Why corrupt recruiting schools have future problems

[canesproponent]

That is faulty logic. Your argument is predicated on the notion that a university makes most of its revenue on football. That is a preposterous take. People go to Alabama bc they are from Alabama, or a neighboring state, and they were able to get into Bama academically, and not Duke or Harvard for example. Not talking football players here, just talking students. While Bama for example does really well in football revenue, the university will always make so much more money in the sum of all their other revenue streams, led by grants and tuition.

Let me elucidate. People go to these schools because they HAVE to. Excluding Vanderbilt, not a single person on the planet would choose the SEC over a Duke or Virginia.

The degrees these students earn from the SEC schools are worthless, so the schools need to engender loyalty for future donations. They need something to tie these students to the school and that bond is football.

Tuition to these schools is a finite revenue stream that does not equal what these schools derive in donations and tuition in most schools is subsidized. If these schools had poor football programs, it would decimate donations. That was my point.

I have worked at 8 elite institutions and we only considered Vanderbilt students (from the SEC schools). If you had degrees from Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi and/or LSU, your resume went immediately into the trash.

 

[canesproponent]

Let me elucidate. People go to these schools because they HAVE to. Excluding Vanderbilt, not a single person on the planet would choose the SEC over a Duke or Virginia.

The degrees these students earn from the SEC schools are worthless, so the schools need to engender loyalty for future donations. They need something to tie these students to the school and that bond is football.

Tuition at these schools is a finite revenue stream that does not compare to what these schools derive in donations. Moreover, tuition is highly subsidized at state schools. If these schools had poor football programs, it would decimate donations. That was my point.

I have worked at 8 elite institutions and we only considered Vanderbilt students (from the SEC schools). If you had degrees from Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi and/or LSU, your resume went immediately into the trash.

 

[pumbaa]

Omg. Lol.

So, Ivy league grads aren’t trying to live in or get jobs in ATL, Charlotte or SF??? What’s?!?!

The Charlotte and ATL....the banking presences in the south or the Silicon Valley/“SF”/Palo Alto/Menlo Park where Apple, Google, Cisco, Facebook, Stanford University and the like reside, and where some of the brightest minds on the planet reside???

Yeah, now I see what kind of mind im dealing with here. And with that I will check myself out of this thread. Goodnight folks

As someone who works in the banking sector in Charlotte, Ivy League grads aren't flocking here. Most Ivy League and Duke type grads work in the RTP in Raleigh in the technology and engineering fields.

 

[OriginalGatorHater]

I spent 20 years on Wall Street and worked for a fund in Atlanta.

Neither Emory nor Georgia place people on the Street. Yes, you may have a few that make it, but on a percentage basis, they are not in the same stratosphere as the Dukes, Princetons, Yales or Stanfords.

I declined an offer from BCG recently and the Managing Partner on the West Coast told me that they only hire from 13 schools with some exceptions (i.e. they hire a former CEO who ran a manufacturing entity).

Thank you. This is exactly what I am saying.

 

[TheMatador]

UM is a decent, nothing special school that desperately tries to be something it can never be; the duke of the further south. We will never even be remotely close to that type of academic school.

They spent 2 billion dollars, inflated grades, made entrance requirements tougher, and destroyed the football program to try to be a top academic institution and guess what? We are back where we started, out of the top 50.

Probably not bad. When I went to college, in the late '60's, UM had a very mediocre reputation. I think the reputation and status is much higher, but absent the financial wherewithal to buy a truly world-class faculty, and to establish highly-ranked research centers, it will take decades and maybe generations to leap into the rank of the very elite. (I didn't go to UM, I've been a football fan for sixty years, though).

One case study in rapid ascent in rankings that I've never understood is the case of NYU law. At one time, in the '60's, it was supposed to be nothing special. By the late '70's, it was highly-ranked, and now, it is just outside the top five.

I worked in a Wall Street firm with NYU grads, and they were no better than some who went to Tulane or Boston U. (We had people from everywhere: Harvard, Yale, Columbia, etc.)

 

[TheMatador]

As someone who works in the banking sector in Charlotte, Ivy League grads aren't flocking here. Most Ivy League and Duke type grads work in the RTP in Raleigh in the technology and engineering fields.

What's the RTP?

 

[TheMatador]

Whatever an eager attorney came make it. You have criminal activity, make it continuing, which it probably is, and you have RICO possibility. Lot of money and assets to seize for headlines. Good chance there is unreported cash payments. Somebody is guilty of something there. For a good lawyer, 2 plus 2 is whatever you need it to be. For me, I’d go for the schools endowment money. Hard case but boy what tons of money. These people are guilty and in it together and the old saying is, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck and is seen it the company of other ducks .... . I’m not saying it will happen but it could.

For criminal RICO you need a willing prosecutor. Good luck with that.

Civil RICO, I'm not sure what the violations are. I'm considering a civil RICO case right now.

 

[TheMatador]

Let me elucidate. People go to these schools because they HAVE to. Excluding Vanderbilt, not a single person on the planet would choose the SEC over a Duke or Virginia.

The degrees these students earn from the SEC schools are worthless, so the schools need to engender loyalty for future donations. They need something to tie these students to the school and that bond is football.

Tuition to these schools is a finite revenue stream that does not equal what these schools derive in donations and tuition in most schools is subsidized. If these schools had poor football programs, it would decimate donations. That was my point.

I have worked at 8 elite institutions and we only considered Vanderbilt students (from the SEC schools). If you had degrees from Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi and/or LSU, your resume went immediately into the trash.

I'm sure there are plenty of people choosing SEC schools over Duke or Virginia. One might get into Duke or Virginia, but does that guarantee financial aid sufficient to cover all the costs? If not, I guess you stay home and pay in-state tuition.

 

[TheMatador]

The top 3 consulting companies in the world are: McKinsey, BCG and Bain. Period.

They do NOT recruit Georgia and Emory students to their NYC, San Francisco, or LA offices. They recruit these country bumpkins to their Atlanta office, so that the Coca Cola, Delta and/or Home Depot mandates have some local "fellas" that the employees can relate to.

Here is another FACT.... Emory was caught FALSIFYING SAT scores for its students a few years ago in order to maintain its US NEws ranking. Woddruff and Goizueta gave Emory $3B in cash to try and turn it into a Duke. They were former CEOs of Coca Cola.

I lived in Druid Hills for 4 years, down the street from Emory. The school is 70% Asian and admits purely on SAT score.

Emory students could not obtain a job in NYC if there lives depended on it.

I worked for a fund in Atlanta for four years. The city is a DUMP and 50 years away from matching the LAs, NYCs, DCs, Seattles or Bostons. Frankly, my friends say that Austin is better.

Atlanta is the Duke of Hazzard.

Wow!

Haven't been to Atlanta in 50 years...used to be a nice city.

Emory used to be considered pretty good...perhaps a notch below Duke.

Lived in NYC, hated it. Horrible place. The then-head of the NYU Corporate Law LL.M. program told me to get out of NYC. (This was about 1990). He saw the same decline I saw. Is the city still full of rats, filth and disgusting people?

DC? I live here....full of arrogant people, getting more and more expensive...the swamp truly is real...take some mediocre people who can't get better jobs in the private sector, give them a job in the federal bureaucracy with some power over other peoples' lives, and they go crazy. Look at the steady stream of scoundrels who corrupted the FBI and the DOJ....people who felt they had the right to overturn a legitimate election...so typical of how D.C. corrupts people. The Swamp is real and you have to deal with a whole region full of supercilious people when you live in D.C.

When I lived in San Francisco, people had a very dim view of L.A......crowded, unpleasant, smoggy, and so on. Back then, housing in L.A. was affordable....not now..

Now San Francisco is reportedly the pits...human **** all over the sidewalks....needles, everywhere. (I hated having to leave--that was back in the '70's--now I'm glad I'm not there)

Seattle? Never been there....my impression is: very dreary, never any sun, too many homeless, probably going to decline because of homeless and sanctuary city status...

Don't know enough about Boston but probably very expensive.

Surprised at what you say about Atlanta... surprised that Emory doesn't have a better reputation.

 

[TheMatador]

Let me elucidate. People go to these schools because they HAVE to. Excluding Vanderbilt, not a single person on the planet would choose the SEC over a Duke or Virginia.

The degrees these students earn from the SEC schools are worthless, so the schools need to engender loyalty for future donations. They need something to tie these students to the school and that bond is football.

Tuition to these schools is a finite revenue stream that does not equal what these schools derive in donations and tuition in most schools is subsidized. If these schools had poor football programs, it would decimate donations. That was my point.

I have worked at 8 elite institutions and we only considered Vanderbilt students (from the SEC schools). If you had degrees from Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi and/or LSU, your resume went immediately into the trash.

When you say "elite institutions" what are you talking about? Investment banking? Will you name them? Why so many? There used to be a stigma to what was called "job hopping."

 

[canesproponent]

Omg. Lol.

So, Ivy league grads aren’t trying to live in or get jobs in ATL, Charlotte or SF??? What’s?!?!

The Charlotte and ATL....the banking presences in the south or the Silicon Valley/“SF”/Palo Alto/Menlo Park where Apple, Google, Cisco, Facebook, Stanford University and the like reside, and where some of the brightest minds on the planet reside???

Yeah, now I see what kind of mind im dealing with here. And with that I will check myself out of this thread. Goodnight folks

This is not accurate.

No true, elite professional talent will opt for Atlanta or Charlotte over the markets you mentioned.

I agreed to work in Atlanta because they matched my LA salary and it essentially doubled my salary on a PPP basis.

 

[canesproponent]

When you say "elite institutions" what are you talking about? Investment banking? Will you name them? Why so many? There used to be a stigma to what was called "job hopping."

It did hurt me to "hop around" in the 90s and 2000s, but I was able to work in M&A, PE, Turnaround, Project Finance and High Yield Debt. Now that experience helps me, but I lost some potential offers due to my 3-year job tenures. No doubt.

 

[TemplarCane]

Speaking of the basketball scandal, perhaps a change of subject?

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...elite-athletes-thanks-to-federal-court-ruling

 

[CashMoneyCane]

No Miami isn’t. In no known universe does Miami have better academics than Georgia. Georgia is a better school than Miami, top to bottom. Better undergrad from soup to nuts, better law school, better MBA program, better international affairs. Miami has a better med school and that’s about it.

Did you actually attend either school and graduate? I'm a Miami alum. I will tell you without question that we didn't have or entertain anyone from Georgia in my recruiting class at a large global bank.

The reality of it is the education and rigor of curriculum are by and large comparable at major schools. The talent attracted to the university has a far greater bearing. I worked with kids who went to Yale who were idiots.

But no, Georgia is not a better undergraduate school across the board than Miami.

 

[CashMoneyCane]

The finance world is a lot different than it was in the 50s. You do realize Warren started out working for his fathers company right? You can make decent money working a finance job in other cities, but no one would consider you killing it in the finance world if you work in Georgia LMFAO.

This is correct. You're not really anyone in finance (banking, more accurately) unless you work in New York or London.

 

[CashMoneyCane]

Omg. Lol.

So, Ivy league grads aren’t trying to live in or get jobs in ATL, Charlotte or SF??? What’s?!?!

The Charlotte and ATL....the banking presences in the south or the Silicon Valley/“SF”/Palo Alto/Menlo Park where Apple, Google, Cisco, Facebook, Stanford University and the like reside, and where some of the brightest minds on the planet reside???

Yeah, now I see what kind of mind im dealing with here. And with that I will check myself out of this thread. Goodnight folks

I'll second exactly what he's saying, and you're way out of your league in this conversation.

Elite banking jobs are in NYC. The vast majority of the employees (ESPECIALLY undergrad and grad recruiting) are recruited from Ivy schools or comparable (Texas, Michigan, Penn State and UNC are the most prominent state schools).

Across the board as a general rule, there is not nearly as much competition for finance jobs elsewhere as there is in New York, and the complexity of the work is significantly greater than in most other places.

 

[CashMoneyCane]

Man, I’m in a bar watching games, typing from my phone. I’m not on a PC.

You can’t just pick and choose which rankings to pull from. We can easily toss those rankings bank and forth.

What I KNOW is the firms i worked for recruited UGA over Miami all day everyday and in the state of Florida they preferred students from university of Florida over Miami. That’s not hating or shyting on Miami, that’s what I’ve seen close up and personal.

Unless you spent your whole life working in Atlanta, this is fake news.

 

[Crimpy]

I'm not killing it in finance, but I wouldn't bet against an appeal in this case. The Universities are the victims. LMFAO. After these convictions, the people who need to worry are the AD's and other University officials who are complicit in this graft, because these sacrificial lamb defendants are going to start implicating people as far up the food chain as possible in order to combat this "University is the victim" argument of the Feds.

 

[JohnAllan]

USNEWS (2019) Rankings: https://www.usnews.com/best-graduate-schools/university-of-miami-135726/overall-rankings

Undergrad:
Miami: #53
UGA: #46

Grad school:
Business
UGA: #40
Miami #65

Education
UGA: #37
Miami: #68

Engineering
UGA: #122
Miami: #97

Law
UGA: #32
Miami: #65

Medical
UGA: N/A
Miami: #50

Nursing
UGA: N/A
Miami: #42

Pharmacy
UGA: #25
Miami: N/A

Veterinary
UGA: #10
Miami: N/A

ARWU (2018) Rankings: http://www.shanghairanking.com/ARWU2018.html
Miami: National (#70-95) International (#201-300)
UGA: National (#70-95) International (#201-300)

Forbes (2018) Rankings: https://www.forbes.com/top-colleges/list/
Miami: #100
UGA: #103

Washington Monthly (2018) Rankings: https://washingtonmonthly.com/2018college-guide
Miami: #252
UGA: #81

QS (2019) World Rankings: https://www.topuniversities.com/university-rankings/world-university-rankings/2019
Miami: #242
UGA: #431

Times US (2018) Rankings: https://www.timeshighereducation.co...gth/25/sort_by/rank/sort_order/asc/cols/stats
Miami: #47
UGA: #240

_____________________________________________
Bonus

Niche College (2019) Rankings: https://www.niche.com/colleges/rankings/
Miami: #81
UGA: #67

Endowment (2017) Ranking: https://www.nacubo.org/-/media/Nacu...hash=E71088CDC05C76FCA30072DA109F91BBC10B0290
Miami: #108 ($948,579)
UGA: #90 ($1,151,904)

NSF - Total Research and Expenditures (2016) Ranking: https://ncsesdata.nsf.gov/profiles/site?method=rankingBySource&ds=herd
Miami: #62
UGA: #54


Conclusion: Neither school is "significantly" better than the other (one school isn't completely dominating other in rankings). Some rankings UGA> Miami and other rankings Miami> UGA.

 

[JohnAllan]

Rankings don't mean ****. UGA is not a better school. You have 0 chance of landing any good Investment Banking, Private Equity, etc. jobs straight out of college if you go to UGA. 0 chance. Those rankings factor in BS majors like teaching, communications, philosophy, etc. UGA may be better at those majors, but majors that actually will get you far in the real world UM has them beat.

Completely untrue. Going to Miami over UGA will not give you a significant advantage in the Investment Banking, Private Equity job market. Also, UGA has good subject rankings and non-BS majors. Not sure where you are getting your information from. UGA is strong for business, law, education, veterinary medicine, pharmacy and Miami is strong in engineering, medical, and nursing.