by Miami standards, considering we've never been beyond that point ever.
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It is almost impossible for anyteam to be filled with 1 and done's, but to make deep runs consistently and have shots at winning it all you need a couple 5 stars.
 
Canedude08 said:
Where did I say that I'm happy about getting knocked out in the first round of the NCAAT? Where did I say that I'm good with NIT appearances? What rational, knowledgable fans like myself understand is that this is a process, Miami isn't going to go from also ran to Duke, or UNC overnight. I'm not going to look a gift horse in the mouth, just so I can have something to complain about. Just remember the following: The run L has put together here, has never happened before in program history. Miami is one of the better programs in the ACC right now, and a couple of frustrating flameouts doesn't change that. There's always work to be done, but fans like you that have little to no understanding of how a program is built over the long term do more to hurt the perception of the program, than actually help. Look at Villanova, Wright had to build, and there were tons of flameouts along the way, and that's at a program with legit history and tradition.

Do you realize how utterly random the NCAA Tournament is? Syracuse was one of the last teams in the **** field, and managed to get to the Elite Eight. Does that mean that they were one of the best teams in the country, or does it mean that in a one game situation, crazy crap happens? Even in your example, Loyola had to have something happen that has NEVER happened before in the history of the tournament in order to advance. They had TWO last second victories, in a 48 hour window. They also were fortunate enough to have the bracket around them fall apart, making it easier for them to advance. It's a single elimination tournament, with dozens of teams, it's arguably the least efficient and effective way of determining a champion. What's funny is that fans like you love to believe that they are helping the program by being utterly unrealistic. Say it with me: L is by far the best coach this program has ever had, the odds of Miami finding someone that can merely tread water, much less be significant better long term is unlikely. When L is ready to retire, Miami should do everything they can to find a suitable replacement, but let's be honest: Mark Few isn't walking through that door, chances are Miami will have to take a chance on some mid major guy, or a highly touted assistant, and that's a complete crapshoot.
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Well Syracuse beat us so I don't really see your point. People love to make that point, but then conveniently forget that L had one of the easiest routes to the final 4 when he was at GM. It just seems from your post that you are very happy just making the tournament. No one expects us to win a ship for even make it to the elite 8 any time soon, but we all want to eventually reach that point. You are the one that fails to understand how a program is built. Landing a bunch of 3-4 stars and keeping them 4-5 years is not how you win championships. As stated before I doubt Miami will be able to land a great coach so I am happy with L.
 
OriginalGatorHater said:
Well Syracuse beat us so I don't really see your point. People love to make that point, but then conveniently forget that L had one of the easiest routes to the final 4 when he was at GM. It just seems from your post that you are very happy just making the tournament. No one expects us to win a ship for even make it to the elite 8 any time soon, but we all want to eventually reach that point. You are the one that fails to understand how a program is built. Landing a bunch of 3-4 stars and keeping them 4-5 years is not how you win championships. As stated before I doubt Miami will be able to land a great coach so I am happy with L.
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Please tell me you are joking about GM having the easiest road to the FF. Outside of them facing a 7 seed in the Sweet 16, they faced the seed they were supposed to face in every other round. Following them beating the 6 seed, they faced the 3, and the 1(And extremely popular national champion pick) in the Elite 8. What the **** are you talking about? They beat Michigan State, UNC and UConn on their way to the FF, that's a **** good haul for anyone, much less someone in the CAA.

By the way, landing guys who are 3-4 stars(and maybe landing the occasional elite guy), and developing them is the way you win. Look at the 2012 team, look at what Villanova has consistently done of late, same with UNC. Roy Williams has consistently been out recruited by Calipari, but look at who has had the better post season runs of late. Team continuity is important, especially in a single elimination tournament format. Unless you are far and away better than everyone else, it's tough to get these hired gun type of teams to stick together.
 
Canedude08 said:
Please tell me you are joking about GM having the easiest road to the FF. Outside of them facing a 7 seed in the Sweet 16, they faced the seed they were supposed to face in every other round. Following them beating the 6 seed, they faced the 3, and the 1(And extremely popular national champion pick) in the Elite 8. What the **** are you talking about? They beat Michigan State, UNC and UConn on their way to the FF, that's a **** good haul for anyone, much less someone in the CAA.

By the way, landing guys who are 3-4 stars(and maybe landing the occasional elite guy), and developing them is the way you win. Look at the 2012 team, look at what Villanova has consistently done of late, same with UNC. Roy Williams has consistently been out recruited by Calipari, but look at who has had the better post season runs of late. Team continuity is important, especially in a single elimination tournament format. Unless you are far and away better than everyone else, it's tough to get these hired gun type of teams to stick together.
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Villanova's best player was a 5 star. They and UNC have had multiple 5 stars..
 
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