Can I make a suggestion

[clg003]

Anyone not sold on Butch, go and grab your copy of Cane Mutiny. Then sit down for twenty or so minutes and re-read the section on Butch. How he recruited before the sanctions were announced and after. How he held out for NFL Hall of Famer Edgerrin James. How he commanded respect. Take a few minutes and know that if he's brought back, there really is no reason why we can't get back on top with him at the helm.

I don't need to read a book. I was there during his whole tenure and nothing about him inspires confidence. I'm not gonna wait for lighting in a bottle twice.

So was I. I'm not interested in waiting 4 years for him to hopefully recruit enough to win. In case people have noticed, the recruiting game is wayyyyy different today. I don't care who it is, if you aren't winning quickly, you won't be recruiting well.

I got bad news for you non Butch people. If Butch cannot duplicate what he has done four other time, that is recruit a national championship team, then we are done. It took Howard to save this program from death. Donna has brought it back to that brink. This is not OSU, Bama, or any of those massive state schools living on tax money and 100,000s of alumni and entire states of fans. This is Miami, fka, SunTan U. Urban can fail here. Remember, when he ran out of Zook's recruits, he got run out of the SEC. Butch recruit for JJ, left those players for Dennis, and even better one for Larry. If you have a another Howard out there who the BOT can bring in, there maybe Butch is not the man. But before you think you have one, take a close look as Howard's resume. I can't think of anyone who can match it in college football today. Saban won at LSU and Bama, both places where recruits are purchases. Urban retreated to OSU another school allowed to buy recruits. Miami does not come with that freedom. You mistakenly think there is a option. There is not. It is Butch or death.

LOL....

Such delusion...

The number one locale for high school talent on planet earth and there is only one guy who hasnt had a winning conference record in 15 years that can save us.

Thats some serious crack aid your drinking buddy.

 

[duke4heisman]

BUTCH MUTHA****IN DAVIS *****ES!!

 

[KevinCaneFace]

Anyone not sold on Butch, go and grab your copy of Cane Mutiny. Then sit down for twenty or so minutes and re-read the section on Butch. How he recruited before the sanctions were announced and after. How he held out for NFL Hall of Famer Edgerrin James. How he commanded respect. Take a few minutes and know that if he's brought back, there really is no reason why we can't get back on top with him at the helm.

I got that book and about 50 other pretty good books on my bookshelf.. I didn't see the part about him spending five years at UNC and not winning a **** thing. NOT ONE ACC TITLE.

he had little, nicks, marvin austin, quinn, the de who played for the jets, those linebackers who never panned out zack brown, bruce carter, and I forget the other guy.. The safety who picked us off every **** year..

Lol his squads were loaded for unc and he still didn't do much with all that carolina talent.

He coached four seasons at UNC. His fourth season half his team was suspended. Three legit seasons and in his third season all of his talent was young. That's a little harsh to judge a guy on.

Wait we judge everyone else on one season or two seasons but he gets pass?

Shoudnt he have shown consistent improvements. Your talking about a recruiting beast, talent evaluating genius and the best talent developer in the game and he gets a pass for never having winning record in the ACC?

People are saying we win it all next year if they hire him.

He took them from 2 winning games to 8 in three seasons. His fourth season his team was taken from him. Butch has taken a rebuilding project at every step of the year but you want to judge him off his first few years at them? Butch built the greatest dynasty we've ever had with 12 scholarships.

This is not a rebuilding project so those first few years are irrelevant to this job.

 

[Big Sky Cane]

Lmfao at all the mouthbreathing retards exposing their utter lack of knowledge wrt the one man responsible for keeping Miami football alive. Had it not been for Butch and the teams he constructed from 1999-2003, the program wouldn't be in the FBS today. He single handedly provided the university with over two dozen multi-millionaire alumni, something no other coach at the U has done and I doubt ever will.

5 of the 30 most talented teams in cfb can be credited to Butch.

View attachment 33657

20 years ago. WTF is your point? Let's bring back Schnelly BABY! Bunch of low level thinking sheep in this thread.

 

[TRock305]

Another Butch debate. Yaaaaaaaayyyyy..

 

[King Slayer]

An 8-4 UNC coach that coached Miami 20 years ago. Lets bring back Soldinger as well.

 

[OzarCaneSaw]

Lmfao at all the mouthbreathing retards exposing their utter lack of knowledge wrt the one man responsible for keeping Miami football alive. Had it not been for Butch and the teams he constructed from 1999-2003, the program wouldn't be in the FBS today. He single handedly provided the university with over two dozen multi-millionaire alumni, something no other coach at the U has done and I doubt ever will.

5 of the 30 most talented teams in cfb can be credited to Butch.

View attachment 33657

20 years ago. WTF is your point? Let's bring back Schnelly BABY! Bunch of low level thinking sheep in this thread.

And then there's the "special" group that fail at basic math.

 

[clg003]

Lmfao at all the mouthbreathing retards exposing their utter lack of knowledge wrt the one man responsible for keeping Miami football alive. Had it not been for Butch and the teams he constructed from 1999-2003, the program wouldn't be in the FBS today. He single handedly provided the university with over two dozen multi-millionaire alumni, something no other coach at the U has done and I doubt ever will.

5 of the 30 most talented teams in cfb can be credited to Butch.

View attachment 33657

And yet he lost all that ability when he went to UNC?

Why does your argument go from posting some weighted chart that no one understands (even you or you would post the weighted calculation because without it means nothing) to a bunch of excuses when UNC is brought up.

If its such a clear case where anyone in the world is dumb for not seeing it why isnt he the most sought after coach in football? That's a very valid question like it or not.

The answer is that Miami was a machine then and yes Butch was part of that machine but to sit here and act like he created that machine, like he built the Miami brand is a flawed one dimensional argument.

And there is no proof he is capable of getting us back to that status without everything else that was in place.

 

[Dash]

An 8-4 UNC coach that coached Miami 20 years ago. Lets bring back Soldinger as well.

I wonder what Sonny Lubick is up to......

 

[Dwinstitles]

Why ya gotta explain this these guys will not listen

 

[TheCane55]

Since when is butch just a good recruiter? IMO he's a better developer of talent, and thats what we need at this time.

 

[mdpcane]

Anyone not sold on Butch, go and grab your copy of Cane Mutiny. Then sit down for twenty or so minutes and re-read the section on Butch. How he recruited before the sanctions were announced and after. How he held out for NFL Hall of Famer Edgerrin James. How he commanded respect. Take a few minutes and know that if he's brought back, there really is no reason why we can't get back on top with him at the helm.

I don't need to read a book. I was there during his whole tenure and nothing about him inspires confidence. I'm not gonna wait for lighting in a bottle twice.

So was I. I'm not interested in waiting 4 years for him to hopefully recruit enough to win. In case people have noticed, the recruiting game is wayyyyy different today. I don't care who it is, if you aren't winning quickly, you won't be recruiting well.

I got bad news for you non Butch people. If Butch cannot duplicate what he has done four other time, that is recruit a national championship team, then we are done. It took Howard to save this program from death. Donna has brought it back to that brink. This is not OSU, Bama, or any of those massive state schools living on tax money and 100,000s of alumni and entire states of fans. This is Miami, fka, SunTan U. Urban can fail here. Remember, when he ran out of Zook's recruits, he got run out of the SEC. Butch recruit for JJ, left those players for Dennis, and even better one for Larry. If you have a another Howard out there who the BOT can bring in, there maybe Butch is not the man. But before you think you have one, take a close look as Howard's resume. I can't think of anyone who can match it in college football today. Saban won at LSU and Bama, both places where recruits are purchases. Urban retreated to OSU another school allowed to buy recruits. Miami does not come with that freedom. You mistakenly think there is a option. There is not. It is Butch or death.

+ 1 MILLION.

 

[CaneTheGaytors]

Lmfao at all the mouthbreathing retards exposing their utter lack of knowledge wrt the one man responsible for keeping Miami football alive. Had it not been for Butch and the teams he constructed from 1999-2003, the program wouldn't be in the FBS today. He single handedly provided the university with over two dozen multi-millionaire alumni, something no other coach at the U has done and I doubt ever will.

5 of the 30 most talented teams in cfb can be credited to Butch.

View attachment 33657

20 years ago. WTF is your point? Let's bring back Schnelly BABY! Bunch of low level thinking sheep in this thread.

I see you haven't changed your ways. You used to be on Golden's jock for the longest time, and you finally at the very end of last season came to your senses.

Now you're repeating the same mistake. Piling on a man that has done this before and done It with both hands tied behind his back due to sanctions.

He still had us competitive and winning bowl games even through what amounts to being pre-death penalty sanctions, with all of the scholarship losses, no tv, etc., that we were hit with back then.

Some of you dudes will never learn. Just keep on hitting your heads against the wall and coming back for more.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

 

[CaneTheGaytors]

Why ya gotta explain this these guys will not listen

I'm just sipping on a nice, cold beer. Waiting to celebrate the return of Butch. All of these mouth breathers are part of why the program is on life support.

A lot of these fools supported Golden til the end of last year and some even this year. Yet, they want to tell us who the right coach for the U is?

You can't make this **** up, man. I'm gonna enjoy seeing them squirm when we win with Butch and I'm gonna let 'em know about it.

 

[Big Sky Cane]

Why ya gotta explain this these guys will not listen

I'm just sipping on a nice, cold beer. Waiting to celebrate the return of Butch. All of these mouth breathers are part of why the program is on life support.

A lot of these fools supported Golden til the end of last year and some even this year. Yet, they want to tell us who the right coach for the U is?

You can't make this **** up, man. I'm gonna enjoy seeing them squirm when we win with Butch and I'm gonna let 'em know about it.

And I hated the Coker and Shannon hire from day 1 (and was proven correct). Haven't posted 1 single positive post on Golden post-VT 2013.....I haven't been a vocal critic because it was pointless. I'd lost the fire. I have the fire back. We now have a great opportunity to make a splash hire and we want to hire a coach that is about 5 years away from diapers. No ******* thanks. Give me Herman and we'll wreck this ****.

 

[Gatorhater]

Anyone not sold on Butch, go and grab your copy of Cane Mutiny. Then sit down for twenty or so minutes and re-read the section on Butch. How he recruited before the sanctions were announced and after. How he held out for NFL Hall of Famer Edgerrin James. How he commanded respect. Take a few minutes and know that if he's brought back, there really is no reason why we can't get back on top with him at the helm.

I don't need to read a book. I was there during his whole tenure and nothing about him inspires confidence. I'm not gonna wait for lighting in a bottle twice.

So was I. I'm not interested in waiting 4 years for him to hopefully recruit enough to win. In case people have noticed, the recruiting game is wayyyyy different today. I don't care who it is, if you aren't winning quickly, you won't be recruiting well.

I got bad news for you non Butch people. If Butch cannot duplicate what he has done four other time, that is recruit a national championship team, then we are done. It took Howard to save this program from death. Donna has brought it back to that brink. This is not OSU, Bama, or any of those massive state schools living on tax money and 100,000s of alumni and entire states of fans. This is Miami, fka, SunTan U. Urban can fail here. Remember, when he ran out of Zook's recruits, he got run out of the SEC. Butch recruit for JJ, left those players for Dennis, and even better one for Larry. If you have a another Howard out there who the BOT can bring in, there maybe Butch is not the man. But before you think you have one, take a close look as Howard's resume. I can't think of anyone who can match it in college football today. Saban won at LSU and Bama, both places where recruits are purchases. Urban retreated to OSU another school allowed to buy recruits. Miami does not come with that freedom. You mistakenly think there is a option. There is not. It is Butch or death.

LOL....

Such delusion...

The number one locale for high school talent on planet earth and there is only one guy who hasnt had a winning conference record in 15 years that can save us.

Thats some serious crack aid your drinking buddy.

You have one statement that is absolutely true, this is the land of milk and honey when it comes to talent. It has always be thus. YET we ruled only under limited circumstances and for limited times. Clearly not everyone can come here and win. It took Howard 5 years to cash in our the base that Lou built. It took JJ, a better coach than any you might be thinking of, 4 years to cash in only ONE title ticket and he started with a NC team and NC QB with Heisman backup. Dennis inherited even more talent, including 2 future NC QBs, one of which was another Heisman QB. When Dennis ran out of the talent left behind he ran out of "genius" too. For some reason the milk and honey in which he swam didn't help any more. Next NC coach was Larry Coker. On th surface he confirms your agreement: if he can win a NC here, anyone can. One problem, he two was left with not just great talent but the greatest talent EVER assembled. With just the smallest downward slide in the talent to merely unfriggingbelievable talent, Larry lost and we began the descent.

The common denominator in all that talent mention above, save Howard's batch, was not geography. It was not coaching. It was one man who had a hand in every one of those National Championship. A hand that did so much important work that is helped win 3 NC without even being here. Butch is that hand. His recruits won those 4 NCs. I don't give a crap if the man hasn't won ONE game in 15 years. He recruits gold, pure frigging gold. If you think a Herman or a Mario or whoever you think is even worthy of consideration is the next young Howard Shnellenberger then bring him on and let him be considered. But anything short of THAT man, you are talking from the dark abyss of ignorance. This is not a CAN"T MISS job.

 

[Klamalama]

I don't need to read a book. I was there during his whole tenure and nothing about him inspires confidence. I'm not gonna wait for lighting in a bottle twice.

So was I. I'm not interested in waiting 4 years for him to hopefully recruit enough to win. In case people have noticed, the recruiting game is wayyyyy different today. I don't care who it is, if you aren't winning quickly, you won't be recruiting well.

I got bad news for you non Butch people. If Butch cannot duplicate what he has done four other time, that is recruit a national championship team, then we are done. It took Howard to save this program from death. Donna has brought it back to that brink. This is not OSU, Bama, or any of those massive state schools living on tax money and 100,000s of alumni and entire states of fans. This is Miami, fka, SunTan U. Urban can fail here. Remember, when he ran out of Zook's recruits, he got run out of the SEC. Butch recruit for JJ, left those players for Dennis, and even better one for Larry. If you have a another Howard out there who the BOT can bring in, there maybe Butch is not the man. But before you think you have one, take a close look as Howard's resume. I can't think of anyone who can match it in college football today. Saban won at LSU and Bama, both places where recruits are purchases. Urban retreated to OSU another school allowed to buy recruits. Miami does not come with that freedom. You mistakenly think there is a option. There is not. It is Butch or death.

LOL....

Such delusion...

The number one locale for high school talent on planet earth and there is only one guy who hasnt had a winning conference record in 15 years that can save us.

Thats some serious crack aid your drinking buddy.

You have one statement that is absolutely true, this is the land of milk and honey when it comes to talent. It has always be thus. YET we ruled only under limited circumstances and for limited times. Clearly not everyone can come here and win. It took Howard 5 years to cash in our the base that Lou built. It took JJ, a better coach than any you might be thinking of, 4 years to cash in only ONE title ticket and he started with a NC team and NC QB with Heisman backup. Dennis inherited even more talent, including 2 future NC QBs, one of which was another Heisman QB. When Dennis ran out of the talent left behind he ran out of "genius" too. For some reason the milk and honey in which he swam didn't help any more. Next NC coach was Larry Coker. On th surface he confirms your agreement: if he can win a NC here, anyone can. One problem, he two was left with not just great talent but the greatest talent EVER assembled. With just the smallest downward slide in the talent to merely unfriggingbelievable talent, Larry lost and we began the descent.

The common denominator in all that talent mention above, save Howard's batch, was not geography. It was not coaching. It was one man who had a hand in every one of those National Championship. A hand that did so much important work that is helped win 3 NC without even being here. Butch is that hand. His recruits won those 4 NCs. I don't give a crap if the man hasn't won ONE game in 15 years. He recruits gold, pure frigging gold. If you think a Herman or a Mario or whoever you think is even worthy of consideration is the next young Howard Shnellenberger then bring him on and let him be considered. But anything short of THAT man, you are talking from the dark abyss of ignorance. This is not a CAN"T MISS job.

THIS!

 

[OzarCaneSaw]

Lmfao at all the mouthbreathing retards exposing their utter lack of knowledge wrt the one man responsible for keeping Miami football alive. Had it not been for Butch and the teams he constructed from 1999-2003, the program wouldn't be in the FBS today. He single handedly provided the university with over two dozen multi-millionaire alumni, something no other coach at the U has done and I doubt ever will.

5 of the 30 most talented teams in cfb can be credited to Butch.

View attachment 33657

And yet he lost all that ability when he went to UNC?

Why does your argument go from posting some weighted chart that no one understands (even you or you would post the weighted calculation because without it means nothing) to a bunch of excuses when UNC is brought up.

If its such a clear case where anyone in the world is dumb for not seeing it why isnt he the most sought after coach in football? That's a very valid question like it or not.

The answer is that Miami was a machine then and yes Butch was part of that machine but to sit here and act like he created that machine, like he built the Miami brand is a flawed one dimensional argument.

And there is no proof he is capable of getting us back to that status without everything else that was in place.

I never said he built the brand you illiterate ****. The program was on life support in 1997 and had it not been for him, we'd be the Valdosta State of the south. Wake Forest would be paying us to come for their homecoming.

And don't blame me that you're a football chick and can't understand the chart. It places a value for each player drafted (round & pick) from those teams who were drafted. Draft1 is the draft immediately following that season (seniors, juniors entering early). Draft2 is the draft 2 years after, and so on. If you notice the 2003 season, it's HEAVILY weighted with the seniors of that team (freshmen in Butch's final year).

Interesting to note that the other two most talented Miami teams were teams that Butch helped recruit as well when he was here as DLine coach.

 

[CaniacMike21]

I'll go on record in saying that I'm not "sold" on Butch returning. I'll be perfectly fine and content if he's hired, but I just don't get the feeling that we're going to be elite again under Butch. Much better than we are now, but not CFP level.

The game is so different now than what it was 15-20 years ago.

 

[simplycanes]

To be clear, I am not a pro-Butch guy for this job. I wouldn't be upset if he was hired, but he isn't my first choice. I think UM needs to make a philosophical choice about its program and then invest in it accordingly. Long story short, I think Butch would be successful enough here to reinforce the notion of needing a "UM guy" and "do more with less" mentality that has rotted this program from within for over a decade. The problem is, he is perhaps the last "UM guy" worth a ****. We haven't been churning out elite level coaches in a long time.

Moving on from all that, I think many people are mis-remembering or overlooking precisely what Butch did here.

For starters, the job he took then vs. the one we are offering now are totally different circumstances. Butch was looking down the barrel of the NCAA's gun. He would be so light on scholarships that Greg Popovich would be his starting safety, and a scholarship player. That is not even the same circumstance today. If you think that where UM is today is anywhere close to what was going on back then, you just weren't around then. Period. Butch isn't taking over an NCAA death knell, he is taking over a program living in the past. These are very different things. Believe it or not, as much as getting DP'd by Clemson 58-0 sucks, it was worse then.

Recruiting-wise, yes things have changed over the last 20 years. That's true of everything, not just recruiting. What Butch excelled in at UM was not recruiting. He was certainly very good at that, and it's a bit of semantics really, but Butch proved to be a superior evaluator and developer of talent. For every 5-star DJ Williams there were multiple 2 and 3-star Dan Morgan, Jon Vilma, Ed Reed, Clinton Portis, Santana Moss, etc. Yes, this is all "recruiting" if you will, but a lot of these guys weren't recruiting battles. This was hitting on evaluations.

So, the point is, the job is different than the last time he took it. I think Butch's limitations though are confined in other realms besides recruiting. I think his advantages are distinctly intact because time doesn't make people better or worse evaluators of talent. They are, or they ain't!