Where we Fall in the HC Pecking Order

They definitely have better support. But Miami can make the financial to commitment to being successful. They’ll never rivals the Alabama and Texas’s of the world. The problem is Miami is making the bare minimum commitment. That’s my biggest issue. There’s no reason Miami can’t pay a coach $5-$6 million per year. I get not paying a coach $10 million. But there needs to be a larger commitment.
Where is this money coming from? The reason why USC can pay what they are going to pay is that they have donors that are willing to step up. If a donor at Miami is willing to step up, the school will pay it. Mark Richt got paid more than Golden, because someone stepped up and made the commitment to paying him. It's a lot easier to find someone to step up when you have a deep, diverse donor pool. Miami isn't going to tap into the general fund for football, and for good **** reason. Miami has shown that they will pay for an established guy.

I'm quite sure if the donor that said they would step up for Mario stood by that promise, they would pay what needs to be paid.
 
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USC's grad school enrollment is one of the largest in the nation and its alums are mega-loaded.

USC has bottomless resources compared to Miami.

What's unusual about USC compared to most major programs is that, because it is in such a large pond (Southern California), that it isn't the fulcrum of regional culture that Alabama is.

But @Canedude08 is absolutely right that it has state-school type resources.

UCLA actually have a ton of money too, but the collegiately-unaffiliated fan in Southern California is far more likely to be a Trojan than a Bruin (this is quite obvious in attendance and media attention to the two programs).

Some coaches want to be the focal point, others would rather be a smaller part of a larger backdrop, so I don't see that as a positive or negative generally, but one must find the coach that suits the style.
 
Where is this money coming from? The reason why USC can pay what they are going to pay is that they have donors that are willing to step up. If a donor at Miami is willing to step up, the school will pay it. Mark Richt got paid more than Golden, because someone stepped up and made the commitment to paying him. It's a lot easier to find someone to step up when you have a deep, diverse donor pool. Miami isn't going to tap into the general fund for football, and for good **** reason. Miami has shown that they will pay for an established guy.

I'm quite sure if the donor that said they would step up for Mario stood by that promise, they would pay what needs to be paid.
If reports are true, that Manny and Richt made $4-4.5 million it’s not like you’d be doubling salary. That’s a $2 million commitment. Again this goes back to what is your commitment? Paying $2 million more for a coach is an investment that shouldn’t be a difficult sell. If Miami becomes relevant nationally again what happens? I’d almost guarantee enrollment increases. Better exposure means more money. Right now what is Miami being talked about? A systemwide administration issue.


There is absolutely no good PR right now. If you can’t go to your donor base and show what this **** show is then kill the program. Again I’m not saying outspend Alabama. But do you want to win or just tread along?
 
USC's grad school enrollment is one of the largest in the nation and its alums are mega-loaded.

USC has bottomless resources compared to Miami.

What's unusual about USC compared to most major programs is that, because it is in such a large pond (Southern California), that it isn't the fulcrum of regional culture that Alabama is.

But @Canedude08 is absolutely right that it has state-school type resources.

UCLA actually have a ton of money too, but the collegiately-unaffiliated fan in Southern California is far more likely to be a Trojan than a Bruin (this is quite obvious in attendance and media attention to the two programs).

Some coaches want to be the focal point, others would rather be a smaller part of a larger backdrop, so I don't see that as a positive or negative generally, but one must find the coach that suits the style.
When I said that USC was urban Alabama, I was referring to the fact that they have a ton of resources and have a very localized, passionate alumni base. People forget that the typical USC alum stays in LA after graduation, giving them a link to the campus. It's a lot easier to fundraise when your alumni stay, find success and DOMINATE the local area. They aren't the only show in town like Alabama but you look around LA, SC alums are there in full force and they support their alma mater. There are more UF and FSU alumni in Dade County than Miami alums.

I can tell you this, the typical Miami alum leaves So. Florida, because most of us aren't local and we have little interest in remaining in the area.
 
If reports are true, that Manny and Richt made $4-4.5 million it’s not like you’d be doubling salary. That’s a $2 million commitment. Again this goes back to what is your commitment? Paying $2 million more for a coach is an investment that shouldn’t be a difficult sell. If Miami becomes relevant nationally again what happens? I’d almost guarantee enrollment increases. Better exposure means more money. Right now what is Miami being talked about? A systemwide administration issue.


There is absolutely no good PR right now. If you can’t go to your donor base and show what this **** show is then kill the program. Again I’m not saying outspend Alabama. But do you want to win or just tread along?
Tell me you haven't been to the University of Miami, without telling me. There won't be an enrollment increase because we are a landlocked University that can't really expand. Yes, a winning football program helps with drawing in applications, but the benefits our fanbase love to tout are also limited by the school itself. Yep, we'll get more applications, but we wont' be admitting additional kids, because we have no where to put them, and a big advantage of a private school is personalized instruction. Guess what? For Miami to expand, we'd have to hire a ton more faculty.

Again, a booster has to step up and say that they will be putting in the money. That happens, you'll get what you want. The school isn't going to take money from the general fund to pay a football coach.
 
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When I said that USC was urban Alabama, I was referring to the fact that they have a ton of resources and have a very localized, passionate alumni base. People forget that the typical USC alum stays in LA after graduation, giving them a link to the campus. It's a lot easier to fundraise when your alumni stay, find success and DOMINATE the local area. They aren't the only show in town like Alabama but you look around LA, SC alums are there in full force and they support their alma mater. There are more UF and FSU alumni in Dade County than Miami alums.

I can tell you this, the typical Miami alum leaves So. Florida, because most of us aren't local and we have little interest in remaining in the area.
I'd be interested to see what the numbers say about the bold. I suspect it's very different among grads (who I would guess stay at a much higher frequency, and I know are more likely to originally be from here) than undergrads.

But I can't say I know the exact numbers that stay in South Florida vs. leave. What is clear is that we don't have nearly enough influence here.

I've long believed the school should be far more Florida-focused in terms of student demographics, and advocated means of keeping better in-state students local. I won't write a book here, but it'd help the football program imo, among other things.

I have no interest in living outside Florida, but that's obviously personal.
 
Miami has NEVER been a top 5 job. EVER. Why? Because the top jobs are ones in which you don't have any obstacles. Miami is and will always be a small private school with a shallow donor pool and a fanbase that is cheap as **** and will turn on you in a heartbeat. This is also a school in which you have academic standards, a school that won't allow the athletic department to run the entire institution. This is also a place where the media isn't beholden to the University. For a lot of coaches, they don't want to deal with that stuff.

Miami is a great job for a certain type of person. Someone that wants to have a pro job at the college level, someone that is looking to win big, win fast and then head to the NFL. That's why the guys that have won at Miami have ended up in the NFL right afterwards. You have to have a level of arrogance to win at Miami, an ability to say "I'm going to win, and I'm going to do it in an environment where I don't have every single advantage at my disposal".
The fan bashing is ridiculous. I’ve seen a comment saying fans of Miami are fickle and cheap and blah. Being fickle isn’t staying and supporting this admin for 20 years. Fans not spending money because they see a bad admin that is ACTUALLY being cheap isn’t on the fans.

Miami’s reputation around the country from other fan bases is Miamis admin is cheap and not committed but some of you want to blame the fans..Unreal…
 
Tell me you haven't been to the University of Miami, without telling me. There won't be an enrollment increase because we are a landlocked University that can't really expand. Yes, a winning football program helps with drawing in applications, but the benefits our fanbase love to tout are also limited by the school itself. Yep, we'll get more applications, but we wont' be admitting additional kids, because we have no where to put them, and a big advantage of a private school is personalized instruction. Guess what? For Miami to expand, we'd have to hire a ton more faculty.

Again, a booster has to step up and say that they will be putting in the money. That happens, you'll get what you want. The school isn't going to take money from the general fund to pay a football coach.
I’m not saying the enrollment doubles. Increased interest in the school benefits the overall health of the school. Right now the President, AD and HC are getting blasted on national television. Keep this and what do have to sell? Declining academic numbers, terrible athletics? There’s no positives. The main theme to what I’m saying is there’s no commitment. There has been a half-assed approach to running this school/athletic program and now it needs to be fixed. This isn’t a drain the schools coffers situation. You had a $14 million donation to build a covered practice field. If the boosters want to play big boy football they’ll pay as such. You don’t need a thousand boosters to cover the increase. Just get the right people with the right money.
 
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I'd be interested to see what the numbers say about the bold. I suspect it's very different among grads (who I would guess stay at a much higher frequency, and I know are more likely to originally be from here) than undergrads.

But I can't say I know the exact numbers that stay in South Florida vs. leave. What is clear is that we don't have nearly enough influence here.

I've long believed the school should be far more Florida-focused in terms of student demographics, and advocated means of keeping better in-state students local. I won't write a book here, but it'd help the football program imo, among other things.

I have no interest in living outside Florida, but that's obviously personal.

You are spot on about grad students. When I was working on my JD, **** near everyone was from So. Florida. Few people moved down just to attend law school. I remember my 1L group, maybe a couple of people didn't have existing ties to the area, and one of those moved down because her spouse was from the area(That was one beautiful lady, I'll leave it at that).

Honestly, I don't think the powers that be are interested in having a Florida centric undergrad student body. There's a legit reason why, and it's something that makes sense when you think about it. At a school like USC, because the student body is made up of mostly kids that are from the area, went to the same high schools and **** near grew up together, you get a very homogenous student body. Unfortunately, that does lead to student body that lacks vitality and true diversity. I remember touring USC as a HS senior, and people asked me where I was from. When I said Dallas, they looked at me like I was from Mars. Mostly because the typical SC student is from the area. Miami doesn't want that kind of vibe on campus.

Miami has prided itself on having a variety of viewpoints and the like, and an efficient way to do that is to have kids from everywhere. That said, it has changed since Frenk took over, you can see that they are just packing the student body out with as many international students as they can, mostly because they will pay full freight. We had international kids on campus when I was there, but the last time I visited campus, I was amazed how many there were and how the vibe on campus has changed. It just seems as if the school isn't as vibrant as it once was, because the kids are becoming homogenous. You don't see the variety of people that you once did. Everyone dresses the same, acts the same. Ironically enough, I got the same vibe when I went to Duke for a conference a couple of years back. They have a similar student body makeup.

I don't think that Miami is throwing around the financial aid money to get kids in as they once did, and it has taken a toll in attracting kids. I think the student body sees attending Miami as a means to an end, a business transaction, nothing more. That does hurt the football program, because these kids aren't going to donate. These kids won't view the University the same way alumni like myself view it. For people like me, that came on scholarship and was able to meet the world thanks to being a 'Cane, we have a passion for the institution that makes us want to help. I donate because I know I'm a better person because of the time I spent in Coral Gables, and I want to make sure the kids that follow me are able to have those experiences. These kids, even if the football program is winning, don't give a ****. I saw it when L had the basketball program rolling, these kids just didn't give a ****. It's a diversion, it's not something that they take pride in. When they leave campus, they view it as "I did my thing, they got my money that's the end of it".
 
The fan bashing is ridiculous. I’ve seen a comment saying fans of Miami are fickle and cheap and blah. Being fickle isn’t staying and supporting this admin for 20 years. Fans not spending money because they see a bad admin that is ACTUALLY being cheap isn’t on the fans.

Miami’s reputation around the country from other fan bases is Miamis admin is cheap and not committed but some of you want to blame the fans..Unreal…
Keep making up excuses for this fanbase. The reason why Miami's administration has that reputation as being cheap is that Miami's fanbase is cheap, and expects the school to pick up the slack for a fanbase that has shown, even when times are good that they won't spend. Again, look at our attendance numbers, even when we played in the beloved OB, even when we were winning. Exactly.

The administration is INCOMPTENT, they do a poor job of leveraging the resources available, but they haven't gotten help from our fanbase. Miami won 5 national championships despite a lack of consistent support. We are expected to beat Alabama and Clemson, without nearly enough resources. The group that could help bridge that gap doesn't, and they also allow Alabama and Clemson to come down here and buy kids, without making a stink about it. That's the part that annoys the **** out of me. This community knows full well that Clemson, Alabama and others are pimping these kids and they let it happen.

You think that if a kid in Alabama was interested in Alabama, and LSU came in and tried to buy him that the local community would let it happen? Heck no.
 
Sir, the OB was over a decade ago. Miami’s admin has been cheap and not committed twice as long. You don’t know what people will spend now because of the ineptitude of the admin.

The fans need something in order to come back now, that’s obvious.



Notice the difference in atmospheres.
Show me where the admin wasn’t cheap and committed over the last 20 years? History and results aren’t on your side.
 
Sir, the OB was over a decade ago. Miami’s admin has been cheap and not committed twice as long. You don’t know what people will spend now because of the ineptitude of the admin.

The fans need something in order to come back now, that’s obvious.



Notice the difference in atmospheres.
Show me where the admin wasn’t cheap and committed over the last 20 years? History and results aren’t on your side.

You are pointing to two different games, and also failing to grasp the point I'm trying to make. It's easy for this fanbase to come out and get hype for a big game. They did that when times were great in the OB as well. The problem is that in that SAME SEASON(2017), you had a half full building for conference games. That's the problem. I don't blame anyone for not supporting a crap product, but you can't then sit on your *** when times are good, and only care when it's a once in a lifetime event. Keep in mind, our attendance figures can be predicted by one event: Does FSU come to town that year. Lets look at some good times and the numbers.

19996235,57839,263
20006350,57858,430
20016282,97246,162
20026417,23369,539
20037406,94558,135
20046354,80359,134

For a program in the middle of a **** good run, coming off of the lows of probation, those numbers are depressing. Not an accident that 2002 featured an FSU game, and 2003 featured a visit from the Gators. By the way the 1999 team went 9-4. 9-4 and they drew **** near a half stadium.

I don't blame fans for not showing up to the UVA game this year. Frankly, the best thing fans can do right now is NOT SHOW UP, because it's beyond obvious that Manny isn't the answer. We have to cut bait and force a chance. That said, don't be shocked that Miami wont' spend like Bama, when our fans don't spend like Bama. Miami will always have to work within a budget, and that's because 1)There aren't enough alumni willing to donate to change that and 2)The fanbase has shown for the better part of 4 decades that unless it's an event, they won't spend a dime. Does that excuse this administration for being poor stewards of the resources that are available? NO. Blake James has done a poor job maximizing what he does have. That's my beef with him and the people he reports to. We aren't getting the most bang for our buck.
 
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You’re showing me stuff from 2004. It’s 2021. I’m with you that in those years the fanbase was spoiled and out of touch. Now everything, including Richts early years, are a prove it. Waiting showed that Richt wasn’t it. Some people called Richt out for hiring his son. He ended up being a huge fail and I love Richt but it is what is. You do realize what happened right after this Norte Dame game and how the season ended? You do realize what happened the next season against LSU and how that season turned out?

You’re neglecting the fact that Miami has NOT been good and hasn’t given fans a reason to donate. You gloss over the FACT that the admin has hired poorly and won’t acknowledge how that would correlate to poor donor ship from fans. Like I said blaming fans is old. Like I said, you don’t know what fans will spend NOW…
 
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You are spot on about grad students. When I was working on my JD, **** near everyone was from So. Florida. Few people moved down just to attend law school. I remember my 1L group, maybe a couple of people didn't have existing ties to the area, and one of those moved down because her spouse was from the area(That was one beautiful lady, I'll leave it at that).

Honestly, I don't think the powers that be are interested in having a Florida centric undergrad student body. There's a legit reason why, and it's something that makes sense when you think about it. At a school like USC, because the student body is made up of mostly kids that are from the area, went to the same high schools and **** near grew up together, you get a very homogenous student body. Unfortunately, that does lead to student body that lacks vitality and true diversity. I remember touring USC as a HS senior, and people asked me where I was from. When I said Dallas, they looked at me like I was from Mars. Mostly because the typical SC student is from the area. Miami doesn't want that kind of vibe on campus.

Miami has prided itself on having a variety of viewpoints and the like, and an efficient way to do that is to have kids from everywhere. That said, it has changed since Frenk took over, you can see that they are just packing the student body out with as many international students as they can, mostly because they will pay full freight. We had international kids on campus when I was there, but the last time I visited campus, I was amazed how many there were and how the vibe on campus has changed. It just seems as if the school isn't as vibrant as it once was, because the kids are becoming homogenous. You don't see the variety of people that you once did. Everyone dresses the same, acts the same. Ironically enough, I got the same vibe when I went to Duke for a conference a couple of years back. They have a similar student body makeup.

I don't think that Miami is throwing around the financial aid money to get kids in as they once did, and it has taken a toll in attracting kids. I think the student body sees attending Miami as a means to an end, a business transaction, nothing more. That does hurt the football program, because these kids aren't going to donate. These kids won't view the University the same way alumni like myself view it. For people like me, that came on scholarship and was able to meet the world thanks to being a 'Cane, we have a passion for the institution that makes us want to help. I donate because I know I'm a better person because of the time I spent in Coral Gables, and I want to make sure the kids that follow me are able to have those experiences. These kids, even if the football program is winning, don't give a ****. I saw it when L had the basketball program rolling, these kids just didn't give a ****. It's a diversion, it's not something that they take pride in. When they leave campus, they view it as "I did my thing, they got my money that's the end of it".
I was a grad student. I don't remember associating with a large number of out of state students.

My social life was admittedly far more off campus to be sure.
 
Our job isn’t open….. 😣
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Whoever the next HC is has some options for an elite level DC

- Muschamp
- Pruitt
- Steele

I don’t think any of them come though unless it’s a pretty respected name.
 
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